Why I dated 'bad guys'

Why I dated 'bad guys'

Disclaimer: By bad guy, I mean any guy that isn't an entitled, nice guy/incel and may or may not have bad behavioural tendencies.

We've all heard it;

"I'm such a nice guy, I don't know why women only date bad guys!"

You just have to browse the sub-reddit, /r/niceguys, to realise how nice the self declared 'nice guys' are. But for the guys out there who really don't understand why girls date "bad" guys, I thought I'd share my own experiences of why.

They weren't bad to begin with

When you see your crush break up with a 'bad guy' and you find out he treated her badly, it's highly unlikely she started a relationship with him, whilst he was treating her badly. Poor treatment often comes gradually but in the beginning they're very charming. If a guy is abusing a girl and she's still with him, it's not because she's stupid or that women enjoy being treated badly, it's because they're trapped in a cycle of abuse that's hard to break.

They're confident

They don't sit from afar crushing on a girl, they go for her. They don't sit there feeling sorry for themselves, acting like some kind of victim. I like confidence in a guy, but there's a fine line between confidence and arrogance and if you date the latter, things don't always work out. I am not saying that shy guys don't get girls, but personally, I find it difficult to converse with a shy guy.

If a guy is abusing a girl and she's still with him, it's not because she's stupid or that women enjoy being treated badly...

You view them as 'bad guys'

because it's not you with the girl. If you're bitter, you're going to find flaws in the guy she's dating or view yourself as the better choice. I've dated guys who could be viewed as a 'bad guy' to others due to their reputation, but they have treated me perfectly well behind closed doors, so just because you think they're a bad guy, doesn't mean they're bad or are treating the girl badly.

They're not sickly sweet or too nice

This may sound absolutely ridiculous, but I have dated guys who put me on a pedestal and totally forget about themselves and their own lives. They become a 'lost puppy' that will say yes to absolutely everything you say and never stand up for their own beliefs. Soon you start feeling like you're looking after your boyfriend like he's your kid or he's more like a servant (which makes a guy vulnerable to be taken advantage of). Instead of the relationship being 50/50 where you both come to a decision, it's an imbalanced relationship where the guy is just agreeing with everything you choose and it becomes irritating. You want to converse through things, see things from their point of view, learn about them so how can you do that when he moulds into a clone of you? The relationship gets boring fast. When they say 'treat them mean, keep them keen', it doesn't mean actually being nasty, it means being able to live your own life, having time away and standing up for your own beliefs. No-one wants to date a sheep!

just because you think they're a bad guy, doesn't mean they're bad or are treating the girl badly.

They're not entitled or blame others

The extreme version of 'nice guys' (incel) seem to have an entitled attitude, that they're entitled to a woman for the slightest thing they do and act like they're such a great guy. 'Bad guys' are secure in themselves and don't blame other men for why they couldn't get a woman. They shrug it off, accept there's no spark and move on. They might think they're a catch, but they wouldn't get angry if a girl turns them down.

If you're finding yourself telling yourself that you're such a nice guy and girls aren't dating you because you're such a nice guy, maybe there's a lot more involved rather than just you being 'so nice' that's causing girls to not be interested. You can't change others, you can only change yourself so don't fall into the trap of blaming the world for your problems, make changes in your own life if you want to see change.

Hannah591 is a GirlsAskGuys Editor
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Most Helpful Guys

  • I've been the "nice guy" who was jealous of the "bad boy" who got the girl, then later on down the road there was a "nice guy" who was clearly jealous and because I was the "bad boy" who was dating the girl. As someone whose been on both sides of the coin I can say that the "nice guy" is definitely not really nice at all, and I don't consider myself a "bad boy", just a confident guy.

    Sure he'd be nice to my face, but when I was with my ex I noticed him staring at me and giving me bad looks when he thought I wasn't looking. I saw him watching me when I talked to female friends. I knew exactly what he was thinking, he was waiting for his chance to get me out of the way and be the one who "rescued" my ex from me.

    • Preach it bro. I had to beat up a scrawny asshole last week who thought I couldn't hear him mumbling all this shit talk about me. He was talking nonsense really just riling himself on how much he deserves my girlfriend and how I'm terrible blah blah blah. Any way He though he would lie to my face and say he didn't know me when I confronted him about it, so I gave him a bloody nose and a few choice words. XD Nice guys are fucking pathetic when they get into that jealousy stage.

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    • Also, I don't give a flying fuck if high school was rough on the kid. You DON'T FUCKING KNOW HIM. Thats NO reason to support the feeling of entitlement to a woman. Shut the actual hell up.

    • @VaIiant No way. Regardless of what he says, no one deserves to be punched or the victim of violence for that reason. Regardless, that other guy is a clear douche and if you can't see that there's something wrong with you.

  • Yeah I would think what your saying is common sense. The best relationships just fall into place, everything you do is right, and there is not a care in the world, you could not be more complete than when you are spending time together. As for nice guys finish last and blah blah, incel garbage, I don't know what to say, be a man and fucking grow a pair.


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What Girls & Guys Said

  • "They weren't bad to begin with"

    Ok, then your entire mytake is a lie. You never dated bad guys. What is the point of this article then? May as well write an take titled "Why I drove a Chevy, not a ford" and then in the second paragraph have a title that says "It wasn't actually a Chevy."

    The whole "nice guy" paradox is literally a badly name literally existing for no reason other then a way to excuse people from dating decent people.

    If there is no such thing as "nice girl" then why is there for guys? It's an excuse, not legit.

    " I've dated guys who could be viewed as a 'bad guy' to others due to their reputation, but they have treated me perfectly well behind closed doors, so just because you think they're a bad guy, doesn't mean they're bad or are treating the girl badly."

    You aren't special. There's no point to this article. Who you dated is just AVERAGE. Many guys don't fake being nice or are flat out assholes, both of which are extremes. Many guys, believe it or not, are in between. Decent enough to date, but not pushovers. It's like the whole "millinial" "Baby boomer" etc. buzzword crap. They don't exist. It's just PEOPLE. Born over a long period of time with a billion different personalities and grouped together to make billions off of books, articles, news, etc. using those words. It's literally hype over nothing. You dated OK guys. Cool. Want a cookie? I dated OK girls. They weren't "nice" but weren't assholes. Just the middle with varying like any other human. Don't see me writing a take about it do you?

