Ten Lessons We Are Failing to Learn from Covid-19

[Anonymous]

1. Covid-19 isn't a political game that can be won

There are a lot of politicians and a lot of people outside of politics who believe that this virus is actually the fault of a political party. No political party caused Covid-19 and yet, listen to five minutes of politicians and people going back and fourth from opposing parties, and you'd think they did. This is not a Republican, Democratic, Conservative, Liberal virus because we're all dying of it. Period.

2. Everything scientists and doctors know about Covid is not fake news

It is unbelievable that people who have never spent five seconds in a lab or doing any type of research outside of some Buzzfeed article all of a sudden think they know WAY more than people who have studied viruses and diseases and their spread and transmission their whole entire lives. I don't know about you, but I don't give scissors to my 5 year old nephew and tell him to cut my hair if I want it to come out right for a reason!

3. People are not expendable

Some people are so incredibly selfish as to not give AF about anyone else including apparently themselves. They sit around talking about how this is natural selection at its finest, and so what if a few old people and sickly people die. There are 45 million Americans with underlying health conditions and it's not just the elderly. Add to that, it's not just those with underlying conditions or the elderly that are getting sick. Thanks to complete ignorance, the virus is spreading to younger and younger populations, a lot whom we are now seeing in hospital beds on respirators. You might not care at this moment but what happens when your trash isn't being picked up, or there is no one to teach your kids, or you can't get a doctors appointment because those people have died. Each death affects each of us and will affect more and more things the longer this goes on. We're already starting to see the effects.

4. Doing nothing isn't helping

This whole idea that we all need so much freedom as to allow no masks or any precautions at all, has not worked. It hasn't. If it had, numbers would not be on the rise as fast as they are and we would all be back to life as we know. Guess what, we've tried your way, and it's failed, it's time to actually try doing something that can safe our lives because ignoring this and just hoping for the best is not going to make it go away.

5. Testing is not the only reason cases are on the rise

Testing will only give you a partial snap shot of cases on the rise, but what you really need to look at is how many people now as opposed to last month have actually landed in the hospital. Say all you want about how testing is the ONLY reason numbers are rising but that DOES NOT explain why hospital cases are rising at an exponential rate because no one is just going to the hospital and being hooked up to ventilators for the fun of it. You cannot explain that one away.

6. This virus doesn't give a damn about your so called rights

This is just laughable to see people protesting for their rights to walk around and infect people. Look around. Your so called rights aren't making Covid disappear any faster. Have things magically gotten better because you went outside with a poster and an AK-47 and screamed about how unfair life is because someone is asking you to wear a mask? Has your job gotten back to normal? How is your dating life? Are your kids back to school like normal? Did you wake up and everyone was suddenly cured of the virus? Virus and disease are the great equalizers because they can't be beaten with money, or your race, or your political party, or your protests. They don't care what you think or feel or your status in society no matter how bad you think you can make this thing to bend to your will. YOU WILL LOSE EVERY TIME.

7. Masks are not completely useless

Are you telling me that someone open mouth coughing and sneezing into your face is something you are fine with....on a good day...let alone in a Corona Virus pandemic? Don't scream about how right you are, prove it! Would you be willing to stand there and have someone infected cough on you so you can prove your point 100% in how useless masks are because if the answer is no, then welcome to reality. If the answer is yes, then at this point in your delusion, you might as well go outside during a rainstorm with no umbrella and try to convince us all that you are somehow going to be the only one not to get wet. Hint: it's not going to work. No one has ever said masks are the cure for Corona virus or that masks stop all and every bit of transmission but what they are there to do is to help prevent the spread of the virus which is 100% better than nothing.

8. Trump's Covid advice is unfounded and dangerous

Where are the results of Trump's miraculous plans to fix our economy---his main focus, forget human lives, oh but also maybe lastly to cure the virus. You, myself, anyone can say we're winning the wareon Corona but none of the numbers are backing him up. Where is this magical place in the US where people have explicitly followed his bleach cures, or his no mask wearing preachings, or who have a vaccine lickity split. What medical or scientific knowledge does he actually possess in order to accurately give health advice? Has he studied this? Has he even listened to his own health advisors? Is he sending his own son back to a public school with other children who potentially can get him sick in the Fall while he demands yours go back regardless of the risk in your area? Why is the country not cured from listening to his sage advice?!?

[N192K001]

