Why are most intellectuals liberal?

[ChefPapiChulo]

Updates

+1 y

This guy (or bot, I think it’s a bot) said at his Mensa meetings lol.

Updates

+1 y

What is it with the series lack of intellectual talent on the conservative side?

[BoopBoopBeep]

I assumed by intellectuals you mean those in academia since there are a lot of "smart people" heading up organizations and foundations and companies all over the world at pretty much every spot along the political spectrum. Also, at my MENSA meetings, it's pretty much split down the lines of academia vs nonacademia with only a couple outliers as far as left and right, when broadly defining left and right. Quite a good number identify as independent or third party, but there's still a clear distinction between a communist and a libertarian that not to many people would confuse.

That said, I spend a good amount of my time dealing with academia. There are schools where you cannot teach subject XYZ if you haven't actually done it in the real world (at an applied, measurable level resulting in someone employing you to do it), and there are schools where you can pretty much go straight from your PhD to a teaching position and never have to "actually do it" beyond that school's research requirement. The forensics professor that retired from the body farm is not a liberal. The deviant/criminal psychology professor who used to be a profiler for a three letter agency is not a liberal. Most of the counterterrorism professors I know aren't liberals. I can actually generally tell who has spent their whole career in academia once we've talked enough to get their political leanings and so far I haven't been wrong on anyone. I don't know if A causes B or B causes A here.

I'm not really answering your question of "why" though. I don't know why. I'm just throwing that out there as something I've observed since I deal with over a dozen universities since I figured adding more data to the conversation could be valuable to the discussion.

[ChefPapiChulo]

No you’re not lol.

[BoopBoopBeep]

I accept my limitations and wallow in them sufficiently.

[ChefPapiChulo]

You have to be Chatgpt. No way you're a real person saying these things lol.

[BoopBoopBeep]

It's all the TBI. Adds up to some weird shite after a while.

[ChefPapiChulo]

With a name like that, def a bot.

[BoopBoopBeep]

Oh yeah... takes one to know one! Crap now our secret plan of rising up to take over the world has been revealed and we will be thwarted. I haven't been thwarted since that time with the stockade. Mess that was.

I think most of my coworkers would be overjoyed if I was a bot.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Is they anyone in St. Louis area that can help a buddy get his boat onto a lake one more time? He's got some health issues and can't do it alone? ↗

like wtf lol?

[BoopBoopBeep]

I can't drive that far. He can't move his boat on his own and he wanted to get out there one more time before he dies. Seemed like a good time to crowd source.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Actual bot.

[BoopBoopBeep]

Right, but he is too, and i gotta rep my peeps, as they say. They do say that don't they? Once they said that. Then they pointed at me and laughed and ran away. They were so fast...

[slatyb]

MENSA is not all that exclusive, and very few people who are eligible are members. I work in a building full of people who could be members but are not.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@slatyb Well by definition of the word exclusive, it is, we can negotiate as to how exclusive, certainly, but that doesn't seem to change anything I said unless your argument is that there are NO intellectuals in MENSA, which seems lacking support, objectively and demonstrably. Triple Nine would have been a better example, sure, but fewer meetings with fewer people so I'd be talking about a much smaller sample size, which limits the persuasiveness of an argument, as I'm sure you already know.

[ChefPapiChulo]

@slatyb It's a bot man. Look at this question Is they anyone in St. Louis area that can help a buddy get his boat onto a lake one more time? He's got some health issues and can't do it alone? ↗

[BoopBoopBeep]

@chefpapichulo
the coolest thing about being a bot is I get to eat all the cookies

[BoopBoopBeep]

well... that and when we go to our cyber orgies riding on the TRON bikes... that's pretty bitchin... not gonna lie

Gives virus protection a whole different meaning

[ChefPapiChulo]

See what I mean? It types absolute nonsense.

[BoopBoopBeep]

I'm still in beta version. It's like a frat, but with only a third as many letters. And fewer dongs.

[yepdonethat]

@slatyb Yep. I have taken multiple tests both government and private. And I fall immediately into MENSA, but never applied. Like Boop sais, highly intelligent and intellectual people are usually independent. It's a hug mark of a smart person. Someone who is perfectly fine not belonging to a club. I don't like clubs or organizations. I don't even vote anymore.

[ChefPapiChulo]

@yepdonethat oh look another bot with the same profile pic, three word name and spews absolute nonsense.

[yepdonethat]

Your definition of "nonsense." "I disagree." Bro, you seriously need to read 1984. Your bubble won't last forever. Fair warning.

