For the people that aren't well informed on ammunition, Radically Invasive Projectiles, also known as R. I. P bullets are projectiles that come in several calibers that have several sharp shards that work as several smaller projectiles in one shot, they were designed to separate and spread when contact with it's target, I'm not sure why they were designed and created but one can only assume it's to assure dropping a target, kinda wanna hear from gunheads but it's open for people against guns as well cause y'all can be victims to these as well if it ends up in the wrong hands, personally I'm going to own these and possibly put one in every 3 hollow points, in the magazine, or maybe put 5 hollows on top for the first 5 shots and the rest are these, usually if you have to fire morw than 5 shots it most likely means i loat the advantage, its most likely an extreme situation, many people have guns here and not everyone is sane so I think it's probably overkill anyways but surely seems like an advantage which is where i usually like to hover, So thoughts?
What are your thoughts on radically invasive projectiles?
This just a marketing gimmick. All that stuff about stopping power only matters in extreme cases that are extraordinarily unlikely to ever happen.
Yea, I understand "be prepared". But there is a point when you have to ask "be prepared for what? And how likely is it?". If you want to be prepared for every possible scenario you could possibly run into during your life, you'd end up living without really living.
Life has risks, millions of them. There are a hell of a lot of risks that are far more likely than needing full stopping power. Are you going to live your life in a bomb shelter? Are you going to be a germaphobe and live in a sterile bubble?
If someone cares about the difference between a FMJ and one of these rounds, then they shouldn't be driving a car which is way more dangerous, and way more likely than a round like this making a difference.
Muzzle velocity, muzzle energy, etc etc Do the physics/math on energy of any pistol round compared to a car driving at slow speeds. Do you drive a car or ride in one? Driving a car and being concerned about the round, is like jumping out of an airplane without a chute and wondering if your shoes have enough cushion for hitting the ground.
You're missing the point. The likelihood of running into that situation are extremely small. Don't say "but it could happen". Of course it could, but so could a million other things that are a lot more likely.
I don't know. The point of self defense is to neutralize the threat, not necessarily to insure death.
The best bullet for doing that is a hollow point. It doesn't over penetrate (pass through the target). It expands, hits hard, and is designed to expend all its energy in the target. "Oomph!" Like getting hit by a 500 mph fast ball. And, yes, it causes lots of damage. After a double tap, the fucker ain't getting up.
Those fragmenting rounds are designed to disperse like shrapnel in a body. I don't even know if they have the same hit power as a hollow point. They are designed to shred, damage multiple organs, cause a person to bleed out, make life-saving surgery very difficult, and cause almost certain death.
Yea I agree I would imagine it maybe goes faster than a hollow because of the sharp design of the edges, I'm sure it helps break through the air easier and it's probably lighter but I don't know about speed but finally someone that knows that they are talking about geez 😂
Speed in a handgun round is irrelevant. You can't dodge an 800 fps any easier than a 1200 fps bullet. Besides, you don't want it going so fast that it passes through the target. Speed only matters if you are shooting long distances.
Heavy slugs are preferable. They hit you harder, especially if they expand like a mushroom.
No shotguns shoot pellets, metal pellets, like BBs but out of metal and bigger and many at once, there's 3 common shotgun shells, birdshots, buckshot and slugs
Slugs:1 huge projectile
Buckshots (most common): several oversized metals BBs
Birdshots: they are like birdshots but normally have many more metal BBs but smaller, usually less effective than bucks
All shells types can have options with different gunpowder amounts and BB amounts
Cops probably don't use it cause society will probably be completely against it considering these bullets can probably be way more fatal than a normal round, kinda inhumane to have these rounds, cause let's be foreal cops aren't suppose to shoot to kill, they are suppose to shoot to neutralize the threat which sometimes required fatal force, they probably want the least fatal rounds cause they want criminals to have the highest chances of survival, well the country, not the Cops, many cops might join just to have an excuse to kill for all you know lol
@ChicoFromThe305 I'm guessing cops don't use them because they have less immediate stopping/dropping power than a bunch of other rounds and make much more of a mess inside the victim. Imagine trying to fire a single stopping shot with one of these💀 I can just picture a whole lot of internal bleeding and one nightmare of a job for the surgeons trying to extract all the fragments😂
What do you think drops someone, internal bleeding does, I'm surprised many people don't know that, if y'all believe the power of the bullet hitting someone is what imobilizes a person when shot then y'all agent seen enough people get shot, ever seen someone get shot and run for a while before dropping? That's cause the wound bled slow enough to give them enough energy to do that jog, imagine 6 open wounds in different organs, you won't even have the energy to jog from all the blood loss, of course that depends where you hit, if your aim is an L then it doesn't matter what round you use lmao
The wounds might be smaller but most organs can't handle an opening of any kind, the more openings the more effective it is "considering the fact humans organs aren't meant to be opened in any way lol
They're not going to drop your target any faster, I believe they'd actually have less dropping power than a standard HP. If you've ever seen one fired into ballistics gel, they definitely make a mess but most of the damage is close to the surface because those shards lose all their energy almost immediately. Meanwhile, a HP opens up a much bigger cavity at a much more effective depth into the target.