    • Spot on, she isn't the brightest tool in the shed.

    • @UmarSpiegal Good to say some support on this. WAY too many would downvote me and start saying how I myself MUST be a "nice guy" for pointing this out and then get all stupid and condescending. Wrote a take expressing exactly what I said, BARELY was read and the people that did likely didn't have the patience or intelligence to read past the title. Which at least, was an HONEST one. But I guess being honest make me "nice"? BUT "nice guys" aren't honest though... OH NO... something doesn't add up...

    • Yep pretty much, i mean, to be honest i think people are taking this stuff far too in depth (especially in the wrong way). I'm only 18 so i don't have much experience with life, but i understand that the rule of thumb should just be to live for the betterment of your happiness as well as the joy of others. This chick literally posted a defense for dudes that beat their girls... I mean come on, how can anybody with a brain write what she wrote and have thought "Gee sounds like a plan". Just wrong in various forms.

  • So basically it's ok for them to treat you poorly at the end of the relationship as long as they are charming in the beginning and there flaws just vanish as a appposed to dating someone who will probably treat you right through out the entire realtionship yeah makes sense makes complete sense

    • You know this has always been my problem with women and that bad boy bullshit women find every excuse in the book and literally promote the abusive behavior some of these men do then when a dude turns around and does it there all butt hurt like the fuck and they praise these men as if they are saints and they are all saints in there eyes it's fucking retarded logic like I'm sorry. Then on the other end of the spectrum there are the nicer guys but no no no I only ever here neagtivity about nice guys like there all entitled or fake or there door matts like no they fucking aren't you can't fucking generalize a group of people some guys might be like that but just cause a nigga nice don't mean shit don't get it fucked up that nigga

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    • Ok I'm convinced you must be fucking retarded I came into you my take with an open mind and incel nice guy is just as fucking bad if not worst then the bad boy character you described if there are seriously females out here that are thinking like this then you people are worse then anyone could have imagined

    • Cause your promoting the bad behavior then complain and put men in jail for it WHEN IT US ENTIRELY YOUR OWN FAULTS

  • For someone to be considered a bad boy or girl, they would have to be considered someone that is the opposite to you and your normal characteristics. They do things that you wouldn’t do with no cares of the risk and consequences that could occur by doing them. So lets create an example, lets say you dont like to drink because you believe it causes the mind to think less and your scared of drinking and driving and getting caught by cops or hurting yourself or others on the road... but the bad boy or girl your interested in is not, they’re confident and willing to take the risk to do it anyways knowing those consequences and risk and simply not caring about them and once you take the risk with them you see you find you enjoy them with them and it wasn't as bad as u were thinking (they bring out the inner being in you and show u what its like to live and have fun) and make you realize you were analyzing maybe too much or being too much of a scardey cat or goody too shoes to begin with. The point is to be attracted to a bad boy or girl is to be attracted to someone who will take the risk that you’ve always been scared to do or wondered about doing but haven’t because you were scared or expected not to do by the means set up by society norms and expectations, or ones set up by family or even for that matter by yourself. I seen a lot of people dont agree with the the askers post but, the definition and meaning of a bad boy’s definition changes from person to person. To be a bad boy everything is taken into consideration... personality, the way he looks, dresses, carries himself, acts, the things he does and says and facial expressions.. there's serval things that contribute to it and as i said change from people to people. Her opinion is just simply her opinion... there's no wrong nor rights, i suppose 🙂

  • Can someone define 'bad guy' and 'nice guy'? I'm not sure I understand your definition of either term, might just be me. But, they seem like two opposite extremes. 😂

    How about a "normal guy"? As in, just a pleasant person to be around and talk to. A man with whom it's possible to form a mutually loving, loyal, and companionate bond. Both a friendship and a loving relationship.

    I'm sure there are plenty of good men like that out there.

    • 'Nice guys' are the guys who think they're entitled to women because they're apparently so nice, except they will give a woman shit for rejecting them and they're sometimes socially awkward. This myTake is more of a twist on 'bad guy' directed towards these 'nice guys' and why girls date these so called 'bad guys', but I touch on the fact that it's often their own perception that makes them 'bad' in the nice guys eyes, if that makes sense? I was in essence, and in some parts, talking about normal guys though, when I refer to bad guys.

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    • So you actually like ford mustangs according to your profile pic xD LOL omg ford mustangs? looossseeerrrr. (this is sarcasm by the way, I may or may not be mgtow so what if I am or not? Ik women like you want a reason to be condescending but it won't work on me. It's a good try, good effort, I guess, but nope, not gonna work, especially coming from a... xD FORD fan... LOL) Oh and I see the license plate. Texas. You really are making our state look shittier ya know? But wouldn't surprise me if you are invading into Dallas from some LA suburb. Borders are open so you can go back :)

    • And at the very least, I have evidence in what I said, as you do in fact have a Ford Mustang with a Texas license plate. Meanwhile, you lack evidence 100% on whether I am or am not part of MGTOW yet go ahead and laugh anyways whether you know it's true, kinda like laughing at comic strip that isn't really a comic strip, but a blank peice of paper isn't it? But alas, I expect a response of "TL;DR" or whatever insulting condescending bs you can come up with. Come on. Show your worse. At least it'll keep me from yawning.

  • i'm so tired of this bad guy vs nice guy conversation. nobody even seems to be able define the terms, including you, who only writes one sentence to declare what a bad guy ISN'T before writing a whole article to justify why you're attracted to them... it's all a load of crap.

    • So well said.

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    • "By bad guy, I mean any guy" yep that pretty much explains it. if people keep making these posts they're gonna find out how fast i go from a nice guy to a bad guy.

