Why Is Adoption Not on the Table?

[Anonymous]

I've read or heard of stories of families dealing with infertility, and for some the struggle is 2, 5, 10 years plus of trying to get pregnant, and I often wonder, why is it that adoption, or surrogacy, donation, or fostering, etc, is not on the table?

Infertility is one of the most taxing things a couple can go through. It's insanely expensive, it's physically difficult, it strains and sadly ends a lot of marriages, and a lot of times it doesn't work or the couple runs out of money to afford another round to even get that far to find out. I understand the desire to have one's own biological children, but DNA isn't everything, and if it can't happen, there are other options. DNA doesn't make one a better person. It doesn't determine who a person will be in life. Biological children vs. adopted children aren't these magical perfect beings.

I feel that if a couple feels in their heart that they want more than anything in life to be parents, why then is adoption or other methods for having children, not on the table? A child will inherit the lessons and mannerisms, and habits that a parent teaches them. If that lesson is love, they will feel it. If it is hard work, they will know that. If it is how to be a good person, they will exhibit that through a parents teachings.

I don't see why a woman in particular needs to feel bad or shame for not pushing the kid out herself. Physically having a child doesn't make one a good parent, it's what you do all throughout that kids life. If someone is saying to a couple they are somehow less than for not having a child themselves, that couple definitely needs to associate with better people. I just feel it's sad that some people who claim they want children so bad, don't pursue other methods if one doesn't work. I feel like a lot of kids who need homes are missing out.

[Barrabus_the_Free]

People want *their own* kids. Kids that have *THEIR* DNA and absolutely *are* related to them.

Not some castoffs from the local high school slut who got knocked up at a party and doesn't know who the baby's father is, or a crackhead who finally got her kid taken away after the 8th time she tried to sell the baby for crack.

Having your own kid reduces the chance of getting one that's seriously fucked up, unless both parents have genetic disorders or the mother smokes, drinks, or does drugs while pregnant. You adopt, who knows what you're getting. It's not even like getting a dog from the pound, because at least at the pound they check the dog's attitude, see how it reacts to other dogs, give it a medical screening, etc. With adoption, you get a baby and it hasn't had any kind of screening. And a dog from the pound can be returned. Adoption, not so much. So you get a kid with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome or a crack addition, with a severely damaged brain, who will never be able to function like a normal person, and you're stuck with it.

Yeah, no. Fuck that.

[lumos]

Wow Barrabus, tell us how you really feel.

[Barrabus_the_Free]

@lumos

I always do. There's no reason to sugarcoat things.

[lumos]

I know. I was being sarcastic.

[Listening5]

lol this guy needs to get best answer, no fucks given haha

[lumos]

I agree that infertile parents should be more open to the idea of adoption. It's kinda crazy that some would rather spend thousands and thousands on failed attempts at getting pregnant, rather than helping a child clearly in need of a loving home. I understand that having a child that's genetically yours can feel more "fulfilling" in some way, but if you truly dream about becoming a parent, I don't see how being related by blood to your child makes it any more special.

[Prof_Don]

people still want to pass on their own bloodlines primarily, so most people will do anything possible to conceive with their own DNA, before giving up on that idea

[lumos]

@Prof_Don I sorta understand that but still think it's silly. If they're nearly infertile but manage to get pregnant thanks to a one in a million chance, they're merely passing on this problem. I just think adoption makes more sense, and going above and beyond just to try to get your own kids because "lol blood", I'd actually consider that kinda selfish.

[Cuteusernamehere]

Well I can tell you I was told as a teenager that it wouldn't be long before I would most likely never be able to have children. so I did the most irresponsible irrational thing any person could do and purposely became a teen mom by no longer trying not to end up as one of those statistics I hated.

Granted it definitely wasn't the right time but my internal clock was breaking and before it was completely broken I wasn't missing my chance.

Fertility treatments are ridiculously expensive. Private adoption averages at about 30k with NO complications.