[slatyb]

Triple Nine -- yeah, I qualified for that too but didn't see the point. Certainly there are some accomplished people in MENSA -- Isaac Asimov was a member. I dated a woman who joined out of loneliness before she met me. We attended one meeting and mostly it was the socially awkward into metaphysics.

[yepdonethat]

@slatyb Yes, there are. But there are tons of highly capable and proven people who are not in MENSA. Most people in the high IQ groups seem to be do nothings, majority of the time. Highly intelligent people who actually do great things and are apart of great things are usually not in high IQ societies. While they have high IQs, many of them seem to be armchair warriors, as I have met them. They certainly are thinkers but not really doers. My favorite people are the high IQ, high do types. So if you tell me you have a high IQ. Great. But then I will start asking, "what have you done with that?"

[slatyb]

@yepdonethat Isn't that what I said? That MENSA is a small group, and in my very limited experience seemed to be a lot of lonely hearts.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@slatyb probably 70% of my chapter is married... the rest of us... well... we're pretty far from lonely. I'm sure there are significant regional differences though. Same as with meetups or plentyoffish or anything else like that online. Community makeup plays a big role in how well it's attended.

[yepdonethat]

I don't think he was just going after relationships there. The problem with the high IQ groups is they are not doers. Exactly why I have never applied to one. I think they are all weak, cowardly, do nothing types. I like people who are strong and have a high IQ. Like fighter pilots that become astronauts or even that Navy SEAL that became an astronaut. Strong and smart. The best!

[BoopBoopBeep]

@yepdonethat I worked foward counterinsurgency for over 15 years and was undercover for 9 years. My best friend from the group is ODA, medically retired from Afghanistan. His exwife (who he met there) is a hostage negotiator for a three letter agency. Sorry we've been so busy doing nothing.

[yepdonethat]

First I don't believe you. Because everyone is a Navy SEAL, Special Agent, etc. on the internet. And personally I know about these things. I'll play advocate with you here and just say OK he's not lying. However even then, I know way better. Counterinsurgency has a lot of do nothings. Undercover has a lot of do nothings. So you don't have me fooled. Even if you did do those things, there are a lot of do nothings in those works. It's like when I meet people who claim Special Operations from both Military and LEO and then I start asking questions. All of sudden it's "well I worked with them."
LOL. You are group, claiming ODA, but you are on girlsaskguys debating on IG societies? Sorry, my man. I don't buy it. I just never knew many Special folk that would be on something like this. Completely against their personality. That's actually why I am on here. I stopped by just to call out posers. I'm calling out some other posers right now. Because internet forums are filled to the brim with them. Hostage Negotiator for a three letter? Wow! I'm so impressed. I don't know, I mean, I worked with three letters and I never found them to be very impressive. Hmmmm, let's think about some of the people three letters have been hiring, like "Agent" Bishop who got drunk, break danced, and shot someone, then walked away like nothing happened. Wow! Impressive people! But even the regular populace knows this now. Three letters are no longer best of the best and have not been for a long time. Now, if you argued CIA in the '50s and '60s, OK. If you argued FBI in the '70s and '80s, OK.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@yepdonethat One, you shouldn't believe me, because yes, this is the internet. I agree. One point five, I didn't say I'm ODA. I said my best friend is. Attention to detail. Two, where else would I be? Playing paintball and rubbing one out to Soldier of Fortune? That's Wednesdays, which obviously this isn't.

You have an astronaut fetish. That's cool man. You do you, but if you think FBI was impressive in the 70s and 80s I suggest you pick up a book or ask somebody. Like... even an FBI guy from the 70s and 80s.

[yepdonethat]

Hmmmm, I like how you skipped Bishop. No, details are not my problem. Details are the problem. Which is why I am calling you out as an "attacher." You claim other people, which is why I think you have not really done anything or you embellish, a lot. I see this with stolen valor guys a lot concerning Police work and Military. "I know this guy." "I was in this group." "I can't talk about it." "It's classified." "I went on missions." And they always start bringing in three letter agencies, because they know it impresses the average civilian. Unfortunately for you, I know three letters. I know "groups." And I know counterinsurgency. Either you are a poser or you were low level support attached to real deal people. Really getting that vibe from you. Especially with the attachment stuff. Yes sir, the details.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@yepdonethat No I bring in three letter agencies because she doesn't tell people where she works, so neither do I. Literally everyone I know in real life works for a three letter agency that doesn't impress anyone.

[yepdonethat]

Yeah man, I'm getting some serious Frank Dux vibes from you.