Good points, but some are… lacking. Here are some points to also consider:
• Actually, medical-masks provide some defense, but (even then), it's not substantially. And cloth-masks can actually RAISE your chances of infection! Don't take my word for it. Read it from the peer-reviewed medical journals:
“Nonpharmaceutical Measures for Pandemic Influenza in Nonhealthcare Settings—Personal Protective and Environmental Measures”
May 2020
「Although mechanistic studies support the potential effect of hand hygiene or face masks, evidence from 14 randomized controlled trials of these measures did not support a substantial effect on transmission of laboratory-confirmed influenza.」
— Abstract, sentence 4
「None of the household studies reported a significant reduction in secondary laboratory-confirmed influenza virus infections in the face mask group (11–13,15,17,34,35). Most studies were underpowered because of limited sample size, and some studies also reported suboptimal adherence in the face mask group.」
— Methods and Results, Personal Protective Measures, Face Masks, ¶1, sentences 7-8
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article
“Cloth masks: Dangerous to your health?”
22 April 2015
「This study is the first RCT of cloth masks, and the results caution against the use of cloth masks. This is an important finding to inform occupational health and safety. Moisture retention, reuse of cloth masks and poor filtration may result in increased risk of infection.」
— Conclusions, sentences 1-3
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/04/150422121724.htm
“Face masks to prevent transmission of influenza virus: a systematic review”
22 January 2010
「There is some evidence to support the wearing of masks or respirators during illness to protect others, and public health emphasis on mask wearing during illness may help to reduce influenza virus transmission. There are fewer data to support the use of masks or respirators to prevent becoming infected.」
— Summary, sentences 4-5
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/epidemiology-and-infection/article/face-masks-to-prevent-transmission-of-influenza-virus-a-systematic-review/64D368496EBDE0AFCC6639CCC9D8BC05
• And quarantining may have worked with other diseases, but apparently not COVID-19. In fact, coronavirus-infection is actually MORE LIKELY at home!
https://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2020/07/21/world/asia/21reuters-health-coronavirus-southkorea.html
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/risks-coronavirus/story?id=70624608
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8293417/66-New-York-coronavirus-hospitalizations-people-staying-HOME.html
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/shocking-66percent-of-new-coronavirus-patients-in-ny-stayed-home-cuomo/ar-BB13HKJO?li=AAggFp4
The well-ventilated environment of the outdoors is actually far more advisable than the confinements of indoors, where any COVID that does find its way inside is trapped inside with the unsuspecting quarantiners.
• And aside from the concerns shared by @Not_Average, remember that indoor-crimes (ex. rape & domestic-abuse) also exist and are boosted when the victims are confined with their perpetrators. And this is happening ALL ACROSS THE GLOBE:
https://www.un.org/en/coronavirus/un-supporting-%E2%80%98trapped%E2%80%99-domestic-violence-victims-during-covid-19-pandemic
https://www.voanews.com/episode/nigeria-sees-spike-rape-cases-sexual-violence-during-pandemic-4327176

So, the prescription (of a global-lockdowns & mass mask-mandates) is not without side-effects. And it's not 100% effective either. (In fact, it may even make things worse.) Yes, there are the ignorant who sadly believe that the virus does not exist, but blind obedience to the error-prone fellow-humans is a mistake as well. (If they make 1 mistake, ALL who follow them suffer.) All of us must take individual responsibility for our own well-being, should research the relevant topics, and should make our own decisions based on our own living-conditions & health-situations.

[myTake Owner]

This seems like you just randomly picked a set of links as a lot have nothing to do with what was said here. I also don't understand the point of you posting all of this when what was said in regards to masks is masks can help the spread of infection but they aren't perfect (Literally nothing is---hello condoms?). If the point is to say well they don't work all the time therefore NO ONE should wear them, then be my guest and volunteer to stand there without a mask or because condoms don't work all the time either, go condomless as someone infected coughs or has sex with you. Do you think that's the better solution here than having even SOME protection? If masks prevent even 5% of infections, why would that not be worth it if those 5% equal human lives?

[devilman666]

Ima listen to a real scientist instead of you, specifically, Bill Nye. As he eloquently put it, the mask isn't supposed to protect you, it's supposed to protect me from you, and you from me. To put this another way, the mask doesn't prevent you from catching it, it prevents you from spreading it.
www.mayoclinic.org/.../art-20485449
Please read that link.

The idea that quarantining doesn't work with covid is ridiculous, even the links you gave mentioned that it was talking about transmission between family members, which we've known about for a long time, which is why here in Canada they actually suggested that we have 1 person go out to do shopping and then they socially distance themselves from the rest of the family when possible. There are ways around this effect, but regardless quarantining isn't the problem here, living in the same house is the problem. Quarantine or no quarantine, if 1 person in the house gets covid then everyone in the house will get covid, because it's just that infectious.

No one said it was without side effects, obviously we don't want people being abused, but the downside of not quarantining is millions of people getting sick, just look at the USA. Don't be blindly obedient, but it isn't even like they're asking very much of us, no one asked you to jump off a bridge for covid, we are just trying to find the best method to slow the infection, it's possible there might be a better method but we don't currently know about it. Waiting for us to find that better method that might not exist, instead of doing what we can right now, is the same as doing nothing.

Let's be real, almost nobody will research it, we should be responsible for ourselves, sure, but answer me this; when was the last time you read an end-user license agreement? Aka that thing they force you to read/accept before you join most websites/apps.

[N192K001]

@myTake Owner「This seems like you just randomly picked a set of links as a lot have nothing to do with what was said here.」
Huh? Which points are 'just randomly picked' here? My links are related to my points: On the less-than-perfect protection of masks, the links provided are peer-reviewed studies on the effectiveness of personal protective equipment. The links on COVID-infections being more likely while confined at home are on my points about home-confinements raising the possibility of coronavirus-infection. Likewise, the links on the spike of rape & domestic abuse are with my point of the home-quarantines raising the instances of home-based crime. So, none of these were randomly-selected. They were all selected to support my point.

Refuting "7. Masks are not completely useless" (the point of half my writing here), CLOTH-MASKS are worse than useless (even raising the chances of infection), while medical-grade masks are worth wearing. But even then, it's not as effective as some may think.

[N192K001]

@ devilman666 「Don't be blindly obedient, but it isn't even like they're asking very much of us, no one asked you to jump off a bridge for covid…」Not for everyone. Please, read @Not_Average's response. The quarantine order has ruined the lives of countless local mom & pop business-owners, some having decades of hard work & sacrifice thrown into the garbage only to be buried in overwhelming levels of debt they didn't have before the government-mandates.

On most not researching, that is the problem with mankind, especially in democracies where the citizens are supposed to be the sovereigns of the nation. Can you imagine what would happen to a business where its manager (s) don't give a d— enough to do some basic research? Yet, we think this can be done with a country? And we wonder how our jurisdictions have reached their current level of decay? (And answering your question, I started reading them after starting work in a legal department. I'll admit that I've gotten sloppy and only started skimming. But I've started reading more thoroughly as of late.)

