"Zero Tolerance" Border Policy: 15 Slow Facts

1) The policy detains all adult immigrants, whether or not they have children

Detention center
Detention center

2) A ruling upheld by the ninth district court of appeals mandates that minors be put in "the least restrictive setting possible" and this holds true for both unaccompanied and accompanied minors.

3) Separate from the ruling, the ninth district court of appeals states that minors and family members must be kept together

4) The Trump administration maintains that there is no way to keep illegal immigrants from entering the US whilst also allowing families to stay together because of the ninth district court of appeals.

5) Trump's dissenters maintain that "least restrictive setting possible" does not dictate children must be separated from their parents.

6) Previous administrations (Bush and Obama) faced with this dilemma decided against it, deciding it was immoral and unethical.

7) In some cases families are being split with no warning. Parents find out their children have been taken away, as do the children.

8)The children will be put into foster care or another similar environment

9) Flight risk is not currently taken into account. Whether or not the risk of an illegal immigrant not returning to court is high or low, all illegal immigrants are held in custody.

10) Previous administrations ordered illegal immigrants to return to court, in some cases using ankle bracelets. In some cases, they did not return.

11) Democrats argue that Trump's interpretation is not genuine and that this is an attempt to force democrats to change laws- using children as pawns.

12) Republicans argue the Ninth District Court of appeals upheld the original ruling because they wanted to deter detaining any illegal immigrants and hoped that this would discourage detainment because no politician would willingly separate families.

13) The ninth district court of appeals stated the ruling was meant to allow minors to pursue a future and education even if their parents broke the law.

14) guards cannot have physical contact with the children due to liability concern. The children are kept in large fenced in areas. Ages vary wildly. In certain cases one immigrant child has changed another immigrant child's diaper due to the restrictions of the policy.

15) Democrats are accusing conservatives supporting "zero tolerance" of being morally corrupt and evil. Conservatives are accusing democrats of leaving out key details.

From what I've read and found, this is what I managed to piece together.

Now it's up to you to decide

Which way do you lean on this issue?


1|4
638

Most Helpful Girl

  • It’s kinda funny how no one is blaming these parents. They are the ones putting their kids in this situation.

    2|6
    2|2
    • @Rissyanne In some cases I agree with you. In other cases, families seeking asylum have to enter at ports along the border to avoid being detained. These ports are often overcrowded and can be quite difficult to access. Also, families are often not aware that this is the case. Undoubtedly they understand there is a chance they will be caught, but they do not know they will be separated from their children.

      If they know, regardless of the ethics of the policy, they are aware that their children may be taken from them. The question is: Do they?

    • Show All
    • by the way, this policy was pished in Trump's 'brain' by Alt Right fanatic Stephen Miller , a stinkin' PoS.

Most Helpful Guys

  • While I have disagreed with almost all of Trump's policies (barring immigrants from entering the country due to religion) and got angry at a few of them (banning transgender people from serving in the military), I have never been so angry and humiliated in my country as I am now. The fact that children are taken from their parents without the parents knowledge, locked up in cages, and in some cases sexually assaulted, is unbelievable. I can't believe we can still call ourselves Americans. This is a dark and shameful time for us all in this country and possibly a turning point in American culture. Those who voted for Trump are resonsible for this. This will get worse. Trump has been emboldened by voting technicalities (electoral college), so that he was elected despite being the loser of the popular vote. This has emboldened the lowest levels of society to crawl out of the shadows and have an influence on what happens to us. And what you see here is the result. Shame on Trump supporters, shame on Congress for their cowardice, and shame on us all as accomplices to this tragedy.

    0|1
    1|3
    • The electoral college, which was established in the constitution and has been used in each election, is now a "voting technicality" because a guy you don't like got voted in? Really? I bet you'd have had no issue if Obama had won either of his elections the way President Trump won his. And yes, shame on us Trump supporters for wanting border security and not wanting an open border where criminals could come and go as they please. We Trump supporters are so unreasonable. Also would love to see your source that proves children are being sexually assaulted in these temporary separation camps. I'm guessing CNN told you that.

    • Show All
    • @Jonny317 to be fair though, ALL developed countries have policies mandating who can and cannot immigrate into their country. ALL developed countries use force, if necessary, to make people leave. If everybody living in poverty on the continent of Africa came here, our entire country would collapse and everybody would lose. In the short term, letting people in seems like the right thing to do. But in the long term, it would create new issues that would likely disproportionately affect immigrants and people living in poverty. Canada, which is a larger country in terms of land mass and has a far smaller population can take in illegal immigrants if they would like to.

      America is actually far more accepting of immigrants than many other countries. 1,000,000 immigrants a year, compared to Canada's 250,000.

