I’ve started to grow more and more worried about when I will settle down and have children

[Anonymous]

As a traditional person I always thought I’d marry young. I was always very maternal and nurturing wanted to be a mother from a very young age. I always knew I would marry when I wanted to have children.

It’s probably for the best that I waited until now because I can make better decisions. I am delaying marriage because I haven’t found the perfect person yet. I need to find aomeone who will make a good father - I never had a present father growing up and I don’t want the same for my children. At 18 I didn’t consider financial stability even though that is the most important factor in raising children. All these things are what I think about now and that is why I have not found the right person yet.

When I was sixteen I thought I’d be married by 21 with at least one child. I turned 25 a couple of weeks ago and there are no signs of a wedding taking in the foreseeable future.

In fact I am not even speaking to anyone seriously to consider marrying them at the moment BUT it is a worry at the back of my mind as I get older and closer to 30 each year. Perhaps what I have done wrong is that I have only spoken to two people who were unsuitable and wasted years with them despite them being unsuitable for marriage.

I have five years until I turn 30 in which I have to find a spouse so that I can start a family and have a child by 29-33 and then perhaps one more before I am 35 so now I don’t have any time to waste. I have to get serious about this now.

I am not a social butterfly, in fact I barely leave the house. I don’t know how I will do this in the little time I have. Some reassurance and if you share your own stories would be much appreciated - particularly how things have worked out for other introverts. I would appreciate advice in finding a husband as quickly as possible and signs on how to weed out the people who are not suitable prospects for consideration.

The internet is full of misogynistic horror stories scaring young women with ideas like: “If we aren’t married by 30, we probably never will marry.” Or that “men do not want older women and that they all only want women 5-10 years younger than they are.” Or that we have to “compete” with younger women in their 20s when we get to our thirties and that men would prefer a less attractive young girl over a very pretty older woman and that “how you age doesn’t matter - your chronological age will put them off”

I need some real life success stories of people who found true love a little later.

[monorprise]

Your looking for someone to make you feel better, and its not that simple. You are up against biology, nature intended women to start having children in their late teens thou early 30's. This is unfortunately a fact we still can only change on the margins.

The problem your having is a problem many if not most in our western civilization are having. Frankly for many of the same reasons many of which were I'm sorry to say intentionally encouraged to have precisely this effect.

The longer a woman delays marriage, the less likely she is to be married and the fewer children she will have.

There are a number of reasons why this is true.
1: First and foremost is biology, Nature cannot wait.

2: The 2nd problem is sorting, as you recognized the older you get the less valuable you are to every man who shares your goals of marriage and family, as you become less suited. We men are actually programed by nature to favor young women for precisely this propose.

3:The 3rd problem is resources, one of the main reasons not finding a man who can support you in all theses ways is there are in fact very few such men, particularity among younger ages. This is a result of education changes in the late 90's that drove a lot of boys away from learning and the very high cost of living today due to competition and legally limited housing availability.
The reality is if you want a man who can pay your bills and keep a roof over your head he's going to need a lot more time to become so established. Which means you have to go older, because again #1 you can't wait. Otherwise your going to have to struggle together.

4: Opportunities to communicate, like it or not modern social and cultural issues have made it very difficult to meet people. Put simply we have become very intolerant of male pick ups and hermits. If you wish to find men you must go to where they are. Today that is either outside or if your looking for a homebody like you you might try video game forms. Granted the odds of such men supporting you are not so good, but neither is the available population.

5: Examine modern demographics and reevaluate your standards of "unsuitability", your absolutely right you have yet to meet a suitable man in 8+ years of looking. That means your either looking incorrectly, or more likely setting standards you can't afford in today's world.

As explained in Issues #3 the world of men is no where near as rich as most people think. As explained in Issue #2 every year that goes by your selection gets worse with the only mitigating factor being that your max age range goes higher, but that also means fewer and fewer "Good men" are still available, as what remains increasingly consist of men who have choice to remain single or players.

[myTake Owner]

Thank you for your very detailed advice. I have read through it and will be considering joining a church group. I will refer back to it in the coming weeks as my goal is to be married by 29 at the very latest - that means I have four years to find someone to marry. Hopefully I can find a traditional man in that time.

[monorprise]

@Sarahr123
I would like to point out there is an algorithm you can follow developed for this sort of problem if your looking for a mathematically optimized solution for your best chances of finding the best partner.

Basically it comes down to around 30% rule.
1st: First set a period of search in this case your planning around 4 years.

2nd: For the first ~30% of that time (~1.3 years) your just identifying the market to know what is really available to you as an individual. You could really say this period has already passed unless you want to start anew with say a Church group or going out.

3rd: From that market, of guys and traits Actually available to you pick the best combination of traits, and marry the next guy who has them.

This algorithm is used professionally each similar problem and in fact was originally developed by mathematician for this very propose of finding a partner. As it is deigned to account for the time factor.

[Mallic00]

It's not a complete lost cause there are medical means for a woman to have a healthy child even well into their 50s

[BoopBoopBeep]

@Mallic00 Expensive ones, with mixed success rates, but yes...

[monorprise]

@Mallic00 Medical tecnoligy can make a woman pregnant in her 50's, the oldest is actually 80's but not with her own eggs unless they were frozen many decades before. Even then The risks get higher with each passing year that it won't work or something could go wrong. Realistically 45 is the max, and your odds are already not good.

Nature designed women to have their babies in their 20s and 30s, many women only have their 20s. if that. We still can't change that fact and likely won't be able to until we are close to immorality.

[monorprise]

@BoopBoopBeep Even when it is possible for a woman to have babies that late reliably, men are still programed with the old rules in mind. All the men available will also have had that many more years to settle down for good with a woman if they had any intention of ever doing so.

Frankly if you want a loyal man after 40 look for a widower

[Mallic00]

It's better then nothing. Besides people are dating and getting married later and later in life.