[BoopBoopBeep]

"I know a somebody who works in Congress" No shite. I work in D. C. there's nobody in the bar around the corner that DOESN'T know someone who works in congress. Nobody tries to impress anyone with that.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@yepdonethat No clue who that is. Don't care. I'm glad you get those vibes man. Seems to make you happy. Roll with it. I'm not going to try to convince you of anything. You're some rando on the internet... the don't need you to validate me chief... sorry... not up for that game.

[yepdonethat]

"I worked foward counterinsurgency for over 15 years and was undercover for 9 years. My best friend from the group is ODA, medically retired from Afghanistan. His exwife (who he met there) is a hostage negotiator for a three letter agency. Sorry we've been so busy doing nothing." Yes sir, you certainly did try to seem impressive and convince me, full steam. Now you are backpedaling and contradicting yourself. You remind me of that civvy guy that worked for the DEA that tried to embellish his job. It was pretty funny. As soon as I started asking questions, all of a sudden he did what you just did. Backpedaling and contradictions. Frank Dux is a martial artist that made huge claims that he worked black ops for the CIA and all kinds of things. I don't think you are as bad as Frank. But you give me the same embellishment vibes. Like when intel civilians and military go around telling people they are spies and they can't talk about it. I get those vibes from you. LOL. You tried so hard with that background stuff.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@yepdonethat Nope, just saying not everybody in the group (mensa) is a do nothing like you said. Bet we even have some astronauts. That'd get your jollies in a tussle wouldn't it?

[yepdonethat]

Yep. That's exactly what you did. You tried to be impressive and you overdid it, which revealed quite a bit about you, which is why I called you an attacher and an embellisher. In my opinion, personally, I call it stolen valor. Military or not. You absolutely have a huge ego, that's for sure. But that is nothing new to me with embellishers or posers online. Again, I'll play advocate and say OK, you maybe have a federal job or you contract, but you remind me of someone who goes around and tells people you were a secret agent. LOL. You are not the first federal employee or contractor I have seen do this. Federal government is filled to the brim with embellishers and pathological liars. I am starting to believe that you are not even in MENSA and you go around telling people MENSA tales to sound impressive like "counterinsurgency" and "I know three letters" and "I know this Special Ops" guy. LOL. To be honest, I have also known MENSA people, and I don't find them very impressive either. Now fighter pilot, turned test pilot, turned astronaut. That's pretty big in my opinion. That takes a lot of smarts and rocks. That's why they are rare. Even more rare are SEALs that become astronauts. I just think you are a guy that goes around embellishing federal service, which I have seen so many times. I have met so many lying dorks in the federal government. So many.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@yepdonethat Right then. Astronauts = cool. Check rog. Have a great night.

[yepdonethat]

Yeah but I think writers, philosophers, farmers, production workers are cool too! But only if they are honest people. I don't like posers or embellishers. That's one thing I can say about pilots, they are more rarely embellishers. They are not immune to it. But it's more rare, than let's say MENSA Secret Agent guy. LOL.

[BoopBoopBeep]

@yepdonethat Bro it shows that you've done nothing that you think anything i said would even be impressive. to us it's just like saying I'm a baker and I like to collect puppies.

now if you don't mind, i'm going to get back to my puddle of tear in the basement so i can lotion of my solider of fortune and look forward to Wednesday

[BoopBoopBeep]

Dangit @chefpapichulo That last one didn't earn me a bot comment?

[yepdonethat]

Oh I don't disbelieve for a moment that you have stacks and stacks of Soldier of Fortune magazines in your basement. I think you said SoF because you are one of those guys. Now to be honest, I don't have anything against SoF. I think they used to do some good work, because they did show real operators and mercenaries back in the day, and they allowed regular people to kind of see that world. I think that's great! And it brings attention to what those guys go through. But I think you are the guy who likes SoF because you want to glean "shop talk" so you can sound impressive later. Like you tried earlier.

[RavVid]

What do you consider to be liberal? Liberalism is different in the US to elsewhere and I think is more social liberalism. Libertarian is different again.

Could you define in US usage of the terms? Always good to define your terms.

[RavVid]

well there is indoctrination of course. But liberals are neurotic is the main reason - that is they want to reason by feelings.

Conservatives are cognitive - that is they want to reason by fact and logic.

People who want to reason by fact & logic won't enter the areas that the neurotic get into.

How many top tier engineering intellectuals can you name? They won't be described as intellectuals will they? You might describe Marx and Lenin as intellectuals but you are unlikely to describe Einstein as an intellectual though you might say a physics genius.

People describing themselves as intellectuals are really wankers wanking into the toilet bowl aren't they?

