Does religion poison everything?

[ladsin]

I agree, religion poisons everything.

I disagree, religion is not a poison.

They're being a tad hyperbolic, but I agree with the idea.

Religion is not a poison, it's the only source of good in our world!

[Anonymous]

The suicide rate amongst atheists is very high, I wonder why haha. I think atheism is a good thing as it is the fastest way to decrease the human population. It prevents overpopulation and only the strong and the rational keep existing. Atheism poisons itself which is pretty impressive in my opinion. I also think it´s admirable how they always stick their noses into businesses which has less to do with them and which they don´t understand e. g. religion. Like where does that anger come from buddy. Mind your own business and live your life. That again is a good thing because it encourages people to actually research stuff when they see atheists bitching about religion, no wonder the amount of reverts is the fastest growing, especially in the west.

Ignorance is poison and the root of evil.

Sincerely, an ex-atheist x

[ladsin]

Where did you get your information that atheists are returning to religion? Every study I've seen on the subject says that non-religious, or atheists are on an exponential rise.
It is a good question, "why are atheists more prone to suicide" I don't know, no causal link has been found. Is it possible that they're discriminated against which may increase depression? Is it possible that atheism itself leads to suicide somehow? I don't know, but I would hinge my bets on the former rather than the latter.
Religion does and did impact my life for a long time, as it effects the lives of millions of people across the world who are being murdered for not sharing in religious belief, or doing something that a particular religion says is bad. That said nothing I said here was angry, I asked a question, about a particular quote.
I find it very telling, that you find suicide to be something good, something to mock.

[Opinion Owner]

www.dailymail.co.uk/.../...Christianity-Islam.html

It is true that the philosophy is growing, it´s the third largest, but since christianity and islam are obviously faster, we could conclude that a big amount is a revert.

´´But using census data on race and religion, and questionnaires issued to mosques, Kevin Brice, a researcher at the University of Wales Trinity Saint David, calculated that around 5,200 Britons turn to Islam every year, and that the total number of converts is about 100,000.´´

´´United States : According to many sources, more than 20000 Americans convert to Islam every year.

United Kingdom : Kevin Brice, a researcher at the University of Wales Trinity Saint David, calculated that around 5,200 Britons turn to Islam every year, and that the total number of converts is about 100,000.

[Opinion Owner]

France : 4000-7000 Frenchman convert to Islam every year. There are about 150000-200,000 Muslim converts in France. Conversion rates have significantly increased (nearly doubled) after the Charlie Hebdo attack. An estimated 70,000 French citizens have converted to Islam in recent years, according to a report by France 3 public television.

Germany : More than 4000 Germans convert to Islam every year. There are around 100,000 converts to Islam in Germany.

Russia : I didn't find any source but my own estimate is 5000-10000. There are about twenty million Muslims in Russia. Correct me if i am wrong.

Singapore : About 500 people convert to Islam each year. That has been the average since the 1990s, said the Muslim Converts' Association of Singapore.

Ireland : It is estimated that up to 500 Irish people convert to Islam every year. Islam is Ireland's fastest-growing religion, with the number of Muslims recorded in the 2011 Census – 48,130 – expected to reach 100,000 by 2020.

[Opinion Owner]

Spain : 2000-4000 Spanish convert to Islam every year. About 50000 people converted in recent years.

Source :

Rise of Islamic Converts Challenges France
How many people convert to Islam?
Being German, becoming Muslim: how German converts to Islam balance their national identity and their faith
Muslim Converts in Germany: Angst-Ridden Germans Look for Answers -- And Find Them in the Koran - SPIEGEL ONLINE
Comeback: How Islam Got Its Groove Back in Russia
500 here convert to Islam every year

[Opinion Owner]

Lifting the veil on Irish Islam - Independent. ie

I couldn´t really find the same about christianity but it still is one of the fastest growing in the world: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_population_growth

I think the latter would be more logic, because I´m from Europe and atheism is well tolerated here (in fact religion is kinda looked down upon), yet the suicide rates are in my country high. Before I reverted I had this feeling I was missing something and I felt like I was drowning seeking for what it was but I had no clue what it might be. It was pressuring on my heart constantly and at a given time I started to feel gloomy. I can´t really explain the feeling but whenever I came close to a sharp object I was thinking what if I just kill myself now. I felt peace when I was talking with a friend who is Christian.

