What Happens Subconsciously When a girl Friendzones a Guy

[TheDevilInside]

To the age-old question of why do girls friendzone the "nice guys" and falls for the assholes instead, I have an analogy.

Ross from Friends helped me think of it:

" It's just--I want someone who... who does something for me, y'know? Who gets my heart pounding, who... who makes me, uh...
[begins to stare lovingly at Rachel] "

Here's what I think of it:

• The "nice guy", the best friend, is like vitamins. It's good for you in the long term, but it doesn't bring any immediate effect.
  


• The asshole is like meds. It brings immediate effect, but in the long term, it's toxic for your body. Not to mention side effects.

It's a thing that I think happens in a girl's subconscious. Like Ross, many girls want someone who can give them that rush of emotions, that pounding of the heart, that feeling of excitement. The best friend is "safe", something familiar and comfortable, but maybe not exciting enough. Whereas that bad boy is new and... oh so interesting.

When that asshole finally hurts her, she'll just think "I might be allergic to this one med, I'll just try with another one." It never occurs to her that maybe vitamins are the ones that can help her.

Now some of you guys might think "well, then it just means that girls are stupid." I beg you to give us a break. When you're considering whether to take vitamins or meds, you can still use your logic. But when we're talking about love and feelings, how much does logic really play a role?

Now, there's also the possibility that the best friend or the "nice guy" is just not attractive enough for her. In that case, I'm sorry, you'll just have to find another love interest, guys.

Please write in the comments, what do you think happens when a guy friendzones a girl (supposedly he finds her attractive enough)?

[Ozanne]

Then again - there's neither the Vitamin or Meds Guy but the in-between guy that the doctor prescribes you, kind of like physical therapy or a neck brace or something. The guy that comes along and whisks you away from both losers and is immediately good for you and naturally makes you feel as though you're getting your life back together.

I married my neck brace. :)

[TheDevilInside]

I'm still waiting for my neck brace to come XD

[Ozanne]

Have you had "whiplash" or anything yet? Usually you don't think of your neck brace until you need it, and know how helpful and good it did you once it comes along.

The Vitamins keep you from having whiplash, and the Meds fool you in to thinking you don't need a Neck Brace.

[Tomsta]

Also main problem of nice guys: We don't flirt or show interest and have no backbone, i was guilty of this for YEARS

[TheDevilInside]

YES! How the hell is a girl supposed to know you're interested? We're not fucking midn readers!

[Tomsta]

However the same can be said of girls, if you like a guy, we can't read your minds so how can we know when to make a move, but yes it was only until last year of uni when i become more confident about myself and i turned out to be REALLY cheeky and flirty

[gray_sailor]

Credit to you for figuring it out by 22. For me it was closer to 30.

Incompetence in this area goes very underappreciated.

[Tomsta]

I figured it out before i was 21 :p

[gray_sailor]

One element of this discussion that I find woefully lacking is that fundemental assumption that both people know what they are doing.

I fully recognize that some men knowingly take advantage of a woman's friendship in the hopes of getting in her pants.

Their are also legions of men and women who are clueless in the world of dating. The difference in outcome for the ignorant of each gender is determined by the normal actions of their opposite.

When a naive woman pines for the attentions of a man that once looked at her briefly in passing, she is not his friend, his acquaintance, his love or any other relationship at all above the level of complete stranger.

When a clueless man approaches a woman with romantic intent, his actions could be misunderstood as only seeking friendship. Being clueless, any attention she gives him feels to him like his efforts at romance are working.

The difference between the outcomes for each gender is a function of who is approached and who normally approaches.

The moral of the story: Never assume malicious intent, when stupidity explains things completly.

[Philosopher_Edge]

I have to disagree with this. Well, to some degree.

We forget in our arrogance, that we too, are animals. And being animals, we follow a pattern of mating. And in a lot of primates (which we belong to), the females will go after the Alpha male, since he is the one that can provide the most protection to the offspring.

Now, in our society, we believe that being an Alpha means we have to be the asshole. Which is not true. Asshole betas do exhibit Alpha qualities, but they aren't truly Alphas. Unfortunately, many women think that money, power and influence are examples of Alpha traits. They are to a degree, as they provide.

However, what is failed to be recognized is that the Alpha is the primary protector of the group. He is the strongest and largest for a reason. True Alphas are pretty rare, and they are often the males that put their families, their group's well being before their own.

