I saw a video online where people were making fun of since it was ridiculous but I’m wondering if men actually agree with that statement since it was popular amongst the red pill male community.
I personally don’t agree with it because I agree of course a child is loved by there parents unconditionally or at least a child should be loved by their parent unconditionally but a woman and man of course aren’t going to be loved unconditionally because if you love anyone without question that’s just a recipe for toxicity?
And dogs aren’t loved unconditionally because if your dogs out of control you’ll send it back to the pound or something.
Do men actually believe only women, children, and dogs are loved unconditionally?
"because if you love anyone without question that’s just a recipe for toxicity?" Yes, that's sometimes true. And yet that doesn't prove the statement false.
Talking in generics, I know it to be true because I innately feel attentive and affectionate towards women, children, and dogs, but not to men. Other men have to earn my admiration before I feel anything but apathy towards them.
This is emergent in societal outcomes as well. Men are either biologically predisposed to or are socialised with principles of self-sufficiency and self-sacrifice. Men overwhelmingly die in war, crimes, and accidents in place of women and children. Women and children get homeless shelters, men get to be homeless. Breast cancer gets orders of magnitude more funding than prostate cancer, etc. Men earn more money, women spend more money. Ultimately if someone has to suffer, it should be the man, and if a man fails, it's his fault.
Supporting characteristics can be found in biology too; men have larger tear ducts and smaller tear glands, meaning they're not just less likely to cry, it's physically more difficult to cry. They have faster metabolisms and therefore shorter life spans. They have genetic and hormonal physical enhancements specialising them towards violent action, offensive and defensive, either way putting their life at risk. They have greater variation in intelligence and other attributes, because greater genetic fluctuation is a riskier strategy, and humanity can afford to discard a stupid or otherwise dysfunctional male while benefitting from the additional geniuses that accompany them.
In terms of survival strategy all of this makes sense. If 90% of women were to die it would be much harder to recover the population than if 90% of men were to die, simply due to how reproduction works.
So, men are disposable, and therefore can be afforded to be loved more conditionally. If men do not choose to take these burdens, women and children suffer them instead, and that conditional love is a large reason that men take them and have taken them. Technically women have conditions too, but they're usually negative conditions that apply to both sexes anyway, not positive obligations, especially not today, but I'm not a woman so I don't personally know what obligations I'd have as a woman outside of having kids.
I don't even think it should change, nor am I resentful. I think this is how men are, and to deny our purpose is to deny a part of ourselves. I don't think equality is important, because men and women are simply different, sculpted by nature for different roles. I think the red pill folks that want to separate from women are bitter and deluded to think we can thrive apart, even if these days it might be difficult for many to live together.
Yep. It's a generalization, but fairly true. Men are in no way prioritized, we are the drones of society and we are as useful as we are expendable.
Even in contemporary culture we look at women as the victimized gender, despite men throughout history having lower lifespans and victimization rate for pretty much everything except for sex crimes-and that may be the case solely because men are unlikely to report such crimes.
While things are changing, a lot of life revolved around making women happy. Get a nice job so you can provide a woman with a comfy life and she'll give you kids and a legacy in return. Doesn't matter that you work your life away because this IS the point of life. A lot of the men in my family carry the entire household on their backs. They make all the money, do most of the cooking and cleaning, and do many extracurricular activities with the kids. The cherry on top is that they're treated like dirt by their women.
As a man, you know nobody has your back when it comes to strangers. People don't want to help you when you're down, you have to be the solution to your problems.
Unconditional love is near impossible. Unconditional loves means you have to excuse anything that the person you love does. So, let’s say you claim to love some boy unconditionally. That means you will still love him if he cheats, murders, robs, steals, rapes, leaks your nudes, ruin your job and any relationships you have with anyone outside of him.
It’s a bullshit notion.
Even dogs and kids are not loved unconditionally. Maybe kids when they are so little that they can not commit and major acts to cause a parent to stop loving them or lose love for them. You can lose love for anyone. It doesn’t even have to be behind something terrible. Over time people lose love for other people and things. People I used to love I no longer do for one reason or another.
I think attractive people can do the worst and still have a lot of love but there is still a line that can be crossed and once it is, the love is gone.
I think only overly entitled people in general think that. In reality, only certain people will love you unconditionally. You have to find them and love them the same way. Many of the people who say things like that don’t so why would they receive it on a regular basis?
@Nomoturtle sorry love takes work and effort. If you’re too selfish to give you can’t take. That’s how most people, male and female end up alone. They all say and do the same things a the asker and likely you as well.
Well children, women and especially dogs aren’t all equal. I know some people have this bizarre psychological love affair with dogs. I like dogs too but if one (unprovoked) attacks a human resulting in serious injuries or worse it should put down.