「which is why here in Canada they actually suggested that we have 1 person go out to do shopping and then they socially distance themselves from the rest of the family when possible. There are ways around this effect, but regardless quarantining isn't the problem here, living in the same house is the problem.」
Well, tried that, but it only worked for 2months. Especially with elders who savor the outdoors and hate 'canned air' (their term), it can only work for so long, even with the support of other younger peers in league with you to keep the vulnerable inside. That said, home-quarantining with vulnerable people who love the outdoors is unless.

[AvaW359]

BECAUSE THE MAJORITY DO NOT BOTHER TO WASH AND BOIL TO FUCKIN STERILISE THE CLOTH MASK! The cloth mask is boring, 100% cotton and fuckin white so you can boil it. And yes , it protects the rest of the world in case you're infected and you are not sick yet. That means it's useless, right?
You have the right to do whatever the fuck you wish with your body but it is not only about you. And you don't have the right endanger someone else's life. Your rights mean shit then.
People who have no fuckin idea of what it looked like , cause the fuckin public is too sensitive to see the reality and the reality was not something to show the "heard "!
I also had and I'm young , you want to know?

[N192K001]

@AvaW359 Yes. And while I daily wash the mask I'm required to use for work, even its value in supposedly saving others is debatable. In fact, the consensus in science is still not established. Don't just believe me because of my words here. Read it from the study published just weeks ago by the U. S. Centers of Disease Control itself for the World Health Organization:
“Nonpharmaceutical Measures for Pandemic Influenza in Nonhealthcare Settings—Personal Protective and Environmental Measures”
May 2020
「Although mechanistic studies support the potential effect of hand hygiene or face masks, evidence from 14 randomized controlled trials of these measures did not support a substantial effect on transmission of laboratory-confirmed influenza. We similarly found limited evidence on the effectiveness of improved hygiene and environmental cleaning. We identified several major knowledge gaps requiring further research, most fundamentally an improved characterization of the modes of person-to-person transmission.」
— Abstract, sentences 4-6

[N192K001]

@AvaW359 「Disposable medical masks (also known as surgical masks) are loose-fitting devices that were designed to be worn by medical personnel to protect accidental contamination of patient wounds, and to protect the wearer against splashes or sprays of bodily fluids (36). There is limited evidence for their effectiveness in preventing influenza virus transmission either when worn by the infected person for source control or when worn by uninfected persons to reduce exposure. Our systematic review found no significant effect of face masks on transmission of laboratory-confirmed influenza.
…
In lower-income settings, it is more likely that reusable cloth masks will be used rather than disposable medical masks because of cost and availability (38). There are still few uncertainties in the practice of face mask use, such as who should wear the mask and how long it should be used for. In theory, transmission should be reduced the most if both infected members and other contacts wear masks, but compliance in uninfected close contacts could be a problem (12,34). Proper use of face masks is essential because improper use might increase the risk for transmission (39). Thus, education on the proper use and disposal of used face masks, including hand hygiene, is also needed.」
— Methods and Results, Personal Protective Measures, Face Masks, ¶1 & 3

[N192K001]

@AvaW359 「In this review, we did not find evidence to support a protective effect of personal protective measures or environmental measures in reducing influenza transmission. Although these measures have mechanistic support based on our knowledge of how influenza is transmitted from person to person, randomized trials of hand hygiene and face masks have not demonstrated protection against laboratory-confirmed influenza, with 1 exception (18). We identified only 2 RCTs on environmental cleaning and no RCTs on cough etiquette.
…
We did not find evidence that surgical-type face masks are effective in reducing laboratory-confirmed influenza transmission, either when worn by infected persons (source control) or by persons in the general community to reduce their susceptibility (Figure 2). However, as with hand hygiene, face masks might be able to reduce the transmission of other infections and therefore have value in an influenza pandemic when healthcare resources are stretched.」
— Discussion, ¶1 & 3
wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

So, even the experts are at a loss. Reading the study, it seems that keeping good hand-hygiene definitely works. But the masks, seem to good in theory base don past info, but there is data contradicting the theory, so they still have to clarify WHY that that is the case: what circumstances, what exceptions, what factors, etc. make the theory not work, so they can counter it.

[betaTester]

1. The first link is literally a meta analysis of INFLUENZA, using data from 2018, even though it's published in Feb 2020. Please at least look at the date of your data, 2018? 2015? 2010? the data from Covid 19 is a few months old, in 2020! whatever biased political sites you got these links from basically ignored all the relevant data.

Here are the research papers that are actually about Covid 19, with data from Covid 19 patients:

www.thelancet.com/.../fulltext

"Our search did not identify any randomised trials of COVID-19, SARS, or MERS" (before this paper there was no RCTs for effects of masks on Covid 19 transmission!)
"We included patients infected with SARS-CoV-2, SARS-CoV, or MERS-CoV and searched relevant data up to May 3, 2020."
"No face mask, 17.4%. Face mask, 3.1%
Medical or surgical face masks might result in a large reduction in virus infection"

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7191114/
"Cloth masks are a simple, economic and sustainable alternative to surgical masks as a means of source control of SARS-CoV-2 in the general community "

[betaTester]

2. Here is common sense: Masks are not for "defense", masks are for source control: with mask, droplets from your mouth are less likely to reach other people/surfaces when you speak, the virus is in the droplets, so it does work due to simple grade school physics:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BA2BOT3A70w

https://twitter.com/i/status/1248134471481577473

Here are academic papers saying the same thing the common sense above:

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7367512/
"Face coverings... function primarily in source control; capturing droplets expelled by an infected individual."
Droplet spread is widely considered to be the main mode of transmission of SARS-CoV-2: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32171952/

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2
"Surgical face masks significantly reduced detection of influenza virus RNA in respiratory droplets and coronavirus RNA in aerosols"

There are so many other similar articles.