    • I said basically the same thing. Wholeheartedly agree. Ironically, when guys like us call this Hannah chick out on her BS, gals come at us saying we must be "incels" and nice guys" YET, I THOUGHT those type guys were friendly up front but aggressive later... were we not aggressive up front? Even more reason why this trivial BS is in fact BS.

  • What I just read is that you dated and stayed with bad guys because they had "good" demeanors. You didn't perceive them as being capable of hurting you due to their nice and good fronts, but they ended up shitty in the end?

    This whole GOOD GUY vs BAD GUY coin terms thing is giving me a headache. Most people want to give off a good impression, whether they are good on the inside or not. It is normal, as annoying as that is to say. I think a major problem is that people blame themselves for "not" having realized that someone is an ass, rather than trying to figure out how they can get out of the relationship and move on. I think both men AND women choose to stay attached to the fantasy of a not-so-great person when they are not mentally healthy enough to be realistic, or frankly they don't think they deserve better.

    If you are not okay on the inside, then you truly are vulnerable to being treated any ole' way by someone with their hands around your fragile heart. We need to stop seeing people as GOOD and BAD guys and start seeing them as people who are *good* for us or *bad* for us and our well-being.

    • I always said if you want to find out about how somebody really is before you date them then ask people of the same gender that know them (but not their friends). People put on a good act for the opposite gender but show who they really are to the same gender.

    • That’s a pretty good stance. Someone’s reputation says a lot about them, especially it being asked by someone not expected to use it in considering them. Hah, now I wonder my own reputation :) good point.

  • That would be the type of human being that I would want to avoid at all costs.

    If he was labeled "bad guy", then it is for a reason. Because one or several people have interacted with this person and defined him as being bad.

    the definition of bad is "of poor quality or a low standard"

    I am attracted to people of high quality and standards, meaning that I want to be able to be on a level, both intellectually and physically with persons that are able to challenge me. And that is not what I define as bad.

    If I see the picture taken as example of a bad boy, then to me, this is a creepy looking person par excellence that I would rather not meet in a populated street during daytime, even less at dusk in the same street and not at all in the same street at night.

    Both extremes are bad, incel and bad boy. I would rather have no relations with either one. I need a person that knows what he wants but does not impose his views on others or is afraid to voice his opinion.

    Both type of persons are those that eventually will find themselves excluded from many relations because both of them are unreliable characters.

    Mr. Nice Guy puts his girl on a pedestal while Mr. Bad Boy steps on her.

  • I'm beginning to wonder if maybe women don't understand men as equally as men don't understand women.

    • That’s brilliant. I hadn’t thought of that, but it actually makes perfect sense.

      The other night I was playing a card game with a group of all girls except for one friend of mine. We had to provide one word hints to identify ambiguous photos laid out in a grid on a desk — first team to correctly guess them all wins.

      I literally did my best at providing hints and one time this girl literally says to me in shock, “that hint was so overly logical that it actually... (short pause) made sense.”

      She couldn’t believe something could make so much sense that it was actually straightforward to her and obvious what I was referring too. It was like it was the first time in her life that she made a clear logical connection. I was flabbergasted.

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    • I don't think the fact he's a jerk equals him getting women. I think he simply found women who are looking for the same thing he is, that is, sex without the relationship and it works out for them. The nice guy doesn't want sex without the relationship and a wimp doesn't know how to handle a relationship or a woman at all.

      I once heard a trashy woman say this phrase and I'll never forget it. No kidding, she's been around an awful lot. She said women who are with jerks want something that's good for right now until the woman grows up. A woman knows a jerk isn't the type to marry. He's for fun. She knows the genuinely nice guy is the type to marry, but she's not ready for that yet.
      That logic kinda makes sense and kinda doesn't, but it has stuck with me.

    • But what if an ordinary guy wants to be used just for fun too? That’s the part about this that peevs me.

      Regular guys want casual sex just too. They can also be just as fun. Something needs to let this be known to the world.

  • I didn't have to read this. I think I know what it's going to say. I find it bizarre so many people are so into stereotypes. You basically twist what many guys try to explain into this stereotype. It does not comprehensively represent what many guys try to explain. There is actually a thing where girls may be drawn to dick heads. And no I'm not an incel which is the typical defense mechanism people love to use. What a derogatory socially acceptable insult to use in this politically correct, identity politics, me too, hyper sensitive times. It's okay to insult men than have difficulty with women for some reason. Bizarre.

    Basically your argument is:
    "I disagree with your stereotype of these guys and I believe in my stereotype of your opinion instead. Nothing you can say can describe something I'll listen to because I follow my stereotype only. Incel (A jab that means I'm better than you)."

    Try actually listening to some of these guys arguments without your prior opinions. New argument evaluation is a skill.

  • There has been some research made as to why some girls date so called ‘bad guys’. They say that they some had a good childhood filled with love and security, some didn’t. Sometimes the parents broke up or something else happend where the young child had to kinda “take care” of the parent and surpress there own feelings and be very considerate for the one of the parents, too sweet. So when they grow up, they sometimes fall for a bad guy who exhibit the behaviour they feel inside at times, that reckless behaviour they can’t let out, but he can and has no problem being bad and reckless, so sometimes the girls fall for that. You can say the sweeter and nicer the girl, the more likely she is going to fall for a bad boy at least once until she learns.

    • Respect for citing science.

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    • @Robertcw there’s no proper citations tho :/ it’s like saying correlation is causation.

    • Very interesting, thank-you for sharing! myTake is more a direct statement to 'nice guys' but I can see how my upbringing influenced the guys I fell for.

  • My problem with these kinds of Takes is that they're kind of like blaming poor people for being poor. "Oh, but you made bad decisions" says the rich person, not acknowledging that life isn't a one-way street. It's a constant interplay between the individual and its environment.

    E. g. with girls I feel bad for the shy, bookish girl boys don't really notice. I don't blame her for not being the bitchy "mean girl" all the guys are chasing, and I don't think the bitchy "mean girl" has necessarily earned the attention from guys. Life is just unfair. But I honestly worry less with girls because my experience tells me that things tend to work out in the end for girls. Guys are less picky. I've seen so many women date up. I hardly ever see the reverse.

