Is an "independent woman" equal to "an average man"?

[genericname85]

like what is an independend woman independend of? a male partner? her own parents? how? by having a job, cooking her own food and washing their own laundry?

doesn't that make an "independend women" just a person who barely passes as what you'd call an average male adult? what's so special about managing your own shit? like if a man ever strutted around, declaring pride in being independend for havin a job, preparing his own food and washing his own clothes, people would think he lost his mind. yet for women that seems a very special thing.

this is not meant to offend women. i think women are and should be equal to men. so since they are equal to men, why do they get to be so proud of just barely passing as an adult?

[CubsterShura]

Would you ask the same question to an "independent man"? Would you ask him what he is independent from? Or do you just want to act dumb when you ask these questions to women?

Being independent simply means that you don't depend on anyone else to survive, operate your life and make life decisions for you. You have the financial scope and life skills to meet your basic needs such as food and rent, you can pay someone for services that are beyond your own expertise or skill level. You make your own decisions such as career and finance and don't depend on anyone to make those decisions for you.

The reason why being an independent woman is something to be proud of is because no one questions an average man being independent, he is not expected to be anything else and it is seen as default. For women, not so. Even you wouldn't ask the average man does he need a woman blah blah blah. Suddenly when a woman talks about being independent she is met with a lot of judgment and scrutiny. She is antagonized for not needing a man to survive. It is ridiculous.

[genericname85]

men don't strut around being proud of being "independend". but if they did, i sure would do the same for men. cause having a job and managing your own shit is certainly not anything an adult should have special pride for.

[Exterminatore]

If you don’t like his questions you don’t have to read or answer them. Use your independence and choose to not answer next time. Of course you won’t do that. You want to smear your emotions all over the place like a Pap smear in a frigging gynecologists office.

Who gives a rats ass if he would ask men these questions or not it’s irrelevant, he can ask anything he wants, and I think he’s asking both sexes? Feminazis think they can control everyone and everything.

[bingbongbangbung]

If you have to depend on society and government to maintain and create the infrastructure necessary to survive, then you're not actually independent based on your definition (which applies to most humans since the last few centuries)

[CubsterShura]

@genericname85 and that proves the point that men aren't subjected to as much scrutiny to begin with. Many people still consider being an independent woman as a mythical idea and not reality that a lot of women are living.

Women still do majority of the household chores even in couples where both parties are working full-time especially those that have children. Women could not own their own bank accounts or credit cards without a father/spouse until recent decades in the West and they still cannot in some countries today. Women's household chores increase by up to 7 hours when they get married and for men they decrease by one hour. In many parts of the world women cannot move out and live independently, they have to stay with their parents until they get married and then they have to move to their husband's place.

It is absolutely a thing to be proud of being able to overcome all these barriers to independence that women face on the daily.

[CubsterShura]

@Exterminatore I'm not stopping him from asking anything, it is a valid question to raise in response and if you don't like being questioned then don't post anything.

[CubsterShura]

@bingbongbangbung if you wouldn't say that to a man, don't say it to a woman. Stop acting dumb.

[genericname85]

that was absolutely incoherent rambling of non facts and falsehoods. none of what yo said proofs that men are somehow subject to less scrutiny. men have the exact same barriers. in fact the barriers for women are artificially lowered in many places.

[genericname85]

and then you mix in women from backwards societies, which has nothing at all to do with the topic at hand because we don't live in a backwards 3rd world country where women are still oppressed. also 7 hours of household chores. never heard such nonsense maybe if you do all the chores of a week in one day. you can't tell me that's 7 hours daily. cause i'm doing all my chores myself so i would know if it would ever take that long. furthermore, you conveniently ignored all the repairs and homesteading that men are by fault expected to do which i'll just claim is 9 hours a day, cause apparently we're now just throwing around completely unreasonable numbers.

[CubsterShura]

"men have the exact same barriers"

Oh yeah? Where in the world has anyone said to a man that he cannot have his own credit card or bank account and his mother/wife has to open one for him?

[CubsterShura]

"you conveniently ignored all the repairs and homesteading that men are by fault expected to do"

I live in a female-only apartment, a lot of girls I know live in such apartments/houses, you think we do no homesteading by ourselves?