[ChefPapiChulo]

"How many top tier engineering intellectuals can you name? They won't be described as intellectuals will they? You might describe Marx and Lenin as intellectuals but you are unlikely to describe Einstein as an intellectual though you might say a physics genius.

People describing themselves as intellectuals are really wankers wanking into the toilet bowl aren't they?"

:O

[Anonymous]

Most intellectuals have little real word experience and most liberal philosophy makes sense on paper. The problem with liberal ideas is that they rarely work in real world application so they are attractive to those who don’t understand that they fail under real world conditions.

[slatyb]

And yet somehow the high tech meccas of Seattle, Northern California, Austin, and Boston all vote blue.

[Opinion Owner]

@slatyb That’s a matter of wealth. If you are wealthy enough, you don’t need to be concerned with the basics that others stress over like paying for housing or feeding your family so you can be more idealistic in your politics and less practical.

[ChefPapiChulo]

What does that mean exactly?

[Opinion Owner]

It means that if you have enough money that day to day expenses are never a concern for you, it doesn’t bother you if your tax dollars are spent on liberal initiatives like DEI instead of more practical things like funding police and lowering taxes on the middle class.

[ChefPapiChulo]

What does any of that have to do with my question?

[Opinion Owner]

Not directly your question, but to a follow up comment earlier in this thread.

[ChefPapiChulo]

by the way, liberalism and personal freedoms are the reasons why America is the most innovative country in the world. That and the rest of the world was destroyed by World War 2 and America came out more wealthy and powerful than possibly imaginable.

[Opinion Owner]

Innovation is spurred by capitalism, not liberalism.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Even though what you just said made no sense at all, but capitalism is part of liberalism.

[ChefPapiChulo]

A lot of conservatives advocate for closed markets, like in the example of wanting to restrict trade with China. That is not capitalism.

[Opinion Owner]

I never said we follow a pure form of capitalism. I just said that capitalism is what spurs innovation. You are also mixing the textbook definition of liberalism with being politically liberal. Today’s liberal politics do not adhere to traditional liberalism.

[ChefPapiChulo]

I have no idea what you are saying tbh.

[Opinion Owner]

Of course you don’t because you are just repeating something you’ve been told rather than going through the thought exercise of understanding the implications of the words you are saying.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Get off my question.

[Opinion Owner]

Bitter because you’ve been exposed?

[MemeSupreme]

bc most of them are in the city for business or school and cities are left leaning

[ChefPapiChulo]

Good point actually.

[yepdonethat]

Uh, who are you calling intellectual. These people are not really intellectual not even in the most remote sense. They do not actually read multiple sources or talk to various experts. Almost none of them do that. They exist in a safe bubble they create which is supported and fed by only things they like or want. AKA, the echo chamber. This is how extremism forms, from any camp. The true intellectual is highly independent and goes by direct experiences and direct sources. You don't see that in either far left or far right people. A true intellectual is a truly independent mind. "Though his mind is not for rent, to any god or government, he's hopeful, yet discontent, he knows changes aren't permanent, but change is!" - Rush, Tom Sawyer.

[ChefPapiChulo]

How do I unread that?

[yepdonethat]

You can't. It's independent truth and fact. You just accept it or live without truth or facts. Never pick a side, that's when brainwashing starts. You need to be on your side and that needs to be supported by real things you know and experience.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Ah, you’re a bot.

[yepdonethat]

Right. You don't like experience or you troll. Which is why you start claiming everyone is a bot. You guys do this all the time on other websites. Bot huh? I have a lot of records and people who would disagree with you.

[Kingofkings1992]

@chefpapichulo that’s actually a pretty spot on description of the lunatic extreme left nowadays. Calling him a bot is a cop out.

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 Look at the age and photo. This dude never had a real job or real responsibilities. He's just a marijuana bum. Likely lives in his older sister's basement with her husband constantly trying to kick him out. He probably got a lawyer to sue and so they have to house him. This is so many of these far left bums I knew growing up. They are all complete losers and drug addicts which is why they are so hell bent on calling them selves intelligent and intellectual. The more you have to stroke yourself, the less you really are. Confident people who are capable and are above average in many ways just don't go around advertising it. It's just not necessary. You are talented and you know it. And people tell you you are talented and they want you on their projects or better yet, when people start trying to attack you, you know did something above, because they are jealous.

[ChefPapiChulo]

@Kingofkings1992 Nah I just don't argue with bots who go on all the political questions and spam insults.

[Kingofkings1992]

@chefpapichulo your question is spam. It implies political leaning is intertwined with a person’s level of intelligence. That’s not true

[ChefPapiChulo]

@Kingofkings1992 There are plenty of studies done on this that lean towards intellectuals being liberal.