    Anyway, my point is that I don't think a whole lot of bitter incels are born. They are made. Partly by nature, which can be cruel and ruthless. And partly by a society that has adopted unscientific feminism as the absolute truth, a society that has no problem feeling sorry for women, but never feels sorry for men.

    • true low profile girls can be "invisible" some times.

    • I specifically go for the more shy gals honestly, if any at all. Same with a lot of people I talk to really. Nothing like seeing somebody who looks a bit outcast liked yourself, going up to em, and making yourselves your own group. People often get so picky about who they talk to when and in front of who. Then they are "oh so shocked" when they get screwed over. If ya want to be pretentious and only like pretentious people, does it not make sense, that screwing over will happen? DUH! Outcasts and more shy people on the other hand often aren't aiming for any goals with a friendship, it's just there to be there, for the sake of it, as it should be.

  • I think this "girls only date bad guys" mentality, stems from the High School life.
    There's no denying that in HS most of us were very superficial. We mostly just cared about looks and reputation, and usually, it was the "bad guys" and "bad girls" that were the most good looking and got all the girls/guys. So these people that complain about the "bad boys" tend to have little social skills, they don't go out, they don't interact with others, so they still maintain this view of when they did interact with others, which was in school. Since they don't do much now that they're adults, they still think people keep choosing partners the same way they did in HS.

    I do gotta say I am a bit tired of the internet definitions for the terms "bad boy" and "nice guy". Now if you think of yourself as a nice guy, people picture you as a "Nice Guy".
    I know I'm an asshole sometimes, but in general, I'm a good person, and I try to show it with my actions, and if asked, I will firmly state that I'm a good person, ergo, a nice guy, but nowadays you gotta stay away from the latter term or otherwise they'll think you're a bitter incel.

    Anyways, I mostly agree with what you said in this Take.
    Mature girls don't choose guys that they know will hurt them, either physically or emotionally. And if a girl you like does choose a guy like that, then don't get mad, she's not the type of girl you should go for anyways. No respectful individual will agree to be part of a relationship where they know they'll get hurt.

  • as expected, mostly negative responses. just want to thank you otherwise, it's a nice insight in things you often fail to consider. gives me material to think about

  • You date who you want.
    That's all it boils down to.

    Personally, I think my best relationships were with the nice guys. Yenno, people who respect me and won't lash out to any small inconvenience, show affection and genuine care etc.

    Sure, the whole "bad boy" vibe is sold to us by Hollywood.
    There's a certain thrill dating that type of guys but it's like chewing sugary candy gum. The taste goes away kinda quickly and then it's just super sticky and messy.

    I prefer wholesome relationships.

  • I don't get jealous if he got to her first. But if I see red flags she doesn't, I worry for her safety. I don't define "bad boys" as the non-entitled. I define them as the suave predators that know how gullible a woman is at first sight, and don't wait to take advantage of her and set a trap. I have a natural protective "big brother" instinct that sees her as "sister in danger," and wants to intervene to make sure the danger isn't really there - or can be prevented from getting worse.

    I don't resent girls because they won't date me. But if they personally damage my way of life by starting BS drama behind my back for me, because they were too chicken sh*t to tell me whatever to my face, that I resent. Why? Because it's one thing to tell her off.

    It's simple: "I don't see you as someone I want to date."

    And I say: "Fine."

    Saying: "Sure, maybe" to something that isn't even a date offer, and then going behind my back and telling some third party I'm the Big Bad Wolf, so that I'm confronted by a misguided crusader out for blood over a "threat" that never happened? Yeah, that's how you get on my shit list.

    It's one thing to be romantically turned down. It's quite another when I have to repair 400 other relationships that she sabotaged with her speculation and lies, defending myself in the court of public opinion over the same horsecrap over and over, just to be able to go anywhere or function anywhere! When I can't get a job I want, because of her ignorant blabbery and reckless shooting off her mouth!

    And if she did it with intent to harm, I can't afford a lawyer to sue. Even if I could, I'd look like the "bad guy" for it!

    THAT, is a woman I would be bitter over. One that caused ACTUAL DAMAGE, and then walked away like it's no biggie, because she knows no one will ever allow her to face any real consequences for it! And the more I rage over the injustice, the worse I look!

    If you like guys that aren't whiny and entitled, good for you. All I want, is someone I can confide in. Someone I know isn't going to backstab me and make it impossible for me to work with others over prejudices and horsecrap that she starts for some BS reason. Where she takes her mental problem, and makes it my life problem. I'm so done with flakes like that!

    How much I'd like to sit a lot of them down, and point out all the flaws in their thinking, and ask them one question: "What do you have to say for yourself?"

    But I know they're too chicken to answer for the harm they've caused, so that would never happen. I just feel sorry for the next sucker who falls into their spider traps. Because those gals will never change.

    It's all fun and games, until I get hurt and blow the whistle. Then, I'm the "bad cop," and they go from 30 acting 20 to acting 3. Predictable, and sad.

    It's simple: earn my trust, you have a loyal friend, possibly for life. Betray that trust, and force me to have to defend my honor against some busybody third party, and your name is mud.

  • 🙄 ‘bad boys’ are bad for one simple reason. They have been treated badly in the past by a woman/ women. This can be their mother, girlfriend, partner, ex-wife etc. They are angry. As they should be! But don’t for one minute think that you are special, and you will ‘change them’. You won’t! Only they can do that! And until / if they do, every woman in their path will be on the receiving end of backlash. Not worth the trouble!