[Exterminatore]

@Cubster

No. It is not a valid question. He’s not just asking women this. That’s how you took it and responded as you did.

[CubsterShura]

@Exterminatore I didn't "take" it that way. I asked him if he would ask the same question to a man, and he admitted that he wouldn't.

[Exterminatore]

@Cubster

I see he says that in his initial reply and I stand corrected.

[Anonymous]

Through experience, I've seen more men use that term than women. Usually it's regarded with a lot of distain. "Oh... So do you consider yourself an independent woman?" When a guy is looking for a housewife.

But I know of a few women who flaunt it around. It's more like to stick it to the man. Like, "I don't need you, I'm independent." Lol it's all really stupid. I don't even think about it or use the word. I just live my life.

But I don't get why you keep saying, "Barely passing as an adult or average male adult." I don't know about you but I feel like most women (at least the old school ones since I was raised old school) know a lot of basic survival life skills that I feel like men allow themselves to be lazy about because they want the woman in their life to do it for them.

I'm not saying that makes us way better than men. Anyone can have these life skills that I feel are more strictly raised and taught in women because of gender roles. But the lazy sort of men who are either too set in their ways to learn for themselves or just plainly don't give a shit will not learn these skills. I'm talking about all ages.

So knowing this, considering the average male, are we still considered just barely on par? I would consider us women average. I'm not saying I want some fancy fucking title like I'm some bad ass bitch. I'm average like everyone else. But barely average? That's rude when i know most guys barely function without a woman doing almost everything for them.

[VIVANT]

Yup this too. I was too tired to get into the next part but absolutely ALL of this 👍🏼

[ManOnFire]

@mewzinc Men use the term disparagingly because women coined it. It was women in the beginning who made a big deal out of them being able to do everything without a man and how that made them important.

[Opinion Owner]

@ManOnFire I understand it was used in the beginning since it was probably a big deal back then. Women were basically property in America in a certain point in time. Of course not speaking for all countries and not excluding races either.

[Opinion Owner]

@VIVANT Thank you 😊

[Lliam]

Aren't most men independent in terms of having a fucking job and being able to support themselves? When a woman says she is independent, I think she means the same thing. Why are some men threatened by that? Is it because the only way they think they can hold onto a woman is to keep her financially dependent.

Are men "dependent" on women? We'll isn't it pretty pathetic for women to be "dependent" on men?

Every one of my girlfriends AND my wife had jobs or careers and supported themselves. I wouldn't want a woman who was waiting around for a man to support her.

I prefer a woman who wants a lifetime companion that she adores, admires, loves, trusts and respects as much as he adores, admires, loves, trusts and respects her. She wants a male partner because she is heterosexual and has a libido. And they may or may not want kids.

I don't need to be someone's boss. I don't need a servant or piece of property in order to be manly.

I prefer an equal partner with brains, common sense, intuition, self esteem, self respect, healthy morals and values, has a strong work ethic, and is feminine. We collaborate, make decisions and have fun together as best friends, care for each other, and work as a team to build a happy future.

That describes the woman I have been married to for almost 26 years.

[ManOnFire]

White-feminists are the ones who came up with all that independent woman stuff. They mean it in the sense of being able to do everything without a man and being proud of it.

You have to remember that feminism is archaic and still rooted in the old structures of white American women from the 1950s, so it still imagines that the world is old because their mental battles are old. Independent women are no more special or noble than anyone else. Okay, so you're grabbing your own life by the horns without a husband. It's not unheard of.

[Datboi65]

You hit the nail right on the head. The racial component is also important in understanding what's gone wrong with our society. Black people used to be the most married group, now we are the least. There's a lot of nuances that went into play like deindustrialization or the war on drugs, but feminism and welfare did the most damage, and white women recruited Black women on their side.

Today you have white feminists that aren't even afraid of showing their racism, they do it in the name of "fighting on behalf of Black women" who are also usually quite radical themselves. Majority of Black women do not take that stance, but when you see it you know what I mean. These white feminists (they call themselves rad fems) will straight up use KKK propaganda and then say that "it's not because they are Black, it's because they are a man" while making racially charged comments. There's been a few examples so far, but they seem to be growing in numbers (5th wave may be?). One twitter user by the name of "Femoid" you can go and check her tweets about men in general, but Black men in particular and you will see exactly what I mean. I was going to make a post about it but then I forgot.