I'm not against them but I think they're an expensive waste of time, that's my opinion.
I actually seen those ballistic gel videos and I believe they are very inaccurate because gel is thicker than flesh, watch someone shoot a rack of ham with bone on it and look at the damage, it even snaps the bone
Most cases when a Good Guy with a gun shoots someone. It is to stop a threat. The more internal destruction that a bullet can do. The better chance you have of incapacitating the attacker. Those bullets look like the California version. All copper. Wouldn’t want to give a Bad Guy lead poisoning, now would you? If those bullets can do more damage. You would have to research the test results or do one on your own. One thing about those bullets. They may not ricochet as much as the HP or the solid nosed ones.
It's safe to say at the very least 2 shards will hit different organs at least and 2 wounds per bullet sounds effective, that's of course if all shards don't hit different organs, getting to the hospital, getting medicated and getting surgery all requires time you won't have if you are bleeding out of 6 different organs, let's not forget the Xrays they gotta take to know where the shards are 💀
I carry those and the original Black Talons before they nerfed those. I've still got a couple thousand left of the originals. Further down the mag switches to Hornady American Gunner, 115-grain Jacketed Hollow Point for heightened penetration, because if I'm going past 10 shots then I'm probably not worried about overpenetration anymore, or I'm having to shoot through a windshield or something.
Whole design is different from the one in the 90s. They just put the name on a new round after california banned the originals. Ballistics have evolved a long way. There's better/stronger stuff out now, but I start my mags with them because I have more laying around than Glazers. That's why after 5 i move over to Hornady, which will go through more stuff.
I think its kind of redundant, as it won't ensure immediate death/downing any more than a regular bullet. So its useless in a confrontation while defending yourself, because if the initial impact doesn't down them, they can still fire back, even if shrapnelled internally. Better off just aiming properly and firing off multiple rounds if in that much danger that you even need to fire a gun at someone.
Because a bullet without that adfitional damage is either goiing to instantly down/kill them, or it's going to let them fire back. Shrapnel of that size is damaging over time, they might be more likely to die in an operatong room during bullet removal, but its not going to increase the odds of an instant kill if you are already aiming at a vital.
A person does not die immediately from that unless its the brain. They die over time from metal poisoning, organ failure, internal bleeding. They still have enough time to fire back if the initial impact wasn't a lethal hit to the head. You can get shot directly in the heart and still be able to fire a round off, because body tissue doesn't die from blood loss until a bit afterwards. The liver, bladder, colon, kidneys, gall bladder, etc is your detox, so thats even longer survival time, and the lungs are air intake, so as long as they can hold their breath without passing out is how much time they have to fire back.
There's not really a limit on how many shots you gotta shoot tho, don't you think it will take less shots to kill someone with these than with hollows if every shot has an additional 6 additional wounds per round on top of the entry wound that's a normal bullet wound?
Yes they will bleed out faster but even after bleed out death isn't immediate. A combat strat must require immediate resolution to avoid return fire, a bleeding out or already bled out person can still pull a trigger for a short time.
Yea but who is gonna aim when being shot at, the closer they are, the less likely you are to aim, bullets will just be flying and I think if y'all both get hit with a bullet through that fight and you shot him with one of these and he shot you with a hollow who has a higher chance of survival?
Actually an adrenaline rush makes me focus better, its when i'm relaxed that my aiming would suck. I'm very good in emergencies and fast paced video games because of this.
Most people get dopamine hits from food or drugs or achohol, and I'm just sitting here buzzed on caffiene while playing geometry dash and feeling like Phillip J. Fry after 100 cups of coffee.
Gimmick. You’re paying out the ass for some shit that has the ballistics of a pine cone. A regular HP will do the job just fine. Hell, in most self defense scenarios, FMJ will probably work just fine too.
Fmjs are known to have high levels of penetration tho, besides what makes it so effective is the shards that go in different angles most likely piercing several organs at once with one round, surely has a higher chance of dropping a target faster than a hollow and maybe even a FMJ
There's of course always chances with everything tho so just how it can be highly effective it can be no effective depending on where they hit so I see your point tho
Find me a recorded instance of a self defense shooting where a guy using FMJ accidentally killed a bystander because of overpenetration. Self defense shootings are a 1/1,000,000 scenario. The moment you pull a gun, 99% of the time that scenario is resolved. The HP is not THAT much less lethal to justify the extraordinary cost increase. Those shards have 0 penetration at all, let’s be clear about that. At best they will chip or crack a bone. Also, they’re tiny. So the actual effect will be that your target will die…after bleeding internally for a few minutes. Furthermore, I’m not sure those rounds will even break up on impact. And if they do, how can you be sure they won’t just fly apart in your barrel. It’s like…bolo rounds, or dragon’s breath. Looks cool. Costs extra. Not actually a significant improvement.