  • Bad boy is not the kind of dude tha will beat ur face up on the street without any hesitation for no reason

    this kind of a guy is i give u my example

    straight forward with intentions towards this one girl

    i ain't gonna take ur shit or bragging about other dudes on my shoulder

    im not a mindreader ifsomething is wrong u tell me , or if u say these words " you should know why im mad" i will shut the door and never come back

    im brutally honest about everything , if i dont like ur skirt or whatever i will tell you that first

    i stand up for my words and im not gonna say "sorry" if i know i am right about something or if we argue

    i am the way i am and if u try to change "me" into someone i dont want to be well im leaving good luck

    i like to drink sometimes and i smoke ( im not aggresive after alcohol but i really like to talk ) , if u do not accept that , bye

    i will not buy you flowers every day and chocolate bars , im not this kind of dude

    i laugh very rarely i do not smile often , i never smile while taking pictures , im not a clown to entertain you , im a serious dude
    if we do something funny we both enjoy yes i will laugh and do stupid things with you

    and i can go on and on but u get the idea

  • "They weren't bad to begin with"
    That's what they all say. I am sure he wasn't or at least didn't treat you as such, probably showered you with affection and gifts, but the warning signs were probably there, and your friends may even have warned you about him but you didn't want to see it. Once the abuse starts, you start making excuses for him. Then the worst part is often the girl then goes and dates another guy, has the exact same problem and wonders why it keeps happening to her,.
    "They're confident"
    This is probably the case and it's often the confident guys that are cocky which can become narcissism. There is nothing wrong with confidence but you even admit there is a fine line.
    "You view them as 'bad guys'"
    It is possible that there is a guy who is jealous who views him as such, but is he the only one or have your friends also made the same observation but you didn't want to hear it?
    "They're not sickly sweet or too nice"
    I see what you are saying here, I can see how a guy who is too obsessed would be a turn off. If it was as simple as this, that would make perfect sense, but he should also genuinely care about you.
    "They're not entitled or blame others"
    There are those who have this problem, that they are entitled to any girl. These are the ones who are the fake nice guys. However, based on the rest of what was stated hear I really don't think that is what this is all about.

  • Women don't have to do anything for men if they have 10 dudes waiting to hump her and give her cash and willing to fight other horny dudes. Women see this as power over men. Men are evil because all they want to do is hump me and when I'm old and ugly men are evil because they don't want to hump me. Imagine if you had 10 horny girls giving you wads of cash wanting to hump you right now and they are all fist fighting to get in your pants. Would you care about the women you didn't want to screw no you wouldn't because no human being is valuable unless they serve a purpose and that purpose is expendable. Women are baby makers and men are producers of goods. Women are only valuable if they are fertile to produce babies and men are only good if the can provide resources and security. Women have all this cash and dick just waiting for them why should they care what happens to any man even if he gets eaten alive by bears. Oh, he died oh well I have 9 more dudes to replace him yay me! Then when women turn 35 and old suddenly men are evil because all the men don't want to hump me only a couple do and I need someone to pay for my single motherhood lifestyle and medical care costs for my fast approaching geriatric aging and oh don't forget she has a loose vagina sagging breasts obese doesn't clean herself or her house doesn't raise her kids she lets daycare do that and she has std's. Still want to hit that sweet sweet dried up roast beef sandwich pussy? Think about all the semen she has had from all the diseased dudes at the bar thousands of times oh how I love to know how much dick she has had before me its so sexy. Good luck with that. Invest in female robots and lets replace women. Because robots are better than used up hoes.

  • yeah blue pilling boys and creating "nice guys" is cancer. but almost no other woman mentions how we play a role in it. especially the mothers. and how we dont teach them how attraction really works but only give them the be a good boy preaching.

  • didn't read but you're a young woman, that's the reason why you dated bad guys

  • As bitter as basement dwelling redditors may be, women do date assholes early in life. They are like magnets to arrogant frat style pricks. They piss and moan about how they want the complete opposite, but they actually want a guy who is exactly a frat asshole but with a secret "nice guy" side.
    This doesn't exist.

    It's only after female looks fade that they start to look for the actual nice guys and avoid the frat meatheads. But by then the nice guys are either married, focusing on work, successful enough to be looking for younger more attractive women, or have become jilted angry redditors. *Which you can't really blame them for. Imagine spending your life being the actual nice guy only to be constantly fucked over for the asshole, you not only get angry and vengeful, you discover that being nice isn't what the women want. SO women create the angry reddit "nice guys" by treating actual nice guys like shit in the early "wild girl" phase of their life.

    Only after the looks fade do women start to understand what these males feel, which is why most desperate middle age women start becoming angry hateful feminist. It's two ends of the same spectrum.

    Why I dated 'bad guys'

    • Is this some girls date bad dudes early? Because when you said, "It's only after female looks fade that they start to look for the actual nice guys and avoid the frat meatheads. But by then the nice guys are either married," I was thinking how they would be with women if those women only wanted bad dudes?

  • no dear its called being immature.

    nice is nice. boy is boy, girl is girl. saying a guy not really nice or nice but feels in entitled (motives) fits the description of manipulative person.

    bad boy, good guy, alpha, beta, introvert, extrovert. putting something in a neat little box what guy is or isn't will only cause confusion. each person is different. point being if you date a guy with immature qualities... what that says about her?

    i dont want to hear the dilemma between love and abuse. its not cycle. its being naive. you put your hands on a girl ( a no no, less she done wrong) then you are short of a man. plus your hurting her. which s guy voews not to do in a relationship.

    so what im getting out of this disrespect the girl you'll get rewarded. hitting ( jail time), confidence ( most seen as creepy), dont be too nice be sweet after you been an asshole.

    these are qualities of a girl who is immature trying loij fir soft spot in a bad boys heart. why?

  • Being nice =/= being attractive, end of the story.

    A lot of the problem has to do with guys thinking being noce means you become desirable.

    Also shy guys are less successful, lets keep it real, amd so are short guys, skinny guys, skinny-fat guys and obese guys.
    So if you are any of that, stop being that.

    • (ok by that logic) nobody gives a fuck about your opinion dipshit. (hey look at me ladies! I'm a mean asshole? Imma destroy this random lord fucker for no apparent reason. sexy af right? come at me bithes :) My dick is hard and ready and this little boy can sit and learn how men do it). Saying THAT is sexy isn't is Mr. Lord_Chilled?

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    • @errorgoodnameunfound

      You didn't get the logic behind my statements, because you continue to have an emotional bias in your reasoning.

      Illogical and emotional outburst! =/= Aka, quite mean.