I am very familiar with foster care as I am technically a foster parent but never took in any children. And know many foster parents that did. It's a heart wrenching experience. You give your all to these broken children to try and mend their little hearts and spirits with as much unconditional love as you can all the while knowing they are not yours and can be taken from you at any time. And that's often the way it goes. Natural parents and families have superior rights to placement then anyone else. Most children you foster will not be with you more then a year before the parents regain custody, most likely to lose it again anyway. adoption through foster care is much less expensive but takes forever and you WILL end up not being able to adopt at least one child you thought you were going to as parents will change their mind on signing off rights, or birth fathers are found etc.

people that want to start families and can't Through exploring all other options to have their own child are generally older and don't want to invest the average 3-5 years for a foster to adopt to be completed to potentially have to start all over again.

Even with older children where adoptions are usually much quicker the children know your not their mother/father and there's always going to be that missing bond. I'm not implying adoptive parents are not good parents or less in anyway but they missed out on some very important bonding time and milestones in the child's life. It's not something that can be made up for. People that want children that badly want the entire experience of being the parent and that includes the coliky crying baby all nighters and the terrible twos.

It takes a very special strong person to be able to foster to adopt and most people just don't fit the bill.

[freakyzeaky]

I know I one day want to have a biological child of my own. I know I am not getting any younger, but I want to meet the right person to have children with; a woman who is compatible and in love with me, loyal enough to stick it out with me through and ups and downs, and the ability to communicate and work towards improving ourselves and being the best possible partners and parents.

When it comes to biological children, it isn't so much the DNA or the passing of genes, it is the bond that is created by coming together with another person and the feeling you get when you know you created this new life with that person. At least, that is how many prospective parents imagine it. Perhaps it is the romantic notion that creating new life is magical, it is a natural wonder, to know you have taken part in that with a person you love so deeply, it seems to be the greatest calling for a human being. For the woman, knowing that baby was growing inside of you, knowing it was a part of you, that has to be both a tremendous and a terrifying feeling. For the man, seeing yourself in your child, the features, the traits, the reflection of life itself, and to be there to support the mother, it has to feel inspiring so many parents.

Of course parenting itself is no walk in the park. It takes work, dedication, empathy, self-sacrifice, and for many people the experience is transformative and pushes them to strive for more. There is a new found reason to reach self-actualization, to correct mistakes, to become that stronger, better version for the sake of the family.

All this said, I would be open to adoption if fertility was an issue. The only problem with it is that many people who adopt wait until they are financially ready to be a parent, but for many biological parents (those who "get" pregnant"), they weren't ready for one reason or another. Maybe it was because they didn't expect it; birth control failed, condom broke, etc. Whatever the reason, not being "ready" forces them to transform. The adopting parents don't need to heed this call to action, they simply wait for the right moment to adopt or when they feel like they can handle this burden. It is a calculated move. Not saying this is a bad thing, most parents want to feel like they are ready before having a child. I just wanted to point out that difference. Some people might put off having a child or adopting because they may never feel 100% ready.

[jp612612]

You know, I read this MyTake and I have to say that it comes off as quite ignorant. For one, the waiting lists for adoption are all really, really long so your implying that people don't want to adopt is completely incorrect given that the waitlists show that they obviously do. Secondly, when you talk about "kids who need homes", the only thing I can imagine that you're referring to are older kids (like say, 3 years old and up) as it's true that people generally don't adopt those kids. You talk about the kid inheriting lessons, learning love etc. as if it's that easy, but the truth is that any kid who is put up for adoption after living a couple years is going to have some serious issues and I don't blame parents for not wanting to take on that responsibility.

I grew up in a rural town and there was a family that made it a point to adopt older kids. Until my family moved in, they were actually the only source of non-white kids into the community. Anyway, this couple must have adopted 10+ kids while I lived there and while a couple of the kids turned out fine, most of them were pretty messed up. One of them even still even calls up her adoptive parents every night to curse at them and tell them how she's going to kill them. You know what I think is amazing? They still answer the phone every time she calls on the off chance that she's calling because she needs their help.