I don't have one, I'm going by what experts say, they recommend hollow points over FMJs and their reasoning was penetration levels, personally I'd shoot someone with a damn missle yo defend myself, actually the more overkill it Is, the more of my attention it grasps I'm just sharing information of a general point of view cause I'm trying to be the least bias as possible lol
Most important things, according to what few relevant statistics exist are… -The round is equal to or bigger than.380 -Minimum 200 ft/lbs energy -Get a decent hit on the target twice The guy getting shot doesn’t really think, “gee, I’m glad that wasn’t an HP round.” He’s thinking, “OH SHIT, OH FUCK, OH GOD.” Listen, at the end of the day, a gun versus an unarmored target is basically a hole puncher. Bigger hole good. More hole good. I just think that these RIP rounds aren’t worth the price increase.
Well if we are talking about prices I don't think these rounds were meant to be an everyday carry, actually these shits will look terrible in court no matter the case also, I think maybe they were meant to be a one time purchase or something you don't buy on the regular like normal rounds, there's really not that much of a price increase, you gotta be either very broke or blow through rounds like crazy to be hurt by that price increase, also I think most people can make one box of these last a lifetime if they avoid trouble, these are surely not rounds you should shoot for fun or blow at a range, these seems specifically designed to kill no lie
Now hunting is a different story , still kinda seem like the wrong rounds for that but acceptable I'd say depending on the prey, but I agree you should be able to afford regular practice, I just don't think these are the rounds for that, honestly if I were to blow rounds I'd by steel casings, those shits are so cheap and unreliable (at least in my guns that weren't designed for them) in anything else but target practice 😂
And one last thing, always be skeptical of marketing designed to sound badass or tactical. THE ALL NEW SUPER DUPER SPECIAL FORCES BLACK OPS TARGETED THREAT ELIMINATION SYSTEM is probably just overpriced.
I don't think these are marketed as tactical, but I think price usually speaks quality, that goes with everything, ever heard of you get what you pay for? Clearly if someone knows something is good they won't sell it less of it's value, judging by price of a box of 20 is around 60 dollars I trust the price lol
Cause it stands for Radically invasive projectile, I know it's done on purpose but you should study human anatomy more, then you'd know how several openings on several organs can be highly fatal, it seems to me like many people don't know the actual effect of a normal bullet.
Several openings that are literally like…a millimeter across. Also, Warsaw Pact surplus, and milsurp in general is a testament to the fact that you don’t have to pay out the ass for quality.
Let's not forget surgeons might be surgeons but there's these things called hard to reach spots in the human body that even surgeons most likely stress about.
I was talking about wound damage and the time between getting an open wound and getting to a hospital with 6 different wounds on 6 different locations on the body, you somehow are talking about aim if I guessed correctly on what that comment was
No. I’m not. I’m telling you that the round is a gimmick. You’re paying $3 a bullet before shipping for a round that’s not as likely to achieve a quick kill, and has inferior ballistics. If he made it to a surgeon then that means he survived for a few minutes. In a situation where your life depends on it, you need him dead immediately, not a few minutes afterwards. He can use his few minutes to kill you, and then head for the surgeon.
You don't need him dead immediately, you need him immobilized immediately and you have a better chance of that with higher blood loss, the holes might be smaller but there's more wounds and what makes the biggest difference is that the fact that there's different locations, it makes the chances of survival slimmer
Do you know what immobilized means? It just means they can’t move. On what planet is a threat that can’t move preferable to a threat that’s not a threat at all because it’s dead?
On this planet, have you never seen immobilization from gunshot wounds bro, what are you talking about, in any threatening situation the first thing you wanna have is the ability to move, if you can't it's because you've reached a point of weakness that you can no longer move, which means you are no longer a threat.
A corpse won’t move, dude. Don’t worry. If it does, you have way bigger problems. Also, he’s not gonna lose nearly enough blood nearly fast enough to be immobilized immediately. You’re not immobilizing him unless you kill him or like blow out his pelvis or knees. You need to lose like a liter or two of blood to kill you.
