My Opinion on the Conflict Between Religion/Spiritualism and Atheism

[ADFSDF1996]

As someone who is Catholic but more spiritual than religious, I tend to see more things that go on in the Christian community that non religious or people of other religions don't notice. I'll be using the phrases "anti-theists" to describe atheists who constantly attack religion. I know not all atheists have a problem with religion that's why I'll try to avoid using the word "atheist" in this take.

1.) Just because Christians have similar faiths, doesn't mean we all see eye to eye

People always assume that all people of Christians faiths are united as one. That couldn't be further from the truth. In reality there are a lot of cracks within the Christian community. Some people might interpret the bible one way and others another way. For example some people might believe that pleasuring yourself is a sin while others will say it's not as long as it doesn't control the person's life. Some claim the bible says that the world will "end" others say it won't exactly but there will be changes.

2.) Not all Christians are zealots

Anti-theists always like to claim that Religious people(specifically Christians) don't use logic or "science". That's incorrect, in fact most Christians and religious people are open to using science. In fact, even the Vatican has a group of Astronomers working for them.

3.) Provoking actions

Anti-theists often accuse religious people(mostly Christians) of being intolerant, sexist and hostile but in reality most Christians are not like that. What I've noticed is that anti-theists intentionally attempt to anger Christians by insulting them. Yet those same atheists become hostile when Christians speak out against those atheists. I respect anti-theist's right to criticize religion but anti-theist should also respect religious people's right to defend themselves. You can't actually think that people can constantly berate a group of people and not expect them to defend themselves.

4.) Scapegoats

One thing that anti-theists do is blame all their problems on religion. They blame religion for starting wars. I don't know if they realize that not all wars are over religion. Wars are also over ideology, resources, territory, ambition and to overthrow tyranny. So it's very foolish to blame war on religion. They blame religion for all the bloodshed that happened throughout history. When not every atrocity that happened throughout history was over religion.

5.) Religion vs. cults

Anti theists often try to lump religion and cults in the same catergory. While certain religions use to have "cult like" elements many years ago, The truth is they are different. A cult usually has illegal elements, religions don't. A cult tries to force people to join them through fear and threats, most religions don't try to force their views through violence. Cults live in some kind of compound and control the lives of their followers. Yes I know there are some bad apples in certain religions who go too far but they do not represent religion as a whole

6.) Neither side has a clean history

Whether you are religious or atheist, you have to realize neither side can claim to have a clean history. Both sides have had their dark moments in history. Christianity has the mark of the inquisitions, while atheism has the mark of Communism(Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Castro).

7.) You can't change everyone

Whether you are religious or anti-theist, you have to understand that you can't force everyone to think like you, it's like politics or sports everyone sides with one side and don't like being labeled as the "bad side". If you're atheist, respect religious people's right to believe what they want, if you're religious then respect atheists' right to not believe. This is called tolerance.

8.) Not every religious person is a bigot

A lot of anti theists assume religion is anti-LGBT and misogynistic but in reality most religious people are not like that. Yes there are some people who use religion to justify their bigotry but they don't represent religion as a whole. There are a lot of female Christians, yet you never hear them whine about "misogyny". There are a lot of LGBT people who are Christian or part of other religions yet you never hear those specific LGBT people complain about a anti LGBT sentiment.

9.) Not every Atheist hates religion

I've met many atheists who simply don't believe that divine powers exist but that's as far as they go, they don't care if people choose to have a religion or believe in God, they are still open to having religious friends.

10.) A lot of atheists are actually agnostic

There are people who call themselves atheists just because it sounds "cool". I've talked to some of these "atheists". I ask them if they are 100% sure there is no divine omnipotent power. They then say "I'm not sure? I need proof." I then tell them maybe they are agnostic and explain to them what being a agnostic is. That's when they say "alright, maybe I am agnostic". A agnostic is a person who believes there is no way of knowing for sure if there is a God or not. So they are basically people who are not sure if there is a God or not. One famous person who is said to have described himself as agnostic is Bill Nye.

11.) No matter your stance on religion don't give your side a bad reputation by doing stupid things

Not that long ago in Germany, a infamous feminist group known as "Femen" interrupted a Christmas mass by jumping on top of the Church altar while topless with the words "I am God" written on her abdomen. She was arrested afterwards. This kind of behavior gives your a bad reputation. http://www.crossmap.com/news/topless-pro-abortion-activist-leaps-on-top-of-altar-during-christmas-mass-in-cologne-cathedral-8225/print

Overall, I don't care if you are religious, only spiritual, agnostic, atheist etc. I don't discriminate, just remember that forcing your views onto others will not result in a reward, all it will do is anger the other groups who feel that their stance is being attacked. Just let people believe what they want or not believe anything. There is no need to force your views onto others.

[SteppingOnRoses]

This is the best take I have ever read on the subject so far!

And same for those that want to attack relgions different from their own.

People should have grown up already and realised all it really comes to is loving one another enough to respect our differences.

[disgustingweebtrash]

Thank you for this mytake

[ADFSDF1996]

You're welcome.

[Intraluminal]

I am an anti-theist by your definition in that I feel that theists, by promoting religiousity, injure others. At the same time, I don't attack theists who mind thier own business.