[myTake Owner]

What I actually said was... if a couple desperately wants to be parents, and IVF has not worked for years upon years, then why not entertain the options of adoption, surrogacy, fostering, or donation (that's a bit long in the tooth for one title, but it's what I actually said in the take). All kids in an adoption agency need a home no matter their age and just as you've pointed out some can be messed up, tu chez; having biological children is no guarantee you'll have angel children either. That is a risk every parent takes when they decide to be parents, and I never said being a parent in any form was easy. I point out that you can parent a child whether they are biological or not and that DNA alone does not make you a good parent or them a good kid.

[Anonymous]

Almost every couple who deals with infertile does consider those things.

You may not realize that adoption costs more than IVF. Seriously. And it's challenging, and has huge wait lists, and is not a sure thing.

Surrogacy and donation are... essentially more complicated forms of IVF. Most people 'dealing with infertility' have not been given a 'one of you is 100% infertile' message. Rather they are 'having trouble' getting pregnant. So they try IVF a bunch of times. if they start seeing that one partner is entirely infertile, then they absolutely do talk about donation. However even legally, donation and surrogacy are messy - and can be very expensive. Surrogacy costs in the 35-120k range.

Foster care is not raising a child. It is short term. The goal of foster care is to temporarily provide a child's care until their family is back on their feet and they can return there. You cannot adopt those kids.

Eventually if it looks like the family situation will never improve, they may become eligible for adoption - sadly this is often at a much later age (on average closer to 10-11 years old).

While I think this is a rewarding opportunity for a parent to be, most people do indeed want to start with an infant.

[myTake Owner]

..."So they try IVF a bunch of times,"... that's 12-15K per trial not including medications vs. an adoption. I've never said, don't try IVF--this take is based upon people who have been trying for years or through several trials with no success. There are some couples that just flat out say adoption is not an option, but I find that hard to believe if they swear up and down the streets that they want to be a parent more than anything in life. There are clearly more than just one way to become a parent if one solution isn't working.

[hellionthesagereborn]

Because adoption is prohibitively expensive, far more then fertility treatments. It can cost up to $50,000 dollars to adopt a child. If you go the foster care route it can be only a couple of thousand but you don't get a say in what child you get and quite frankly most are older and have a host of issues as they are in foster care for a reason (usually abuse). Their is plenty of reasons why people don't adopt, it has nothing to do with them being bad people or being selfish. Further more the child will not inherit the persons mannerisms or traits. Biology is extremely influencial in how a person behaves and that can increase conflict with the parent and child if this is not understood. We are not blank slates, their is a reason why the DNA of one cell is 2 meters long, its not because it just sits their doing nothing. Now I know some people don't want to hear this but its the truth, I myself am adopted and while I do have some similarities with my adopted family (because yes environment does influence us) I have a lot more traits that are nothing like them (I'm the only introvert in the family for instance and I am also more inclined towards solitude while they are far more social (I have biological relatives who have the same proclivities as I)). And yes I also was in foster care and came to my family with many many issues due to the abuse I faced, it took years, decades really, for me to overcome that and not every one is prepared for that kind of a mess.

[WalterRadio]

Adoption can cost more than fertility treatments, sometimes two or three times as much.

I have noticed a change in adoptions over the decades.

I have two cousins that were adopted, and we love them as any other part of the family.

But that was before abortion was legal. In those days, unmarried girls who got pregnant (the pill was not everywhere then either) quickly got married or went to visit Aunt Mae for 9 months, followed by an adoption.

The bio parents were normal people.

Over the past 20 years, there has been a huge change. Normal girls are smart enough not to get pregnant in the first place, have an abortion, or foolishly keep the baby. It has become socially (and wrongly) acceptable for there to be single mothers. The percent of pregnancies of unmarried women that result in adoption has dropped dramatically.

The ones that are adopted out are not smart enough not to get pregnant or an abortion, but are not foolish enough to keep the baby. This tends to be a lot of druggie moms.