To purposely cherry pick old data from Influenza and pretend it's about Covid 19 while ignoring many other published articles about Covid 19 is simply ridiculous. However I understand that this is how conspiracy theorists (covidiots) do their "research".

[betaTester]

3. The links about quarantine are news reports about the rise of cases, but this is simply selection bias, if you look for new Covid cases when everyone is forced to stay at home, of course the new cases must be MORE LIKELY from home transmission (seriously a child should understand this).

Many cases could simply be infected from before the quarantine and show no symptom earlier, in fact that's how most cases of covid 19 spread: through people with minimal symptoms: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0869-5 , aka unaware people who roam around.

[betaTester]

4. How to estimate the effect of lockdown?

What you are doing is: look at the situation under lockdown, see rise of cases -> conclude lockdown doesn't work for Covid 19

But that makes no logical sense. Have you compared the situation under lockdown with what would have happened to the same population (with the same geographic and infrastructure conditions) but under no lockdown?
you need access to a parallel universe, or, simply a statistical model :)

Here is a statistical analysis that carried out the right comparison: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2405-7
www.nature.com/.../s41586-020-2405-7_reference.pdf

last table:
Observed: 128,928 deaths
Estimated deaths (with intervention) 130,000 deaths
Estimated deaths (without intervention): 3,200,000 deaths
"Our results show that major non-pharmaceutical interventions—and lockdowns in particular—have had a large effect on reducing transmission."

I agree that your rape statistics in Nigeria is a great downside of the lockdown, but at this point only conspiracy theorists believe lockdown doesn't work.

So, there is no "experts at a loss" here, only very few people are still at a loss :))

[betaTester]

(The comparison of deaths data are up to 4th May, in case it isn't obvious). The result one hundred thousands vs millions makes intuitive sense because of exponential growth of disease. There is really nothing surprising or new about this, it was known that early action leads to vastly different outcome
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZ957qhzcjI

yet people still failed to act early

[N192K001]

@betaTester Ⅰ
Good & interesting arguments, but some things here:
1. On the 1st Lancet article sent mentions that previous meta-analyses involved other pathogens (spec. influenza virus), rather than COVID-19 & its fellow-coronaviruses, and that they used such studies in their paper. So, looking into past studies on the spread of flu-like illnesses seems valid here… at least, until sufficient info (specifically on the exact pathogen) is collected.
2. Note that I never said that the purpose of the mask was to defend the wearer. () I repeatedly addressed its use to defend others.
3. Exactly! People confined with anyone infected (or any contaminated objects) WILL get infected. Yet, people pretend like it's the magic cure-all. Mass-quarantine will save and protect us all! lol

[N192K001]

@betaTester Ⅱ
In Economics, we're taught to weigh the cost & benefit of all, (and borrowing from Accounting) disregarding in decision-making 'sunk-costs' (costs inevitable regardless of whatever option is chosen). If infection is inevitable, so be it. If most cases are asymptomatic, so be it. What is price is more likely to affect a person lifelong: no/mild symptoms… or rape (repeated rapes), domestic-abuse, child-abuse, personal/family financial-ruin (a major cause of divorces), repossessions, evictions, foreclosures… the Greater Recession?

If you thought economic-disparity was oppressive, unequal, or any way bad before the mandated lock-downs, the Greater Recession has just begun. And as is seen in the lives of those who lived through the Great Depression of the 1930's. This will mark an entire generation and will affect them throughout their lives form hence forth. And all for a disease with a 80% chance of little to no symptoms (for the healthy).
www.who.int/.../q-a-similarities-and-differences-covid-19-and-influenza

[N192K001]

@betaTester Ⅲ
4. Using statistics-models? Remember how wildly off the mortality-forecasts were now that we have the actual death-count data? We were also taught how to use models and interpret their results… as well as how easy it is to make models say whatever we (and/or our employers) want, plus what happens when our financiers don't get the answers they want. (The sayings "The numbers don't lie." & "Let the numbers do the talking." are too naïve.) Even if the researcher (and/or the employer) is honest & unhindered, issues (personal-leanings, blind-spots, group-think, etc.) can steer the answers in other directions.

Hell, Oxford U's model reported HALF THE U. K. ALREADY HAD COVID back in 24 March 2020!
www.dailymail.co.uk/.../...University-experts.html
With half the U. K.-population already infected, herd-immunity should have been reached in short while, and London should have returned the Kingdom to pre-2020 normal long ago!

Either way, 2020 has screwed us all: the old (COVID-19), the young (the Greater Depression), the Asians (anti-Chinese crimes, even against non-Chinese Asians), Blacks (George Floyd murder), Whites (the backlash), N. America (murder-hornets), India (monkey-attacks), Philippines (Taal volcano eruption), etc.

[N192K001]

@betaTester Ⅱ
In Economics, we're taught to weigh the cost & benefit of all, (and borrowing from Accounting) disregarding in decision-making 'sunk-costs' (costs inevitable regardless of whatever option is chosen). If infection is inevitable, so be it. If most cases are asymptomatic, so be it. What is price is more likely to affect a person lifelong: no/mild symptoms… or rape (repeated rapes), domestic-abuse, child-abuse, personal/family financial-ruin (a major cause of divorces), suicides of peers and/or loved-ones, desperation-driven crimes (experienced and/or committed), repossessions, evictions, foreclosures… the Greater Recession?