[Datboi65]

*phemoid with a "ph" instead of an "f". Take some time off and go read about that shit.

[ManOnFire]

@Datboi65 Wow, just checked her out. She got some crazy ass shit on her page lol. She even looks like a weirdo.

Bro, you are one of the few people who seems to understand about how white feminism has hurt our world. I feel like so many people are just blind and dumb. But in some ways their chickens are coming home to roost, like how they pushed and pushed for all the LGBTQ stuff and trans folk to be accepted, and now the trans folk are saying real women aren't real! And it is good to see a lot of women of today choosing not to identify with that all that feminist bullshit.

"Black people used to be the most married group, now we are the least." - You got me beat on that one, I didn't even know that.

[Datboi65]

She had an old page that was banned, and that was her new page. She has confessed to being a pedo and has also been spotted on a discord server asking if it was a "safe space" for using the n word, but she has amassed a cult-like following of so-called "divestor" Black women who hate Black men. Basically acting like a parasite and infecting a would that had been infected for the past 60 years. There's a reason why I made a post back in the day why interracial dating is just a bad idea, because I've been aware of this phenomenon for over a year now. The thing is, there are a lot of folks like her that are just quite. Not the regular Confederate flag waving rednecks, but rather Suburban looking chicks that you wouldn't suspect to hold such views, in the name of "feminism" and "being allies to WOC".

Black women are being used as a proxy to fight a war against Black men. To me, I never see Black women (the group) as an enemy, because they are our people. However, those that follow her (divestor) are definitely an enemy.

I would like to close this by saying that you should really be careful who you deal with. You're a grown man that's got more life knowledge and experience than me I totally understand that, but don't think that the stuff that people say on twitter aren't reflective of their true nature, because it is. There's a reason why people put their real views online, in fear of possible consequences of what they get for saying it out loud in public. A lot of men use Instagram as a litmus test for vetting, but I suggest using twitter instead just to know what kind of views they have.

[ManOnFire]

@Datboi65 Oh I definitely agree. People on Twitter I think are more malignant than maybe anywhere else. The bitches on TikTok too. But they say these things cuz they know they won't be canceled for it, especially if they’re white women.

Even on GaG we got mods and admins who let slimy, malicious feminist white girls do whatever they want and get away with it. Meanwhile other users can be flagged for dumb shit or get their accounts locked cuz a group of these feminist cowards want to team up against someone, and GaG just shrugs.

[MzAsh]

Statistically, women are still doing significantly more domestic labor, even when they’re the breadwinner and paying the bills, so let’s not pretend like men are setting some kind of bar of adulting overall here.
But to answer your question, I think the term is reflective of the typical feminine traditional role of financial and physical dependency. Modern women with their own money, resources, abilities, opportunities, freedoms, etc are significantly more independent of traditional women who depend on men for protection, provision, and support.

[genericname85]

could i see that statistic? cause in many cases when we're talking about dual breadwinner households, the man still generates the bigger income, which would make it fair, if she compensated by doing more of the domesitc labour. looking at isolated statistical facts doesn't allow for any conclusions in social science. i'm not trying to be difficult. i just know that especially in society topics many people use statistics to make arguments that aren't actually supported by that statistic they are quoting. and if it's not a mulitvariate correlative study, then that rises some red flags, cause that means a person looked at a statistic and made their conclusion themself, hich i know from experience is rarely actually accurate.

to come back to the question: ok so then after how many years of "women not depending on men anymore" does it take before that's not considered to be a special thing anymore? cause in my opinion, we've long been there.

[BoopBoopBeep]

I don't care about "statistically" because I'm not dating ALL women, but in every relationship I've had I've done the majority of domestic labor and was the breadwinner in all of them. I'm not sure where you're hiding your women or where I'm finding mine or what, but you mean to tell me there's a whole bunch of women out there that aren't helpless around the house?