The result is that the children often have problems inherited from their bio parents. I have seen this personally, where a couple I know adopted an infant, raised her beautifully, then she became a criminal. It turns out her bio mom was raped and was not smart enough to get an abortion. She inherited her mother's stupidity and her father's violence.

[NearlyNapping]

I understand the point, and agree with much of it, but I disagree with parts also.

We are biologically programmed for procreation. Some people would even argue that the entire purpose of life is to continue life and pass on our genes. Aside from philosophical ideas, it's clear we are strongly driven to procreate.

For a lot of people, adoption is on the table. There is a long waiting list to adopt. Obviously that waiting list gets shorter as the kids get older. I would not personally want to take on an older kid. It's just too high risk.

Yes, those kids need a home. But what about me? I don't want to take a high risk chance of what may be pure hell. As near as I can tell, that's not some very remote low odds thing. It's a very real possibility. Is that selfish? Yes it is. I'm quite willing to help a kid, but I'm not going to risk it all. I learned a long time ago that we can't carry the world on our shoulders. We just can't.

I also think you are giving too much weight to nurture vs nature. I think the genetics play a much bigger role than you are implying. Being part of the "triad" myself, an adoption forum was the very first place online that I hung out (before there was a web). I've heard hundreds of stories from all three sides. One commonality with reunion stories is how much alike the child and birth parents are, even with a child separated at birth.

But it all boils down to biology. It's very deeply embedded in people to pass on their genes. It's the entire reason that males and females exist.

[Pyrofox]

As someone who is adopted for the reason of the first part of this mytake I'd say with confidence my parents who adopted me. Are amazing and the thought of the unwillingness to adopt is just an excuse really to cut off a relationship or get distant. And to me just seems like a really immature choice.

I'd be willing to stick with someone and do adoption because I know what its like to be adopted and I know I would never have been able to experince what I have. If I didn't have the adoptive parents I have now. I'd be more than happy to do the same for a kid who needs to be adopted. I'd say those who aren't willing to adopt are more than likely too closed minded and from the start shouldn't be parents.

As 70% of growing up is being open to experiences. And closed minded biased parents only hinder that.

[goddess87]

Yes, but adoption is also extremely expensive unless you adopt a kid you've had from foster care. Which won't be a baby like most want. sadly most kids in foster care and in orphanages never get adopted and end up being the victims of neglect and abuse. Adoption is a huge money game and the children are the ones that suffer.

Adoption costs between $20000-40000 while an IVF cycle costs around $12000 to complete. So you can clearly see which is more expensive. You are essentially buying a child.

[myTake Owner]

12 K is on the low end, and often doesn't include medications, and additional appointments, however, I'm not suggesting IVF should not be tried. By all means... my question more has to do with, if you're at a stage where you've tried and it's failed round 2, 3, etc that 12k+ only mutiplies to up and over an adoption rate. IVF for those women under 35 in good health, is only successful 40% of the time, and that's not round one and done, that's all told. And the numbers only get worse the older the potential mother is. At least with adoption, the child is there, and the rest is paper work and a wait. It's all screwy though, I agree, in how much any and all of this costs and how there are scams in both industries, and people to definitely prey on couples want for a baby.

[Wonderer89]

You know, things like this seem crystal clear and common sense - until you’re actually in the position to have to make these choices.

There are pro’s and cons for adoption... finding a birth mother willing to give up their baby for adoption has the potential for that offer to be retracted, the emotional heartbreak, wasted time and spent money all for naught. Adopting older children comes with potential emotional detachment and behavioural and identity issues.
And the cost.. which can be just as high as fertility treatment but you’re just waiting. You can’t do anything, you just wait for someone to choose you.