But anyway there is grain of truth of that statement. Men are not special just for existing. We are expected to gain respect through agency e. g. what we actually do. Women on other hand are not held to as high of a standard. For example you got young attractive women who have full time “jobs” being Instagram models and selling nudes. As long as you aren’t breaking the law i don’t care what you do in life. But I don’t respect those women nor should anyone else. And yet they still want to be considered “special”. No one would respect a guy who did that nor should they.
Also the criminal justice system is much softer on women. They get more lenient punishments for the exact same crimes. Why? Because women are “delicate” and need to be loved unconditionally right?
Men also face much more hostility in general in societal situations. Bosses are more likely to severely reprimand male employees. Women are nastier to men (who they are not attracted to) in romantic situations compared to vice versa.
Women might not be 100% loved unconditionally. But it’s very true that they get more leeway then men whether they are children or adults.
Men are only loved conditionally, man has to prove his worth for love otherwise he doesn't get it. Good example of conditional love is the fact that if a man falls on hard times, there is no support for men to lean on and if he's in a relationship he has to worry about his girl leaving him because most of the time females choose the easy way and leave when men fall.
The fact that there are many pillars of support in place for females and the fact if a female falls on hard times loses a job, it's in male nature to continue to love her and support her, this is because she is loved unconditionally.
Your example for dogs doesn't disprove that dogs are loved unconditionally, it only proves there are people out there who should never own animals in the first place, if you have a dog you should start off with training if your dog is out of control.
Kids are only loved unconditionally if they are female, kids who are male are loved unconditionally up to a certain age and then are expected to start proving their worth.
3
0 Reply
Anonymous
(36-45)
+1 y
Its the dynamic that we live with. You see it in the news, in family dynamics, and a myriad of other things. If a man dies, no one cares.. Take the Boko haram situation, There was outrage over what happened to the girls, and rightly so.. But not one peep about the thousands of boys they killed in that situation.. So if something happens to women its headline news, If something happens to men or boys, No one cares. Take family court, Only in family court is the father seen as the lesser parent, I know your political leanings so i dont expect you to understand this or even sympathize with this, but when it comes to divorce, the only parent that has to fight to see their children is the father in most cases. Another thing to think about, Pull a search on this site of women complaining that their husband or boyfriend lost their job, 90% of the comments will be suggesting she leave him, Because a man only has value to most women if he is providing money, home, and resources. You never see women getting kicked out of the family, being divorced, and the like because they lose a job. its part of why 9 out of every 10 homeless people are men, not women..
So yeah based on how society treats men, we are disposable, and only are loved if we provide something of value. While women children, and pets are the only ones that get unconditional love.
When you love someone unconditional that jus means you love their personality and not the assets and things they can provide you by dating them.. for example if you're using them for money or sex or jus for a companion cos Ur lonely... If you love someone for the person they truly are... Nothing much can really stop you loving them cos they'll always be the same person... If they ever get mad or make some mistakes or do some things that piss you off.. you usually forgive them... But that doesn't mean you have to allow toxicity... Only girls do that... You don't have to put up with someone who's being an absolute cunt to you jus cos you love them... Only girls do that... Guys have the logic and rationality to realise we should leave her for awhile, for example kick her out or leave for awhile to show her we will not stand for her bullshit.. ignore her until she realises her bad behaviour and gets better and treats us better... We still love her in the time we have left her and ignoring her.. but we are rational enough to understand you gotta ignore those feelings of love and to get back to her... And force what we need to do.. cos we won't tolerate her to be a bitch and walk on us like a rug.. guys don't stand for that bullshit
That's why you only hear woman in a abusive relationship and not guys.. generally.. girls have no rationality or logic.. they only do what the feelings tell them to do
Also we do not love the cunt birch she's being currently. We only love the old her so that's why it's easy to kick her out cos the person she's being is pissing us off
Nobody is loved "unconditionally", that's mental illness. But it's hard to deny that the expectations placed on men outweigh the few expectations placed on women.
But then again, that's the product of most men having pretty much nonexistent expectations, so they have only got themselves to blame for the double standard.
I personally don't agree with those standards. I place similar expectations on women that they place on me, and I'm not afraid to be frank when a person doesn't meet them.
As a result, I don't find it unfair and I don't believe that statement to be true. Men just ought to tell more women to fuck off if they aren't willing to see their relationship as a two way street.
I'm gonna burst your bubble, but I think unconditional love is not a thing. There is always an exchange of energy. You love nature because of how you feel in it, you love a baby because they have a cute face and it makes your brain release caring hormones and if my kid grows up to be an asshole that makes terrible life choices and hurts people, I'm definitely not loving that shit.
It's stupid for anyone to turn it into a gender issue.
Relationships are give and take and if one person just takes while the other just gives its one sided and it sucks.
It's okay and in fact amazing that it's not a thing. If you ever felt obligated to love, that is your signal it ain't love, you might be getting good vibes or sympathy or a sense of superiority or whatever - exchange of energy, but it ain't unconditional.
Oh you are 100% correct, it is toxic but it doesn't make it any less true.
