Please Stop The Blame Game About "Having to Pay" for a Date

[Anonymous]

Life is unfair, is it not? We all wish everything could be equal for everyone and no one would feel burdens or pressures or pain in life, but it's not that way. American guys most often do the asking out on dates, and thus etiquette dictates, that the one who asks, should foot the bill. Case in point, you wouldn't ever invite someone to your house for dinner and then expect them to cook, would you? Okay, same principal.

But that's not fair...you guys say, if we always have to do the asking out, we always pay. What did I say at the start? Please re-read the first sentence. Try having a gut punching period every month and then complain about how life is unfair. We are all screwed in this game in one way or another, but here is the thing...are you that screwed though?

No one can force you to pry open your wallet and pay for a date. When you ask out, you do so with the knowledge that you will most likely be paying since you did the asking, so instead of whine about it, do something about it. For one, stop going to these expensive a-- places you can't or don't want to afford. I know a guy that says, I take all my first dates to the local bar on their discount drinks night in the middle of the week, so if it goes terribly, I've paid basically nothing and not ruined my weekend but if it goes great, we can go some place better on the weekend and continue from there.

You can go for a cheap date that isn't cheap. There are free events in nearly every city. One of the best dates I've ever arranged myself when I was extremely broke was I made an entire lunch and dessert for the guy I asked out (thank you very much) and we went to the local park festival (which I fully picked because there was no charge), then had a picnic next to this amazing lake. I didn't pay for any extra crap. We had the best time just exploring the festival, laughing, talking and he appreciated the effort of me actually cooking something for him. We ended up dating for an entire year off of that free date.

You have to change your mindset and become the clever fellows we know you can be and find solutions to "having to pay all the time". Spending copious amount of money isn't always the way to win the girl of your dreams, but if you are going to go that route, do so, because you want to and not because you expect your date to owe you financially or sexually (gross). Also if your date is one that can't stomach the thought of a free or cheap date, then guess what, probably not the one for you. You and your wallet should move on.

[Ozanne]

Very well said! I think the problem a lot of men have is that they have this belief that their wallet is an extension of their penis. Look at GaG alone, where for as long as I've been here, men still think what they make is attractive to women. I've said countless times that the man I married not only DIDN'T have money when I met him (while I did), but he was in DEBT. Afterward, I helped him get out of. So that theory, personally, doesn't apply to me nor many other women out there. We value men who can be appealing to us in so many ways because let's face it: money comes and goes.

With that said, many men falsely use their spending as a way to impress, or as a way to start calculating. There is a video that went around on Twitter some months back where a woman video-recorded her conversation with a man out at dinner, where he was saying "get anything you want" and later when the bill came, she said, "I feel better if I pay my half" and he said, "nope, I'm getting this". He went on to insist it. The moment she said, "well thank you that's very nice of you" was when he suggested they go to her hotel room. She said no. Then he accused her that she used him for a meal out, to which she promptly reminded him that she wanted to pay for half. It didn't end well. His entire mood and demeanor turned sour, and he ended up calling her names.

To me, this is not a date. This is a predator. I've been in this situation as the woman who insists on paying, and I've accepted the date as being paid for, only to find out that there was a transaction of my body that he expected.

Men are too concerned with sex AND their wallet. If they wanted to put the two together, they should just hire an escort. That's not how companionship works when it comes to wanting to get to know a woman. Also, it's not how much you spend, but what you do with your time together. Personally, I've had a blast on coffee dates, and sometimes felt very uncomfortable on dinner dates, knowing how expensive dinners can be, and feeling some sort of expectation put on me unless I pay for my share. Dating doesn't have to be this complicated or this expensive. It certainly shouldn't be used as a way to calculate what you're owed.

Because of the times we're in now, it's best for both men AND women to get this expectation out of the way before the date begins so that you can relax and enjoy the good time out together with an agreement already in place.

[Jukes93]

Not really. The biggest problem is that girls will lead guys on in order to get free food and more. It's a lack of respect. Dating is expensive, and most guys are willing to pay the bill without a problem. This is as long as there is possibility of an actual relationship. The problem comes in when a girl goes on multiple dates with a guy, knowing that they are not interested in order to get free things.

That's just trashy behavior.