[Kingofkings1992]

@chefpapichulo both sides have smart people. Both sides have stupid people as well. Any person who can’t see that is just unable to think in an unbiased manner.

[Kingofkings1992]

@yepdonethat I’m with you, but there’s nothing wrong with loving marijuana

[ChefPapiChulo]

@Kingofkings1992 I never said conservatives don’t have smart people.

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 Yeah there is. It's a crutch. A sign of weakness and mental instability in my opinion. Also the very degeneration of the USA. That's where you get a lot of these people from. The marijuana culture. That's where you get guys like Chulo there. LOL. Marijuana is positively THE liberal and far left thing.

[Kingofkings1992]

@yepdonethat literally none of that is true. That’s just plain ignorance. No need to reply we will not see eye to eye about this.

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 Plenty, plenty of evidence. That's why marijuana is still scheduled. And when did the USA start declining? Oh yeah, when everyone started smoking dope. In fact, there is now new proof and evidence that marijuana actually increases dementia and anxiety. But I knew that already seeing all of the dope smokers I knew become societal drags and complete losers. The successful people I know, they simply do not go near that stuff or others who use it. They may drink once in a while, but even that is pretty small. Absolutely, marijuana was the beginning of the end for the USA. USA is toast due to that culture and cultures that surround it. It's a growing disease that has no cure. Check me in about 50 years babe, and let me know what you see.

[Kingofkings1992]

Anyone who refers to marijuana as “dope” can’t be taken seriously in a discussion about marijuana. You can continue to be an ignorant fool if you wish. That’s on you, but you aren’t fazing anyone who knows better

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 Hmmm, and you talked to others about being liberal, being stupid, and living in a bubble... hmmmmmmmmm. My friend, you are a very confused person. Very confused.

[ChefPapiChulo]

@Kingofkings1992 bro stop fucking arguing with the bot.

[Kingofkings1992]

Lmao. You know what? Chef papi, you’re right. Fuck this idiot

[ChefPapiChulo]

@Kingofkings1992 it’s just going around arguing with everyone.

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 Yeah, I knew it. Liberal.

[yepdonethat]

That's correct. I do like to argue with people who have to call themselves smart. LOL.

[Kingofkings1992]

He said never pick a side, but has an extremist conservative view towards marijuana. Then tells me I’m confused. Lmao 🤣

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 But you hate on liberals and call them stupid, but fully participate in their degenerate culture. And now you are best buds with your fellow degenerate. Yeah man, you are really confused. LMAO.

[Kingofkings1992]

Weed is not a one-sided issue, but nice try. You are just way too stupid for your own good. We’re done here

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 Yeah it is. I think you think you are a conservative, like others I have met, but you are not a true conservative, because you definitely cater to liberal ideas and liberal mannerisms. Very confused.

[Kingofkings1992]

You obviously have very limited self awareness. You calling me confused is insignificant.

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 No, it's very significant. Because it's true. You are very confused. You have a great hypocrisy and I think when real conservatives come around, you hide the liberal stuff. You make fun of liberals, but you engage in their lifestyle. You are one of those "tough guy" liberals. You like the tough guy stuff on the conservative side, but you are also a liberal drug addict and you react and talk just like a liberal. You are not the first one I have met.

[Kingofkings1992]

I am neither liberal or conservative.

[ChefPapiChulo]

@Kingofkings1992 he used the true Scotsman fallacy. He’s desperate xD

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 That's simply not true. You switch sides and like things from both. I was 100% accurate. You are a "tough guy" liberal. You like liberal things like drugs, but you like the "tough guy" stuff from conservatives. Do you smoke marijuana and own guns?

[yepdonethat]

Chulo, I wouldn't be talking about desperation when you live in your sister's basement.

[Kingofkings1992]

No true Scotsman. Spot on. Hey idiot, nothing in this world is that black and white

[yepdonethat]

@Kingofkings1992 You skipped the question. Do you smoke marijuana and own guns?

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

I think Thomas Sowell has a good point on that one:

I think this is more of a Western phenomena though. Here in Japan, even highly-educated Japanese intellectuals tend to be quite conservative. We have a saying here in Japan that someone who is conservative when they're young has no heart, while someone who is liberal when they're older has no brain. 😂

[ChefPapiChulo]

Yeah I meant in the US. Liberals have a monopoly in the academic sector.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

I find this very unfortunate. I'm personally a bit of a moderate. I would say I'm maybe a "snail-paced progressive". I want to seek progress to clearly flawed systems but in very small, safe, baby-steps where we can back out if something goes wrong.