[Opinion Owner]

Sorry to hear that. My parents are the opposite and being different from them wasn´t tolerated but here I am today. You´re absolutely right about that people should be able to have freedom in choosing their beliefs without being attacked for it. Saying it doesn´t happen within the atheist community is wrong.. I can assure you it does happen that parents would disown their child for it. Telling them that you converted to a religion would get you a hard time.

Well it´s what I noticed that atheists can´t stand not saying something about religious people at least a few times in their life. I think respect is important. Something we dont´disagree with it alright but we shouldn´t disrespect it as that is what wreaks havoc.

Morally seen it is wrong and horrible, but rationally seen we have an overpopulation problem.

[ladsin]

Those don't say anything about how many atheists are converting. Lateral transfer between religions is pretty frequent.
So perhaps we'd hinge our bets on different sides of the coin, but at the end of the day no causal link has been shown between the two and thus saying people are killing themselves because of atheism is a claim that does not appear to be evidenced.

[NalaxHungry]

Religion can be a good thing. It turns bad when people judging and hating other people because they don’t agree with that belief. Parents disown their children because that kid question the word. Understand everyone is a person and everyone has rights to do and to believe whatever ridiculous thing they choose. As long as it doesn’t harm anyone it should be ok but that is not the case these days. Religion is a problem because bad apples don’t know how to accept everyone is entitle to their own opinion and shouldn’t be stoned for it.

[EllezBellez98]

I saw Lawrence Krauss describe as an evolutionary step that helped us build societies and civilisations, but that like many other evolutionary characteristics it can become necessary at a certain time and if it stays for two long it can potentially slow society from evolving further. He wasn't talking about biological evolution in this case, more so societal evolution.

[jacquesvol]

@EllezBellez98 an evolutionary step, indeed, like getting food by hunting and gathering and knowing how late it is by looking at the sun. Society is beyond that but some die hard Flintstones still think there's a need to impose it on others.

[Red-Blaze]

I completely disagree
Religion is a tool
You can use a wrench to close a pipe and give life saving water to far away people or you can hit it on someone's head to kill them
The tool is not the killer its just a tool is how one takes it and uses it that makes it good or bad

[curiousnorway]

I think religion has it's advantages and disadvantages.

Advantages:
- Gives people hope, a purpose with life and comforting them.
- Religion is like sports and other hobbies, it makes social communities.
- People advertising for their religion isn't necessary only negative. Some positive things with it is charity.

Disadvantages:
- Scaring people and making them believe in Hell
- Used as a tool to control people, spread hate, discriminate and make conflicts
- Use it as an excuse to stay conservative and not being able to understand why the society sometimes needs a change
- Used to explain things that could be explained with science

[TripleAce]

It might have become
That way

But it wasn't that way once upon a time. It was the glue to binding large communities of people giving structure

In fact even today. Religion is a great benchmark to reflect your decisions against
Without the moral ground work that comes from religion I think people would be worse off

The fear of not entering heaven is real as it comes for so many. And it guides their decisions towards a questionable path yes but nevertheless a good one for most

[ladsin]

"Without the moral ground work that comes from religion I think people would be worse off" Explain this for me some more if you would.

[TripleAce]

well religion is like the what if... its the salvation to everything bad... it's the hope to a very hopeless life, a very hopeless world...

we look up and have no choice but to look back down and continue on, we are so weak and pathetic... we can barely even distinguish the difference between right and wrong
--> religion somewhat protects us from that
--> for the most part, religion is created to bind large amounts of people into one civilization, under a common message

it creates discipline but forcing yourself to stick to rituals
and the fear of the god all mighty seems to protect us from doing bad things, for the most part

--> what I really mean to say is that the actual text might not be the best but the idea (god and good deeds to enter heaven) it projects onto us does seem to play a positive role

[ladsin]

Hmm. If that were the case would it not seem more likely that atheists and not theists would fill our prisons?