If you thought economic-disparity was oppressive, unequal, or any way bad before the mandated lock-downs, the Greater Recession has just begun. And as is seen in the lives of those who lived through the Great Depression of the 1930's. This will mark an entire generation and will affect them throughout their lives form hence forth. And all for a disease with a 80% chance of little to no symptoms (for the healthy).
www.who.int/.../q-a-similarities-and-differences-covid-19-and-influenza

[N192K001]

@betaTester D— it! I forgot to add "(Revision)" beside Ⅱ. Sorry for the extra post.

[888theGreat]

Bull Shit, The democrats have used the Virus as a weapon from the beginning. Only a fool doesn't see it.

How does an Anon post a My Take?

People should have a ball sack or two ovaries and give their ID or not post at all. The world is full of chicken shits. They can mouth off , but only if they hide.

[myTake Owner]

So your name is 888theGreat? Guess what, I don't know where you live, your name, or who you are or if you're even telling the truth about any of that if you said hey my name is Larry for California so literally what difference does it make if you know my ID name? Are my opinions going to change? Are you suddenly going to be able to ascertain something about me just by my screen name because you somehow think you know me based on an screen name...No, you are not, so take it or leave it. Simple. I've said what I said and you are welcome to disagree or agree but don't give me a whole spiel about how knowing my ID is going to make this mytake any more or less true.

[888theGreat]

Are you Larry the Fairy? You have a pink ID. So that proves you are a fraud and a liar , so no one will believe a thing you say.

[myTake Owner]

You are welcome to feel upset because I'm right.

[blank_expression]

This is the first take that I can say is completely wrong and backwards from reality. I don’t even trust these bullshit scientists anymore. They don’t seem to know wtf they are doing and continue to change their opinions oh, excuse me, scientific findings.
I had this evil killer bug and it turns out to be a mild flu. What a joke and a con on the population by the CCP and the left Democrat whackos.
I just heard today that most Covid 19 deaths are now tied to those that had flu vaccinations in the past because their immune systems were weakened by not catching the flu naturally. I never got vaccinations in the past and I can tell you now that I have just become an anti-vaxxer after hearing that. Vaccines are absolute foolishness since the bug can mutate and outperform the vaccine development cycle. I always felt that those vaccines were bad for you and it turns out they are in the long run. Mess with nature and you f-k yourself. Vaccines destroy your immune system over time, that partially explains why mine is so strong, and this bug was so pathetic.
The other thing is that testing (SEM not withstanding) cannot verify the type of Covid so all the fake ass results includes everything that is Covid with some Covid 19 in there.
The lesson that I am learning from Covid 19 is that most of you are all sheep and are willing to have a Bill Gates control chip injected in your asses to feel nice, warm, and safe in your snowflake zones. You all deserve to go extinct with all this mental weakness you exhibit. You will all be so easy to control by the state and that is what the left is banking on.

She deleted me/this so I must have hit the truth.

[goaded]

"The democrats have used the Virus as a weapon from the beginning. Only a fool doesn't see it."

Only if you mean the response to it, in which case maybe Trump shouldn't have handed them a big club with "Hit Me" printed on the side.

He made cuts to the people there to provide early warning of a pandemic, totally refused to implement the protocols developed by the previous two administrations, lied about it, said it would go away, and all the time Americans were dying. And now its getting worse again.

The attacks don't have to stretch the truth, they just have to quote The Man.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UGe4dVzExU

[lilyanony1]

I appreciate your post.

Working in health care you come to see and realise that even some of them don't care.

They are too superior to be told you need to wash your hands or sanitise after removing it putting on gloves.

They've been told not to use the air con. But because we are hot they want you to 'bend' the rules.

I've had a doctor lie to me and use information he heard from other staff to convince me he was telling the truth on a subject.

This world is corrupt. And they are not by any means going to change. The human race is too better, too knowledgeable, too invincible to be able to believe this virus is as deadly as it seems.

What we have is a God complex among the masses!

I'm sorry, but I find this world incredibly tiring.

[myTake Owner]

And the things is, it's always been this way. We didn't suddenly grow this level of ignorance out of nowhere---it's always been a part of our world---I've witnessed it with hurricanes in my area---tell people they are in low lying areas that water will rise 20 feet and drown them, they think they somehow know better than anyone who has ever studied storms, the area, or is simply trying to save their lives, and they die for literally no reason! People don't want to be told what to do by anyone because we are so pressed to make our own way all the time with everything, but that doesn't work when you're talking about a virus that spreads from person to person because it simply does not care who you are, what rights you think you have, or how invisible you think you are. It must be extremely frustrating to be where you are and know how bad it can get and have people ignore protocols. Please keep fighting the good fight. You can't save them all, but maybe you can get through to a few.

[lilyanony1]

🤗 I'm doing the best I can really. And I respect this post and your reply x

[scarlett774]

Your post was amazing and it really explains it clearly to the people who think covid is just a politically motivated fake thing. People need to realize it’s serious and take it seriously.

[Not_Average]

I mean I think there’s something to say when the CDC has been caught falsifying information. Now they are forced to report stats to the HHC. While I agree with the premise of what you’re saying, I urge you to keep your mind open. Is there a possibility that the democrats are over-hyping the virus in an attempt to defame the current president during election season? I think that’s a strong possibility.


Something else to consider is that millions of Americans are losing their jobs and business owners are being forced to shut-down and therefore collapse.


My barbershop owner is a first generation American from Vietnam. She came here and started four different shops, and has achieved wealth and the American Dream coming from nothing. She is now bankrupt, and has lost everything. Her son had to drop out of university because she could no longer pay for the outrageous tuition costs. My gym owner has a similar story.


