When I hear 'toned', I typically think of a guy that's basically skinny but with mild muscle definition, e. g.
At a push we've got the way Brad Pitt looked in fight club, and this seems to be an almost universally desired physique for women:
Now let's look at what a google image search says is the definition of 'toned'.
As you can see, these guys are not just 'toned', they are on the verge of becoming bodybuilders. The guys that don't look like this tend to look like this instead:
And this isn't just google, this is what people in general seem to think nowadays: either you're fat, skinny as a rake or jacked. There are no middle grounds.
I already created a GAG poll and the majority of women so far have voted in preference of 'skinny toned' over the 'shredded' option (though it is a slim victory at this point along).
28 girls prefered this guy ^
It's at an early stage yet but only 26 girls preferred this guy^
So if GAG is anything to go on (and it quite probably is not an accurate sample size) it is not women causing this. So what is? Is it an increase of societal pressure on guys to hit the gym 5 times a week and eat 6-8 meals a day, or is google image search just showing a bit of bias towards BB. com? Is it just a failure of simple logic? Or am I just being delusional?
It's wannabe bodybuilder guys saying this stuff.
It's actual bodybuilders and big money trying to create pressure and bodybuilding consumerism.
It's girls: they want more muscle definition in a guy.
It's both girls and guys saying this: their perception of "toned" is accurate
There isn't a warped perception: most people agree with you on what defines "toned"
I like guy 2 more just because he has a little body hair coming in - like come on no one is attracted to little boys except for little girls, give me some damn hair. Consequencially, many (esp older women) prefer the beefed up guy because more muscle is an indicator of manhood.
Dude A could be 12 he could be 26 and the flirty devil expression indicates its towards the older but literally nothing else does. It's not that there is anything wrong with being lean but isn't it a bit obvious that someone with more adult male physical traits is going to be more attractive?
As far as understanding that toned isn't the same as being ripped as fuck - I can see why the definition varies. Toned really just applies to the fact that the muscles have definition, a scrawny guy like pic 7 doesn't have much nor does a super jacked guy whos got some fat on him. So a toned guy is just one where you can see the distinctions between the muscles.
well not every man is physically capable of growing body hair (I personally am bare chested). not that women aren't entitled to prefer hairy men. but the focus in this question is meant to be on muscle tone, so to be objective, try and picture each guys with what you would consider to be ideal physical features (bodyhair, face, etc.) aside from the actual muscle tone.
yeah, the first guy and the guy with the football do look baby faced (it's hard to find suitable examples because like I said every google image search for 'toned' is plastered with either super buff dudes or skinny little boys so it's hard to find guys that meet the criteria of what I'm trying to define. this is what's so frustrating actually because it just further proves my point that society have such warped perceptions about body image in general: www.girlsaskguys.com/.../q1934049-are-these-girls-overweight-or-curvy)
... as for your other point, I get that this is the literal / technical definition. but I think it is more useful to have varying common expressions for more casual discussion about the different body types.
I dont mean loads of body hair, I just mean some. Even if its like armpit hair and pubes lol. I was mostly trying to get across that with everyone shaving everything or almost everything now the more muscular man looks more like a man, period and that subconciously influences the preference most women have (I think).
If it's just about muscle tone - ah thats really hard. I have a huge range I like. I feel like the other features really make it for me personally. It can be easy to be impressed by a lot of muscle, but the other has its appeal as well. I feel like you're kind of asking what insanely hot thing is more insanely hot and the answer is I have a boner lmfao.
And ooooh I just got what you're driving at. Yeah. Body image stuff is crazy f'ed up right now. The only guys that look that buff are practically body-builders with strict work out routines. It's their life. It's totally unfair to expect men to just look like that. I don't know how much people really do though.
So basically it doesn't seem difficult for a man to be toned, people (women) always say they want toned men, he does some light work and excercise and voila he should look like option B, right? I getcha now lol.
To answer your question directly, its a little bit of all of it. I think media, more than anything else is to blame though. Saying look at this, this is what attractive is, this is what attractive should be to you. Which is always ultimately to sell shit.