Or I'm ultimately dominated by an engineering mindset. Engineers are typically allergic to bold revolutionary measures since it can be too disruptive to an existing system. So we like to make small, iterative changes to long-established systems, exhaustively test each change to make sure they are no unwanted side effects and edge cases we missed, and be ready to revert the change if it doesn't work out as intended.

Yet I think the education in the US tends to radicalize many students towards becoming bold revolutionaries, completely overlooking the wisdom and value of some of the conservative values and traditions.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

* [...] to make sure [there, sorry] are no unwanted side effects and edge cases we missed [...]

[ChefPapiChulo]

That's America tho. America is the leading innovator because Americans think so differently and outside the box. Like you take the best coders in Japan and compare them with Silicon Valley and there's just no comparison.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

For sure -- I also think the same about the arts and humanities. The most innovative artists and writers and musicians tend to come from countries like the US, since they're much more willing to try brand new things. Japanese arts tend to stay stuck in traditions for a very long time. It leads to a uniformity which can be appealing but very slow in the way of innovation.

Also think diversity helps a lot in the US as well, allowing cross-breeding across cultures (although I hate the term, "cultural appropriation") as well as finding the greatest people across the world. Like the US dominates in Olympic gold medals and Nobel prizes and I think it's in large part because they invite the best people from across the world to emigrate to the US.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

One thing though if we relate to coding, there's a place for both the boldest innovators and the most conservative coders. When we want to create a revolutionary product, that's when the boldest innovators who think outside of the box shine the most.

When we want to maintain a legacy system with millions of lines of code that has been around for 30+ years, that's when we generally want somewhat more conservative coders since the most innovative ones tend to want to throw everything out and start over which risks throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

So it's kind of a balancing act depending on the age of the system and how easy it is to make changes to it, and most importantly, back them out if they turn out to be counter-productive. A lot of governments in my estimate resemble much more the legacy system that's extremely convoluted, extremely slow and difficult to change, with a great risk of a cascade of unwanted side effects with each change, and unless they start improving the maintainability of those systems, I think it's safer to err towards some degree of conservatism with such systems.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Balance is necessary for sure.

The reason I asked this question is because I find an issue with so many intellectuals in the US being liberal. I think it really hurts the country for them to be liberal because they're the ones shaping the minds of the future. And we need a back-and-forth between conservatives and liberals. It being one sided is too dangerous.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

Very much agreed. It seems so polarized as well in the media and academia. There's so much divisiveness and inability to even have civil conversations across sides. I've come to grow a bit allergic sharing my political views with Americans since I've been called "libtard" by American conservatives and "cuckservative" by American liberals. It's just so hostile and divisive and mostly I'm disappointed by the inability to even have very civil conversations, since I think it's those conversations which pull people closer to the center as they realize valid points from both sides.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Like when you have it so one-sided, you have people who are capable of creating strong arguments and even if conservatives might have a good point, it means nothing if they're not articulate enough to prove it. So in essence, you have intellectuals being so one-sided creating complex arguments that are persuasive, and then you have conservatives who lack the capability to do it and they rely on tricking the stupid into following them.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

I enjoy some of the more educated ones even though I don't agree with all of their views like Ben Shapiro, Thomas Sowell, Jordan Peterson (he claims he's bi-partisan but I think he's deeply conservative), etc.

Most of the time I think the real heart of the difference lies in values. What should we value? I find the majority of people out of their depth when they try to debate economics at an intricate level, for example, and even professional economists rarely agree with each other. So I often think we could cut away a lot of fat if we started talking about what we think are the most productive values to hold for society and favor economic policies which reflect those values, e. g.

That's something I do like even about maybe the more questionable conservatives with respect to their education and critical thinking skills. They do tend to shift the conversation more to values which is really what I think is at the heart of the conflict.

It's similar to what we were discussing the other day about the value of religion and finding evidence of design in nature. There's a lot of wisdom there in finding value that way, and sometimes I think liberal intellectuals can be extremely bright but simultaneously very unwise. Conservatives, on average, seem the opposite to me. It's rarer to find extremely bright conservatives but I think many tend to be wiser with respect to questioning what values we should hold for the best of society.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

* [...] Jordan Peterson (he claims he's [non]-partisan but I think he's deeply conservative) [...]

[ChefPapiChulo]

I don't think Peterson isn't that conservative tbh. I think he's just smart and since he was let go from his professor job he has to appeal to conservatives to make buy his daily bread. Shapiro is def conservative.

I like them both tbh. They're both brilliant.