[Rei13]

This was a really good take! Generally for me whenever I went on dates I was always prepared to pay for myself. If I didn’t like him and didn’t want to go on another date I would pay for myself because I don’t want to feel obligated to him in any way. Not all guys would let me but I would try. If I really liked him I would let him pay and then on the next date do something nice for him. I like men that are providers that will take care of me and support me, not that I can’t for myself it is just nice being able to depend on another person.

[FellowTraveler]

Geez Rei13, you play both sides of the fence. Your opinion sounds a lot like the traditional female hypocrisy in our new , more enlightened age of equality.

[Jukes93]

I feel like most guys, myself included don't mind paying as long as a real possibility of a relationship exists. I want to be clear that I don't mean an expectation of sex. Good men depend on women having the integrity not to take advantage of men paying for dates with the expectation she is interested in furthering a relationship.

[ohsheeT]

I agree with you I have read some questions about pain and it just totally makes me laugh hard

But I don't understand is why a guy would ask a girl out that he likes that he wants to be with and then make her pay that makes no sense to me


I look at it like this when I like a girl and I want to take her out I take her out and I pay I would never ever ask a girl to pay anything when I'm with her that to me is an embarrassment this is why I work so I have money to do what what I want to do when I want to do it with whoever I want to do it with

I'm not going to ask a girl out that I like and show her only how much I like her by making her pay that's ridiculous that's the most craziest thing I've ever heard my life why would I even do that why would I make a girl pay for anything anyway I'd like her there's a reason why I'm taking her out because I want to be with her and that's the first thing that I would do is make her pay that's ridiculous guys are ridiculous

Guys if you cannot afford to take a girl out do not take a girl out

If you take a girl out and you want to show her exactly who you are go ahead make her pay that's ridiculous you will never have another date because your cheapskate

And you cannot take a girl out and make her pay and then call her names or treat her badly because she didn't want to she thought you were man enough to ask her out be mad enough to pay for it it's 50 to 100 bucks out of your pocket that you knew you were going to have to pay anyway why b**** about it if you can't afford it don't do it if you want to show your cheapskate you want to show her that you really really love her don't do it

[YesterdaysChild]

You must have more money than smarts.

[ohsheeT]

Damn
. lol it has nothing to do with that. What it's all about is if you can't afford to take somebody out don't ask them out.

[YesterdaysChild]

Now THAT was a smart statement. 😉👍👍

[Screenwriter]

Why does anyone HAVE to pay for another person. I have money and I work. I can pay for myself.

Just because a guy likes me and asks me out, he doesn't have to pay for the date. If I ask a guy out, and I like him, I don't feel I should have to pay for him ESPECIALLY if it's a first date. And all men don't make a load of money. They should not be embarrassed if they can't pay for a woman on an initial date. No woman should be embarrassed if they can't pay for a man on a date.

If we're responsible for ourselves and come to a mutual agreement about a, say, coffee date: something just about anybody can afford when first getting to know someone, or a breakfast date, also affordable, or a walk in the park or bicycle date, for the first couple of date dates, all this impressing a woman with your ability to "pay" for her company... is pretty weird.

It's the "no romance without finance" sort of thing that mimics a woman being a prostitute: A man must PAY for her... It's creepy.

I think the time has long arrived where there is a more egalitarian choice/solution that allows for no embarrassment on anyone's part, allows either or both to pay for themselves or the other. But let it be discussed so everyone is comfortable and no one is used or overlooked.

[ohsheeT]

@Screenwriter
What I'm saying for me if I ask a Girl out I'm going to pay.

If I ask a girl out and she says yes but she wants to pay for what ever she gets.

I will ask her if she's sure.
Then I will say how about I will get it and you get the top

Is she insists on paying for her I will say okay and then I will say why don't you get the tip too LOL

[Leapfrog00]

I've always heard whoever asks the person out should pay, though I have picked up a check when asked out, but I think I offended a couple girls doing that before because they really wanted to show me a nice time.

It's definitely nice going on picnics. I used to go on a picnic with this one girl I once dated all the time. I would get a picnic basket, pack some sandwiches, some potato chips, and make these really good blueberry muffins. I packed some sodas and we'd be good to go. Then would go and watch these fountain shows at the park.

A lot of guys have no business dating. There are some real jerks out there that purposely treat girls like something they just stepped in. In the town I live in, most of the guys here are on drugs and very violent because this is a bad neighborhood.