      "This law was wrong" is not a reason to break other laws.

    • @JustMyTake summed it up pretty good.

      When Europeans came here America was not an established country and I'm sure the Native Americans didn't have any anti-illegal immigration laws in place. And yes, some things that shouldn't have been illegal were made legal, but not every law that may seem immoral should be changed. It's not demonizing people to tell them to follow our laws. What's truly pathetic is advocating for letting anyone who is in a tough situation come here whenever they please. I feel sorry for them too, and it's unfortunate that they're in the situation they're in, but there is no scenario where letting anyone who wants to escape poverty come here leads to a good outcome.

  • One reason people voted for Trump was because they thought he might have the balls to do what needs to be done, and the hell with what anybody thinks.

    Immigration is not the only issue that has been talked about and talked about, but nothing is ever done because it's not politically expedient. Social Security is a good example. It's simple math. That math has been obvious and talked about for more than three decades, but nothing ever changes because no matter the politicians do, people aren't going to like it. So it's politically easier to hide from the problem and pretend it doesn't exist. So nothing ever gets done.

    Immigration is another issue like that. It's been talked about for a long time, through at least five presidencies. At one time it was even a bi-partisan issue. But still nothing was done. The laws are in place, but when they aren't enforced, people learn that and just ignore them.

    Maybe now people will start taking the law seriously. Maybe now parents will stop being stupid enough to bring their children with them when they commit crimes.

    OK sure, previous presidents didn't do what's being done now. But the policy of previous presidents didn't work. The problem just kept getting worse and worse. The illegals knew that nothing serious would happen so they kept doing it.

    Now they know better. Now maybe they will quit breaking the law. Now maybe they will quit being so stupid to bring children with them when they commit crimes.

    0|0
    0|0
    • I mean, they're bringing children in hopes of giving them a brighter future in a country with more opportunities. I don't think it's fair to fault them for that, especially if some sort of immediate threat is present. I'm all for addressing the issue, but traumatizing kids to "teach immigrants a lesson" seems like cruel and unusual punishment. Illegal immigrants are not entitled to the same freedoms or rights as citizens. Why not set up surveillance systems in their homes, make them wear ankle bracelets? Whatever it takes to get them to return to court. House arrest. All of them combined. A 1984 esque scenario where (most) actions are monitored and if any anti-US sentiment is expressed that is grounds for deportation. That's still better than taking children away.

    • Show All
    • You are mostly arguing the merits of the law itself. That's a separate issue.

      The reasons why the people are breaking the law are irrelevant. As I mentioned the US is expected to bear this burden disproportionately. There are all kinds of negatives associated with the massive immigration. You can't just look at one side and ignore the other.

      You can look at these people and say "poor people are just trying to make a better life for themselves." Which would be true in the large majority of cases. But how many of the few billion people of the world can we allow to enter the country because we feel bad for their lot in life? We have an extremely loose immigration policy. But we can't just let in every person who is trying to make a better life for themselves. We just can't do it.

      You think there is some more humanitarian way to do this. But you aren't the one dealing with it. You are a spectator saying "it's easy", when you probably don't really know how easy it is.

    • Many inmigrants don't go to commit crimes.. They go to the US, scaping from crime. In Guatemala, El Salvador, Honduras and Mexico, are hell on earth, in those countries you can get killed any day, or perhaps your entire family, and I am not exaggerating. Have empathy. Of course all inmigrants should stick to the law, and of course none should be aloud to enter easily the US, in fact, to be honest I think they should stay in Mexico until they could legally be in the US.

Recommended myTakes

Join the discussion

What Girls Said 5

  • Ahhh kiddie internment camps. Even if people argue that they're breaking the law, why wouldn't it be considered "cruel and unusual punishment" to have your children taken away? Then again that's in the Constitution which appears to be foreign to Trump and his followers.

    0|1
    0|1
    • They aren't American citizens, I suppose is their justification.

    • Show All
    • @Anon-ymous1 Why don't you put a sign on your house, all illegal's welcome inside and put a sock in it you hypocrite.

    • this policy was pushed in Trump's 'brain' by Alt Right fanatic Stephen Miller , a stinkin' PoS.

  • i feel like if they are sending their kids here first its kind of the parents fault

    1|1
    0|1
  • Nice take

    0|1
    0|0
  • Okay then

    0|0
    0|0
  • Why can't they just deport the kids along with their parents? It's their parents' fault. This is coming from a Latina by the way.

    4|3
    0|2
    • That would be an option, but in cases where immigrants are seeking asylum, that would be an issue. And a lot of time parents aren't aware this policy is in place until they reach the border.