[monorprise]

@Mallic00 Yes and the civilizations where this is happening are declining with sub-replacement birth rates.
Biology does not adapt to cultural problems, the culture simply solves the problem before it kills them or ceases to exist. Right now the west is well on its way toward ceasing to exist.

[Mallic00]

Look at it this way, imagine telling a woman that she's basically worthless after 30.

[monorprise]

@Mallic00 Real compassion is concerned with results not how someone feels. You only worry yourself with their feeling with it doesn't matter to results.

Beyond that remember we humans are designed to experience a full range of feelings, most are designed for a world that ceased to exist 20+ thousand years ago, however some of them are still appropriate and useful.

[Mallic00]

Sympathetic pity and concern for the sufferings or misfortunes of others.
That is literally the definition of compassion.
What you're talking about is merciless pragmatism.

Seriously this is why you got so many spiteful and bitter women running around, people like you who behind all the flowery words and justification deep down think women are nothing more then glorified baby making machines with an expiration date. You would never be so callous if you didn't believe that to some extent.

[monorprise]

@Mallic00 If your focused on how they feel right now rather than how they will feel over their life you care about how YOU feel during the brief encounter you have with them. Not how they will feel following your bad advice.

Is that Sympathy or pitty? No its not, its your own selfishness, for not wanting to see the temporary unhappiness of having to deal with a problem while they still can.

[Mallic00]

I guess mercy would be a good ol pimp slap and reminding them of their place.

[SakuraBlossoms87]

@monorprise Then explain WHY some of the most IMPORTANT people in the WORLD throughout ALL of history had later mothers.
Thomas Edison - Mother was 37
Nikola Tesla - Mother was 34
Alexander Graham Bell - Mother was 38

The list is ENDLESS of inventors, famous IMPORTANT people, etc been born to later mothers. People who BETTERED the world. People who CONTRIBUTED on a massive world wide scale.

Now on the reverse having young mothers was extremely common to peasants, riftraft and others who did NOT contribute to society throughout history. Because of their lack of skills, lack of education, etc. having children young was important because all these children were was FREE LABOUR.

And it still is the case. People who contribute the LEAST to society have children young. Many end up on welfare with a half dozen or more children because each brat is a bigger paycheque.

[monorprise]

@SakuraBlossoms87 I did not claim that great children would not be born of older mothers. Indeed given the same genetics which would lead to great children would most likely in an industrialized world also lead to mothers putting off child rearing to use said talents.

It is very much more likely that they would be born to older mothers in addition to being fewer in number. The latter of course is in fact a problem for the human race as it inhibits us from containing a sufficiently industrialized population to settle the stars.

[BlackBeauty90]

@monorprise Let me be blunt. Women can safely have children until 40 and it has been scientifically proven MANY times that aging men provide far more risk for children with disabilities then women. The mutation rate is many times higher with old sperm than old eggs.

Increased schizophrenia and autism is the fault of older fathers, as example, not mum.

And so

The average man saying a woman has to marry young, etc. isn't a man.

He is a boy child stuck in an adult body with the maturity of a 5 year old. He says these things to harass, bully and belittle women into getting involved early, young and without in today's world education & career so that she is forced to depend upon the "man" and has no easy means to escape. It is typically a forebearer to what will be a degrading, demeaning, borderline or outright abusive relationship.

One merely has to take a peek at the lower classes of society - where marriage young is very typical - to see reality of this. Police spend more time dealing with "relationships" between a working more often than not embittered alcoholic husband and an at home often poorly or not educated jobless wife than they do in any other spousal bracket. Spousal abuse, spousal rape & other unsavory aspects of course are far more typical.

.

Because biologically women can safely have children until 40.

It is men as they age which provide more of a risk due to the increased mutation in sperm for children to be born with disabilities. And that makes sense. For 1 egg there's thousands of sperm for with 20 to 50% mutation rate = a child with disabilities.

[slatyb]

There are three single women in church for every two men.

[exitseven]

I met my wife by accident. I was 24years ld. We got married about a year later. We had our first baby 11 months after that. I was totally unprepared both economically and emotionally. It was a very hard transition. I was carried kicking and screaming into adulthood. I get that you are hearing the clock ticking but if you are not financially settled in your life it will be a tough go.

[myTake Owner]

Was your wife the same age as you?

[exitseven]

She is 10 months younger than me.

[exitseven]

Thanks for the MHO😎

[Avicenna]

I’d advise you to freeze some of your eggs if you can

[Finchie40]