[Sarahr123]

@BoopBoopBeep Yeah you’re just choosing useless women. All the women I know do all the housework even if they work full time. They get shocked if anyone’s husband washes the dishes or changes a baby’s nappies. I don’t know if it is just a cultural thing but if I am sitting idle for too long I receive taunts about how my future husband will divorce me if I don’t start making myself useful or that my mother-in-law will be complaining about how useless I am. Like in my culture girls are expected to know how to do all the housework perfectly even if they do work. I’d rather do the housework fulltime though as I have never been career-oriented and always been more suited to being a housewife and mother.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@Sarahr123 It's not just the ones I choose, it's all the ones I work with, all my friend's partners, the ones I hear about in conversation... What is "your culture"... maybe I need to target that.

[Exterminatore]

@MzAsh

Does child support for women indicate dependence or independence?

Does alimony indicate dependence or independence?

In the situation of a divorce, let’s say hypothetically the husband makes $80K a year and the wife $40K, but she’s entitled to 50% of all assets accrued during the marriage. Yet she did not put 50% in. Hell of a deal. Does this indicate dependence or independence?

Do welfare and social programs of which women are the majority of recipients indicate dependence or independence?

All women used to receive affirmative action. Is that dependence or independence?

The common denominator with all these things is they show women are dependent on special privileges they should not receive, with the exception of child support, which merely indicates dependence, and social programs which almost no one should receive in my opinion, which also indicates independence.

You are always a formidable adversary in a debate. I look forward to your response to these things.

Based on what I stated, it would indicate women are not so independent as feminist would like to have us believe. I do not think these thing indicate modern women are significantly more independent than traditional women. I think they simply indicate women found a way to use legislation to transfer wealth mainly from men to women, or to give themselves a handicap in job placement. In my mind theft of resources and money by using legislation, and nudging themselves to the head of the line for job placement is cheating in the game of being independent.

[genericname85]

can someone finally show that statistic that was initially talked about? xD or does it not exist

[Sarahr123]

@BoopBoopBeep You should look into Eastern women who’s mothers and grandmothers grew up in rural areas of their country. They tend to have more traditional values. Women from Eastern Orthodox traditions tend to revere their husbands and men in general but not the ones who grew up in metro cities because they try to imitate the West and Western women seem to be in rebellion. It is sad that traditional values have died in the West. Even Greeks are sad about this. My Greek dentist was talking about how the Greeks just want to imitate the West these days and have completely lost traditional values now as opposed to how it was fifty years ago. In the West you see a lot of role reversal happening which is very disheartening.

[Datboi65]

C'mon let's not lie to ourselves here, women are SIGNIFICANTLY LESS LIKELY to be breadwinners. I would say it's statistically insignificant. On the other hand, a more likely scenario where the man is the breadwinner and also pays for a housekeeper/maid while the wife sits down at home and does absolutely NOTHING. Also, "independent" women still complain about making less money than men, which is ironic. The "Gender wage gap" they call it. If these women were so independent, why not just make more money? Why do they have to beg men for it? How are you going to claim you don't need us, then beg us for some money? That in itself is an oxymoron.

[Datboi65]

@Sarahr123 Greeks are among the most sex-crazed people on Earth. Statistics are present, you can verify that fact. A lot of the countries Westners admire for their "traditionalism" they actually have no idea about. On such country is Russia. Russia has a high divorce rate and a low fertility rate. Another one is Thailand. Thailand has one of the HIGHEST cheating rates in the world for both men and women. Japan has a declining population, and Korea has that same problem. Latin America is just as sex-crazed as the West.

As you can see, not a lot of places that haven't been corrupted already. Unfortunately, America is one of the world's biggest exporters of degeneracy, and this is the result that we're living. Traditional countries are viewed as backwards and oppressive, when the reality is often more nuanced than that. Africa, the Middle East and South Asia are some of the last places on Earth that are still true in tradition. There are some backwards practices that need to be fought against like FGM or honor killings, I absolutely 100% think that those things should NOT be tolerated. However, the expectation to be married before a certain age should definitely come back in our society, and the pressure to "marry before you carry" should also be there. So far, I don't think that's likely to happen.

[Sarahr123]

@Datboi65 yes. I am speaking about rural areas in the Middle East and Asia which is where you find the most traditional women. But for instance if you go to a metro city in India like Mumbai or Delhi then they women there try to imitate the West and are even more obsessed with being modern than Westerners however small cities like Silchar in the North East and villages in Uttar Pradesh or Uttrakhand or Rajasthan in the North have very very traditional women.