So while I appreciate your selflessness, let’s also consider all Americans. I personally don’t think businesses should be forced to shut-down as government mandate. I believe that Americans should be able to govern themselves to a certain extent.


They’ll shut down millions of businesses, but they will allow everyone to “protest”? Why is it that particular amendments that benefit one particular political party are allowed when that amendment causes the same, if not more damage towards our efforts with Covid-19?


Also, you should consider that this virus is new, and we really know little about it. For that reason, there are studies that conflict with your statements, and it’s our right as Americans to choose and act on what we believe.


The shutdown simply didn’t work. If there were a vaccine being released in two months- then sure, let’s shut down for two months. But this virus isn’t going anywhere. The same thing will happen as soon as we open up again. “Overwhelmed” hospitals are not as common as you’d think if you dig a little deeper into your research.


I personally believe that people should be strongly encouraged to wear masks, and private business owners should have the right to mandate them- not the government.


I believe that business owners have the right to operate as it’s their discretion and the public’s discretion if they choose to participate within their business.


I also believe that if you’re “at-risk”, then it’s not an obligation of everyone else to stop their life due to your medical misfortune. If someone walks in to a restaurant with a peanut allergy, does it make sense to shut down the entire restaurant? It’s a bad analogy, but it gets my point across.


I’d encourage people to do their own research and not drink the Kool-aid so to speak.

[Not_Average]

Something else to consider- if our economy fails, there will be more deaths than what Covid-19 has caused. Historically, this has been proven to be true if you look at at the numbers.

Imagine if you lose your job, end up on the street, and cannot practice hygiene during this pandemic? That would be catastrophic.

[coffeewithcream]

"Keep your mind open" says someone whose mind is obviously closed. :)

[Not_Average]

Just because I’ve established my stance on a particular subject- doesn’t mean my mind is closed off. I’ve looked at both sides, have done my research, and then I decided on where I stand. If you’d like to offer constructive value as to why you disagree with me- I’d love to hear it. Maybe I can learn more.

[coffeewithcream]

The peanut thing is not just a bad analogy, it makes no sense at all.
Other countries have managed this. The United States hasn't. There are reasons for that.

[coffeewithcream]

What rot.
The CDC hasn't been reporting information. That's their job. For the Trump administration to change where states send their data to and prevent it from being made public is censorship.
The virus is new. But we know a lot about it. For people to reject the science and follow their own guidance means this pandemic will be around for a lot longer and will bankrupt a lot more people.
The shutdown worked in every country but the United States. Why is that? In Europe, Canada and New Zealand, in South Korea and Japan, businesses are getting back doing business, parks are open, people are shopping, ordering food from restaurants. But it was after they successfully followed protocols and flattened the curve.
Not so in the United States. It was against the rights of Americans to wear masks and socially distance.
Be happy. The United States won't wrestle this pandemic down like every other country is able to. Why? Because people in the US can't follow directions or follow the science. It's against their freedom.

[betaTester]

Thanks for writing this.
I wanted to write something like this but I figured I didn't have the time or energy to argue against conspiracy theorists.

Here are the relevant research articles, links for the people who still try to spread misinformation and want to make things harder for the rest of us (the situation in the US is a pretty clear example of what conspiracy theories/science denial propaganda do to your country during a pandemic)

About the mask

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7191114/
"Cloth masks are a simple, economic and sustainable alternative to surgical masks as a means of source control of SARS-CoV-2 in the general community "

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2
"Surgical face masks significantly reduced detection of influenza virus RNA in respiratory droplets and coronavirus RNA in aerosols"

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7367512/
"Face coverings... function primarily in source control; capturing droplets expelled by an infected individual."

(Droplet spread is widely considered to be the main mode of transmission of SARS-CoV-2: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32171952/)

About the lockdown

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2405-7
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2405-7_reference.pdf

last table:
Observed: 128,928 deaths
Estimated deaths (with intervention) 130,000 deaths
Estimated deaths (without intervention): 3,200,000 deaths

"Our results show that major non-pharmaceutical interventions—and lockdowns in particular—have had a large effect on reducing transmission."

About economy recovery and non-pharmaceutical interventions (such as lockdown, social distancing etc)

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3561560

"While the pandemic itself was associated with economic disruptions in the short run, we find these disruptions were similar across cities with strict and lenient NPIs. In the medium run, we find suggestive evidence that, if anything, NPIs are associated with better economic outcomes. Our findings indicate that NPIs can reduce disease transmission without necessarily further depressing economic activity."

Yes, the people who are fighting against NPIs are the ones making your country's economy worse in longer time scale.

[Liam_Hayden]

1. Clearly it can, considering that Trump is being blamed for the deaths when it was idiots like Cuomo, Wolf, Murphy, and Whitmer who sent Covid-19 positive patients back into nursing homes, resulting in tens of thousands of early deaths for the elderly.
2. True, but as they keep changing it and contradicting themselves and others (Fauci's don't wear a mask then yes, wear one) makes it difficult to know whom to trust.
3. Cuomo is running a victory lap after his poor decisions exploded the number of deaths in NY, so at least someone disagrees.
4. Nor is a collapsed economy, forcing businesses into bankruptcy, incurring huge debt, and keeping people who need serious procedures out of hospitals
5. True. Riot and "protests" contributed greatly, which is why Leftist states ordered contact tracers to not ask if the infected had gone to any of the "protests."
6. No virus does. That is not the problem. The problem is that the governors and mayors don't either, which is why they issue such arbitrary and idiot, and often - looking at you Andy Beshear - Illegal rules. They were elected to administrate, not dictate.
7. Not completely useless, but they also give people a false sense of security even though most of the masks they wear have a message on the side of the box that explicitly says "Does not protect against viruses, including Coronavirus."
8. Yawn. Even Leftwing Politifact debunk the false "inject bleach" story

https://www.politifact.com/article/2020/apr/24/context-what-donald-trump-said-about-disinfectant-/

[OddBeMe]

Even if all that were true, shouldn’t we still wear masks in public? And take the vaccine when it’s available?

