What’s your opinion on iron cross symbol?

[ADFSDF1996]

The only way a iron cross can be considered a “Nazi symbol” is if it has a swastika or the Waffen SS lighting bolts.

WWII knight’s Cross of the iron cross

Many ignoramuses still associate the iron cross with Nazism despite the fact that the iron cross predates the Nazi regime and is still used by the German Bundeswehr today.

WWI iron cross

Bundeswehr with iron cross in the background.

I understand that the Iron cross isn’t always associated with Nazism

I understand that the iron cross by itself isn’t a Nazi symbol but I still feel weird when I see people wear it

My iq is too low, I still think the iron cross is a Nazi symbol

[JackPreacher]

The Iron cross and swastika are not the simbols of the Nazi this are simbols that were adopted by the Nazi and as much as the Griffin which still today is used by the US in the military coat of arms yet the Tibetans use it today and the Hindu use it, none of this simbols should be considered good nor bad they are simbols, let me instead say the following in the past this symbols where considered only good symbols for they were benerated by millions and they were every where in the world where temples where present, the bad popularity given by the Nazi, should not condemned this symbols since this are part of our rich past, our mediocrity should not erase them from our past since this symbols did not caused anything but those who caused this things to happened where the ones who chose this symbols for the good and strength they had or accumulated from the rich past, remember now and always that the burn of books in the past came followed by a big war (several instances) now that we use electronic means they have split us all into zones and limit our exchange of information, and can and they have stop people from sharing valuable information, no longer they have to burn books now you have to be more aware and more vigilant of them those who control you.
Remember, remember...
"he who controls the past controls the future"
You have being warned...

[JimRSmith]

I don't think the Iron Cross is tainted as a Nazi symbol like the swastika is, for example.

My opinion on it is that it's a German military order, which, whilst it was in use during the Nazi period, also has an independent history, outside that period.

[TayTay21]

It's a cross, which is a symbol of Christianity, so being a Christian, I like it. And I think this is called a Maltese Cross, so it doesn't have anything to do with Germany specifically.

[something_memorable]

The swastika is a religious symbol of some kind but i can't rember which religion off the top of my head. Brb

Sanatan dharma, hinduism. Thanks google you're the best😄

[ADFSDF1996]

Indeed and various cultures use the symbol as well.

[NeoWraythe]

Yeah, the symbol is flipped, though.

[hellionthesagereborn]

I mean even the swastika isn't a Nazi symbol. The swastika is found in one form or another in every culture in the world meaning it predates human migration (its found even in the America's predating European settlers). It was painted on the wings of US war planes in WW1 for good luck. So yeah, the iron cross isn't a Nazi symbol and quite frankly neither is the swastika unless its within the context of the Nazi's and how they used it (just like words, the symbols need to be taken within context of the time and how they are being used).

[BCA6010]

The Germans have used the iron cross/cross symbol since before Germany was even a country- It started during the Napoleonic wars in the Prussian military. Before that, it went at least as far back as the Teutonic Knights during the middle ages.

Since I never served in the German military and never earned the synonymous award, nor am I affiliated with the Teutonic order, I definitely wouldn't wear it.

[wankiam]

in the uk vw or mercedes car club scene many people have the iron cross on their cars, especially the big motorway cruizers we refer to as panzerwagens but i have to say if we cross the channel all those symbols get removed before travelling because we respect the connetations they have accross the continent

[fauchelevent]

I understand the iron cross by itself isn't a Nazi symbol but I still feel weird when I see people wear it - additionally, I would never wear it myself.

[JackPreacher]

Okay they feel weird to you but there are a lot more good people that use this symbols as a symbols of good and positivity in their religion and their life, did you know that the cross is the oldest pagan symbol in the world, and as a simple question would you be okay to stop every one from using crosses (since they are all crosses regardless of the kind of cross).
I used to feel the same way you do know and the only way to open your eyes and do not allow those who did harm to the world to continue damaging us, is to learn and not let them to appropriate those things or symbols that did not belong to them.
You are a very smart person, you are above them...

[fauchelevent]

@JackPreacher I'm not saying I would stop people wearing it. If good people want to use that symbol then fine. I understand the positive connotations with it the same way I understand the negative. Even though I know about both and can understand it's not purely an evil symbol, and I think people should feel free to use it, I still can't help feel uncomfortable with it and would personally not consider wearing one.