Asshole betas are smart enough to realize that they can act the way they do, because they know mating really is just about the law of averages. By being exposed to a certain number of females, they know that there will be a percentage that will find their behavior attractive.

'Nice' betas are really too scared to try and blame the assholes for taking all the women.

[TheDevilInside]

I agree.

However, if you write this stuff on GAG as a take, you'll get tons of shitstorm from the "nice guys".

I'm usually not a fan of the "alpha and beta male" talk, but that's because when guys talk about them, they're talking about "douchebags and nice guys". Which is pointless to talk about because the ones claiming to be "alphas" are usually just narcissistic douchebags and the "betas" are just bitter. So no good would come out of using those words on gag.

However, when we're talking about animals, I agree with you about the alpha males. There are no beta males in nature. Every female would just go for the alphas

[Philosopher_Edge]

In all honesty, I was specific in my wording because I used to be 'a nice guy.' Then I got divorced, and decided to take what I wanted. (Consensually) But I also read a lot about relationships, mainly what caused them to break. I learned that women really want someone that will set and stick to boundaries. Nice guys will let them walk all over them, and douchbags will be unfair therefore they will appear to be a challenge. A true will say 'I'm doing this because it's the best for both of us.' No matter what it is.

[lolalovesvedette]

A 'friend zoned' guy is usually just a guy who I don't find sexually attractive but want to be friends with.
I hate how some men think they are entitled to every woman sexually. Like we don't have the ability to actually want a great relationship other than romantically.

NO, YOU JUST DON'T TICKLE MY PICKLE IN THAT WAY!! JUST LIKE NOT EVERY GIRL DOES YOURS!!

I don't like assholes, they actually turn me off!!
This goes for most women who have any ounce of empathy. You hear a guy is a dick to women or people in general, then you don't fuck him since he doesn't deserve what you have to offer or any woman in fact.

[TheDevilInside]

I totally agree with you.
Only sometimes wolves wear sheep's skin and some women just don't see the wolf inside.

[Octavion]

This assumes that all girls are like this though. Many girls are quick to figure out what they want and even at a younger age they know what kind of guy they want to spend their life with and go after them. The girls that go for quick thrills when they're young but then when they're ready to settle as they get closer to 30 they start saying "where are all the good men" the answer is they're with the good women who were smart and knew what they wanted. Guys don't like to be compared to commodities that you'll just toss to the side when you're done getting your fill of it.

Again that just applies to people who want long term relationships.

[TheDevilInside]

of course. I was only adressing the "issue" or question that many guys have, regarding the friendzoning and the "why do girls always fall for the asshole" question.

[Retrogression]

Here's my 2 penny's. Nice guys have the asshole thing confused with a guy who likes to have fun and present a challenge. Girls may have liked you in the flirting stages but once nice guys fail to lead game over. Simply put grow a pair and stop blaming the girl your chasing for the mess you made. Instead use your new friend as a tool meet new girls and next round you won't mess up. Nice guys need to take charge and put thier foot down if the girl does something he doesn't like while balancing being cool and fun. You won't be an asshole you will be a cool more attractive human. First step is opening your mind viewing the so called "asshole" in a more positive light.

[circlebill]

Very interesting take! The analogy between drugs and vitamins makes a lot of sense! And you openly admit that logic has little to to love and feelings. However, I question the last part where you said:

"Now, there's also the possibility that the best friend or the "nice guy" is just not attractive enough for her. In that case, I'm sorry, you'll just have to find another love interest, guys."

The problem with this is that many women almost automatically take kindness for weakness which is always unattractive. Thus, a genuine nice guy's kindness actually MAKES HIM UNATTRACTIVE to many women. He can be tall, athletic and movie star handsome. But because he is very nice, many women will quickly label him a pushover, desperate, friend etc.

This makes it basically impossible to be a very nice guy and still attractive at the same time. So genuine nice guys are automatically at a major disadvantage!

[TheDevilInside]

I don't think so actually. Most women also want a sensitive guy. The kind of guy who can speak up his feelings.

Only immature women would see kindness or feelings from a guy as weakness

[circlebill]

I agree that a lack of maturity plays a major role in women who take kindness for weakness. Unfortunately, the existence of immature women reaches far and wide! This exists even among some middle aged and older women who really should know better. If you eliminate all the immature women, I'm afraid we would have a very small minority indeed! Well, you sound like you've got your head on straight! Peace!