      Illogical and emotional means illogical and emotional, not mean.
      What makes your statements unattractive is the fact that they are immature and lack reasoning. Not because they are mean.
      You could have said something "nice" in an equally unintelligent manner, and it would still come off as unattractive purely because it would seem unattractive. Like i said, being "nice" doesn't change it.

      Also, i am not rephrasing. I was explaining to you, the logic behind my statement.
      If i say, "it doesn't matter how hot it is, this object cannot be affected by it, then that means that temperature does not affect that oarticular object" (just an example, i know that almost everything is affected somewhat by temperature) .
      In this case, you did not understand the temperature part because i said 'hot' and thus i explained separately that coldness wouldn't affect it either.

      Hot and cold are just two parts of the spectrum.
      In this case, i dont know if there is an appropriate word that would explain the entire spectrum of being nice/not nice, and drive the point home, so i just said nice.
      Feel free to correct it with a word that would encomass being both nice and mean.

      The meaning and logic remains the same.

      Your personal expereiences cannot have any effect on my readoning because i dont know you. I dont know how successful you are. I cannot take anecdotal evidence of someone who is argueing against me as a fact.

      But i will tell you that whatever success, or lack thereof you have, has nothing to do with how noce you are.

      I know plenty of mean dudes that mistreat the hell out of women that have plenty of womem all over them. Thats my amecdotal evidence that completely opposes yours.
      So what would that say, that both being nice and being mean positively attracts women?

    • @errorgoodnameunfound no, the logical conclusion would be to say that being nice has nothing to do with attractiveness.

      There are plenty of nice/good guys who are with women.
      And there are plenty of mean/evil guys who are with women.

      You would be surprised by how many extremely violent/evil men locked up in prison, even death row, have plenty of women writing love letters to them.

      Does that mean being bad in itself attract women?
      No, there are plenty of losers who are mean and nasty as well, and they do not attract women.

      It simply is not a factor that plays into attractiveness.
      Its not like charisma, good looks amd social status. These are qualities that attract women. And all of these can be possessed by both "good "and "bad" men.

      "I'm hoping that's sarcastic cause if not, I think therapy may be appropriate."-
      No im being completely homest as i said.
      Being shy, short, skinny, skinny-fat and obese are all unattractive qualities for men.
      And with the exeption of your height, and maybe shyness to an extent, all of it can be changed.
      Or, make up for it in other ways. Shy people will always be a bit more introverted than extroverted but you can still develop amd express confidence.
      Skinny, skinny fat and obese people cannot change their body structure but they can change their body composition and go much, much higher up the attractiveness ladder. The only thing that you couldmt help is being short. In which case you will just make up for it in other ways.

  • Yeah, bla bla bla, justifying dating the hot guy because he's hot. Yet when the said guy will slap you, insult you or cheat on you, whose shoulder are you going to cry on?
    That's right, the "entitled, nice guy/incel" you kept in your pocket as a spare tire and you'll use for comfort and free food until the bad guy wants you back.
    Then you'll repeat the cycle, again and again, until the nice guy gets finally tired of your shit, tells you to fuck off, and you'll insult him for that, if you don't simply try to fuck up his reputation because he dared pushing you back.

    • Yeah it super hot when a guy puts on a facade of friendship and then one day saying “oh actually I've been wanking over you this whole time, do you like me now that your soul is crushed?”

      Just be a man about it and say and take what you want to begin with and if she rejects you move on and save everyone the time and effort.

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    • @levantine99 Absolutely it's simple as that. Normal as in, not one of those extremes. It's totally possible

    • @Ponycargirl12 we dont know what we want. humans in general and us women more especially. also what we want and like changes with their inner state. thats what i meant not that simple. and that people have multisided personalities so you can't reduct them to binary dynamics.

  • I disagree with some of your thoughts. Most bad boys are actually incredibly entitled, which is why they think sex is their birthright. That's partly why they're so successful in getting it. By contrast, the guys who aren't getting sex actually don't believe girls want them, which is why they sit on the sidelines complaining about others hooking up.

    Bad boys are bad even if they're nice to girls. Just because a guy treats you like a queen doesn't mean he's not harming others. Bad boys are actually nice to women because they're trying to manipulate them into giving them sex. Bad boys are typically far more manipulative than nice guys, because they're the ones who are actively running game on girls trying to get into their pants. Nice guys are usually too timid to even try getting with a girl. And yes, bad boys were always bad, it's just that it's easy to delude ourselves when there's a strong sexual attraction.

    • This all this. Also, I think bad guys are successful at getting sex, because... well.. they're bad. They can just say whatever they need to say, do whatever they need to do, cut that wire wherever they need to. No morals is an advantage, but not an advantage one should want to have.

    • @SpearsAndStones I think that's true. Guys who try to be gentlemen--the best guys--aren't going to lie and manipulate just to get sex. Bad boys don't feel any remorse about hurting someone to get what they want.

    • wait... oh wow... that means... "nice guys" is just an invented phrase... if that's so though, why is it so popular... maybe I just question and critisize it because I am a bitter one myself. Yup, in fact, that's 100% the correct answer for any guy who dare speak against the term as that what the mob demands and the mob is god.

  • I don't think you're understanding the colloquial bad guy. For example, a rough cut biker that works as a mechanic is not a bad guy. A rough cut biker that sells meth and guns is a bad guy.

  • Interesting take, but calling them a 'bad guy' is such a huge stretch (as you mentioned). Pretty indifferent about it though. This whole concept of nice/bad boy/girl is so dumb that I pretty much view anyone who uses that context has self-esteem issues (whether it is lack of confidence or arrogance).