[JackPreacher]

I can understand that and I do respect your personal opinion and how you feel.
Just remember that this symbols where and are representation of the good peace and positive side of God (or Gods) don't allow evil people from the past to have power over your mind your thoughts and therefore your future.

[fauchelevent]

@JackPreacher I think it's fine to say not to let evil people cloud your mind but in my opinion as a history graduate, respecting history and the events is important too.

[JackPreacher]

@fauchelevent thank you, I respect your opinion and what you think of history.

This on a side note.
I believe in the great general Napoleon Bonaparte said "History is a set of lies agreed upon" there are many scientist and historians that had gone on record against the Catholic Church that was the one entity that intruduced this time line, all of this scientist and historians disagree with the current time line of events we have now a days. That's just my personal opinion and little contribution in this funny subject.

[andreasderjuengere]

Some people indeed believe that any German symbol is automatically 'Nazi' :D
It gives me a correct feedback of their school quality and cultural level as well...
Here's one other Nazi symbol that had been used in Germany:

Heh heh

[Daniela1982]

To me the plain version it is just an award for bravery, like a Silver Star, or the Blue Max. The Germans gave the cross away like candy to keep the troops motivated. I don't think it necessarily represents hate.

[YHL6965]

The iron cross is a military decoration for distinctive combat deeds, it has nothing to do with any political movement like Nazism for example. It's just a decoration to show that someone has done outstanding moves.

[Neptunsheart]

A symbol never stands alone. Context is everything. The true question is, why do YOU care about the iron cross. What does it mean to you? What's YOUR context?

[Neptunsheart]

PS: There is a different between iq and knowledge. A lot of people associate the cross with the third Reich, because that's the most known part of german history in the world. Not even a lot of Germans associate the cross with the Bundeswehr since compulsory military service has been abolished.

[ADFSDF1996]

When a person stubbornly denies facts one has to question their intelligence. It’s one thing to be ignorant (no shame in that) but it’s another thing to deny facts just cause they don’t match one’s narrative.

The reason why people associate it with the third Reich is because of the impact that Nazism had on the world, the ripple effects are still felt by generations today. In the process people fail to get the facts of the subject

[ADFSDF1996]

@Neptuneheart What does compulsory military service have anything to do with the topic we are discussing?

[Neptunsheart]

The big advantage of the compulsory military service was the connction of civilians to the Bundeswehr. Knowledge about the use of symbols like the iron cross was more widespread than nowadays.

[alice55]

I find it pretty, I wanted to buy one but I'm quite afraid that people would misunderstand it (especially since I'm a far right supporter so *-*).

[Exterminatore]

It’s a cool symbol. Agree it is separate from Nazism.

[Matt57]

Doesn’t bother me whether it’s the Balkenkruez or Schwarzkruez

[madgoat]

The Nazi's borrowed a lot of preexisting symbolism made it their own. A lot of people around the world only saw such symbols when they made them popular, thus they are now regarded as nazi.

[LuWe22]

My boyfriend's grandpa got an iron cross for his service.

[smølf]

heil und sieg in named das fuhrers, not something I would be bragging about if I was you.

You boyfriend's grandpa was a Nazi.

[Janncis]

@smølf I gues your IQ is way to low to figure out that iron cross is way older than Nazi not to even mention you lack ability to distinguish Nazi from soldier who did his duty.

[smølf]

@Janncis I guess you are too stupid to calculate age.

A 24 yo girls boyfriend's grandpa is from the Nazi times if you can do the match.

[Janncis]

@smølf i gues you fail to do math Iron cross was used way be fore 1900s and is still used. Implying Her grandfather got it in mear 7 years on Nazi rule is madness.
I would also recommend you to refresh your math once a while, your becoming bat at it. If her boyfriends grandfather was born in 1945 (end of ww2) he would be 74 year old by now. If we assume that he fought in war he must have been at least 14 year old (child soldiers at the end of war) by the end of ww2 but fair ballpark would be around 18 to 20 year old if soldier, way older if officer. So he must be at least 88 year old more likely 92 year old. My own grand parents are in there late 70s.
Now tell me again if my math sucks.