[MrHopper]

• 1) Dont lick strangers
• 2) Dont lick railings
• 3) Wash your hands
• 4) Dont sneeze on people
• 5) Dont cough on people
• 6) Dont hang about with sick people
• 7) If your ill stay at home and dont go to work
• 8) Working from home is a realistic prospect when so many companies said it wasn't viable years ago
• 9) MPs think medical staff are happy with a clap for thanks
• 10) Nurses are less important according to the gov

[OddBeMe]

Seems these were rules before Covid...

[MrHopper]

@OddBeMe Exactly :)

[Liz_thorne]

Your post is great and well founded. It's really sad how many people care more about their own comfort than other people's lives.

[Meatunnel69]

One solid lesson for respiratory viruses for me is when i was in a small room with a man having a sneezing fit. I got no spit or liquid drops on me but was sick the next day with a cold. So the Rona scares me in it’s ease of spread.

These positive tests are bad because many are inaccurate and they lower the mortality rate if more and more “positives” are being tallied which turns people to the “just the flu” crowd. Many young people have died of strokes or other blood clotting disorders with this virus and being able to breathe is pretty important. I have some n95 masks I wear when indoors with other people, call me paranoid but I like being able to fill my lungs with air not liquid.

[NYCQuestions1976]

Schools need to reopen. Just because the threat is real doesn't mean that we should be living our lives in fear, curled up in a perpetual fetal position, sucking our thumbs under our beds indefinitely. You take proper precautions AND you live your life. They're not mutually exclusive.

Why is this Take unnecessarily Anonymous?

[OddBeMe]

So pack kids in classrooms, despite the fact they’re vulnerable? It’s worth it?

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe I don't believe in a no-win scenario. There's ways to make it happen, like rolling off days coupled hybrid learning, and utilizing school libraries and gymnasiums as classrooms. So there's no need to "pack" kids anywhere. That's an excuse to live in fear and defeatist attitude.

[OddBeMe]

Seeing how kids are unruly in normal times, I highly doubt they’ll follow Covid guidelines to the letter. So some kids will get sick and some will die. I’m not defeatist, I’m a realist. And I don’t trade a kid’s life to make Trump look better.

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe More children die separately from pneumonia and violence than the current pandemic. The average age of those dying is near 80, and while this current wave is spreading more than the first wave, it's also far less deadly than the first wave. As I already stated, you take proper precautions AND you live your life. They're not mutually exclusive.

[OddBeMe]

Yes older people are dying bc they’re likely in packed nursing homes. And bc street violence has no bearing on whether kids should go back to school during a pandemic.

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe The point is that children are in far more danger running the streets than being in school.

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe Plus packing nursing homes with Covid patients is on the governors and local government, but off topic.

[OddBeMe]

Funny, there’s been no spike in children’s deaths bc they’re running wild. But experts are saying it’d be more dangerous to pack them into schools and I’ll listen to them over dumbass Trump.

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe Trump has nothing to do with this argument, nor does your clear disdain for him. Kids are more likely to be killed by VIOLENCE on the streets than being in school, not "running around". Don't be deliberately obtuse. If they're in school, that's a significant part of the day that they're not facing random violence. That's the point, not "kids running around".

[OddBeMe]

No... he’s calling for schools to reopen. And currently there’s no spike in kid street deaths.

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe Are you serious? Have you not been paying attention? Are are you being deliberately disingenuous? Violence has spiked against all age groups, including children, in cities all over the country. A lot of the violence is being perpetrated by teenagers.

You're only against schools reopening because it happens to be something Trump said. If he had said they should stay closed, you'd be complaining that they should be open. 😂

[OddBeMe]

Please send me proof that children are dying in the streets. Wanting to break quarantine to pack kids into schools, you better have some damn good evidence they’re currently in danger.

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe Watch any local news broadcast out of any major metropolitan area (particularly Chicago and New York) and pay very close attention to the number of shootings (and the number of corresponding victims) that are taking place on a daily basis. I'm not posting links here. It's not my job to lead you by your hand to the land of common sense and to figure out your homework for you.

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe Additionally, having kids in school doesn't mean we're breaking quarantine. They're not mutually exclusive. Like I previously stated, there's ways to make it happen, like rolling off days coupled hybrid learning, and utilizing school libraries and gymnasiums as classrooms. So there's no need to "pack" kids anywhere. That's an excuse to live in fear and defeatist attitude. Plus you clean and sanitize schools every evening/night and on weekends. We have other places and businesses reopening, following similar protection protocols. There's no reason for the schools to not be open as I described above. I don't believe in no-win scenarios.

[OddBeMe]

Those aren’t kids on the news. Children are more vulnerable to Covid.

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe No. Only the elderly are more vulnerable to Covid across the board. Children younger than school age are at a slightly elevated risk level. The risk is only elevated for other age groups if they already have underlying health issues. For those students with underlying health problems and/or with very young siblings, they can opt out and continue to learn from home. Again, there's workable, sensible, safe solutions that can be implemented with just a little bit of thinking and effort.

[OddBeMe]

I agree there are workable solutions. But even healthy adults at pool parties get Covid and die. Is it worth reopening schools even if just one child dies?