Also, a lot of human societies thoughout history are structured around social class in particular where attractiveness is equated with adornments or body types with indicate affluence and influence for the times. This is part of our that. However, in a modern era there is some redundancy to this as it doesn't actually indicate the presence of something more beneficial than anything anyone else has. I'm getting totally off focus now but yeah thats my two cents I guess.
Men themselves seem to obsess more about their muscles' size than women obsess about men's muscles , just like women obsess more about being skinny than men obsess about skinny women, if that makes sense. It's because some men feel insecure about their looks and about how strong they are. It's also due to the fact that male models' photos are being photoshopped, and most male celebrities are jacked. It distorts people's perception about athletic men. I mean, muscles aren't naturally bulging too much, unless someone is working too hard and takes supplements too
yeah that does make sense: experience does tell me that men and women do tend to have higher standards for themselves than for each other. but in many ways being so hard on yourself that you absolutely despise your body and you set goals that are totally unrealistic and not even necessary is something that is far more psychologically alien to me. especially if it's say a fat guy scoffing at some athletic/skinny-toned guy for not being the right shape (if you don't think that's the ideal shape and your even further away from it, then how do you ever imagine that you will ever be happy with YOURself?)
It's a long journey to feel good about your body. I mean, setting achievable goals is fine, but one can't alter his body shape completely. And I see even very attractive people not feel content with themselves. Of course this benefits many industries who sell products to change the way you look, from drugs companies to make up companies. If you hate yourself, it's your mentality that has to change, not your body.
Toned simply means visible muscle definition and it can be used in a arbitrary way to describe a variety of different bodies.
But in general toned means you can actually see the muscles and their contours which are the lines that show were the muscle is and what it is attached to like the 6 pack abs or the quadriceps muscle, or the pectoral muscles or the tricep muscles but words toned, definition and contours are not restricted to any one body type of muscle mass, but some bodies will be more toned then others and more defined then others sometimes this is due to hard work, other times genetics, other times both.
Source: bodybuilder and soon to be professional trainer from the ISSA institute.
yeah I get that this is the technical definition of toned. my argument is that for general usage we should at least distinguish between 'skinny toned' guys and 'bulky toned' guys, so that 'bulky toned' guys - even if they are still, technically speaking 'toned' - do not get called 'toned' when speaking more casually. maybe you might want to specify the fact they have visible muscle contours and low bodyfat percentage but I think words like 'shredded' cover this. maybe 'jacked' and 'bulky' not so much (these body types could have higher bf%). I would say 'ripped' or 'lean' but in two minds whether they should belong to the lighter weight categories or not.
Yeah that's true, of course I'm going by the actual definition of it used by people who actually work in the fitness industry. We know the difference but your normal common people who have no real knowledge of the subject wouldn't.
But really being "toned" comes down to genetics and body fat %
I think on that last point anyone can have muscle definition really, it's just a case of putting the work in to remove bodyfat (cardio, dieting) and induce muscular hypertrophy (free weights, bulking, etc.). the actual nature of the muscular contour will be genetic but that's besides the point because most guys would be happy to have six pack abs for instance or visible pec definition. it doesn't really matter to them if the abs aren't perfectly symmetrical, e. g. like how this guy has peculiar abdominal proportions:
they wouldn't care so much because at least the muscle is there. but back to the point about being genetic or not, I think some people will have to put in more effort - e. g. if they have an incredibly slow metabolism it's hard to lose the fat (then again, high metabolism guys like me have a harder time bulking), or if they don't have those...
... perfectly symmetrical contour lines, they might still be disappointed. but regardless of genetics, most people can still put in the effort. and this does not change my point of course about the distinction between high definition, high body mass guys, and high definition, low body mass. that's important because the latter still have significantly better physiques than their skinny counterpart (even if you personally think that jacked is better).
