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That’s an interesting argument. Thank you for sharing!
There is no comparison, someone not giving up their organs does not directly cause someones death. But abortion does. Complete redundant argument
How do you figure. People are dying that could otherwise live if I gave them my organs. I choose not to do so. An abortion isn't the killing of a fetus,, it's the termination of a pregnancy, the fact that a fetus can't live on it's own is a different matter.
I don't care if people want to kill their own kids. I just don't want it subsidized with my money.
@JayParris but you don't object if your money is used to kill Afghan, Iraqi , Libyan or Syrian kids?
WHY?
@jacquesvol I do object. We need to get our troops out of there and mind our own damn business
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PROI_yWCHXA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omnskeu-puE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5S1YkQs5nXQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSe5QidAI3s
@jacquesvol economic sanctions have always been the surest way to punish people who have nothing to do with the conflict at hand. Did they think they were hurting the rich leaders?
I believe in the principles of free and amicable trade with all nations, and entangling alliances with none.
You can't COMBAT evil with evil. All you're doing is joining it.
There weren't only economic sanctions. Bombings and complete invasions too. With YOUR tax$$.
@jacquesvol Gee, professor. Really? I had no idea! I thought perpetual war was all about dropping inspirational leaflets and flower petals and throwing parties and shit!
Bombs? Invasions? Who'da thunk it!
All done with your $$..
@jacquesvol *gasp* NOOO!!! You mean politicians don't use their own money to fund wars?
What a revelation!!
You forgot it in your statement.
@jacquesvol The obvious is usually better left unsaid.
The fetus's body is NOT the woman's body.
Once we get that cleared up, we can talk.
Who said it was? Did you read the argument? It's super short and should have cleared that up.
What about the bodily rights of a child who did not ask to be brought into this world, or to be brutally murdered within it's mothers womb? Mothers protect their children, not kill them.
That’s my argument. The pre-born baby has the same rights as the born baby. If the born baby doesn’t get to live on the mother’s organs (ie kidney) then the pre-born doesn’t.
I agree. Women should be able to kill their children if they don't want them.
If it's killing to deny a person a right to your organs then I'm killing every person on the organ donor list by denying them my organs.
I agree
not saving lives is not equal to intentionally kill them
With an argument like that I'm sure you are in full support of post-natal abortion. Right?
How do you possibly figure that?
Let's first ask... What did I write? What's my argument? Did you read it?
Because of the basis of your argument. How did you NOT figure that?
"No person has the right to another's body without their consent and continued consent. I don't have a right to your organs, you don't have a right to mine, a 2 year old doesn't have a right to it's mother's organs, and neither does a fetus." That summarized this entire take and explained your argument.
That is one flexible standard. All I did was bend that standard the way it would be if that were the law. Since consensual permission to someone else's body as a resource is the basis, irrespective of life as you put it, then babies directly outside of the womb also fall under the requirements for abortion.
Unless you're a hypocrite (as I suspect you are), then it would only be fair and pro-woman to give disenfranchised women the right to post-natal abortion as well wouldn't it?
No... It would be hypocritical if I thought that after birth babies had a right to their mother's organs... I don't. Where in my argument did you think that I thought anyone had a right to another's organs? I didn't imply that anywhere, and even in your summary you acknowledged that I didn't.
If a baby after birth wanted to use it's mother's organs I wouldn't give it that right... I'm not sure where you're confused.
What? That's exactly my point... Since that's your argument it would make you unjust and hypocritical to NOT support post-natal abortion.
I don't mean to sound rude, but I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
Thus far nothing you've said has made any sense at all.
I think that no person has a right to another person's organs without their (latter's) consent. I don't care if it's you, me, john, mary, or timmy down the road. We don't have a right to each other's bodies.
I do make sense since other people can understand my argument. You can play stupid all you want but I've made my point clear as day and congruent.
Read your take and then our whole thread over. Your argument: Consensual permission to someone else's body as a resource to be the basis for abortion (irrespective of life).
Any and all abortions are admissible under that basis, what is SO hard to understand about that? Babies inside and outside of the womb fall under the requirements for abortion if that is the basis.
That is why I said I hope you give your full support towards post-natal abortion since that's what you believe the law on abortion should be. It would be hypocritical for you to NOT support post-natal. You can act clueless all you want but you know damn well you understand my point, and if you'll keep being dumbfounded then we can just stop talking.
I agree. If someone is using my body without my consent then I have the right to deny their use of my body.
Not if their lives depend on it and you're the reason why they're alive in the first place. Good of you to at least not be a hypocrite, but you just showed support for post-natal abortion. That says everything about you and the women support you here.