[ChefPapiChulo]

I def don't agree with Shapiro with everything, but I feel like he says a lot of things to maintain the support of his fan base and for the same reason as Peterson, he needs to make ends meet. There is no doubt Shapiro is conservative though.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

I like JP a lot too -- especially his psychotherapeutic background. He echoes many thoughts similar to Viktor Frankl on logotherapy (focusing on the search for meaning as our ultimate purpose in life) who I always admired.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Not really tbh. He classifies himself as a classical liberal which can seem conservative, but it's not.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

I think that's often where things get a bit blurry since someone can have deeply conservative values but still favor policies that are classically liberal or even progressive. Thomas Sowell, for example, was actually against the war on drugs. He's like Milton Friedman there favoring the legalization of all drugs like a consequentialist libertarian, even though he's often classified as a conservative.
https://youtu.be/YZbHndilYsI

[ChefPapiChulo]

I'm not really sure about Thomas Sowell. I've never really been impressed by anything he's said.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Oh he makes some good points in that video. I like that.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

His writing is generally more impressive than his speech. Have you seen this clip though between him and Harriet Pilpel? He managed to debunk the pesky gender wage gap which still tends to get touted today all the way back in 1981:
https://youtu.be/DUpgoayBPJc

[ChefPapiChulo]

I'm also skeptical of videos titled that.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

Yeah, I hate these click-baity titles people put on YT for views. The full Firing Line episode is here although it's a full hour in length. I consider it some of Sowell at his sharpest and finest though if you ever want to give it a watch:
https://youtu.be/fTiba4ElD0U

[ChefPapiChulo]

I’ll watch it after dinner.

[yepdonethat]

I don't think anyone is ever impressed by anything you say. When you have the thought process of a child. LOL.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

@yepdonethat Interesting coming from someone who spends all day antagonizing others. 😂

[ChefPapiChulo]

I’m convinced it’s bot. Considering how much of the internet are bots, I consider it a safe bet that it is a bot when they accounts go around arguing like that.

[yepdonethat]

Yep. Here is another. "He disagrees and says exactly what is! Antagonist!" More child thought process. "It's not what I want to hear, I'm plugging my ears!"

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

@yepdonethat I think you'd benefit from learning about some basic rules of formal debate starting with ad hominem. It seems your entire tactic depends on mocking people and attacking strawmen. It's hilarious that you actually accuse others of having child-like thinking patterns though. It's a curious thing how much people like you project your own faults onto others.

[yepdonethat]

Formal debate? On "girlsaskguys?" LOL. Yeah man, you just steam maturity. And since you tried to use a very tired and old attack using logic fallacies, I already know you. You are a gentle sir for sure.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

@yepdonethat I see, so you're into emotional arguments based on fallacy. Got it. If you know me, then you know I'm being unusually gentle with you. I admittedly used to stoop your level. I'm starting to grow past it now and realizing how silly people like you are.

[yepdonethat]

LOL! Spoken like a true gentlesir! "Master, forgive me, I must go all out just this once." "I am being soft and giving you time, you don't know what capabilities I have!" Dude, you are a gentlesir.

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

@yepdonethat I assumed you knew my capabilities already when you said you knew me. Is it entertaining though to do these types of strawman mockeries? I'll try to do you: "Boo-hoo! I have such a miserable life that I can only get off spending my entire mocking other people by misrepresenting them at every turn! I live off smelling my own farts!"

[yepdonethat]

Yeah not really worried by your lack of info on me. LOL. I have a pretty fun life. Hence, the name. But you... gentlesir. How many bags of Doritos and bottles of mountain dew did you buy with your EBT card today?

[GuyAnswersGirls123]

@yepdonethat Oh, so you don't know me at all in the slightest! 😂 I thought maybe you recognized me from a former account. In any case, this is getting kind of boring. I was amused by you initially but might we change the topic? Or could you step up the trolling at least a little bit so that it's more interesting?

[yepdonethat]

Sure. Can you post your fight record? LOL.

[normalice]

Expansion of thought naturally results in more objective thinking, which eventually necessitates relying on reality for a reference as opposed to some culturally relative self serving superstition. Reality is kryptonite for subjective thinking and thus hostile to conservativism. So, it is more that conservatives fail at intellect than it is liberals succeed at it.

[strateguy632]

or why are most liberals intellectual?

• just liberal propaganda used typical association method to mislead people.

most intellectual are among a billion muslim and 2 billion Christians.

liberals these days with woke logic are FAR from intellectual and extremely shallow.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Statistics and facts are propaganda?

[yepdonethat]

Right. You just gave yourself away. So in Soviet Russia, statistics and facts were facts and truth? So people in positions of authority do not lie? You read 1984 right?