  • I have some doubts:
    1. Where is the man in your answer? Nice guys/aren't men, bad guys are just cry babies who abuse their power, so, where is the man?
    2. About bad guys don't blaming others, let me tell you something... YES THEY DO, I'm used to see how they pass the fault to other people, lack of respect and pass you the problem, and you are the one who really solve it.
    MEN are who doesn't blame others because they are more focused on problem solving that on surviving.
    3. They don't trate bad her at the beginning and being bad with people doesn't mean to be bad with you.
    There is a problem with that thinking, it's the Antoinette mistake, if I don't know anything. Im innocent, no, you aren't, if you are with someone who lacks the respect to others, or who push them too charge or that is bad, you are with him at time to pay.
    And if they treat you badly, it was your choice.
    I don't feel any pity when a girl who chooses one of them as partner is bad treated, it was her choice just, don't come to me asking for help, and if your boy treat bad to other people and they go for you, do you know how finish Antoinette?

  • Bad boy is usually an attractive looking guy with aggressive and cocky personality. He is manly good looking, he is dominant, he is in control, he doesn't give a flying fuck about anything... he is the guy that ticks all the check-boxes on a list of things that women are attracted to. Just imagine what a protective bad ass male that evolved trough 100000yrs of history looks like and you'll get a bad boy guy right there.

    And nice guys? A feminine looking, pussy manginas who in addition act like submissive cunts and drag girls around dates and buy them shit, while actual men are (at the same time) fucking them. That's a more pussy drying combo that anything else. It's almost worse than being ugly. Forget about being nice, unless you're already masculine good looking... just forget it. Of course, women might like you for your (cunt) personality, but they WILL. NOT. FUCK. YOU.

    Try to acquire what women are actually attracted to, and don't ever listen what they say. Ever. Often they will say that they prefer nice guys and whatsoever, but if that was the case nice guys would be full of women and they would turn into players. But that's not the case. So get in gym, make your face lean, bulk up, roid up, testosterone up, tattoo up, bad ass up... remember you need to get girls attracted to you and that won't happen with being nice.

    I know, it all sounds absolutely stupid to what women are attracted to - especially because society and namely the women are saying different things-, but from evolutionary perspective it makes perfect sense.

    • Sounds you like you've created a fetish porn fanfic. It's actually usually the "aggressive-acting, manly" types that are the first to whimper, sob and dodge when faced with real danger. Manliness-real manliness-is not about excessive preening in the gym because that's ever so metro. It's about having a will of iron, it's about being passionate and having unshakeable calm and resolve.

      None of these attributes having anything to do with how you look (again, that's a very shallow and stereotypically metro-leaning thing), but who you are as a person.

      And you know those "not give a fuck about anything" guys? Complete turn off. It's literally the ultimate form of passiveness; a supposedly fem trait.

    • @simpy3 you're wrong on so many levels..

    • @simpy3 Spot on! the dude who commented this is hella insecure, but sadly not wrong on all his points just the majority.

  • Very well said, very normal female. this is the stuff lot of guys don't get, keep pounding it in their heads...

    Question for yo uthough... for me my language of love is touch, I love it. I could go and massage my GF's body, back , shoulders, feet, hands, kiss, touch, etc.. all the time. It is what I want to do and give. My question is can that get to a point of seeming needy, smothering and become a turnoff, like I become the puppy? Or does it have to be done in such a way that says "you don't have control of me", I'm giving what I want to give.

    • I have this question sometimes too, because I like you. Use touch to convey my love often. But luckily my girlfriend is the same way so its not a problem. I just wonder if other girls feel differently.

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    • I'm glad you liked the take!
      I think it depends on how the woman interprets affection and physical touch. You would have to find a girl who is equally as physical and affectionate for her to know that you're showing your love and not trying to smother her.
      If she ever said "you don't have to massage me!" then it's ample time to say "I want to". :) That kind of happened with me last night. I moved away from my boyfriend and he followed and gave me a random shoulder massage because he wanted to do it and I could tell he wanted to be affectionate. I didn't feel smothered at all, it was a kind thing to do.

    • That feels right, ty!

  • Here is the difference between Nice Guys and "Nice Guys."

    Nice guys have no ulterior motive. They just treat people how they'd like to be treated with no expectations.

    "Nice guys" on the other hand are whiny, manipulative little pricks. They seem to think that each "nice thing" they do gets them a point on a punch card and when it is filled they get a free booty call.

    • This isn’t really accurate but whatever. They are the regular people who wonder why someone else was chosen over them when they did nothing wrong, over and over and over and over.

      Then eventually it becomes ‘man wtf is wrong with me.’ Then if finally becomes ‘I’ve done nothing wrong! What did he do better that I did wrong?’

      The answer, of course, is that those other guys are naturally more aggressive. That’s the uncomfortable truth of female sexuality as many red pill experiments have shown.

      People spin this truth all sorts of ways, including inventing the narrative that ‘nice guys’ are actually just a bunch of people who want to literally exchange good deeds for sex — as if that makes any sense at all. (It doesn’t).

      People might think this after investigating, wondering what the hell is wrong with these guys because they are doing fine themselves. Well, by then all you’ll see is the frustration and you might assume they were always like this, but you’d be wrong in making that assumption.

      The fact is they always had trouble, way before they ever knew they would have trouble. Way before they ever had problems or even tried. They just didn’t realize it until after failing multiple times.

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    • @Robertcw Dude, what exactly scares you about MGTOW and when did I sound like it? You can't claim to dislike it but also accept red pill theories and shit. What community do you think helped it become a thing? You realize I took lessons from it but I'm not fully into it right? Since I am for women's equal rights and I am not that into getting sex or multiplying (I am a anti natalist), many from it would reject my stance. You don't have to go full MGTOW, but you only hurt yourself taking "nice" guys as a serious phrase that exists. You can't claim to confront bullies while still using a phrase that they invented and want you to use. Perhaps you need to realize you don't need women for sexual pleasure. There's guys, there's your goddam hand, and in the future, there will be sex robot brothels hopefully. Why are women necessary for "sexual experience"? Hell, why is that a goal? It's not that big of a deal. Women can be great but also quite horrible so they are often just not worth the trouble just to get laid. Think with your brain dude, not your penis. Women control you if you think with your penis. You want to be at the mercy of boobs all the time?

    • @errorgoodnameunfound You have good points. I went 'monk' for the past two years myself after feeling like I rushed into my first sexuak experience in an unsatisfactory way. I want to set that aside right now and be an optimist about the good of interacting with the opposite sex going forward.