It’s hard to hold onto tradition in the West. One thing I admire orthodox Muslims for is how they have managed to keep their children away from the frivolous activities of the West and they teach their daughters to be subservient to their husbands and cook for them and be a good wife and mother.

I mean if you’re not even cooking for your husband and children and taking care of your children then what even is the point of getting married and having children?

They even dress so modestly which makes them look so powerful in a world full of women who are screaming for attention by literally revealing everything on the streets and online. Imagine how secure they are in themselves to not need validation from a single soul. They only care what their husband, their family and God thinks of them and nobody else matters. That is real power. That is freedom from slavery. Oppression is when you have to make yourself a sexual object to be validated by any Tom Dick and Harry fapping over your bikini photos you post online.

I saw a quote somewhere which said that class is when you have everything to show off but choose to hide it.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@Sarahr123 Your last few paragraphs ought to be inscribed over every college and university in the country.

Also, I'm stealing "I saw a quote somewhere which said that class is when you have everything to show off but choose to hide it." for future use.

[Datboi65]

@Sarahr123 If there was a like button for replies, I definitely would click it. You hit the nail right on the head, and you're definitely a brilliant mind which is unfortunately rare on this portal.

[Sarahr123]

@BoopBoopBeep Please do use it! The message should be spread far and wide. 😊

[Sarahr123]

@Datboi65 Thank you! We need more people to adopt traditional values - especially in the West.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@Sarahr123 Blessings in abundance to you and your family. I'm sure it will last far longer than most western ones.

[Sarahr123]

@BoopBoopBeep Thank you once again. May God bless you and your family in abundance too.

[MzAsh]

Here’s one recent article on what I’m talking about. www.women.com/.../

Egalitarian and breadwinner wives are on the ride. As a breadwinner wife myself, I refuse to be a part of this trend. Part of the problem, I believe, is that many women are often too timid in delegating household related tasks. On one hand, women who have chosen a quality husband won’t have to do too much delegating. He’ll know what needs to be done and take initiative without her having to ask. On the other hand, many households are conditioned where the wife is expected to take care of the kids, laundry, dishes, sweeping and mopping, weekly scouring the bathroom and kitchen, grocery shopping, etc. and many husbands slide into the expectation that this will be done without much of their input, as it was done by their mothers while growing up. Few wives are ready and willing to challenge this dynamic, but for working wives, it’s necessary.

[MzAsh]

Exterminatore, these are good questions. The way I see it, child support is for the children, not the woman. It indicates the child’s need for having financial input from the parent who is absent physically.

The interpretation of dependence or independence in these situations you’ve brought up may vary depending on the circumstances.

Child support and alimony can ensure financial stability for those who might face economic challenges after divorce. The idea is to support those who have traditionally taken on caregiving roles and might face difficulties getting back into the workforce or maintaining the same standard of living.

When it comes to welfare and social programs, they're created to provide a safety net for those in need, regardless of gender. Many women benefit from these programs, but they’re not exclusive to women, as they assist anyone facing financial difficulties.

Affirmative action has historically aimed to address systemic inequalities by ensuring equal opportunities for marginalized groups, including women. This can be argued as promoting independence by leveling the playing field and helping them overcome historical disadvantages.

These discussions tend to be very nuance and contextual.

[DextroShade]

@BoopBoopBeep many modern women are perversely proud of not being able to cook or clean. They are utterly worthless outside of sex.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@DextroShade Yeah thats been my findings as well

[A_Bell]

Women do more household labor on average because we choose to waste time buying nonsense that clutter a house and are inefficient in how we work. My dad can do in 2 hours what it took my mom or older sisters all day to do. My oldest sister would criticize her husband to my mom for not doing chores correctly and then criticize him for not doing enough as well. I learned how much I dislike this behavior.

Now, I've been staying home and raising two small kids with one on the way and do most of the housework. It's amazing how much less stressful and rewarding it is than working a job.

[βιυεsκγs]

That’s interesting! Would you recommend women to live as stay at home wives? I secretly wished my boyfriend would consider this in future, I love doing the housework

[A_Bell]

@βιυεsκγs if they enjoy the option.