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe Those aren't comparable situations. All of those stories about parties spreading the virus all featured the same nonsensical behavior: People not wearing masks, people not social distancing, and people not be careful. No precautions whatsoever.

[OddBeMe]

Yes! And you think ten years olds are gonna follow CDC guidelines. In 30 student classrooms with desks next to each other?

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe Again: Rolling attendance, utilizing auditoriums and gymnasiums and cafeterias and libraries, cleaning everything overnight and/or on the weekends. Like I already stated, it can be done.

[OddBeMe]

So there’s 30 kids in a class. Say a quarter at a time to keep social distancing. That’s basically once a week per kid. It’s worth the expense for that?

[NYCQuestions1976]

@OddBeMe A rolling third would stay home every third day (1st third, 2nd third, 3rd third, and so on...). Plus utilizing the extra spaces as I already stated with daily cleaning, and I'm sure 20% to 25% parents will choose to opt out. It can be done, and yes it's worth the financial cost.

[PBandJ_Nerd]

The only things I don't like during this pandemic is: people who don't wear a mask, people who don't want to do social distancing, protests, and those dumb bleach "cures" (I already know the last one is dangerous. Bleach can do horrible things to your body if consumed).

[Oigit]

If you are not a legit virologist or hold a degree in a medical or biological scientific fields that deal with viruses, you need to shut the hell up and listen to those that do. The simple truth is that many people do not have the actual qualifications and experience necessary to give their words any actual credibility and weight. That very much proteins to those in the politics and the media as well.

[WhiteSteve]

Caught this the other day, thought it was pretty funny. My dad watches FoxNews all the time so I remember hearing a lot of this the first time, it’s all in proper context lmao. My dad saw it too, but I think he pretended not to, and he left to go upstairs😂

https://www.youtube.com/embed/HGDNaB6fZCU

[Anonymous]

This should be featured on g@g so some idiots can read and stop thinking it’s a hoax

[zagor]

So tired of hearing the conspiracy theorists; it is a VIRUS. It doesn't care who you are or how you believe. It doesn't care about anything, including it's own existence. It is a complex group of proteins that just keeps replicating itself in compliant host systems until it can no longer do so. It doesn't care if you live or die.

[Anonymous]

9. Making masks mandatory is unconstitutional. Americans with disability acts some people can’t be forced if they have underlying health conditions. Walmart and target had to quit their mandatory mask idea because they received many phone calls from customers and calls from their corporate lawyers pointing out the absurdity.

[myTake Owner]

I'm not sure about this where you live, but all the "Mandatory to wear masks signs" in our area include an underlying statement that this is not required for young children, or those with health or mental issues...but those are not the people that are "taking on the system." The ones getting pissy and causing a fit are not those people at all. I've witnessed at least 3 times where managers have had to deal with people screaming about rights, but clearly 3 people are not the only people with rights to want to live and protect their own families.

[Opinion Owner]

It’s about controlling people with fear, scare tactics, and the idea of potentially hurting other people if they don’t wear a mask. People shouldn’t be giving dr fauci a death threat. But he should lose his medical license and high paying cushioned job. Governors like Andrew Cuomo should receive a second degree murder charge for the 32,000 elderly that were knowingly killed in NYC. The medical ship comfort was ready to go along with field hospitals that remained empty, ready to go with the necessary equipment and medications. Hopefully things will get back to normal after November 4th.

[acooke-13]

Americans just like to complain, if you physically cannot wear a mask, don't go out unless absolutely necessary. My friend has severe asthma and wears a face mask for 6-7 hours a day with no complaints.

[Opinion Owner]

@acooke-13 it’s a lie propagated onto the entire world. It should end a day after the US election on November 5th. Then people around the world bitching about the re-election will be mainstream again. It’s about preventing Trump from getting re-elected cdc, who, nih, mayors, governors don’t give a fuck if people die in nursing homes from not being allowed onto the military hospital ship at the time, or the temporary hospitals, cuomo knowingly had people killed to inflate the numbers. They will only care if it’s their own family.

[Anonymous]

Citation needed on your last one.. If Covid is not political you certainly made it political.. Seriously your TDS is strong.. I liked your mytake until you mentioned trump, i even agreed with you until you mentioned trump.. Now i just feel sorry for you.

[Be4rdy]

Yet kids can't get it


So it does give a fuck who you are... if your young and mostly looked after by their parents are fine


But if your old cost the government money and take up hospital beds... your pretty much dead


🤔

[WhistleForTheChoir]

First part isn't true. Second part and third part miss a very cogent point: What happens when there are no more hospital beds. Mortality rate in Wuhan was 4.9% because people who might've survived didn't receive the medical care they needed. Then the rate of young people dying is going to go up quite a bit.

[Goodwifie]

Kids can get it and they can develop kawasaki disease as a complication and we don't even know what the long term effects of getting Covid are.

[Be4rdy]

Trying telling that to the uk government who cares ending kids back to school with no distancing measures at all because "kids dont get it"

If kids can't get it but carry antibodies they need to know why,

[frostwalrus]

I think it's mostly a 'murican issue.

[acooke-13]

Anyone reading, don't be so fucking selfish, wear a mask it isn't going to harm you darling.

[genericname85]

"Everything scientists and doctors know about Covid is not fake news" everytjomg scientists "know" about covid is not at all coherent and absolutely not pointing in "one" direction.

[Gedaria]

True. The wearing of masks is for the other person so you don't cough or sneeze on them. That is why it's better every one wears them. The mask just rejuices spray...

[Bananaman177]

One lesson you are failing to learn from Covid-19:

1. Nobody cares.

[masonderek6994]

Exactly correct sir