      I'm ready to leave the woods as it were. But, I think MGTOW is great. Lots of guys doing deep self reflection, practicing introspection. Keep on keepin on.

  • I'm 28. I'm just gonna say that your age is showing. Lol. I'm at a unique age now. It's funny. I can TOTALLY see the difference from a woman in her early 20s to a woman in her late 20s. You think like a kid.

    Looking at your take, you aren't even talking about 'bad guys' or 'nice guys'... you are talking about insecure or bitter men, which are entirely different.

    Oh, and newsflash... a 'NICE GUY' can have confidence, too. Confidence comes in many forms. Some people are publicly confident and some people are confident in silence.

  • I'll break this down into the most simplistic and realistic version.

    Psychologically, misery loves company.

  • You are explaining this to yourself not anyone else
    Your definition of bad guys is wayyyy off

    • @Muliaklian Go away and stop spamming

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    • I left it... in the dustbin where it belongs

    • And it's his opinion and many opinions, really, that your opinion fuckin sucks. Both can be said like it or not, as there's a thing called free speech that likely applies to this site being it's American and I highly suggest you respect that British girl.

  • Lol all I got from this was that it's cool to abuse women sweet

  • Hey, another entitled young girl jumping on the incel/nice guy bandwagon.
    I promise you, you'll have your negative experiences alright.

    • This is only the beginning. There will be more.

  • Ah, didn't know theirs only two types of men :
    (False dilemma: "A false dilemma is a type of informal fallacy in which something is falsely claimed to be an "either/or" situation, when in fact there is at least one additional option. A false dilemma can arise intentionally, when a fallacy is used in an attempt to force a choice or outcome.")

  • Girls love bad boys! I had to learn this in the worst way... i was educated to be a "nice guy", but i saw all the girls wanting the bad boys in school. I thought i was right because i was sweet and gentil and a gentleman, but the truth is that this is weakness, and women don't like weak guys. An advice to all men: don't be a nice guy. And the term bad boys doesn't mean an evil motherfucker, i am a very good person but the last girl calling me a "good guy" was 10 years ago.

  • It doesn't take a rocket scientist to spot the bad guy in the room, girls damn well know what they're getting into, stop trying to justify being dumb.

  • Who are the nice guys anyway...
    My ex was the worst kind of woman in private.. Controlling, nasty and manipulative. In public she was the sweetest person you could meet. Confident and amazing. The problem is you can't often recognise a narcissist because they're very good at covering up who they really are..
    People need to recognise danger signs of who someone really is.. Believe me abuse is very real. It happens to a lot of people.

  • The guy in the picture doesn't look like a bad guy, he just looks like some edgy chav prick who listened to heavy metal once and has taken it so far to the point of being cringey.

    • Actually I guess going by my definition of bad guy, he would sort of fall into that.

  • Get me a beer bitch! And don't stop blowing me while you're doing it!
    Is that the way women want to be treated? yes.

    • I literally just said this to a girl the other night after our first date. Except it wasn't a date because girls don't like dates they like to just be pumped and dumped on a dirty couch and then told to fuck off.

  • I would of just assumed preference honestly. Is it really that big of a deal that some women prefer the bad boy? Are we really at the stage where a partner preference needs explaining to sooth the ego of others?

  • Dont know what a nice guy is exactly... I mean I'm nice as in I would treat a girl like a gentleman... I would treat her with respect... Like "hi 😍... Your pretty... What's your name?"...

    But I'm not exactly a good person either... I've committed a few small crimes... I'm also not a nerd and heavily into hip-hop music and culture... So does that mean I'm a nice guy cos I would treat a girl nicely?
    Do you have to be sort of a asshole to girls to be considered "not a nice guy"?
    Or is a nice guy just a dorky virgin who treats females with too much respect?

    • I'm confused lol

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    • @errorgoodnameunfound and being from UK doesn't effect it much... It just started when I was 3 n I saw these 2 guys walking around the local shop with extra baggy clothes and baseball caps n stuff... I jus thought "damn that's so cool... I wanna be like them one day"
      So I started dressing the same way... Then I heard Eminem on the TV and ever since then I been hooked on hip-hop music and can't stop listening to it ever since... I listen to it at least 30x a day

    • Ah I figured dude. I've seen the Ali G movie before, lolz, so I have some sort of idea of what you likely meant. I had a small feeling you were putting off nerdy stuff as if it was a bad thing so I decided to troll a bit and test it. But good job and standing your ground, cause trust me if ya didn't I'd still be sitting around callin ya a dork. I do on purpose very ironically cause I am one myself, but it's hilarious to call people really far from stereotypical nerdy and dorky stuff nerds and dorks. Its puzzles people because its super unexpected and it gives me leverage in conversation, just in case they start to get mean or something. Ya gotta realize tho... if you've ever played GTA SA, the amount of super dorky references they make is EXTREMELY high. Honestly, the gangsta hip hop stuff and nerd culture goes hand in hand a lot of times, so careful what ya say. Remember, people like Jay Z at one point teamed up with linkin park, there's rappers that often LOVE superman and stuff. Even MLK Jr. the true OG, was a trekky, or into star trek. :) Everyone has a nerdy side. Can't escape really.

  • Amen. We need more posts telling nice guys what trash they are.

  • They say that women in abusive relationships, that end... will seek another abusive man. I think that factor plays a roll in it, also.

  • 1) They are bad you just justify it because he makes you wet and he's generally nice to you.
    2) Nearly all men are confident, plenty incredibly so! You like a man who is CONFIDENT playing women emotionally, not confidence for confidence sake.
    3) Sounds like your confusing kindness with co dependency or some other attachment disorder.
    4) Again confusing good well adjusted men with a cartoonish trope that you can attack and justify liking bad men.

    Seems like you are trying to convince your self of your own bullshit.

  • The title of your article I think is wrong , because, there aren't bad/ good guy or bad/good girl in life, the bad and good are different parts of human personality...

    • while you are right, but that's how the term is loosely used by the young generation

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