[Exterminatore]

Interesting. Sounds like you ladies would dispute the 2nd wave feminists in their general attitude of being a housewife was akin to being a political prisoner in a gulag somewhere in Siberia.

Yes, it must be so terrible to be able to set your own work pace in your own way, according to your own schedule, while having autonomy over much of the running of the house on a day to day basis, while not have to deal with rush hour traffic and not have to go to a job where you want to strangle 85% of the people you work with. Where there is no boss breathing down your neck wanting you to produce more. How awful it was for women 60+ years ago to preform the majority of their work in a climate controlled environment at their own leasure. When I think how bad it was for those poor, poor women. Well…it just makes me want to cry.

Truth be told if it were possible I’d be a house husband in a heartbeat. I’m not saying it’s always easy and is not hard work sometimes, but I am saying it damn sure beats having to be in the rat race every single day dealing with the stress of holding down a job.

Unfortunately we will probably not see many housewives ever again. See once the feminists screwed you ladies into thinking “you can have it all,” corporations said: “wait a min, there’s now two incomes in each household….. raise the prices on everything…. making it almost impossible for any man making less than say $120K or so a year to be able to afford a housewife and still live a middle class life style.

@A Bell

I’m glad you’re able to do this in your household.

@blueskys

I hate to interrupt your pipe dream, but chances of you being able to be a housewife and still not be dirt poor are slim to none. You can thank the 2nd wave feminists as you haul your ass off to work everyday to be chained to some cubicle or work your fingers to the bone in manual labor. My condolences to you and the rest of women along with all men who must now suffer because of feminism.

[βιυεsκγs]

@Exterminatore I read all your comment, feminism is rubbish🤣 at the same time, I would feel kinda bad if my other half was working so hard and I was at home all day

[Exterminatore]

@blueskys

I’m glad you seem to enjoy my sarcasm and satire.

I don’t think it would be anything to feel bad about. One makes the cash, the other tends the house. That would be a fair exchange. That’s if it were possible but it pretty much isn’t anymore in America.

[A_Bell]

@Exterminatore I think the corporate world is where your soul goes to die. How was that defined as success?

Every minute I am with my two baby girls an my DH, is joy. I've never had a job where I did things for someone I loved.

[Exterminatore]

@A. Bell.

I agree. Women were jealous of men. They seemed to think before the 60’s men went off to a job where they got all this honor and glory and prestige.

The reality is no different now than then really. Men in reality went off to a job and got their asses kicked every day.

They also wanted money so they could leave their husbands, so success in the cooperate world was seen as part of success in that goal.

[WhitneySnow]

Because some guys expect women to be subservient to men and to exist in a dependent relationship with them. And yes we should be given credit for being responsible adults once we cross that threshold because for generations women were not given credit for that.

[RealMarek]

There are plenty of women who are independent because they have to be. My girlfriend, for example, has a loser ex who never paid child support. It’s not something she brags about or anything, but she had to go back to work and restore order to her own household and life. There are many such cases.

[AnusNdaPainus]

No because as a woman society is more likely to put programs in place and lend a helping hand if she is down and out

just being born female puts women in a safety netting

but men we have to fight or the world will eat us alive once a man turns 18 the world will watch you starve and die

help isn’t coming for men and we know better than to expect it

[Anonymous]

That would depend on your definition of "independent woman" & "an average man"!

But consider this, The "an average man" is single as the vast majority of men never marry, and that is how it has been since the beginning of the specie, and do all of the domestic work that women do.

As for the "independent woman" she is doing what the "an average man" is doing, but they seem to be doing it intentionally, and not choosing or delaying marriage.

Where the "an average man" is where he is mostly through society and the choice of Women

[Kaamraj]

Equal to meaning how? Legally, absolutely, financially no, the average man outearns the average woman and it has nothing to do with the gender pay gap but choices in career, hours worked, skills, etc. But men never go out and chest-pound that they are independent because it's expected of them.

[Likes2drive]

Definitely interesting way of looking at it, the fact they still have to say they’re independent shows they usually need men in most cases so I guess we mostly have traditional women. Guys like to feel needed anyway so it’s not a bad thing. Not all men are independent even though they have to be

[genericname85]

i think being "independend" is nothing you should be proud of. men who are "independend" are called simps. cause for men, not having a partner means he's a failure. for women, somehow that's an achievement for some reason.