The sandwiches I used to pack and the picnic basket, I used to put little love notes on the sandwich bags. I think I'm too much of a romantic though. From what I've seen, a lot of girls would rather be with a badass guy who doesn't care, so I'm thinking about changing.

But yeah, people should not fight over who's going to pay the check. It's childish.

[myTake Owner]

I'm glad at least one guy sees that you don't have to spend this ton of money on a date. You can have fun doing things for free or cheap. It's about that quality time with someone and building up to hopefully a sustainable relationship. Too much focus on spending money and who is spending it for what purpose. Dating is hard enough as it is.

[Leapfrog00]

I know it! Dating can be so stressful. It's bad enough worrying about appearance, how to act, what to do, who makes the first move. Sometimes it's nice just to sit with someone and watch the beauty in the world. I like to cook for girls, and write them poetry. It's too hard to find anyone in the town I just moved to because it's full of drug addicts, so that definitely adds to the stress!

[OlderAndWiser]

For my generation, the guy pays for every date. It is not a question. It is not an issue for discussion. It is automatically assumed. And I can afford to pay for my dates. I normally suggest an agenda for the date and I don't arrange something that I can't afford. I don't want a woman to pay for a date, and I don't expect sex simply because I paid for her meal. All that I expect is that she will give me her undivided attention while we are together, she will be sincere with me, and she will not agree to a date simply because she wants a free meal. I have plenty of first dates that didn't lead to a second date, but I don't think any woman every agreed to a date simply because she wanted to have prime rib at Seasons 52.

HOWEVER, there is a horrible flaw in your argument. Yes, I understand that life is unfair and all that, but comparing the expenses of dating to having a period is nonsense. Yes, you have periods and, for some women, they are painful. . . but that's not my fault. . . and I can't do anything to help you with that, can I? On the other hand, you can help with the expense of dating, but you choose not to do that. HUGE DIFFERENCE.

When you use analogies, you must think them through very carefully!

[DaveJord]

Okay, first off... a woman's period and who pays for dates are completely unrelated, and woman complain about life is not fair all the time, which usually is laid at the feet of men... but I digress. Because point is the same, deal with people and stop blaming others, and take some personal responsibility. that is all you are really saying here... and that's a universal message to all men and women... and yes you can only be one or the other, a man or woman that is.

But in the end, when comes to dinners, you are right the man is supposed to pay, or just don't ask her to dinner. But when comes to trips and weekend get aways, yeah, she needs to pick up some the that cost. I usually pay for the hotels and transportation, which is the most expensive part of the trip... and I do not stay in cheap hotels. The deal usually is that she pays for the food. But I ask her if she wants to get a place with a kitchen and we can buy and cook our own food, if she wants to eat out. And yes, I do help cook.

When you as the guy are paying anywhere between 150 to 400 a night at a nice hotel, then yeah... she can pay for meals. As the guy you just monitor what you are eating and how much it costs.

[ManOnFire]

Most guys are not trying to eat at the most expensive places unless they're substantially wealthy. It's women who want that, and so they can take selfies and post them on Instagram to show they're out and about doing something lavish.

You argue that if a man asks a woman out that he should pay, because it's only natural. Yet I've had women be the ones to ask me out or suggest/set up where we should meet and when, and they still expect me to pay for them. And I imagine other men have the same experience. You are not laying out any better argument than any other woman who wants to be paid for on a night out. No matter how you slice, whether he asks her out or she asks him out, there will be women who still expect a free night or a free meal, meanwhile thinking some guy is a low life for hoping to get sex.

[MrNameless]

lol this! I've been on dates where women are the ones who suggest the places or activity/restaurant, but then expect me to pay. It's a lose/lose situation for men.

As a man I have to constantly be on guard to not be taken advantage of/be used. I'm not looking for sex. I don't mind paying for first dates.. But I hope she at least offers to pay and she can meet in the middle in terms of where we can meet. Is it fair that on top of having to make the plans, and pay for the date.. I always have to meet her closer where she lives or literally in the city she lives in, and then pick her up as well?

[Summeroflove]

I don’t mind paying if the girl appreciates it. I don’t like entitled women. The whole point of me paying is because I don’t have to.

Im a give and take type of person. I don’t do one sided relationships. Now I respect someone if they’re looking for something different then I am. We can go our separate ways.