It’s very hard to find true love these days , I blame social media for most of it by damaging a lot of the traditional foundations of a relationship, Most people have a hard time trusting each other these days because of these friggin devices we keep by our side , Not realizing the damage it can cause in a relationship , When I was in my late teens early 20’s smart phones and social media apps wasn’t really a thing , I ended up dating a girl and marrying a girl that I thought I would spend the rest of my life with , Her and I were inseparable, we made beautiful children together and I was so happy to be with her , things were great between us until social media apps like Facebook and MySpace were the new trend , that sucked a lot of us in , cuz it was new and exciting , not realizing the shit that came along with it , Girls from my past and present were reaching out to me , Guys from her past and present were reaching out to her , little by little the trust we had for each other started getting bumpy, because we were wasting our time and energy into things we didn’t have and comparing our lives to others , thinking we deserve better than what we already have , and started being distant from each other all of a sudden , I was no longer her priority, anymore , the intimacy and affection between us started to fade we both sat with constant question marks over our head wondering if each of us was being up to no good, the trust between us started dwindling , Ex girlfriends and new girls were reaching out to me easily and the same thing was happening to her , to save our relationship I got off those apps but sadly she didn’t, she was more addicted than I was , I eventually busted her flirting with a co worker that wanted to fuck her that she was secretly having conversations with , Next thing you know she was meeting him at a hotel to make his wish come true , Most people think they can be sneaky on their phones but little do they realize their phones can also get them busted , I filed for divorce and ended it with her after I busted them red handed , So again social media has played a big part on damaging the foundation of love and commitment people use to have for each other , people have become more selfish and only do what is best for them , most people today aren’t content with each other anymore , they constantly think they deserve better than what they already have , I have witnessed and experienced so many relationships fail because of people being sneaky on their phones , Most people today aren’t content anymore , because they fill their heads with useless information that they read every day on social media , every one is a cheater , everyone will back stab you , if your partner is doing this it means they are doing that blah blah blah , Entering back into the dating world after my divorce , I was so lost , and in shock on how much times have changed , I started dating girls’ that were secretly married and lying to me or secretly cheating on their boyfriends with me , or girl’s that couldn’t stay committed that were jumping from guy to guy , I am not saying everyone is like this but a majority of people are especially the ones that t came Into my life , and it’s sad , My heart has so many walls up now so For me to even consider getting married again, because of all the craziness I experienced , so a girl is going to have a lot of wall climbing to do , to prove to me she isn’t a selfish piece of shit , that only cares about herself , Most of the girl’s I have dated ended up being very selfish , so I no longer settle for a girl that does t understand the real tradition of a relationship and what commitment means , I no longer rush into a relationship with a girl because so many people in general are selfish these days and only do what is best for them , I am not saying I am perfect , but based off of my experiences with girls through the years , I know selfishness is the biggest relationship killer , when someone can’t wear your shoes like they expect you to wear theirs , that relationship won’t last , it’s a complete waste of time , The only way a relationship can survive today is if both partners remove selfishness for each other and make each other their top priority over everyone , understanding you can’t always be right and they are wrong , understanding that love only grows when 2 people value each other over everyone else , over your friends over your family , or your relationship will not last , cell phones has made it easy for people to have back up plans cuz they are selfish people period , if they don’t get their way , they go get it elsewhere , Divorce rates have climbed over marriages because people are selfish period only doing what is best for them , the truth is you can only give what you want to receive , No one is perfect , so stop comparing , Your partner needs to be your top priority period , We don’t get into relationships to be single , if you do be prepared to be single again bottom line

[MzAsh]

I believe social media doesn’t change people or relationships, it reveals them. I’m sorry to hear about your marriage, but it was always fundamentally flawed. You may have not been right for each other or you may have not been ready for each other. Social media brought out other options that piqued her interest. If that didn’t, a middle aged crisis likely would have. Sad truth is, most people are marrying the wrong person or they’re marrying way before they’re ready. If you were right for each other and ready for marriage, you both would have made a commitment to work things out, but that’s not what happened, and it was for reasons rooted inside of the two of you, not within social media. Social media exposed the fact on some level, she either felt you weren’t the one she wanted at the time. That was always the case lingering inside of her. You just didn’t know it until what happened, happened.

[myTake Owner]

I agree with you that social media can ruin more relationships today that it could have when it didn’t exist but I also think it is a tool that is useful for bringing out someone’s true colours. A cheater is a cheater regardless of the circumstances. If someone gave them attention online and they melted, they’d do the same in real life - it just becomes easier for men to approach women online because they don’t feel as nervous as they would on real life.

I know many good women with private accounds and less than 100 - sometimes less than 50 followers. I have never had more than 30 followers.

A person’s past is an important factor at determining what kind of partner they’ll be. I’d avoid someone with a lot of partners, a lot of female friends and a lot of people on social media - I know many girls who prefer men who despite being young and born in this time of technology choose not to be on it. I’m am old soul - probably should have been born in the 20s.

I value traditional gender roles and the institution of marriage. I always just wanted to be a devoted and traditional wife and mother with a good, loving and loyal husband. Just wanted a simple life with 2-3 children and a to own a cosy little home but inflation and living crisis has made even that so difficult a thing to achieve for people my age.

I am not the frivolous type and I am seeking a traditional, good and loyal man who does not validation seek online like the people you pointed out do. It is so rare to find such people in today’s society and that is why my search is taking this long. I will not settle until I find that rare diamond - I know he’s out there somewhere. In the meantime I am trying to work on myself so I can be worthy of him when I find him.

[Finchie40]

It doesn’t change people but it opens doors for people , opening them up to a world outside of reality , being drawn into something new and exciting , instead of what they already have right in front of them , Back then we didn’t give 2 shits about what someone was eating or where someone was going , or what someone is wearing , we weren’t bombarded by other people’s lives period , We didn’t know what our exes were up to , we didn’t know if someone was interested in us unless they had the courage to approach you , social media made it so easy for people to come into our lives , people I thought I would never see again were popping up with my finger tips , someone that had a crush on you that you never knew had a crush on you was easily expressing how they felt about you , Yes we all make our own choices and decisions in life but social media made it easier for people to be more selfish , comparing their lives to others , Almost every girl I have dated would compare me to some other guy , Look where he is taking his girlfriend , Look what he is doing for her , I wish I was treated that way , I wish I didn’t have to work , I wish you thought of things like they did ect… back then you valued each other more cuz we weren’t bombarded by nonsense, People easily get bored these days because they put themselves in this fantasy world that social media is feeding onto their heads. So yes it doesn’t make
People cheat it opens doors for
Them to cheat , and it opens doors to not being satisfied with what you already have in front of you , Most people want their cake and want to eat it to, They only want what they feel is best for them , Most people want what they don’t have , they focus their energy and time on things they don’t have over things they already have. , when they lose it all then they realize how much of a selfish piece of shit they were and then sometimes they try coming back begging for forgiveness, I never take exes back, You dug your own grave so lie in it

[myTake Owner]

I agree with you that social media makes us compare our lives to others. A lot of the stuff we see on people’s accounts are not even true but our minds are distorted to think of it as such. We only see things the way people want us to see them. I have never told my ex that he didn’t do anything for me - in eight years he never once got me flowers. We never went anywhere either. We used to meet in parks mostly. A handful of times we met indoors but that was it. We were so young when we started. I was 15 and he was 21 when we met. We were 17 and 23 when we started a relationship and we were 23 and 29 when we broke up. As I grew older what I wanted in life and in a husband changed and so I just couldn’t see him the same anymore and we ultimately went on our own separate paths.