[TripleAce]

well that's hard to say because atheist still live in a world that has been intertwined with religion, moral justifications... and law
I mean an atheist today isn't so likely to feel that taking a life is ok since we grow up into a world where it is not ok - because of moral justifications from religion and the law...

[ladsin]

Why do you think it is then that secular societies tend to have the lowest incidence of crimes like rape, murder, etc whereas highly religious societies have the highest rates?

[TripleAce]

Its almost like laws of diminishing returns
The world has become overpopulated and religion has served its purpose long ago

If it wasn't for religon who knows if colonies would of even gelled together. They might have but potentially based on some other idoelogy

Today, power, greed and the hunger for money rules most people
Religion is lost within that huge mess

Its sacred lessons are now motivation for power, control and to further personal agendas
Its also become a great way of segregating the population. Identifying people ny religion. He's a jew, she's a muslim for example

Secular societies might indirectly draw in people that are tryng to get away from all that mess

But again what it is today isn't the sAme as what it use to be
Its a mess today. Ya i do agree with that

[ladsin]

Oh no, not to be confused I Would most definitely disagree with the notion that things are more a mess today than in the past. In fact on almost every societal health factor available we're living in the absolute best of times.

[SirMavane]

Hitler used christianity because it was the religion that also disliked the jews, it was easy to get christians to follow his goals of taking out the jews because christians didn't exactly take a liking to the jews either.

"In his book Mein Kampf and in public speeches prior to and in the early years of his rule, he affirmed a belief in Christianity.[7][8]Hitler and the Nazi party promoted "Positive Christianity",[9] a movement which rejected most traditional Christian doctrines such as the divinity of Jesus, as well as Jewish elements such as the Old Testament."
He wrote that in his OWN book. He wasn't a firm believer, because he felt it hindered scientific advancement and more, but he wasn't atheist. And even if he was, that doesn't automatically mean all nazins were

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

That's ridiculous. I know they are exaggerating, but saying something like that is stupid.

Religion can only become a serious cancer to society as what Islam has been doing for over a thousand years currently still doing or the demonic Catholic Churche did during the middle ages to people.

Other than that, religion as a whole even though I disagree with Hinduism and all other religions gives people hope and a personal sense of security and "joy"

So leave them alone.

[sophieevans]

Ironic how you say leave them alone while calling Catholics demonic and muslims cancer. Fucking hypocrite

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sophieevans: learn to read. I said the Catholic Chruch and Isalm.

[sophieevans]

Still calling islam cancer which means muslims are cancer either show your true hateful colors or don't be a hypocrite trying to act nice by saying leave them alone

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sophieevans: Isalm is a cancer. Anyone that knows a bit of its histroy knows that. Even currently Isalm and its wacked out Muslims are causing major headaches around the world with their violent non sense.

[sophieevans]

Then either do as you said and leave them alone or stop being a hypocrite

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sophieevans: Leaving them alone meant if they aren't screwing around with others with their foolishness.

[sophieevans]

a lot of muslims don't do shit its only isis and a lot of muslims disagree with isis i have a muslim bestfriend and she is great don't judge if you don't understand shit

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sophieevans: You're the one that don't understand.

They are about I think last time I checked about 500,000,000 million Muslims radicals world wide out of 1 billion plus Muslims.

A small percentage actively engage in jihad against infidels and strictly follow the commands of the Qur'an and Hadith to kill infidels.

The other big percentage just sit at home but support the idea of Sharia law world wide and that Islam should rule world wide and support other Muslims that push the agenda of Islam to rule by any means.

So don't tell me it's a small percentage.

[sophieevans]

Yeah as if i would believe a statistic online whats the source of it i dont remember my friend taking that servay of do you support isis and the majority of muslims do not support radicals , radicals kill even muslim people we have a common enemy yet you make them the enemy im done talking to you

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@sophieevans: Whatever

[Anonymous]

An asshole will be an asshole regardless of what they believe in or support and will use any excuse to justify their behavior. This is a problem with the individual not whole. In short religion is what you make of it. I will say that making such a broad statement as "religion poisons everything" sounds toxic and close minded. A great deal of charity work is done through religious organizations. There have also been many wars fought on the matter as well. If you look at any large scale organization that has existed for hundreds or thousands of years there is going to be good and bad history.