Yeah, plenty of guys feel entitled to sex because they paid for a date. That’s not doing something genuine for someone. But I do expect effort to be put in by my partner. Not having someone demand this and that just to give little to nothing in return

But I think you just like being a victim

[MrOracle]

I have no problem paying for my dates, but I also do not date Feminists or "strong independent women" - only all-natural, biological female, feminine-presenting women who have traditional values and respect traditional gender roles.

[Avicenna]

I don't waste time on this. The two women I went on dates with most recently both insisted on paying for both of us after I made a move to pay.

[coachTanthony]

I agree women should just pay for every date!

[Lliam]

Guy asks a girl out, she says yes, then he says she has to pay half? WTF? Instead of being honored that she agreed to go out with him, he acts like he did her a favor?

I only ask girls on dates when I am into them and think they are worth pursuing. If they accept, I'm excited. When they show up and look like they put time and effort into looking good, I can tell that they were excited, too. It's a big deal when a girl tries to look her best to impress me and is happy and even a bit nervous when we meet up for the date.

It would be a put down if I suddenly asked her for money. It would make me look like a destitute free loader or a guy who resented women because of "feminism", or like I didn't appreciate her company. Either way, she would know I wasn't a gentleman or even a man. What could she expect from a partner like that? Nothing.

I've taken girls to various places on first dates - a favorite, not overly expensive, local restaurant or county fair. I've packed picnics and taken them to a botanical garden or a grassy bluff overlooking the ocean. It doesn't have to be expensive, just fun and special. My focus is on them.

I don't mind paying because 1) doing something fun with a beautiful, charming woman is for my own pleasure. 2) I want her to feel appreciated and valued and free from care and worry. The last thing I want her to think is that she's a burden. 3) I want her to know that I am a man who is capable of providing. A guy who can't, or is unwilling, to do that is worthless. What is his value, having a penis?

I agree with everything you said, Ms. Anonymous, and you said it well.

Guys who resent women; guys who don't have the imagination to think of something inexpensive to do that will impress a girl and make her feel special; and guys who can't afford anything at all shouldn't bother asking quality women on dates.

I can't think of any worse partner for a woman than a guy who bitches about feminism and women's equality. They are as bad as the misandrist kinds of radical feminists that they despise. They resent women, have negative views about them, think that women are inferior to men, and want submissive women with low self esteem that they can completely dominate and control. They have old fashioned views on what makes a woman a lady, but not what makes a man a gentleman. And a sign of this is resenting paying for a freaking date. Women should steer clear.

[MrNameless]

you're not a free loader for asking her to pay.. unless you're asking her to pay for you as well. I mean, you're asking the person out (both of you will equally invest time on this), and making all the plans. in the worst case scenario, everyone should pay for themselves or take turns paying

[glennos89]

You could be a perfect example for other woman out there that putting some effort in themselves can actually result in succes because the way I see it is...

that sadly most woman just wait and pick their best option available when they are dating but they put 0 effort into it themselves while doing that.

Therefore I stopped dating and I'm out untill more woman begin to understand that dating requires 2 people to put in the same amount of effort but right now I'm done putting in loads of effortz paying for dates only to find out, I wasn't the best option available for her. I rather stay single then wasting my time on useless dates.

Instead of blaming men for doing things wrong... you should start teaching woman to follow your lead and teach them to put some fucking effort into dating themselves rather then just waiting and picking 🤷‍♂️

If more woman where like you... dating wouldn't been so difficult like it is now because men are tired of the lack of input woman give in dating

[Anonymous]

"American guys most often do the asking out on dates, and thus etiquette dictates, that the one who asks, should foot the bill."

I didn't bother reading beyond this ^ bullshit statement. What "etiquette" are you referring to? The same "etiquette" that says women should be ladies, dress modestly, know how to cook a great meal, and do it every day? Yeah, total traditional bullshit. You are just another example of the entitlement and hypocrisy of modern women. Men have to be the ones who take the initiative, put themselves on the line and risk rejection so you entitled, cowardly women don't have to do it, and the thanks we get for doing that is the obligation to pay for your meal too.

If I take a woman on a first date and she doesn't offer to pay her share, she won't get a second date. If she pays her share and then judges me for letting her and won't do a second date, she has done me a big favor by showing her true colors right up front so I don't have to waste any more time on her before discovering she an entitled hypocrite.