It’s important to find an understanding, loyal person who is not too materialistic but is practical and understands that money is important but is not greedy. It is important to find someone who is emotionally mature and has a high EQ. Someone with humility and integrity so they’ll always try to rectify their wrongs and will not do anything that causes them to not be able to meet their own gaze when they look into a mirror. Reading people properly and choosing people based on good character is the most important thing.

[Finchie40]

Exactly , accepting each others flaws and prioritizing each other over a everyone else is the only way love can grow , Always wear your partner’s shoes before making decisions , always consider them when making decisions, if you can’t do that for your partner, they will not be able to do it for you period because it will become a double standard, Double standards don’t work well with me period , If a girl expects me to do for her she needs to do for me bottom line , it can’t be one sided , Just because you might think you are right , your partner might think you are wrong. so never assume things are ok until you communicate with your partner about it , if your partner is telling you they do not want you going away on a girls trip you tell your friends sorry I can’t go , especially if you told your partner the same thing, if he wanted to go away on a Guy’s trip , I am not saying you have to hold each other’s hands every where you go , but your partner should always be your top priority when making decisions period , You are no longer single , you choose to be in a committed relationship with someone the same way they choose to be with you , when boundaries are set in a relationship that goes for both partner’s not just one, Why so many relationships fail is because people are selfish and only think what is best for them , I don’t get into relationships to be single , I get into a relationship with a girl to share things together , to go places together , work as a team , My friends will never come over my partner the same way her friends should never come over me period , Why I no longer jump into relationships with girls’ because most girls don’t grasp the concept of commitment, I am not going to stand by a girl that is clearly not standing by me , I will not commit to a girl that can’t remove selfishness for me the same way she wants me to remove it for her , it needs to go both ways or it will not work period , it has nothing to do with insecurities

[Finchie40]

It comes down to respect for each other

[BoopBoopBeep]

The more I read your replies to others the more I am confident that with your new course of action you'll get where you want to be. I look forward to reading of your engagement in your sign-off message here.

[TDDMS]

Your entire post is an example of someone ignoring the rule of "Knowing One's Terrain." I'm making the following statement under the assumption that you are here in the states. If true, ask yourself this: How do women treat men in this country? Additionally, how do women see men and vice versa?

Regarding my first question, if your response is women are great and treat men as royalty. Such a response is nowhere near reality. The fact of the matter there are too many women who are dysfunctional. They engage in magically thinking, have unrealistic standards, don't pull their weight, engage in many unproductive and unhealthy behaviors. Namely using social media for validation and social interaction. My list can go on.

Regarding my last question, men see women as a luxury and women see men as a necessity. Even through all the haze of modernity and feminist thinking, women cannot live without men. As an example, the very machines we are using at this moment to communicate. Men designed the machines, manufactured the machines, invented the mathematics to make these computers work, maintain the infrastructure, and so on. This is one example of many. It was men who moved people away from living on the savannahs and jungles into a civilization. And because men see women as a luxury, that's a reason why we have a take it or leave attitude when it comes to women, relationships, and the like.

What do women contribute? They make other humans through a natural biological process that doesn't require any work, other than being smart enough to get pregnant before the age of 35. But the ability to be a good mother isn't marked by her ability to get knocked up, but rather, as a litmus test, if her kids make it to the age of 25 and aren't screwed up (eg. not having a $200/day coke habit, haven't seen the inside of a prison, is able to stand on their own feet, etc.)

Lastly, regarding your last paragraph, you claim all of those preferences and real statements are misogynistic. The statement "men don't want older women." That's a statement of FACT!!! The only time a male wants an older woman is when he is a freshman in high school and wants to hook up with senior girls. But outside of that context, the majority of men aren't going for or have interest in women older than them.

The sooner you understand the terrain you are in, the better at navigating it you will be.

[myTake Owner]

1. I am in the UK. I live in London and although some people here have crazy habits, I don’t think it’s anywhere near as crazy as the US.

2. Even if people have bad habits, it doesn’t apply to me. I am a good girl. My mother locked me up at home as Rapanzel for 25 years (for my own good). I have never seen the inside of a club or shisha lounge or bar let alone the inside of a prison. I am a teetotaller and have never even touched alcohol or cigarettes in my life let alone drugs. My only friends are female. I don’t use social media - I have WhatsApp which only has my family on it, very close relatives and only female friends. I want a husband like that so I keep the same rules for myself.

3. I understand that men want younger women but despite being a traditional woman living in an ultra-modern society it doesn’t seem easy to find a traditional man to marry. I don’t want to delay getting married and having children, I just can’t find the right person to do it with. I grew up without a dad and of course I don’t want the same for my children. Given my circumstances and turbulent early life I am very very proud of my resilience and the way I turned out and the way my siblings turned out.

4. I have never claimed that men are not important or that we do not need men. I am well aware that women are not able to do a lot of the things that probably only men can do. We have different roles in society. I agree with educating girls and making them independent enough that if they have to get by on their own. Survival is very important and if they get an abusive husband or their husband abandons them or God forbid something happens to him then she should be able to at least provide a decent life for herself and one or two children. I am not saying that is going to happen but it prevents a woman from becoming completely defenceless under such circumstances.

[monorprise]

1: The USA is a big place 5 times as many people as the UK spread out among a vastly diversity in geography and sub-cultures. What you see on TV are the rare extremes, most places are very quite. I'm sure this is true of what little we know of the UK, but then again we know almost nothing of the UK.