[dragonfly6516]

I agree, for the most part. Religion in and of itself is a type of culture. Groups of people have run entire civilizations with laws based on their religious practices.

I've been saying for a while now that they only thing which truly divides the human race, is culture.

When your faith based belief that cannot be proven with science is literally law, it makes perfect sense that people will rebel and go to war over it.

[Bananaman177]

Why wouldn't you assume that HUMANS poison everything, and that religion is just another example? We poisoned Capitalism and Communism, why not religion too?

Jesus had nothing good to say about religion, but most Christians have no idea what Jesus said or why.

[iChris28]

Tell that to St. Joan of Arc. She made Victory of Hundred Years War, but was accused of "Heresy" by the "Holy Church" because she used "Magic" to aid her in the war. Ironically, in Ten Commandments, "Thou shall not Kill". In that war, she might have murdered several dozens of people, but nonetheless because of her "Faith" in God, she was Canonized as a Saint. Man, quite entertaining actually...

[jacquesvol]

and Joan of Arc had an affair with pedophile murderer Gilles de Rais. Some saint :-p

[MrTim]

Pure religion teaches you must do something or be something, bring something to the table yo be saved. = the fact people murder in the name of gods, teach others to hate I the name of religion. But you must look into a religion to understand. Those who do not look into it, will never understand, so they judge.

[ladsin]

What about if your religion commands you to kill?

[MrTim]

Then what's the point of having it? If your religion tells you to kill, that means some one was told to kill you before you converted. Why would you build yourself up on a religion of blood and death?

[ladsin]

I don't know why, but it seems like many do XD

[MrTim]

Exsaclt. I do not have religion. I have a belief. And that belief is what many people call religion but it tells us nowhere we must kill. Or that some one is unworthy, or needs to die.

[Political_dude]

Ehh. I don't think so. I wrote a mytake about it Religion Isn't the Worst Thing to Happen to Humanity - From an Atheist ↗

[deady]

Religion made everything good and pushed for people to great things. Something you should look up is sphere sovereignty. A place for everything and everything in its place, gotta keep a balance.

[ladsin]

Religion made everything good? Like the enslavement of others?

[deady]

That's not what religion did. Religion is what made the renaissance great. Its what molded western society and culture and built the family. Its what made morals so that you would know that enslavement is bad. Why do you think religion made slavery?

[ladsin]

Several religions mandated or condoned slavery. Specifically the three monotheistic ones.

[deady]

Christianity is the only one I have any real knowledge about. It does not condone slavery, it only says what you should do should you find yourself enslaved. I'm assuming you're referring to Ephesians?

[ladsin]

No, not at all. The explicit command to take slaves, and "20 “Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property." Exodus 21:20-21
How much of the Bible have you read? It often endorses taking slaves, young virgins as prisoners of war etc.

[deady]

Exodus is a story, what you are reading is from someone speaking not from God. I have ready the bible, i mentioned Ephesians because it is where most people have issues.

[ladsin]

Those are god's commands. According to the story at least. I obviously don't believe it, but the religious holy text says this is the word of god. These are part of the first set of commandments that Moses was given.

[Urkandir]

It had made a lot of bad stuff back then, but today it isn't that dangerous, but still, a lot of people die because of religion nowadays, terrorism is the most common of causes, that war in Israel too.

[ladsin]

Don't these two statements, "today it isn't that dangerous, but still, a lot of people die because of religion" appear to be in direct conflict?

[Urkandir]

No because I actually said that isn't that dangerous, not that it isn't completely dangerous at all, wich is true that there are lots and lots of religious that aren't even a bit dangerous, while few ones today are. The same applies to almost everything, car are dangerous, alchoolic beverages are dangerous, drugs are dangerous and a poison just the same, lots of people die in illicit drugs smuggling so, you can't say something like that isn't totally dangerous or totally safe.