Of course generalizing to all women is stretch however there lots of women mainly the good looking ones who get to cruise through life without ever being asked to earn their value, all they need is to maintain the appearance and they will be handed things just like kids and dogs.
Now to be fair this is the fault of some men, mainly the rich men who compensate their lack of originality with money, buying their way into a hot girl's pants instead of trying to earn it but once that hot girls realizes how much her pants can generate revenue she will never let a man without the money anywhere near them for free creating the paradox.
And as you said it is toxic but it is also a reality
A lot of men just like women are abused. A good marriage or relationship requires both parties to love each other unconditionally. Men often get this perception based on how their lady treats them if they say something wrong or do something wrong. Men want to make things right for his partner so she will restore her love for him. Men can be abused for their resources and protection. Sometimes wives forget and they have to reflect on if he was her son, would she treat him and love him the way she loves him now and if he is to be her best friend for life how does she picture a best friend being treated. Each Man may have a different love language: words of affirmation, acts of service, receiving gifts, quality time, and physical touch. If that persons number one love language is neglected, then he cannot enjoy the relationship.
If you allow yourself to get a used as a man I have no sympathy or respect with you, any intelligent man will realise you gotta treat her like a bitch too if she treats you like a bitch and leave her... Don't matter how much you love her... Any smart and rational man would do this
There is wishful thinking and there is reality. Once men have kids too early in the relationship, then they have to make life changes to raise the kids. I have been a part of seeing so many peoples court hearings. I have seen so many men abused. Its usually financially and emotionally. The abuse hotlines and shelters are usually biased so men usually have no where to go and men don’t support each other to help them get back on their feet again.
I'd imagine few people believe that as an absolute, meaning literally only women, children, and dogs are unconditionally loved, that even applies the red pill community you referred to. But people don't always mean what they say literally. I assume you, too, believe that those guys aren't saying literally everyy single women, child, and dog is adored without exception. There are bad people out there that are women or children and there are some savage dogs out there. This isn't news to those people. But on average, people are much more concerned with the wellbeing of women and children, and dogs are just great in general. Men certainly have it harder in this regard. That's what they're saying.
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Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
It certainly makes you wonder I guess. We are the meat shields of society, the no counts, the laborers, the drones. We are nothing to women. How many men are passed by, never given a thought by a woman? We're the ones who have been dragged off to war. We're the last ones off a sinking ship... if ever there was room enough left for us. We're nobodies and I understand why so many men have checked out of society. Who put value into something that will never value you? Sure society wants our tax money. And sure women can get into us with rock hard abs and a boat load of cash. But at the end of the day is it really all worth the effort? For what? For dying and having her collect all the resources and forgetting about you? Or shacking up with another guy after? We are not remembered, we're just a foot note in a woman's life.
True. There's a reason why in the vast majority of cases a woman would sacrifice herself for her kids but not for her husband. He's expected to be a human shield for them. It's just how things have been for eons. And also why a man should be very careful which woman he decides to take seriously. Picking one that creates drama or brings him into contact with violent dudes unecessarily is going to ruin his life.
Woman are not loved unconditionally either. Just imagine a woman who does not want to care for your children or do house chores or support the family with a job or take care of you when your sick, a normal person would end the relationship.
I agree with you and your reasoning. It's an absurd statement.
I'll add that I am so sick of the whiny, "poor me" attitude that some men have. Pull up your socks and grow some balls. If your unworthy of love and admiration, then money will only attract leeches.
I think children you love unconditionally up until an age, that their adult enough to be held responsible for their own actions.
Women, you can love unconditionally, but it always a trust but verify thing going on. So yeah, its conditional. She steals, lies or cheats... well thats a conditional standard.
Dogs, yeah dogs you absolutely can love unconditionally. You love it, you train it... and love it forever.
I just answered another question and I put in there thank God for making dog because otherwise women would still be the beautiful women they are and men would still be caveman God didn't give us dog to teach us how to love unconditionally dog is the reason why men learn how to love unconditionally
Yes I agree with that. We may be loved unconditionally by our parents But as far as a marriage or a relationship if you can't contribute something to the woman's life then she will replace you. Perhaps you, not being a male shouldn't get to have an opinion on this topic in the same way that males don't get to have an opinion on the topic of abortion.
The statement "a man is only loved under the condition that he provide something" is both false and true. There are plenty of people in my life that love me just because I love them and care about them. If I didn't love them and care about them, they would not love and care about me, and vice versa. So I have provided them with love, but not material things or financial support.
well you can't have all, its the old thing, you can fool some of the people all the time, you can fool all of the people some of the time but you can't fool all of the people all of the time
Well the only thing I love unconditionally is my pom 😌
1
0 Reply
Anonymous
(30-35)
+1 y
In the relative sense and in practical terms, yes. Technically no, everything has conditions. Existence has conditions. But in terms of the relative valuation and care for women, children, and dogs, they dwarf what men receive. So in practical terms, yes, it's right.