Are you not thinking? Unless you carry a musket pistol you should have more than one bullet in your gun, 2 of these bullets will do more damage than 2 hollows, you are also forgetting to count the entry wound in sure which is the size of a normal 9mm
Yeah…unless you hit an artery you’re not making him lose a liter or two of blood in any hurry with a 9mm. Even with multiple rounds. You ever see someone actually get shot? It’s not like CoD where they just instantly keel over. In fact, unless you brain them, it’s very rare for them to just die instantly. Sure, you could use two bullets, and you probably should. But if at that point you may as well just hose the target down with FMJ or whatever else. My point is that this round probably won’t actually achieve a one shot stop, and you’re not likely gonna create enough blood loss to incapacitate the target in a hurry.
Unless you are blowing him away with a rocket most bullets don't kill anyone instantly unless it's in the head or heart, I don't think you are aware of how fragile a human life actually is to any projectile, you are probably thinking about how in movies people get hit once or twice and they still seem totally fine, a real bullet, which is what I'm talking about will do more to anyone than just a groan of pain, the moment someone gets hit with a bullet, they will either run to a safer location, which already gives a disadvantage if they have to retreat in any way, because most of the time they will have to turn their back or take their eyes off You, or they will tap out of the fight, you are also forget that the more projectiles they get hit by, the higher the chances are of hitting an artery as well, if you shot him twice then you shot him twice , with these if you shot him twice, you shot him twice with an additional 12 smaller projectiles spreading out in their body, don't exclude the entry wounds that are normal sized, I also saw a video of someone shooting a car door with a 45 and a 9mm and the 9mm went through while the 45 stayed lodged on the door
Car doors aren’t actually very strong. Cold War era helmets would deflect both. Bigger is better is fine when you’re just dealing with unarmored targets. You’re basically shooting a steak. Those 12 projectiles are literally like…fucking tiny, and may not even carry enough energy to get through very much flesh. The hollow point holds together. The round is a gimmick. It’s overpriced and badass sounding, but definitely inferior to a hollow point.
I disagree, considering the bullet will do the same damage as a normal hollow with additional damage I believe you aren't thinking clearly on what this projectile actually does, I might have to describe it more clear, when the bullet hits, it will open a hole the size of the caliber you shot, opening it's first wound on the organ it hits, then with the impact it will open and shoot shards in different directions causing more damage, all just from one round, it's not a 9mm shotgun shell, it's not going to spread after firing, it will open and spread after contact with the target, meaning it will enter in whole, and after the bullet already entered the person, it will shoot smaller fragments everywhere meaning if this bullet didn't spread it would he a normal bullet
The fragmenting round almost immediately sheds all of its energy, though. The hollow point goes deeper. You’re not shoot a hollow point but better. You’re shooting a weakened hollow point round that basically spreads a little more.
In the ballistic gel demonstration you can see the bullet travels straight for like an inch inside the person before it opens and spreads to smaller fragments
Oh yeah, I mean I wouldn’t wanna get shot by it, for sure. But what I’m saying is that you’re overpaying for something that’s not significantly better (assuming it’s not inferior) to a regular HP.
Well i believe it can be better because a bullet can misdirect, these bullets are meant to be messy, hollows would just be easily treatable compared to one of these I believe it can be more fatal not from strength or power, but from how messy it is, I believe that's what makes them worse than hollows cause all bullets can be fatal, but I believe a bullet that spreads causing damage in different directions causes more complications and the more complications there's to treatment of your health, The slimmer the chances of survival become.
They aren't like sabot rounds, those striations don't go all the way through, they're just black talons that got around copyright restrictions that way.
Oooh so it was sarcasm, fair enough, I thought you were insulting me because of the rounds I wanted, like "you must like in paradise if you want that shit lmao
I got a Smith % Wesson Model 66. It is powerful and it takes a while to be able to squeeze off more than one shot at a time. I went to a firearms course and the instructor thought it made a lot of sense for home defense. I do not plan on carrying it around with me.
Actually a.357 as a everyday carry seems like a good caliber to carry, I forgot a there is.357 handguns, since you are a fan of the higher calibers, what would your opinion be, if I wanted to get a deagle, should I get it in.357 or.50, it's not for regular carry tho, I know that not a good idea but the price difference is quite a lot, for the.357 it's like 8k tax not included and for the.50 it's like 12k at the shop I went to you think for the difference it's worth such a price increase?
The 50 cal. looks really deadly. One of my former customers is a cop and he showed up in my driveway one night and he had a royal blue cloth bag and he took out a 50 cal Desert Eagle. this guy is a real gun nut.
Well then buy what you want online because your local store is gouging you if they're charging 12 for a desert eagle. Anyone dumb enough to shop there deserves to get ripped off I suppose.
The name is valid tho, it sounds less violent than gun actually, the other kind of boom boom would be when babies take a shit which still kinda fits cause if you with a gun fight you basically shitted on the other person, it a different way 😶
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