[Ozanne]

That's not how it works. This works among friends too. If same-sex friends go out, it's usually understood that the person doing the inviting is the one paying. Or they come to some agreement of "I'll get it next time" or to pay for half. Whoever does the asking does the paying has been the etiquette for decades. The reason is because the person being asked is being sprung upon the idea of going out, and shouldn't also be put in a situation to pay for something if they're asked for the pleasure of their company. Today's world is different though, and many people do opt to pay their own way because they can, or don't want to feel obligation. But generally, the initial expectation is that if you invite, be prepared to be the one to pay. And if the gripe is about 'how much' you're paying, then don't select some extravagant place to spend your money.

[SaltyBeaches]

@Ozanne I strongly disagree. You're right that's not how it usually works, but it's how it should work. It's a date, and both participants should get exactly the same thing out of it. And both should go into it knowing they will pay their own share, or at least offer to and not judge him if he lets you. It's not one person buying the other person's company. Your attitude is a carryover from a time gone by when traditional gender roles were the norm. Why do you feel the need to perpetuate this one? We earn our own money now and we can pay our own way, and we should. It's unfair that we still expect men to be the ones to take the risk of rejection AND pay for it. Let's move on from that outdated gender role like we have the others. Stop using "etiquette" as an excuse and do the right thing.

[VIVANT]

@Avonlea strongly disagree. You're right that's not how it usually works, but it's how it should work. It's a date, and both participants should get exactly the same thing out of it. And both should go into it knowing they will pay their own share,

Yup. This just this and the thing is people who think this way can just date other people who think this way so no drama.

[Opinion Owner]

@VIVANT I'm confused about who you're responding to and what your position is on this subject. Can you please clarify?

[Crazyced]

I will preface by saying that I agree with the sentiment and it is actually what I do. I expect to pay for the full date and pick accordingly. This is cultural.

That being said we need to call a spade a spade, and 'Who asks pays' is a cop out, reality is, 'men pay'. Because in the western world they are in general heavily expected to plan the 1st date. Modern progressivism for women is for them to send the 1st message and maybe pay their half. We are a long way away from having a significant portion of them plan and pay 1st dates in full. It is also extremely convenient that this 'Who asks pays' expectations completely vanishes a few dates in as soon as the woman starts wanting to plan and do things.

I have a longtime good friend that makes great money. When he asks me to join him at the sports bar to watch the game I don't expect him to cover for me and what I order, that would just be profiting from them. Home cooked meals and activities are different and if that's what both party are comfortable doing as a 1st date then great.

[FellowTraveler]

I totally agree with the low cost date guides outlined above. Good ideas all around. But for the expensive date, read on!

What's been lost in this whole discussion is 'going Dutch', meaning he and she share expenses equally. I've posted this elsewhere, but here it goes.

In 1968 an organization of women for women was created - National Organization of Women (NOW). This went hand in hand with the Equal Rights Amendment, which was not ratified. Said another way - women such as Gloria Steinem who once wore a shirt that read - "A woman without a man is like a fish without a bicycle'. Gloria SWORE of marriage. Guess who got married? Cute huh?

Those women (NOW) made ALL the decisions for the women of today, and their number one assertion IS 'we are equal too every male'. It's time to put that into practice, meaning share the expenses of ANY endeavor without either party having to request financial assistance. If among themselves they decide otherwise, that is THEIR deal.

Women have made tremendous strides - Astronauts, Supreme Court, etc; and in my opinion it's time for women to share finances on dates -Going Dutch. The truly infuriating thing is it's perfectly fine for a woman to fall back on 'oh your the guy, that's your responsibility'. Men have NO such option, and yet women are supposed to be equal in every respect. So simply pony up the moola girls, you just might get that date you couldn't get before.

[provokeesmokee]

I always assume I'll pay, or at least I'm always ready to pay for my bill.

I've dated enough men to know many will say "yeah, don't worry, I budgeted for this" and then balk when you order a single drink that isn't water.

I know what I like and if I'm going out to eat, I'm going to enjoy my meal. Regardless of whoever's dating me's wallet.

If I really like someone, I'll offer to take the bill, but I'm budgeting 3x what I expect to spend just in case. And if the total comes out insane, I will straight up ask to split it.