2: That is very admirable, but also quite explanatory of why you have soo few opportunities to meet men. I would strongly recommend a church group, although I understand Church in the UK is even more dire straits than in the USA. As such it is a shame you can't simply move to the American Bible belt and join a local church group here.

Anther option is something like EHarmony which is a a christian match making service. They might be able to find a man in the UK who shares your values.

3: As admirable as your goals are at some point you need to face reality of what you can afford. For 8 years you have been trying to find such a man and have failed. He may not exist within your reach, and unfortunately Time is a factor here.

From an algorithm point of view you should have: A) First established the appropriate search time, that you can afford.(which for you being a woman is likely 8 or less years) B) Then spent only about 33% of that time establishing what was available in the market. That is the range of men you can actually choose from. From that market choose what qualities you like most from among them.
Then C) marry the first man who met those available qualities.

That is the optimum algorithm for this sort of problem. Ironically first developed by a guy also looking for a wife hundreds of years ago, and is still used to this day.

[BoopBoopBeep]

I'd say let's go grab coffee and talk about what's going on, but, you know...

As someone who by most standards is considered a man of value (though I'm only 5'10" so your mileage may vary), when I first skimmed through your post I was confused why I was seeing so much bad energy slung your way. You seem to have your head on your shoulders, your profile picture at least gives reason to believe you know how to take care of yourself. You listed a number of behaviors you avoid which are certainly plusses in your column.

Then I got here:

The internet is full of misogynistic horror stories scaring young women with ideas like: “If we aren’t married by 30, we probably never will marry.” Or that “men do not want older women and that they all only want women 5-10 years younger than they are.” Or that we have to “compete” with younger women in their 20s when we get to our thirties and that men would prefer a less attractive young girl over a very pretty older woman and that “how you age doesn’t matter - your chronological age will put them off”

Of course I have no direct understanding of what you've read based only on these generalities, but I know this paragraph was enough for me to lose interest in you, so I wonder if that's happened to other men closer to you. Statistics cannot be misogynistic. They simply are. We can attribute misogynistic or misandrist analysis/commentary to them, but truth is just truth. Not saying all of those are truth, but we'll go through them because I at least don't find you boring.

“If we aren’t married by 30, we probably never will marry.” Or that “men do not want older women and that they all only want women 5-10 years younger than they are.”

Both of these are statements of generalized preference. Most women want a man who is over 1.5 meters tall. That's just an observance, a quantifiable one, and is verified and reproduced in data set after data set. Let's be honest, it's a lot higher than 1.5meters. Verdict: Not misogynist

"[W]e have to “compete” with younger women in their 20s when we get to our thirties."

Do you take issue with the word "compete" here? Which part is misogynistic? Seems rather thin-skinned if that's the case. Competition is what everyone is doing for our time, be it the next hour or the next 30 years. Our time on this rock is finite and there are many different forces seeking to pull us away for a slice of it. This is particularly true for men of value. Let's say I live in the U. K. Actually, no, you live here, otherwise this analogy isn't going to work. You live here, I find you attractive (not "pretty to look at" but attractive as a potential partner). Currently I've started putting together a charity race (5k through half-marathon) in honor of a murdered professor. There's a lot of moving parts, can you take some of those off my plate and serve as sponsorship director? That would A) help me, B) possibly increase the peace in my life and C) give us more time together for me to learn about you, since we'd be working together on a shared end state. You learn more about a person that way then you do by going to coffee with them once or twice.

At a former job I spoke with a woman who went through some real misogyny. Skip the rest of this paragraph if you're easily triggered. I warned you. She fell in love with a boy of the wrong sect. As punishment for being a whore, because if you have a boyfriend and not a husband you're "obviously" a whore, her family, including several of the women, held her down and filled her insides with gasoline, after 4 of the men in her family took turns raping her. Then they dumped her in the river. Despite all that she did manage to get medical treatment quickly after she was fished out of the water. They had to remove everything, so she'll never have kids, which means her boyfriend decided to leave her once he found out what happened, and she's got lasting issues resulting from severe toxicological assault on her body. That's misogyny. That people are aware that geriatric pregnancy starts after 35 isn't misogyny, it's awareness of a medical fact. For the men out there who want children, that is a concern.

"I am not a social butterfly, in fact I barely leave the house."

I'm not a social butterfly in my personal life. I have to be one in my professional life, but that's another story. That said, if you barely leave the house then how/where do you expect to meet a man of value? I think it's admirable you haven't even been inside a hookah bar, but you're not going to meet your dream man in your living room. Find a cause you support if your local churches are underwhelming. Go volunteer. You'll meet men there (or find another cause). I participate in charity races nearly every weekend. Twenty something so far year to date. You eventually do start seeing the same people at these events, even among the sea of nearly 12,000 that was my last race. I work with local animal shelters and vets to provide care to the local rescue and stray population. Many of the vets who do not know me on a first name basis at least know me by face and reputation. That's what you need because then you'll also get referrals from these people for other single people they know, and they'll at least share a commonality with you and be somewhere for you to learn more about each other without having to try out that sheesha bar.

I suspect this is going to hit whatever word limit, so I'm going to get this sent so I can get back to my morning routine. The best of luck to you.

[myTake Owner]

Thank you for taking the time out of your day to write back this very concise response.

I take this response as the most constructive one I have received so far. I would like to thank you for informing me on what behaviours and thinking are off putting to traditional men so I can work on myself to become a better wife in the future.

I would like to thank you once again for opening my eyes with the story of what your friend went through. What she went through is beyond horrific and I hope and pray that she is happier now. May God bless her soul.

Sometimes I can get a little bit ungrateful whilst drowning in my own sorrows and forget the tragedies people around the world are facing. Your response has reminded me today to be more mindful of others and never to forget that there are people who have dealt with serious trauma in life that has had lifelong implications on them. I would take this opportunity to apologise for my naivety and childishness in this matter. I have always been sheltered so it is easy to forget and I appreciate my family for protecting me from such disgusting atrocities that happen to others.