If liberals like you made the rules our country would be in ruins and void of any morality whatsoever. Such nasty people. Extreme liberals like you are the reason why even many left leaning people decided to vote Republican and bring in Trump + Pence.
I'm a libertarian, but yeah if you think that you have a right to my body I have to tell you that you're sorely mistaken.
Regardless of whether or not you need my body to live.
You'll be happy to know that I don't think I have the right to live off your body without your consent either though, so at least you can sleep peacefully.
I'm sure you think you're some smartass who found the greatest defense for pro-choicers but there's a reason why even the most radical feminists who speak for the movement do not use that argument in defense for abortion.
A basis like that would alienate many people who would otherwise support you since it's flexible and can be stretched to cover even the most sadistic practices solely on the convenience of people.
Ironically I thank you radical leftists. You will keep people with a sane head like Trump and Pence in office for a LONG time.
* use that argument in defense for abortion in front of the masses
It’s one of the more popular arguments and cannot be used against the masses as the masses are not trying to use other people’s organs to sustain their life.
What are you talking about?
Show me video proof of a feminist spokesperson speaking at any public event (ex: Emma Watson speech to the UN) using that type of argument in front of an unbiased crowd.
What are YOU talking about? Are you insane? If you think the general public is okay with sweeping post-natal along as acceptable abortion then you're insane. I'm sorry.
I'm not sure what delusions you're under, but this is incredibly pointless.
You can say I'm delusional all you want but I'm still waiting for proof that "this is one of the most popular arguments for abortion". You are radical and your arguments are beyond weak.
This is pointless, you were right about that. You can play stupid all you want. I'm done here.
@ovoxo_ you do not make sense except to people with little logical thinking, how does the baby after birth use the mother's internal organs? that's like saying "do you support the murder of pregnant virgins", it's completely vacuous. If you are truly pro life, I know you have a few organs you can live without, I know there are more than a few people in your country who actually need these organs to live because they might have lost them due to some condition, are you willing to go through surgery while being completely awake to transfer those organs? pro life people are just people who are too slow to figure out their hypocrisy.
@betaTester are you drunk? You’ve never heard of a baby needing a kidney or liver transplant? If a baby needs such a transplant is the mother legally forced to give hers?
If the child has clear signs of mutation it ought to be killed immediately, the Imperium does not tolerate mutants.
Just let women do as they wish. Remember , its murder in the real , and that abortion accual goes to heaven as a innocent (unsinned) soul , all the while the mother goes the opposite direction by choices made. Yup , your body , your choice...
A women’s body is her own, until it’s CREATING another human being. Abortion, unless for the saving of the mothers life, is murder.
Wait, a woman's body is no longer her own? Who owns it? Why should they own it? How long do they own it for?
They are saying that a woman has a right to her body and not that of another human she willfully created.
It would be a right to abort a fetus if they did not consent to being impregnated, otherwise, i think that they fetus has a right to livw
I grant every fetus the right to live, just not by using another persons organs.
fetuses should use their mother's body for survival. That's NATURE.
Saving someone and intentionally killing someone are NOT the same thing
Parents have a special responsibility to their offspring, one of God’s responsibilities is to keep them ALIVE. This shouldn’t change just because they are in the womb. This has nothing to do with consent
Not”gods” I meant “their”
As the country moves further and further to the right, I will be outlawed soon. Ironically women are leading the way.
How do you figure?
trump will put more right wingers on the supreme court.
I have always been pro-choice and will always remain pro-choice
I've had 4 abortions so far, i love sex and do it raw. nobody will tell me what to do
Nobody tells I guess. Cause everyone knows what you are. But don't spread STD, HIV and etc. Into this world.
100000x times this had been said
Sure, but not everyone knows it. As demonstrated below by a fella that said he'd never heard it. I hadn't heard it until I was ~20.
Agreed
women shouldt have rights
Did you mean 'should' or 'shouldn't'?
If you meant 'shouldn't' (as in, women are second-class citizens), then on behalf of women everywhere, go fuck yourself, you uneducated, old-world, cunt.
@MissFallenAngel i meant should
calm your britches
Excellent take !
Abortion is murder
read my opinion.
Is it murder when I don't give other persons my organs?
are you comparing yourself to a pregnant woman? lol
Women are naturally meant to give nutrition to their unborns.
ladsin, it's murder if you cut up another person and throw them away...
@wolfcat87 are you anti abortion, too?
@Az-Arm- I'm pro preventing the pregnancy so that they are unnecessary. With what we have available today, there should be no need for abortion except for rape or health.