Fortunately most people I date or pay for are very reasonable people.

[ZackBan]

My personal rule is: I pay for my date what I would pay for my good friends. Which is a lot.

But at the same time I'm not the girl's father.
Meaning it will end quickly between us if I sense that I'm becoming a meal ticket for her.

I have a friend who's completely whipped by a girl and pays for her all day every day.

And another dating a classy woman who's been raised to pay her fair share and not expect to be spoiled by someone else's son.

And it's clear to me that it's the latter that I envy for being in a relationship as opposed to the first that I would even encourage to cheat (even though neither of us really accept that morally)

[Singing_Hollow]

You make good points however I am going to say that periods arnt that bad and women tend to bring this up in every argument but we forget that men might not go through the physical pains but they do have more stress when it comes to being providers and making money. Id rather have a period than deal with the amount of stress they deal with everyday until the day they die.
Regarding who pays, I understand why guys dont want to always pay, Women use them to get free meals and drinks and its messed up big time! If more women were honest then men would be more happier to pay for the meal. I do prefer a man to pay on the first date but thats because Im not using him and also would suggest coffee first or something where if it doesn't work then I dont feel bad and neither does he.

[Aiko_E_Lara]

Exactly! Someone who acknowledges that! I'm sure there are times where periods get so bad but those aren't normal really. Not the usual thing that happen. A lot of women just exaggerate it that it happens to them when a monthly basis feeling like someone stopping them to death yet they were able to move normally and just cry if they get punched in the shoulder. Sure I cannot don't play how much it hurts but I don't normalize it. I doesn't associate being on their periods alone with severe cramps. I separate those two issues. It's just like being a soy boy and being a weak man has nothing to do with being a man alone.

[VIVANT]

I didn’t think anyone should pay for dates based on their sex but your example is terrible

Being a provider is a choice.

A woman or a man can be a provider but Women get a period no choice in the matter whether they choose to be a provider or not. it’s not comparable.

One is a lifestyle choice the other is actual biology.

[Aiko_E_Lara]

Men's stigma and our drive designed for us to keep working physically or get rusty is also not a choice. Just like periods but it is our choice to do something about it. Improving our lifestyles to combat that issue.

[Singing_Hollow]

@VIVANT Periods arnt a choice however if a women uses that as an excuse 'pain etc' then she has a problem and needs to seek medical help. Its not the guys job to pay because you have a medical issue with your cramps etc. Being a provider isn't a choice for a man because if he doesn't provide for his family then he is seen by society as weak, would you date a hobo with no money? i dont think so, so in order for a man to get the women he wants he will have to work his butt off where as we just look pretty and we win.

[VIVANT]

I don’t think anyone should be doing anything simply based on gender. Not paying for dates nor providing. I don’t use my period as leverage. I have no reason to examine if periods should or should not or are used as an excuse for something I’m not promoting.

Men do not have to “provide” women have to have periods for sone portion if their lives. I am not saying therefore men should provide. I’m just saying one is biological one is not. Everyone has stress just bc people call men providers does not mean women are not working and stressing equally or more,

The term provider is inappropriate bc all contributions provide to society. If a person had to work non stop but they don’t get paid they are not not original curing they are simply not getting financially compensated and I think this would be the most stressful kind of work, for the world to watch you slave away and think you’re not providing, it’s absurd.

This post was from long ago I’m not sure why I got a notification. These are my thoughts they are not directed at you or against anyone here.

[Aiko_E_Lara]

You can say that men don't have to provide but when people say that, it's usually all words because society had been hardwired to see men as the providers and have the stigma of being a deadbeat for not being the provider. But it's also something men couldn't control, societal pressure. Just being a man by itself have their own disadvantages and it's not even only limited to having to pay for dates.

[Singing_Hollow]

@Aiko_E_Lara Correct. What women dont realise is if men stop working all together then the whole world would collapse and economies would drive. It would be the end of the world pretty much. The pressure on man is much higher as their financial value is that much more than a females.

[Kaamraj]

Most men understand that the burden of sexual preformance is on them. They must do the asking out, and the paying on the dates. Most guys are also not trying to take their dates to the most expensive place, it's women who repeatedly say that they dont do coffee or drink but would rather have dinner which entails a fine dining experience and associated expense. If, as as a man you can't pay for a date, then you have bigger problems to worry about.