[genericname85]

meant to say incel not simp xD but i guess these words mean nothing anyway

[Likes2drive]

Yeah that’s funny how it’s an achievement if a woman doesn’t have a man and is on her own

[OddBeMe]

Um you’re confounding several different things. I could say why can’t you LGBT aholes stop obstructing Women’s rights?

It makes not sense.

But to make the best of this shitshow of word vomit, the average male still has more opportunity and way more wealth than the average woman. But it is equalizing.

[genericname85]

how does any of this have anything to do with lgbt? and how does what i said obstruct womens rights? if you accuse others of "word vomit", you better make your own shit concise.

[DextroShade]

When women say they are "independent" it is a huge red flag 🚩 because what they mean is "independent from a man". If she wants to be boast about her independence she is recreational use only and should never be considered for serious relationships or marriage.

[Anonymous]

I don’t know, but if someone feels the need to tell me they’re “independent”, I lose interest because that just tells me their focus is going to be in themselves and they have no need for me. And sure, you can say, no one should “need” their partner, but I actually disagree. There has to be a certain level of need for each-other or you’re easily replaceable.

[VIVANT]

Yea it’s a sexist term. It implies Basic living is somehow super big girl pants for women.

[Billlewis]

Perhaps, but you're so far beyond the category of 'average' that I believe you could easily date probably 80% of the female population if you so desired, Sir.

[whirled_up_girl]

I agree there should be no need for a special label. It should be equal, either independent men and women or average men and women to describe being able to sustain one’s self in life.

[Anonymous]

:- we need to stop labelling others. If a person is a hard working, modest, honest, reliable, loyal person, they get my respect. I don't respect people who let their status and power go to their head so they act like assholes or bitches to other whether it's in a marriage, a "friendship", a co-worker, a boss, a professor, a teacher, police officer, even a celebrity.

[Drewtate]

An "independent woman" is basically an adult female.

Sigma male as a title is the equivalent of a strong independent female. Basically they are claiming to be adults.

[inhua]

no because the moment a spider, snake, cockroach or rat gets discovered, all that independence goes out the window

[Anonymous]

Women have been forced in the house and to be financially dependent on their parents usually (father) or husband. So being independent is being financially dependent and not being stuck in that cycle of dependency…

[genericname85]

yes like 100 years go. it's not like women were liberated recently or something. at least in western societies.

[Anonymous]

I'd say she is inferior to an average man. Because she doesn't need a man nor does she deserve one.

[genericname85]

the concept of "deserving" something is nonsensical to me.

[Anonymous]

Actually no, all men are independent, the average man is moderately successful. Therefore, an independent woman corresponds to a man below the average, in the 10th percentile.

[genericname85]

i mean that just stands and falls with whatever you subjectively determine to be moderately successfull. cause certainly women who choose to go for a career instead of a partnership do quite well as well. in fact women do better in schools then men.

[Opinion Owner]

No, in fact when I said that the average man is moderately successful I am speaking only in the professional economic aspect (net survival).

[Opinion Owner]

Women get better grades in school, not because they are smarter, but because by nature they need to be liked, whereas men don't care, in fact they don't like being nerdy. At the university level, men dominate engineering, which is the school where truly intelligent people go.

[genericname85]

the correct argument you can make is that men are on average slightly more successfull in their career "all things being the same" (education level, working hours, wage negotiation skill level and so forth). not that the average man is moderately successfull and the average woman is not. when it comes to intelligence, the bell curve for men is ever so slightly shifted towards higher intelligence and the female bel curve is more flat meaning the distribution at either extreme is slightly higher and the average is slightly lower in proportion than in men.

[genericname85]

the only way you can make that argument is if you arbitrarily make a subjectife cut-off for what you define as "successfull".

[Opinion Owner]

Man has a higher intelligence quotient, he is more successful, because he is stronger and more intelligent, simple.

[genericname85]

the difference in iq is negligible. it does by itself not create a great enough disperaty between male and female income. that is evident from multivariate correlation between income and gender where iq is a controll variable.