I will consider your advice on joining church groups and becoming involved with charities and NGO’s. I suppose I was always doing things wrong somehow expecting a husband to land in my lap whilst never leaving the house. I will endeavour to meet new people in the right places now.

I will certainly hold onto this advice for many years to come.

Thank you, have a lovely day and God bless you. 😊

[BoopBoopBeep]

Your humility is incredibly attractive, just in case you didn't know. It will serve you well, as will the fact that you've engaged in actual introspection, not the worthless naval gazing of so many now a days. I'm confident that with your course of action you'll find a man of caliber. I'd like an update when that happens, and I'm sincerely glad if I could have played even a small part. May your blessings be in abundance and God be with you in all you do.

[inhua]

change has never occurred when society was comfortable. change only happened when society was uncomfortable

if you're feeling uncomfortable then there's a good reason for it. it's because there's a problem in society that needs fixing and the more that problem lingers on, the more uncomfortable you'll remain until you address it. if you felt comfortable, then these issues wouldn't have been addressed to begin with

few people are ever truly brave enough to address the elephant in the room. those who do address the elephant in the room receive insults, slander, character assassination and buzzword labels like sexist, racist, incel, homophobic, transphobic, xenophobic, bigot etc.

now you can either correctly or incorrectly identify the problem and figure out a viable solution accordingly which can either solve the issues or further enhance those issues

that being said, given the current situation you're faced with, these "misogynistic" horror stories are compiled evidence and experiences that aren't hateful, only events that have occurred. yes it probably hurts as a woman to read all of these men in the stories getting cheated on, losing all his stuff in a wrongful divorce, falsely accused of rape, physically abused and assaulted only to be ignored etc. and you're afraid the road isn't going to be as easy as before where guys would happily show love and affection on the first date now to vetting their women properly and enforcing standards and boundaries

this isn't stuff that men haven't faced before, constantly being told they are useless unless they make 100K a year, are at least 6 feet tall, look like Brad Pitt etc. misleading societal lies are being spread about personality being most important yet criminals like Ted Bundy and Jeremy Meeks can receive love letters and adoration from millions of fangirls while the average dude who works 7-5 24/7 to support himself and eventually a family can commit suicide and nobody gives a shit about him

if being told a reality that men prefer younger women is really that bad, how about being told a reality where you shouldn't have existed to begin with and are expendable. that's just the history of the world where humanity today has far more female ancestors than male ancestors and every other male was expendable. today it's no different and the reality is, most men are simply those expendable men

[DaySpring]

It's pretty simple but the work requires effort... Everyone says they want something but then they aren't discipline as if they get to choose the cost.

Anyway, if you want to weed out the bad... Understand good and bad don't exist. Good fit and bad fit is what you mean. I don't personally believe in making a standard out of money... Especially when you dont even another to earn all the money u want... But the key is too understand the mind and habits. All that a person is, is habit. Words never EVER tell u the truth. My brother, I love him, but is trying to be in the NFL agrees with me that you must pay the cost to have ur goal... Yet I he has trouble staying consistent when he is back in our hometown/area. Yet he has a phone problem like most people... And probably more habits that are sabotaging him.

You can consciously believe something and not subconsciously believe it. Subconscious beliefs show up in behavior and they show consistently.

It is that simple to weeding out a mate. Learn their subconscious programming. Do not trust what they say. Consistent actions and results are the only real indicators of who someone truly is. HOWEVER, that doesn't mean someone isn't growing and getting better. That's something I really dont like about women. They expect guys to just have it all together and they just dont. They are human being trying to figure it out. It doesn't make them bad it just means they are ignorant. It's not bad to grow with someone who really wants that.

I think finding someone is the easy part. Maintaining it over the years is the hard part. I created a whole philosophy on lasting, fulfilling relationships and I think finding someone is the easiest part. But my philosophy is based on growing with someone not finding someone ready made in a world of mostly fuck ups. But u know once u find someone there is a lot of work that doesn't need to be done because it is already done. I just think most people aren't going to find a perfect fit. That's why I prefer the art of changing deep rooted conditioning in order to create perfect couples. It's hard work but it last forever.

[SoIcyGang]

The most important factor in raising children is not money.

I would say that what is most important is the ability to transfer to your children, those habits and knowledge which gives your child maximum control of their own life and happiness.

You don't just want to have money. You want to equip your kid with the tools required to live a good life.

Having money is not an indicator of whether one has such tools. Since with those tools, a person can pursue any avenue they wish in life, including not making a ton of money.

If your values are children and having a family, and prioritizing their futures, than you must look for a man who has the same values as you and understands it the same way you do.

Stop fumbling blindly in the dark. Boldly pursue the values you desire and make DAMNED sure the man you settle with has the same values as you. That he is a man of values and is capable of achieving values himself and capable of teaching the kids how to live.

Learn yourself, how to achieve values. What if you have kids and the man runs off? You left their life's success up to him.

It's not good enough to only be the "warm mother." I think women put a priority on their role as mother. If only you love them and give them a proper home they will have the best life. That's not good enough. Every person must learn to live this life. Learn to pursue the values THEY wish to have in their lives, just as you do yours. Because you want what's best for yourself and for your kids.

Don't just play the role of mother. Know and understand what it takes to achieve the values you want in this life.

Cuz you'll need to teach it to the kids too. You have to teach them to live too, it's not a man's job. It's not a woman's job. It's a rational person who wants the best for their kids job.

Most dudes are not on that level. Even if they are mentally capable, they probably don't really want kids.

Most dudes don't want kids. I think most dudes wait until they're older to want kids. Once they learn that having fun all the time only lasts so long. So start to see that having kids is the final frontier of life.