And what I meant by genetics was that some people genetically have better shape then some other people like they're muscles will pop more or be more defined after putting in the work to get them a reasonable size. So not everyone can have that true toned look, some people got it and some don't. I'm one of those people because genetically I have better muscle shape and definition like one guy may have much bigger and thicker muscles on their arms then me. But I have better definition, shape and contour to mine then he does.
' some people genetically have better shape then some other people like they're muscles will pop more or be more defined after putting in the work to get them a reasonable size. '
agreed that the muscles will be shaped differently (e. g. some people have more thickness in the upper pec region). lots of people think they can remedy this through isolation (e. g. you ever heard guys at the gym talking about how they can bring the pecs 'inwards' by doing dumbbell flies? or bodybuilding sites that say you can isolate either the short head or long head of the biceps brachii?) but for the most part it's not true. either the muscle grows (hypertrophy) as a whole or it does not. but I don't really think it matters that you can't change the shape that much. just having the mass and low bf% is good enough (at least for me) so I can't really see how the definition of muscle tone has anything much to do with genetics or contouring/shape.
Well since muscle shaping is a myth and can't be done it all comes back to genetics, hard work and proper nutrition play a major role but a lot of things are decided with genetics, genetics make some muscles stronger then others, or allow certain people to build up a muscle group much easier then the other. And it makes definition much easier for some people or rather more prominent. Genetics contouring/shape etc, all keyed to genetics. To a point. Our genetics determine how an individuals muscles will grow and balanced mix of proper form and heavy weight dictates how effectively and proper nutrition dictates how quickly.
But at the end of the day genetics only make the journey slightly easier or slightly harder, hard work, determination and proper information are what win out. Genetics still do play a key, that's all I was saying, it's a piece of a much larger thing.
And I've said about all I can on the matter so I'm done talking about it.
'But at the end of the day genetics only make the journey slightly easier or slightly harder, hard work, determination and proper information are what win out. Genetics still do play a key, that's all I was saying, it's a piece of a much larger thing.'
You're right bro. I'm toned. I'm slim with lean muscle. I'm not jacked like the middle guys are, but I'm not skinny like those guys you posted with the bird chests.
yeah, I think it is most annoying for guys like you and me that fit into the 'slim but toned' category because we hear about these bigger guys being called 'toned' and we know it's b. s.
Well my issue is what do we call us? Like a big muscular guy is called jacked and ripped. What are we called? Lean slim guy with some slight muscle tone. All that to define us? Not just one word? Lol.
ok then, if you say athletic, you have to specify what you mean. otherwise lean and toned for us, jacked and shredded for them sounds pretty good. keep in mind it's just slang though (if we are going to define 'toned' scientifically, then we are discussing a low ratio of bodyfat to muscle which bigger guys can have too. but when we say 'toned' informally we just mean 'slim but toned'. this reasoning could apply to 'athletic' also - if we are using the term formally or more casually).
'muscle tone' is how low your bodyfat:muscle ratio. so in this, you're right (you can have low bodyfat and lots of muscle).
the problem is that this means there isn't a linguistic distinction between 'skinny toned' and 'big toned'. that's why 'big toned' people should be called shredded, jacked, etc. but 'skinny toned guys' should be just toned.
Ya true. Applicable in different body types. Once I said I was lean on here once and this girl was like you seriously think you're lean? haha I'm like you realize lean doesn't mean skinny, it means low body fat composition right you fucking tard? lmao
I understand the sentiment. Two or three years ago when my room-mates said I was skinny I explained I was actually toned and they google searched and were like, "no, this is toned". It's just frustrating if you've put a lot of work into actually getting the kind of body you want and people that are lagging way behind come out with really ignorant remarks.
Yeah if you are lean and toned you're NOT skinny. LOL. I don't know why people say that. Skinny is like the opposite of overweight. That's not fit lol. People just throw that word around when it's not correct.
I like "skinny" "jacked" more lol it's a bit more descriptive person-to-person in my opinion. Or like this skinny-toned body type lots of people call "a swimmer's body" which I think is a clear description, that really resonates with me.
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