[Rloco]

If a girl says she just wants to be friends she's just not interested. It's not because of anything else other than lack of chemistry or attraction. I'm friends with a beautiful girl and we get along. But I just don't feel romantic chemistry. I'm not going to pursue her. I wouldn't say she's in the friend zone because I'd probably go on a date with her if she asked but I wouldn't ask myself. Guys who are actually nice will move on and want the best for the girl they like. If they actually care about her.

[TheDevilInside]

I like the last part. But I can also understand the hurt and the fact that they see the girls they like chooses a guy who they think will treat her badly, can make them quite bitter.

[Rloco]

I understand and feel the hurt. I've never had a girlfriend and girls usually just see me as a friend. But I don't blame them. They just aren't attracted to me. I wonder if I will find someone will sometimes but I don't say it's because I'm a nice guy. I genuinely like to do nice things for people and want nothing in return. It might hurt me sometimes but I can handle it. Someday I'll connect with someone and end up happy that day just can't get here soon enough though lol 😂

[Scrambled]

Its simply because those nice things that women want is a generic given. Its not what attracts them initially. That's why men need to get a personality or all that "nice" stuff doesn't count. Anyway, here is a genius take on what happens to a male in the friendshipzone:

www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a9479-male-emotional-friendship-zone-damage-scale-the-male-efd-scale

[koko124]

The truth is that everything in life is an objective trade-off, and everyone settles for what they can get.

This is why you see so much stratification in attractiveness by height, status, age, etc.

There's a reason why men nearly always report being more successful in their 30s than in their early 20s... by their 30s, they've developed a higher profile career, and the women around them are fading physically, and thus are willing to settle lower.

What's going on with "friendzoning" is twofold:

1) Most women below 25 are quite attractive, and have their pick of the men around them.

2) Social media/internet and high living standards have produced a "princess effect", where ordinary girls are praised and coddled from childhood to their 30s simply because they are cute and adorable. As a result, their egos become even bigger, and their standards increase ever higher.

[TheDevilInside]

what an interesting comment!

- it can also be that men in their 30s are rarely still boys, so that maturity and confidence makes them more attractive to women.
- while it's true that internet gives them validation, but remember that they're also constantly confronted with that standard of beauty (skin, eyes, nose, body size, boob size, butt size), and that may just have a high impact on the women's self-confidence as well.

[koko124]

Men are confronted with the same amount (if not more) of confidence-reducing beauty standards that women are subject to.

The simplest explanation is the "social validation" theory, and it's been going on for several millennia now. As society becomes more complex, women gain access to a larger number of men, thus widening the sexual inequality. Food also becomes more abundant, and life becomes safer, which further reduces the female need of men. It's been documented that many male lineages underwent an extinction event shortly after the rise of agriculture.

[thegirlnextdl]

Or, she may just be friendzoning him because she's not interested. Maybe he's a cool guy, has a good sense of humor, some common interests, whatever, but if there's not chemistry there... that's just what it is.

Still, your take is probably true.

Although, I tend to fall for the nice guys.

[TheDevilInside]

yeah. you also have a point

[DaCrownlessKing]

This whole "Friendzone does not exist" thing is stupid. Yeah, it exists but you shouldn't complain about it, move on. If a girl tells you "Hey, I only like you as a friend" she is obviously putting you in an area of no dating or romance, hence the friendzone. It exists, it just that people dwell on it too much because they were so stuck on getting what they want. If being friends with them is so hard, leave her, that's what I did but to be fair this particular chick was only using me for attention and told me that she loved me as a hook. If you can manage it, stay and nut up about it

[JaysunPro]

The asshole shows his feelings for her and fucks her satisfying her solution and and arouses her sexual awareness. The nice guy she keeps around emasculated because he allows her, and/or gives her no sexual notion, and she needs someone to fall back on when she realizes what kept her hooked she can't win was the nice guy who after abandones them makes her and her bad boy go into disaster. After all the nice guy is where she gets the social skills to continue to please her bad boy who she does't understand but loves all the special treatment.

[spuitkaas]

Vitamins as in if you have enough of them, you pee them out?
But seriously, not every nice guy is good for you. You have the insecure ones who walk behind your butt and do everything for you. You have the ones who are a little bit too nice, as in they're the relationship and you have no role in it. Those are not the best kind of guys.

[rocccky]

agree! too much nice is also kinda weird, and we dont owe anyone just bcz she/he was nice to us.

[Mesonfielde]

Nah, this take is incorrect. This scenario isn't so black and white at all. The beating of the heart you mention is just infatuation based on external (physical) and immediate behavioral cues. Infatuation however makes you more lenient towards errors of your partner. They were always "assholes" if you want to name it that, you just tried your best to never realize and accept it.