[ladsin]

Ah, I understand.

[sawno]

Not everything, i don't think religion can corrupt love.

[ladsin]

Some religions, Christianity for example, ask you to love someone you're afraid of. Does that not corrupt love?

[sawno]

I dont think so because people can step over it and genuinely love but in case of these religioms i dont think genuine love comes in to play.

[Anonymous]

It depends on the person spreading it, really. Religion is supposed to be a good thing that makes people good to others, but some people use it to manipulate them and spread "poison". Like how some religious people say that gays will go to hell because God hates them, even though God is supposed to love everyone, including gays.

[Anonymous]

I'm not religious but I don't think its a poison. In the old work I think it was was shaped civilizations and made them have morals. What better way to keep people form just killing and raping everyone then using everyone's fear of death. I suppose it also backfires... a lot. because everyone is like I WAS RAISED THIS WAY SO MY WAY CAN'T POSSIBLY BE WRONG!! but I mean without it i don't think we would be where we are today...

[ladsin]

Hmm. So, for example, the laws where I Coke from were heavily based on religious morality. As a result slavery was legal and men were allowed to beat their wives on the courthouse steps every Sunday. Would you still say that was good, because it allowed cohesion?

[Opinion Owner]

Yeah I'm not saying it was good or anything, but as we evolve and become closer together we are more compassionate. But go back farther than all that and there was less intelligent human beings with the mind set of MINE. Religion was the first step towards humanity. let me be clear it wasn't a very far step there was a lot of things that was still messed. But then it allowed us to make more steps over time... does that makes sense? I don't know maybe just in my head. and it wasn't really religion telling people to do all those things... religion just said you could. so i wasn't really religions fault it was humanities fault in the era because in their minds it was okay. Like slowly we're loosing our barbarian side but you can't blame people from 200 years ago for being terrible people because they were raised with completely different ideas of what is right... ugh I don't know how to explain

[ladsin]

Let's see if I can understand you by analogy. "You can't blame (hitler) for being terrible because (he) was raised with a different idea." Would you agree with that?

[NalaxHungry]

I agree with what your saying on religion I don’t think it’s poisonous but it does need some work.

[fearless_strength]

Religion im my opinion ia rules.. In every religion you have to do something to go to a predice. Or be perfect in every way to go to heaven and if you mess up you are punished for it...

[themetalhead]

religion is only poisonous when it seeks to take control and forces others to be involved in it, instead of letting the people decide for themselves.

[johnboymuscles]

I'm not religious but wish i could be. There is peace to be found in religion. My mind just won't let me accept religion as its just a good fairytale

[ladsin]

Hmm, why do you think it's peaceful?

[johnboymuscles]

I've seen people with my own eyes find peace. They get a sense of being and belonging. Something i as an atheist don't get

[ladsin]

Have you ever tried joining community groups?

[johnboymuscles]

No and no intention to

[ladsin]

Do you not think that part of the unease you're feeling may be a lack of community?

[chc0009]

I agree, it does. Why does western Europe have a higher atheist population and do so well, yet places like the Middle East and Africa have high religiosity and they are piss poor?

I kneel to no gods! And I'm not afraid to be blasphemous.

[SirMavane]

Well we were way ahead of them back in roman times, and in the renaissance. So your argument isn't very valid. Its not because of religion, but because of the people that lived in those times

[Tomblebee]

Poison poisons everything.

[Volvagia]

thats deep.

[Tomblebee]

@Volvagia I'd like to think so.

[ladsin]

DAmn

[Tomblebee]

Hey to the downvoter: sorry I was still being a tad hyperbolic, in theme with the asker.

[martsa]

Well I think it depends on what perspective you are looking it at. But I think religion aren't poisonous even thought I don't have any religion.

[ThreeSheetsToTheWind]

They're being a tad hyperbolic, but I agree with the idea.

I think religion does more harm than good, in many cases. For instance, when Jehovah Witnesses deny their children blood transfusions.