My point is you have to vet dudes and really stuck to your values and don't let anyone manipulate you. Cuz most dudes only want sex. So you have to stick to your principles if you ever want to have that family and life you want.

[MrOracle]

First, you are going to have to leave the house and spend time out in world. Forgot the idea of finding guys on your phone - you can find hookups but you won't find husbands and father's. You have to meet those in person.

The other thing is that you will need to vet any man you are considering up-front, and you need to pick the man based on his morals, values, and life goals (being a husband and father in the near future has to be among those, obviously) rather than on his looks, status, money, or excitement (aka chaos/danger).

Expect money to be tight and expect to have to build together. What matters is that he prioritizes his family, especially you. Most men will find a way to make enough money when motivated (and supported/respected) by his wife. This is why morals and values are so important.

The chances of finding a hot rich guy with family oriented morals and values is worse than your chances of finding a rainbow unicorn riding a Harley in the Bible Belt, so if you chase the hot, popular guys, expect it not to last.

[hahahmm]

Right. Traditional dudes aren't hanging out on dating sites look for Mrs Right.

[BlackBeauty90]

Let me be blunt. Women can safely have children until 40 and it has been scientifically proven MANY times that aging men provide far more risk for children with disabilities then women. The mutation rate is many times higher with old sperm than old eggs.

Increased schizophrenia and autism is the fault of older fathers, as example, not mum.

And so

The average man saying a woman has to marry young, etc. isn't a man.

He is a boy child stuck in an adult body with the maturity of a 5 year old. He says these things to harass, bully and belittle women into getting involved early, young and without in today's world education & career so that she is forced to depend upon the "man" and has no easy means to escape. It is typically a forebearer to what will be a degrading, demeaning, borderline or outright abusive relationship.

One merely has to take a peek at the lower classes of society - where marriage young is very typical - to see reality of this. Police spend more time dealing with "relationships" between a working more often than not embittered alcoholic husband and an at home often poorly or not educated jobless wife than they do in any other spousal bracket. Spousal abuse, spousal rape & other unsavory aspects of course are far more typical.

.

Because biologically women can safely have children until 40.

It is men as they age which provide more of a risk due to the increased mutation in sperm for children to be born with disabilities. And that makes sense. For 1 egg there's thousands of sperm for with 20 to 50% mutation rate = a child with disabilities.

[midnightmoon05]

Are you financially ready?
meaning say you get married at 27. First kid at 29. Something happens to your spouse when you are around 33 or 35…

are you able to care for yourself and your child financially?

if what you are doing is not working…it’s time to make some changes.
I only hear you complain…where is the action?

i have never thought about marriage, or kids. I enjoy life and takes care of my self. I completed college at 22 and started my career. I save and completed my grad school by 28. By then, I am financially secure and career set. I also went in to higher education before I got married so that I am in top pay.
I met my first husband at 27. Married at 31. First kid at 33. Second kid at 35. I stayed home with them for about 3-5 years.
I returned to my career…my husband decided to leave the marriage. I moved into a tiny apt. and rebuild myself and raise our kids separately without alimony or child support. Since I am able to build wealth at a young age…at this point of my life…I have no financial burdens. My kids college funds are all set. And I also have enough to help them buy their home. But I am not going to do that. They will have to work for it.

so yes.. I too am very traditional, but I am also very independent and logical.

i will not bring a child to this world unless I have the support I need just in case something happens.

my little sister got married at 36, just had a kid at 38. She also has her own apt. her husband came to this country with no work for a yr. He just got a job. Now my little sister is a stay hime mom. … even when we are all financially healthy…we all (15-20) people in my immediate family to help care for each other.

[nastyb]

take this from a 27 yr old woman who is single:
be very careful about rushing to settle down with a man: you might end up lowering your standards and end up marrying a bad man. You might find yourself divorced in a few years down the road.

My advice is: if you truly wanted children, go ahead and have them as a single woman. I expect myself to be single into my 30s and I'm planning on having kids on my own. I have enough money. I have a great paying career. I can afford to have kids on my own.

Never rely on a man to feed you. Because if you rely on a man to feed you, you are also giving him the power to starve you. Learn to survive without a man.

And as for men not preferring women in their 30s. There will always be men chasing you at any age. If you are in your 30s, you will have men in their 40s-50s chasing you. If you are in your 40s, you will likely have 50-60 yr old men chasing you. You might not have tall strong young hot men chasing you but there will always be men going for you. Nobody likes old. Of course a 30 yr old man would be more attractive than a 45 yr old man.

[MzAsh]

Those scare tactics you’ve mentioned are based on unrealistic expectations, and it seems you’re beginning to experience that yourself. They’re set up for a very specific purpose - to get you settled and locked in a situation before you’re smart enough to know better. Of course, that doesn’t mean all women who marry and have children young are settling for less, it’s just that it’s not realistic enough to be set as a standard for everyone, even though they try to make it the standard anyway.


Humans are biologically *and* conditionally immature in their early and mid 20s. The ways you’ll change between ages 20 and 30 are usually pretty significant. I’m know I’m not even compatible with the same type man I used to think I liked when I was 20. My god, marrying that young would have been a disaster.
I want you to think about how all the worrying is serving you. When you look back at your life in 20 years, what do you want to remember about your 20s? Is marriage and babies the only things important to you? Do you have career goals? Hobbies or interests? How do you want enjoy life now?

You’ve mentioned that you’ve wasted time before with men who were unsuitable for marriage. Do you want to also waste time worrying about things you don’t have control over?

[hahahmm]

You know women have a LOT of ideas about men... so of course men are entitled to form opinions about women based on experience. Of course men know that most women today (in the western world) aren't worth settling down with. It's just a fact of how society has changed. It's on you to stand out from the crowd and be known as a traditional type if you want a traditional guy to find you.