[Northeast106]

This,

[TheDevilInside]

of course it's not black and white. Nothing in life is.
It's just a take where I'm expressing my analogy here, and what I think. I'm not striving to be "correct". So it's fine if you don't think this is "incorrect". But that's also your opinion.

[Mesonfielde]

I just think it's funny how two girls down voted me. I guess they claim their partner randomly "turned for the worse".

[pavlove]

We've been through this zillions of times on this forum... it's a factor of immaturity. When you're young you want to test the limits, but after getting burnt both men and women start to appreciate those of the opposite sex who are genuinely nice and start seeing people who treat them like crap as more ugly not better looking. If you're genuinly nice and aren't just fronting because you put girls on some pedestal but just have a naturally nice personality and that still isn't working then maybe you're too mature for the girls anyway.

[bobbydigitaloa]

The sad thing though is that women are valued for their youth so they can't bank on being mature to save them in getting the type of men they could of gotten when they were younger. In short men are given a 2nd chance later in life from chasing bad girls if they kept their looks up. While women not so much.

[pavlove]

Well girls can date like late 20's when they're 20 years old and still date 20's when they're 20 and still be dealing with a mature guy. Though, I imagine that would be a bizarre experience.

[VRosetano]

Been down this road enough times to just drop it. I don't even see the need to bother trying if I'm gonna either fall into this situation or I get lucky and then the girl decides to cheat on me.

The whole concept of women finally getting with good guys at an older age doesn't sit so well with me. If they didn't want me then, why do they want me now? And it feels weird to me when women put themselves through all of the bad boys and try to date nice guys. It feels like buying a used car with a ton of dents. Is that too selfish to say?

[thatcomplicatedgirl]

I friendzoned guys not because I don't find them attractive. They were pretty cute and handsome. But I didn't want to date them because we didn't have an emotional connection. I couldn't trust them fully. They didn't help in my emotional or spiritual growth. They couldn't understand me fully. And I stay away from assholes. So, not all girls are same.

[TheDevilInside]

never said that

[TheSpartan]

No emotional connection? What's an emotional connection?

[thatcomplicatedgirl]

@TheSpartan For me, the emotional connection is when I know that I can say anything to that person but he won't ever judge me. He won't question my past but accept it. I think, it's when I can talk about my passions, desires and everything. When I know that there is a bond of care, trust and sensitivity between us. Basically, when we both try to know each other beyond a superficial level.

[thatcomplicatedgirl]

@TheDevilInside My opinion was in response to this line of yours :)

"Now, there's also the possibility that the best friend or the "nice guy" is just not attractive enough for her. In that case, I'm sorry, you'll just have to find another love interest, guys."

[NervousToTheMax]

This is actually really true. I've been called attractive and cute by many, but I've been put in the "friendzone". It was usually that I didn't make a move quick enough, didn't flirt, or she didn't get to know me well enough.

[Anon-ee-mous]

The part about logic not playing a huge part is true. But you've basically just painted a polarized picture. People think others are either one or the other, or they act like one or the other themselves.

If a guy or girl is having a problem in this area, common sense dictates that you look for/act the best of both worlds, yes?

[Anon-ee-mous]

Basically: people need to be given a little more credit than this. They're not this simple or one-tracked

[TheDevilInside]

of course not. This is just ONE of the possible explanations for this kind of behavior from SOME women.

[Anon-ee-mous]

I understand, but even if this only explains some people... it's still overly simplistic. And when there's so much "this or that" on this site, reinforcing all of that isn't really helping or giving an accurate picture.

[TheDevilInside]

*sigh* All I wanted was to give a possible analogy to make people understand WHY some girls do this.

I don't have a solution.

[MrLi0n]

Trying to get out of the friend zone with the woman you adore is like playing chess... You have to make the right moves that will lead her to believe you're embracing that friendship but at the same time you have to also make yourself seem desirable and attractive and better suited as a lover and boyfriend. ITS A WAR DAMMIT!😤😁😬 lol

https://i62.tinypic.com/2i0fzi9.jpg[/IMG]

[TheDevilInside]

The dating scene IS a war, my friend.

[trieze]

I think this whole friendzone/bad boy analogy is a steaming pile of horses**t, girls don't chase guys they find attractive if they don't chase them, and bad boys are just someone with someone who understands that girls like guys that know how to look good.