While there does need to be an end point for fertility assistance, every couple makes that choice for themselves. It’s not an easy process, the entire thing is so fucking hard but the desire is deep.
It’s just not as simple as saying we should just adopt

[myTake Owner]

I KNOW it's not easy, and as I told someone else, I also mentioned fostering, surrogacy, sperm donations, etc. as viable options to those that have exhausted the option of IVF. The point is not that they have to adopt, it's that when IVF has been exhausted, there are other options if a couple truly desires above all else to be parents--if that truly is the most important thing, that is when I understand a bit less how they can essentially give up because one option didn't work. Knowing that drive and desire, there are other choices available. As far as IVF, you're waiting as well for something to happen, and if it doesn't, you're waiting again on doctors, on money, on treatments, on time off, on a potential child that does not yet exist, to come into your life. All equally difficult, but I only say any of this to say, DNA isn't everything if one truly wants to be a parent... there are other options out there that can get the desired end result of having a child.

[Wonderer89]

Surrogacy and sperm donations are still assisted fertility treatments with the same costs as ivf or iui unless a couple is willing to do it the old fashioned way.
The other choice is fostering; leading to potentially giving back a child you’ve bonded with or adoption as I’ve already gone through negatives.
People have their own personal reasons for stopping when they do and whatever options they choose to try, my point is that being judged for it just adds to an already difficult situation.
Ivf isn’t just waiting for years on end like adoption is. There is getting your body ready, your investigative procedures done, trying any pre-meds to regulate a natural cycle, then an antagonist cycle, using any frozen embryos if that cycle isn’t successful, and repeating. I’m ALWAYS doing something towards my dream, while my phone hasn’t rung for a potential adoption in 7 months despite regular follow ups from me.
DNA isn’t everything, it’s not even a major factor but there are reasons for both

[myTake Owner]

It is the lucky person who can personally afford to keep going after 2, 3, 4 failures with IVF. Most can only do one, or two if they are lucky, but at some point, I think adoption should at least be considered by those that feel completely unfulfilled in life by not having children. If this is a "problem," there are other solutions including other fertility methods that I think should at least be considered by those who have not been successful with IVF treatment. If you can't afford another round of IVF, you will still be waiting years on end, so the differences are slim in those regards.

[Wonderer89]

Adoption can cost the same, if not more than a cycle of IVF with the same unsure results.
Other fertility treatments are limited to particular diagnosis and are a precursor to IVF. Where they can be done instead of; they are and IVF is the last resort, be that with a donor or surrogate. No one goes straight to ivf if there are other medical options available.

[Wonderer89]

I understand that you’re just saying “why aren’t people open to it” but you’re missing the point that people are open to it, but it comes with just as many challenges, cost and success rates as fertility treatment. For ivf there is a 70% chance of having a live birth in 3 cycles where bonding is almost guaranteed due to our own DNA and pregnancy.
For adoption 62% of children in private adoption are newborns and the wait is between 2-7 years to be chosen as well as risking that there won’t be a connection - which as foreign as that personally sounds to me does happen - as well as up to the same cost of ivf.

People weigh up what risks they’re willing to live with, none of it is simple or one dimensional

[Anonymous]

I agree with you. There are so many kids in this world who need a home and family. Adoption should be more considered even by parents that don't have any problem to procreate. I also truly believe that the title of parents is given to the two people who raise a kid, it has nothing to do with a biological connection.

[heclinybad]

That’s all very humanitarian and sense of community and all but ahyo forgetting why you want to have kids in the first place may some people are so based as to satisfy their feelings and adopt but you want a child with that person you love ❤️ so much. That what gives you the desire to procreate. Me I wanted kids from since I was 14 I could tell you the very day I felt and desired it. So I read and looked up online all about it and watched maybe more than a few of those jerry springer or whoever episodes. But the fact remains I want a child from or with that girl I find irresistible. some people are so desperate as to mother or father other people children but what happens when they finally get their own?

[ASEXY]

People are more likely to be nicer to their own biological children than some adopted child. This is also true for animals too. Most people have this instinctive drive to have their own children. Did you honestly think that this kind of rationality would override that?

[Annie_Mosity]

Sorry but your analogy doesn't work. People don't give birth to their own animals. All are adopted. Adopted parents do not love their children less. They had to fight for the right to raise that child, not just forget to use a condom. The number of children who are abused and abandoned by their natural parents compared to those abandoned by adopted parents will be significantly higher I bet you. The issue is not love, it's vanity. Making a thing together... instead of re-using someone else's cast off DNA.