    • Show All
    • @Anon-ymous1 Your down vote or your comment about your down vote also have no effect on my stance. Just saying.

    • @Allie_Oops Their parents have full legal guardianship over them. If the parent is being deported for breaking the U. S. laws, then the children should go with them regardless of the child's citizenship status. It's the consequences they have to suffer as a result of their parents' actions. They can blame their parents afterwards, but it's not the government's fault for enforcing its laws.

What Guys Said 36

  • i appreciate you bringing facts to the argument rather than the misleading stories (propaganda) politicians (shockingly) tell the public in order to sway opinions

    0|0
    0|0
  • I understand people being upset about the separation for sure, but to those comparing this to the holocaust need to get a fucking clue.
    They have doctors on standby 24/7, they're being fed and have a decent set up arrangement compared to some of the homes I'm sure they're seeking asylum from. Wake up and realize it's almost like we have no choice. Put the families together in detainment, but either way they need to go back until they do it right for everyone's safety in the long run.

    0|2
    0|0
  • I think you detain families entering illegally together once you apprehend them. Rather than worrying about prosecuting the adults for illegal entry, take their fingerprints and ban them from entering the US for 10 years. Maybe only prosecute multiple illegal entries by an individual.

    0|2
    0|0
  • OK, Trump has apparently decided to do what Democrats said he could do from the start, and stop the practice by executive order.

    #10: Do you have a figure for the percentage not turning up for their hearings?
    This link says "most" turn up: newrepublic.com/.../immigration-stories-burying-corruption-scandals
    Couldn't that number be reduced just by detaining people without children?

    #14: once you know what's going on, how is this in dispute? (Many, probably most, Republican senators and representatives have come out against it, but none signed on to Feinstein's bill to stop it.)
    www.congress.gov/.../text?r=1

    All the rest aside, who chooses to take children away from parents and lock them up in disused Wal-mart stores? Are the Walton family making money from this?

    The reason was clear; Trump wanted $25b for his wall and used (or didn't care about) abuse of children to try to get it.

    0|0
    0|0
    • "we have championed progressive ideas and challenged popular opinion"

      Considering the first paragraph reads: Meanwhile, Trump’s cabinet is corruption central. Amid the furor over the family separation policy, new scandals continue surface about President Donald Trump’s cabinet. These stories deserve to be flagged lest they get lost in the avalanche of breaking news that defines the Trump era.

      If you claim to be a news source, act like it. This is bad writing from any angle. The writer cannot help but go off on rants about Trump. I have no issue with progressive sources, but I do have an issue when they make no attempt to be factual and appeal to emotion.

      I don't think this part is in dispute. I would seriously question the character of anybody who disputes that children changing children's diapers in large cages is perfectly OK and acceptable. Objectively speaking it is not.

      I don't ascribe motives. Trump has done shitty things, but using children as pawns is pure evil.

    • @goaded If most turn up, some do not. I was arguing that some do not and specifically chose "some" instead of "most" because I wasn't sure the precise figures. This doesn't change my stance towards this website at all.

    • I gave a link that included what I wanted to point to on the page, but not the direct link:
      newrepublic.com/.../mind-boggling-cost-breaking-migrant-families

      It seems to be a very opinionated site, I just found it in a search, but at least by giving you the link, you could see for yourself. I do wonder where they got their figures (and I did note elsewhere on here that "most" could be just 50.1%).

  • Let's see, hmm...
    Number of children torn from their mother's breast before Trump = 0
    Number of children torn from their mothers after Trump = 2000+

    Yeah. After a careful computation that equals TOTAL BS.

    0|0
    2|3
    • Where do these numbers come from, or is this just hearsay? I've heard otherwise.

    • Show All
    • I mean the 0 figure. No disagreement on the 2000+

    • It's hard to find good figures, but do you really believe that no one would have pointed out that this wasn't new? "Obama is killing children at the border - News at 11!" Fox would have been trumpeting this for years.

  • I'm in favor of zero tolerance policies.
    If you aren't coming into a country legally, you shouldn't be allowed past the border.
    If you intend to make it to the country legally, do the paperwork before you deliver yourself to its doorstep.

    It's as simple as that.

    1|0
    0|0
  • What is the end game for importing immigrants? Is it truly humanitarian or is something else? Foreign voters lean toward the left while providing cheap labor. This is a power game.

    0|1
    0|0
    • I don't think allowing them to cross is the same as importing them, but I guess that point could be argued. Illegal immigrants can't vote, but the more pathways to legal citizenship the more support for the democratic party. I guess the intention depends on the individual person.