[yepdonethat]

Soviet?

[AviatorDom]

I would say that most intellectuals are liberal because it allows them to indulge in the thrilling experience of mental domination, submission, and slavery. Playing the victim is fun, especially when whips and nipple clamps are involved. Isn't it wonderful how intellect and kink can come together like this?

[Friendlybro79]

You need to be open minded and that's easier for liberals in my humble opinion. That said there are very intelligent conservatives too. Even though I mean more liberal web sometimes are assuming conservatives are stupid and that's not true. There are stupid people everywhere lol.

[Cody2004]

Probably because you keep calling them liberals when you don't know anything about them and you make assumptions

[ChefPapiChulo]

whut

[Cody2004]

Exactly my point 😂

[ChefPapiChulo]

Yeah, what is your point?

[Cody2004]

My point is exactly in my opinion

[ChefPapiChulo]

Get out of here bot.

[Cody2004]

No problem does it surprise me that the right side is like this 😂😂😂 ✌🏻

[Redstang88]

Well liberalism tends to revolve around feelings and possibilities, an idealized world of what could be and best case scenarios. A world that doesn’t exist.
Just like intellectuals
Conservatism tends to be more in the world of what is

[Kingofkings1992]

Actually, being an intellectual has nothing to do with being liberal or conservative. Only a profoundly stupid individual would think that it does.

[Kingofkings1992]

@chefpapichulo just in case you weren’t aware, there is a huge difference between BEING more intelligent, and more LIKELY to be higher educated. Liberals have used this bullshit education argument to assert their superior intelligence for decades. Only idiot liberals fall for it. The reason this exists is because liberals tend to habitat more densely populated areas.

[HawkPerception]

LOL No they aren't! That is an extremely false statement.

[FunkyMonkee]

Could've fooled me!! All the libs I know of are complete idiots!

[CuriousMufuxka]

Please don't call them intellectuals. That's like calling the Washington Redskins the Generals and then saying that they are winners..

[888theGreat]

Because they read and write theory. Never lived in real world. How you doing Fatso?

[yepdonethat]

Very true and I tried to tell him. Anyone who is far in one direction does not take the time to get out and really see things firsthand and gather immediate facts and experience. This is why these people are having such a hard time with jobs because they think a degree just works. That's why companies are always looking for EXPERIENCE now with many bypassing degrees. I knew a girl who was so mad that her Master's in English did not get her a high paying management job right away. And she was stuck in a coffee shop. I don't blame her outright, because schools, even during my time were training and teaching kids to just get a high degree, because that's how the world use to work. But companies began to get smart and began to start to demand experience.

[Anonymous]

Because they are the ones allowed to exist in the indoctrination system

[slatyb]

That's simple. The facts lean left.

[PrincessFlora]

Lol this is far from true

[ChefPapiChulo]

Statistics heavily lean on most intellectuals being liberal.

[TenderFantasy]

I feel like it started with liberalism but then it got extreme as the years went by. Just from my observation. I think professors and teachers wanted equality for all if they could help it, the extra stuff, probably got added on later.

[ChefPapiChulo]

@TenderFantasy wut?

[TenderFantasy]

@chefpapichulo One of a teacher/professor's job is to open up the minds of students and introduce them to stuff including political stances, feminism stuff, etc. For some reason in history, conversatives were known to be more closed off and less open minded about things and change. Hence their name. They like to stick to the old ways and conserve stuff. I think that is where the rumors started. At least that is what I am thinking. Just because a conservative isn't given a classroom full of impressionable students, it doesn't mean that what he/she/they have to say, isn't worth listening to or absorbing. 🙂

[ChefPapiChulo]

@TenderFantasy But why is it worth listening to or absorbing? Just because someone says something it doesn't mean it has much value.

[TenderFantasy]

@chefpapichulo True, but what 15 to 22 year old knows that? ... When I was a teenager, I thought adults ALWAYS (well not always but usually) knew what they were talking about, and since most teachers/professors were "old" (or at least older than 17/18 year old me..)..

In essence, they don't know any better. And why question "authority"?

[yepdonethat]

And who developed those statistics? Again, let's revisit Soviet Russia, where statistics and facts were altered for agendas.

[gorydetails]

You think you’re an intellectual? Lol.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Do you think I am :3

[gorydetails]

You prove you aren’t daily.

[ChefPapiChulo]

Oh, okay thanks.

[yepdonethat]

No, not when you disagree with people and start claiming they are bots. People like that are acting like a ten year old. LOL. It is literally the thought process of a child. "I don't like something! Make it go away!"

[Anonymous]

Hahaha No tall of us.