However, most guys do complain about the new trend of "Foodie Dates" where women agree to a date with no romantic intentions, with the solve intention of having an experience and posting about it on social media.

And in converse of this statement I'd like to say that yes men should not complain about paying for dates and women should not complain about being pumped and dumped.

[Phoenix98]

I don't, I prefer the more old fashioned way of doing things, also you don't have to take someone out for dinner to have a date, go on a walk, get some ice cream, have a picnic, go fishing, go to a car show or my personal favorite exploring (driving down) backroads there are lots of cheaper but still fun ways to have a date.

In my opinion whoever ask the other out should pay though I think this should be the case for men and women both. If you ask someone out then pay for it unless you both have agreed to each pay your own share.

[exitseven]

Okay- I invited a girl to come in the city with me and we were going to one of the biggest tourist traps that there was. I was open to any restaurant that she wanted to go to. We walked through the whole place and everyplace we looked at had big price tags for small portions. I suggested that we go to an Italian grocery store my father used to take me to when I was little. We could buy sub rolls and cold cuts and make our own sandwiches and eat by the waterfront. So we bought stuff to make subs, a couple of cans of Coke and a bag of chips. We actually had people come over to us asking where we got the subs. It was an awesome date that did not cost a lot of money.

[TheSpaceGnome]

Women don't deserve to be asked out on dates unless they pay for their half.

There is no reason to even go on a date at all tbh. Its not needed to connect with someone, or to figure them out, or to spend quality time with them, and its honestly pretty piss poor for all of those things.

If I want to spend time with someone, I will play video games with her, watch a movie or tv at home with her, talk with her, make art with her, etc, but I'm not taking her out on a date.

A man does not need to bribe a woman who is actually interested in him.

[Screenwriter]

My voice cries out in the wilderness constantly: GO DUTCH! GO DUTCH!

Each person pays for themself.

Then, agree on where you are going so that BOTH PEOPLE CAN AFFORD IT!

It's very, very simple if you want it to be. If you're with someone who expects to be paid for, I believe you're with the wrong person, period.

[FellowTraveler]

I could NOT have said it any better than Screenwriters comment!

[YesterdaysChild]

That is my view. That and some women make more than the guy. He may as well pay her house payment too if he is that generous.

[Billlewis]

@YesterdaysChild 'He may as well pay her house payment, too'. Perfect, absolutely perfect.

[Screenwriter]

@Billlewis WHEW!!! House payments!!! You guys are killin' me!!! .. But sadly, I have heard that precise thing before... That kills me in the most unfunny way.

Just another version of prostitution. sigh.

[VIVANT]

💯 💯💯💯

[VIVANT]

It’s crazy ooo need to maybe this complicated by complaining the simplest solution is making it complicated 😂

[MrNameless]

most women expect guys to pay for the first date though. It's a lose lose for a guy either way. You risk not moving to a second date if you don't pay (as a man)..

[Screenwriter]

@MrNameless Mr. Nameless, AM I STUTTERING!!! How old am I? Nearly 70. And I think it is RIDICULOUS that "women expect guys to pay for the first date." Is this in some rule book I'm not aware of? Are there some cadre of women who are unemployed and can't pay for their own meals?

How is this stuff still happening? Why are young, working women operating under these outdated rules? Why are young men accepting this? Is no one afraid to speak up before a first date?

Back in the Jurassic Age when I was dating, my mother told me to have enough money to pay for myself and to get home in a taxi. I think civil conversations BEFORE first dates are requirements. And always make first dates coffee shop dates. I pay for my coffee, you pay for yours. If the date goes well, we'll meet again to talk some more. Make all these early dates lowbrow, so no one is wasting money or time.

It often takes weeks or months to find out you aren't suited. Why burden EITHER person with paying for anyone other than themselves? This is only fair.

I realize some women are weighing whether a guy "can support me." Or, "afford" me. This is creepy, if you ask me. And seems like someone is looking for a free ride. There might be some minority of men who are looking for a sugar mama. But benefit of the doubt... Most folks are looking for neither. They're seeking a good partner and relationship.

Make it easy on yourself and have each person pay for themselves. If they don't like this, they don't have a sense of fair play. Best to avoid them.