    • Show All
    • Turns out that Kobach is officially full of it.
      http://electionlawblog.org/?p=99605

      "That leaves Defendant’s empirical evidence of noncitizen registration. He has submitted evidence of 129 instances of noncitizen registration or attempted registration since 1999, bu looking closely at those records reduces that number to 67 at most. Even these 67 instances are liberal estimate because it includes attempted registrations after the DPOC law was passed, a larger universe than what the Tenth Circuit asked the Court to evaluate. Only 39 successfully registered to vote. And several of the individual records of those who registered or attempted to register show errors on the part of State employees, and/or confusion on the part of applicants. They do not evidence intentional fraud…. Moreover, the Court is unable to find empirical evidence that a substantial number of noncitizens successfully registered to vote under the attestation regime…."

    • @goaded my sources weren’t about Kobach

  • I lean on Zero tolerance with the following proviso that illegals' children also get detained with them and that they are not considered legal citizens until their parents get legal

    1|0
    0|0
    • I agree with the provision suggested, I do not agree a minor's status should be at all based on their parent's status.

    • I think it should. Why do you ask? Because, the minor is always used as an excuse of why the person who broke the law should stay.

    • Mandate that they cannot stay if the minor chooses to separate themselves from the parent.

  • You left out the part that a big percentage of the children were not separated from their parents, but were unaccompanied minors coming across the U. S. border to be used by gangs, to recruit new members. More than a third of already arrested MS-13 members and associates came into the U. S. as unaccompanied minors.

    1|0
    0|0
  • Obviously, the moral thing to do is just let Mexicans live and work in the US (I'm British, and have no problem with economic migrants from the EU coming to the UK).
    Of course, Americans are never going to go for that, so they need laws to prevent it. And as long as you're going to have laws, you have to enforce them - and you don't get to express moral outrage because some of the people affected are children.

    0|0
    0|0
  • I don't fully agree with it, but the fact is they shouldn't be illegally entering to begin with. You can't expect to do something illegal and just get away with it.

    0|2
    0|0
  • Be a Democrat who care more about illegals than the American people. OPEN the Border free entry, free health care, free welfare for all the illegals. Here's your green card now STAY and live like ever Democrat.

    0|0
    0|0
  • "Previous administrations (Bush and Obama) faced with this dilemma decided against it, deciding it was immoral and unethical."

    Factually incorrect. The Obama administration was splitting families since the first term.

    0|0
    0|0
  • Trump abuses children as argument to get Democrats to vote some GOP laws and to scare Mexicans from even applying for a work permit.
    Dirty politics thus, VERY dirty. :O

    1|0
    1|4
    • Abuses children? You are... insane. The parents of the children are to blame for this. They are illegally coming over the border knowing what’s going to happen. They need to come here legally and stop breaking the law.

    • Show All
    • @Rissyanne The Trump clan had a clear message: https://i.imgur.com/XQjAzFz.jpg

    • And like an ignorant liberal you are wrong. She is talking about all the fake liberal bull shit news that you worship

  • Guess what, you lying sack of turds: TRUMPIEPOO JUST CHANGED THE POLICY!

    So, is Trumpiepoo a filthy LIAR or is he a CRIMINAL?

    0|2
    0|0
  • Oh, the crying of crocodile tears by the Commiecrats, over a detention policy that has been in place for years, nay, decades.

    0|0
    0|1
  • Do with them what you will. solve it however you want, hold them all together the bottom line is people should never just be allowed to flood in without permission from other countries through our borders. Just letting them come on in is not an acceptable option. If they've been marching for 2 months on foot though Mexico than they've been taking care of themselves just fine. We are under no obligation to just say sure come in... as many humans as can humanly walk here, all can just come in. No limit on how many come into this country.

    0|0
    0|0
  • Trump is a heartless bitch. If the US had constitutional flaws like in Latin American countries he would be a dictator.

    0|0
    0|0
    • I'm sorry he did not raise your welfare check... Maybe you should go back to mexico there Pedro.

    • @Max_winner1 I don't even live in the US 😂

  • Yo dawg I heard there were internment camps for children back under Obama. But no one gave a shit back then?

    0|0
    0|0
    • The issue most people have are the family separations, not the actual family detention centers. They were whole families under Obama, not solely for kids. Family separation was a rare thing under Obama. He also instituted DACA at the same time to protect the kids who were here illegally and who had no choice. And the point of the detention centers was actually to make sure the families were coming in the right way. Trying to come to America from Mexico is extremely dangerous.

  • LOL because illegals ONLY enter from the southern border... much easier to ignore the truth that admit it's just because these kids were not white

    0|0
    0|0
    • To be fair, I can't think of a single reason why somebody from Canada would ever want to immigrate to the United States.

  • More from Guys
    16

Recommended Questions

Loading...