Far as the age thing... most women don't bother to develop/have the kind of character and personality that men value. They put all of their value in how they look and some random other things that they think men will value because women value it like having a degree, nice job: but it's stuff men don't actually care about in women. And the more traditional the less he cares about it. Yeah, a guy who is a mooch will love it if you make lots of money tho.

If you do bother to develop the kind of character (the kind of) guys you want are into then you will be more valuable than a woman who looks younger than you but doesn't have that.

That said... you're on the clock. Time is running out. You should prioritize here. if you want to be a mom (with a good husband) you should make being the kind of woman he's looking for your #1 priority right now. You'd be foolish to fill your life with a bunch of other activities and just hope that in the last 3 seconds before the buzzer you can make a 3 point shot from full court distance. Lot of women have tried that and failed.

Check out some of my mytakes from a traditional guy POV. May give you ideas. But you're going to have to set aside ANY so-called feminist/lesbo/man hating ideas that might be lurking in your mind. Living in this culture, you will have some ideas that aren't actually going to help you get what you want.

[nolabels]

I was a confirmed bachelor of 34 when my then-future wife stuck her foot in the front door of my life.

I told her, no kids, before we were eventually (sigh) married.
She wasn't happy about it, but she agreed, no kids.

A couple of years later, here comes a kid.

Now, many years later, the kid has grown and recently left the nest.

My best years are behind me, but I'm hoping to still enjoy life now that some small degree of freedom has been restored to me.

Do what you want.

Go get it if need be.

What I didn't want came to me, and I allowed it to happen.
I should have run the other way.

You do you.

[BoopBoopBeep]

You know, there was a time when I would have sworn my best years were behind me. I certainly can't do all the stuff for my job I once did. No more international bounties. I just want to pick up groceries. But when I reframed my happiness to pull back from the adrenaline junkie life I'd had, I found a lot of solace in what was left.

I get to actually see my house now, do projects in it, make it mine. I am currently sitting on the lower deck with a nice coffee and bourbon watching a deer teach her offspring where to forage for berries. They're 10 feet away. I have two rescue kittens that I would walk through molten glass who provide me with unexpected antics and love in a way I really needed after my ex broke up with me. While I was still able to very actively work, I was able to set my mom up with an annuity that will take care of her as long as she's here. The slippers I have on are very, very comfortable. I got paid to sit in my house today and work on my work computer. Nobody shot at me. Nobody tried to stab me, and I didn't get blown up. When my BP tanked on the way back from the lab yesterday I was able to pull over and get it stabilized really fast... didn't even miss dinner with my kittens. God knows I've had a ton of health problems, but it's just one more thing in line to take me out, and I told all the others "not today" so I'm doing the same to this. One of the charity races this weekend is for the wonderful people who brought me rescue kitten #1, and it has been a pleasure raising money for them, even if I did fall short of my goal. That I can even be part of the race when less than 16 months ago they told me I was dying is not something that is lost on me.

[BoopBoopBeep]

Cont'd for length

I have some people that will and have stacked on a corner with me in some really distant shizhole places, and I have some people on here that I really enjoy getting to talk to. Thanks for that.

I don't know man, I don't want to sound cocky, but maybe this is the start of the best years to come.

I hope you get at least half of what you deserve buddy, 'cause that'll be enough to light up the darkness and shine on through.

[sunflower00]

People honestly only have those insane standards online! In the real world people generally don’t care as much about having a super young partner or having a baby by age 30. My dad had me and my sister when he was 22-25 with my mum, they split up. He has now found love with a different woman and they are perfect together, I can’t remember her age exactly but she’s around mid to late thirties and they have two kids - aged 2 and 1 month and they are very healthy and happy. My dad is 45.


This happens all the time. Most of my friends parents had them when they were mid 30s or even 40. There’s no time limit on love either, it’s not a race, it’s about finding the right person and sometimes it takes time. A couple I know just got married and they are in their 50s!

[EricSummer]

There is no need to panic. You already realize that time is limited which is great, but you are overdoing it a bit.

The main point is not to waste time with unsuitable guys, for example a boyfriend who does not ever want kids, or in some distant future that may never come.

If you are dating for marriage with serious guys, you have all the odds in your favor. You are only just approaching peak attractiveness and I think the challenge is more to weed out unsuitable guys out of the many who are interested.

[DarkWinterNights]

Id like to give you some positive encouragement, but the unfortunate reality is (Western) society has become very socially isolated and anti-family in the last several decades. Both ideologically and lawfully. I don’t know first hand, but I don’t think the UK is in a much better place than the US. I kinda inadvertently gave up on having a family years ago. Never met anyone I felt I could connect with and aren’t really in a place to really socialize with new people on a regular basis. Everyone’s just wrapped up in their own heads.

[abedheadstory]

My mother is a real-life success story of a woman who found love a little later in life. My mother was thirty-two when she had me, thirty-eight when she had my little sister. She had never been married before, but she found the love of her life when she was in her early thirties. She has been happily married to my dad for almost thirty years now, and I'm so proud of her for taking a chance on love. My mother's story is similar to finding a diamond in the rough – she waited patiently until she found her perfect match, and their love has lasted for decades.

[provokeesmokee]

The only suggestion I have for you is give up your dignity and sign up for a church that is least offensive for you.

Offer yourself up to the misogynists there and you'll be knocked up before you know it.

But that's the worst reason to have kids.

Unless you really want to raise kids for the sake of those kids, don't have kids.

Or, if you find someone later in life, consider adoption.

Think about why you're so obsessed with your concept of motherhood, being a wife, and what all that means to you.

You are running out of time to seriously consider your own motivation.

[whirled_up_girl]

Yeah it can be tough. I grew up in a small town and it seems in small towns a lot of people marry someone from highschool, the neighborhood, church etc. When I moved to the city it was all of those things plus work, and college that people met. It does seem to get tougher as we get older and less likely to venture out socially.