[LuWe22]

It was WW1.

[October808]

@smølf I guess you are an ignorant Gen Xer for associating the Iron Cross with just Nazi Germany. Regardless if the grandfather fought in WWII. That's irrelevant to the origin of the Iron Cross.

[smølf]

@Janncis
1. I am aware the Iron cross was used way before the 1900s and but it is not still in use and wavetn been since WWII.
It has been replaced thoung.
2. The Nazis was from 1933-1945, that's 132 years not 7.
,3. if she is 24, herboyfrtin would no older then 35, his parrantees not older than 65 and the grad father around 85 +.
Bringen hin into WWII times.
Do the math.
No Iron Cross since 1945, do its Nazi times or he's is way way older as in 120 years old.

[smølf]

Clearly not WWI (1974 to 1918), that woudl make hin born in the 18xx, and older than 120 years.

Clearly your are wrong.

[Phoenix98]

The Iron Cross actually didn't originate in Germany it's Prussian and was later adopted by Germany and was used mainly with the Wehrmacht or German Army during WW2 .

[Anonymous]

The swastika also predates the Nazi regime.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika

[Red_Arrow]

So in the askers view, the swastika is not a Nazi symbol.

[ADFSDF1996]

@Red_Arrow

[Red_Arrow]

Regardless of the many ways it has been used, it has been used by a violent group and when used in many places is obviously being used to associate with Nazi.

[ADFSDF1996]

@Red_Arrow The Nazi swastika is tilted 45 degrees.

Hence the German government’s strict censorship law (Strafgesetzbuch section 86 A) only criminalizes the public displaying of the “Nazi swastika”. And people in Germany can still display other swastika variants without issues.

[ADFSDF1996]

@Red_Arrow Neo nazis rarely use the iron cross.

They primarily use the Celtic cross, “14/88”, the SS symbol and the Odal rune.

Condemning the usage of an Iron cross is no different than condemning vegetarian lifestyle just because Hitler was a vegetarian.

[Red_Arrow]

Your own definition that the only way an iron cross can be associated with Nazi is if it has a swastika (without specifying a type of swastika). And regardless of German law, the swastika at any angle is recognized as Nazi associated in most countries that had to fight Germany back then.

[ADFSDF1996]

@Red_Arrow Germany has strict anti Nazi laws as we speak, any public displaying of Nazi symbols for non educational use is punishable by up to 6 years in prison. The Iron cross is still able to be displayed without any restrictions and is even used by the German military because it’s not considered to be a Nazi symbol.

Most people are too ignorant to differentiate a non Nazi swastika from a Nazi swastika. But more and more people are starting to learn that only the 45 degree angle swastika is the Nazi variant.

[Janncis]

@ADFSDF1996 there's so much more about Swastika or fire cross than being titled 45 degrees. Context matters to. For Balts - fire cross/ thunder cross (god of thunder in ancient Balts mythology/ Laima cross (goddess of destiny in ancient Balts mythology) and a lot more variations are still used as ornaments sometimes still as religious symbol. Used only in 45 degree tilt. A way older than Nazi. In fact popular theme for tattoos as part of "Belt of Lielvarde"

Still i consider calling each cross as its men to be called if its possible. Swastika is just one name for it.

[Miristheiss]

It looks cool.
I have a guitar strap on my guitar with that symbol lining the length of the strap.

There us a sect in today's culture whose goal is to be offended by everything in life.

[Bananaman177]

The last true German died in 1945.

[MoscowMitch]

That's literally the dumbest comment I ever heard.

[Bananaman177]

@MoscowMitch That's the dumbest retort I ever heard. I'll take you on in backyard wrestling any place, any time, and bring your girlfriend, because after the match, she's gonna be my girlfriend. Maybe. If she's hot.

[OddBeMe]

Alt answer: Iron Cross and Swastika were both around before Nazism. But because Nazis were so evil, the symbols are tainted and should never be used, unless you’re a right-wing piece of shit.

[CarrieBlossum]

The swastika predates nazism by thousands of years but that doesn't mean you can use it in western society.

[Fiiggy]

Yeah it's not a problem. What i do see alot' lately are the SS lightning bolts on T shirts and tattoos. Those are way more concerning.