[curiousnorway]

@ASEXY, no, it's not true. I'm adopted myself and I'm loved. I've a good relationship with my family and I knows about people who lives with their biologically parents where they dislikes them for being bad abusive parents.

[ASEXY]

@Annie_Mosity What I meant is that animals are nicer to their own children than another animal's child... This is why male lions kill the cubs that aren't theirs. Step parents have been known to be abusive as well. People who don't want to adopt know that their not going to be adoptive parents. I was just explaining of what humans and the animal kingdom are generally like... Don't like it? Too bad. It's reality.

[ASEXY]

@curiousnorway that's nice. I said "more likely." Not 100% of the time. Adoptive parents are usually different people from the rest of the population, they are more "open hearted" compared to people who don't put "adoption on the table"

[Kuraj]

"I feel like a lot of kids who need homes are missing out."

Grown up ethnic children, yes.
But reality is that everyone wants white infants, which are practically always out of stock and you can expect half a decade waiting times if you want to adopt domestically and not some questionably imported little Russian.

Surrogates are a great option, and also by far the most expensive priced at 60 to 80k on average.

As for fostering, that is quite far from being a parent so it is typically the option of older couples who already had their own children grow up but still have resources to take care for more.

[Astoriana]

Anecdotally speaking, from what I have seen, it is men that have a problem with adoption more than women. They don’t want to raise someone else’s kid. For example, my aunt has PCOS like me, and in fact she has a much more serious case than me. She’s probably been infertile since puberty. Her husband absolutely refuses to even consider adoption or fostering.

[Anonymous]

Because humans are intrinsically selfish and greedy. No child will be as good as their own. I wish more considered adoption before spending thousands to have a baby. If you're infertile, accept that you're not going to have children, it's just nature.

In the wild, an animal that is deformed, infertile, has poor genetics will not reproduce and that's natural selection so only the best genetics carry on, whilst us human beings like to completely mess around with it. Infertile people having children through IVF just pass on the possibility of infertility in their own children (if genetics is the cause) but of course, they don't care about the potential distress of their child in future, as long as THEY get a baby. Just like people who continue to have children, when there's an 80% chance of their kid having a severe illness or disability. Pure selfishness.

[estoydorado1]

My thoughts exactly. I was just stating this on another post. I feel bad for people that struggle with infertility but there are some couples who think that they're entitled to tell other people how to handle their children because they think that they're more "deserving" or "nurturing" or whatever. Meanwhile all these children are being exploited and neglected in the system and those same "More deserving" couples are blowing their life savings on strenuous, futile, and dangerous procedures.

[ATuairiscean]

Great take - I am the same whenever I hear stories about infertility - There are so many ways to help/have children apart from biological - When I was growing up, adoption was very common in Ireland - I would say about 20 to 30 % of my same age friends are adopted.

[Nyx_85]

I think it takes a particular type of person to adopt. Either those that don't mind not having biological children regardless of whether or not they can have their own or those who are exhausted all other options. But I think the majority of people who want children (which is more than those who don't want them) prefer biological children because it's ingrained into them. If humans didn't want to reproduce and pass on their genes we wouldn't even be here.

[LaikaFreefall]

Now, I actually agree 100% with you... but playing devil's advocate, the drive to reproduce and have your own biological offspring is only literally the most intense biological drive we have as human beings lol. No big deal.

[myTake Owner]

Okay devil's advocate :) This is true, and I'm certainly not starting off with... adoption is the only answer, but if we're talking about 12-15k per treatment, and it's now 10 years later, and you're running out of money with still no child to show for it, I think at some point, a reality needs to set in. If one truly desires to be a parent, biology isn't everything.

[LaikaFreefall]

I very much agree. I think it would be nice to have a biological child. But Ik that if my girlfriend can't have children, I would be okay with adopting. And I'd love the kid every bit as much.