So, when do I "attack" theists? I attack thier arguments whenever they try to present their delusions as being logical or based on reality. If they are honest enough to say that they believe in one-day men who ride eight-legged horse, and that's their belief, I'm fine with that. It's when they try to present their poorly thought out "theories" as reality that I respond with facts that they find uncomfortable.

One BIG issue I have regarding religion is that I am forced to support their religion, but they refuse to acknowledge that. If a religious edifice is exempted from paying taxes then everyone elses taxes have to be raised to compensate. That means that everyone pays for that religious edifice to go tax-free. Theists hate to acknowledge this reality.

As for your take, I disagree with several of your points. I will not go through them all, but one that is simple to refute is this one:

"certain religions use to have "cult like" elements many years ago, The truth is they are different. A cult usually has illegal elements, religions don't. A cult tries to force people to join them through fear and threats, most religions don't try to force their views through violence. Cults live in some kind of compound and control the lives of their followers. Yes I know there are some bad apples in certain religions who go too far but they do not represent religion as a whole"

First
"A cult usually has illegal elements, religions don't."
Has two problems. 1) the use of the word "usually" it would be more correct to say 'sometimes' and inasmuch as that is so, that 'difference' is no difference at all. 2) Religions have usually had the time to condition society into accepting acts that would otherwise be illegal, thereby making them legal. A simple example was communion wine. During prohibition wine was illegal... unless you were running a religion in which case you were exempted. Hey presto! You're not breaking the law.

All religions, including Christianity, began as cults. Religions are just very big, old, socially accepted cults. There is nothing that you can point to that can differentiate between the two unless you use "weasel words" like usually, frequently, sometimes.

[ADFSDF1996]

When I say cults, I'm referring to the cults that scam people. I'm aware that all religions started as "cults" but the difference is that religion as we know it today has come a long way while cults don't last long, just look at the "heavens gate" cult for example.

[Intraluminal]

I don't mean to be mean, but this is an example of the No True Scotsman (NTS) fallacy, which is a logical fallacy that occurs when a debater defines a group such that every groupmember possess some quality. For example, it is common to argue that "all members of [my religion] are fundamentally good", and then to abandon all bad individuals as "not true [my-religion]-people". This can occur in two ways:
During argument, someone re-defines the group in order to exclude counter-examples. Instead of backing down from "all groupmembers are X" to "most groupmembers are X", the debater simply redefines the group.
Before argument, someone preemptively defines some group such that the group definitionally must be entirely "good" or entirely "bad". However, this definition was created arbitrarily for this defensive purpose, rather than based on the actual qualities of the group.

[Intraluminal]

The coining of the term is attributed to professor Antony Flew, who gave an example of a Scotsman who in his 1975 book, Thinking About Thinking, wrote;
“”Imagine Hamish McDonald, a Scotsman, sitting down with his Glasgow Morning Herald and seeing an article about how the "Brighton Sex Maniac Strikes Again". Hamish is shocked and declares that "No Scotsman would do such a thing". The next day he sits down to read his Glasgow Morning Herald again; and, this time, finds an article about an Aberdeen man whose brutal actions make the Brighton sex maniac seem almost gentlemanly. This fact shows that Hamish was wrong in his opinion, but is he going to admit this? Not likely. This time he says: "No true Scotsman would do such a thing".
Thus, when McDonald is confronted with evidence of a Scotsman doing even worse acts, his response is that "no true Scotsman would do such a thing." This denies membership in the group "Scotsman" to the criminal on the basis that the commission of a heinous act.

[ADFSDF1996]

I never said every religious person is good.

[TheOtakuMaid]

1, we know

2. that is true but the catholic church is the Lord of Hypocrisy. you guys have a library of works that completely contradict your main book that you edited and made.

3. come to America. Christians have always been on the other end of progress always trying to halt it. not atheists. Christians. and a large portion is still intolerant and the ones who are not. is because we changed the social fabric that made them not

4. it is a scapegoat religion is not the blame of every conflict. however, in the past, it was the reason for at least 80% of it or was used as a scapegoat to promote war. read the bible.

5. sigh*, read up on Christian history you guy's did force people to join you for a long long time. Christianity especially the fucking papists did not become number one by the truth of their word but by the edge of their sword. the ONLY reason you don't know is due to the reformation and again us changing the social fabric that makes it frowned upon so you have to cherry pick.

6. that's a fallacy. atheism has no doctrine so an atheist killing million's is doing it for their own agenda even if they see it as spreading the truth. while religions have doctrines and many of which including Christianity promote such actions and encourage such. it's why you can only site 1 or 2 atheist dictators mainly from communism which in and of its self is a religion. while the atheist is stating a lack of evidence for a God that is it. it gives no stance on anything else. what you do with that knowledge is not connected to atheism as atheism is just accepting 1 possible fact as current truth unless evidence proves otherwise.

7. yes but we can, however, keep your ideals only in church and your home and your head. and bring education and progress many of you would wish to silence and stop. there will always be naive children who back an idea whether it is in service to some "God" or to some idea like Nazism. there will always be doctrine people follow and back because people are sheep

8. and every religious person is then a hypocrite as you doctrine backs bigotry openly I can cite it now. the ones who are not are cherry pickers and hold such a stance due to OUR work

[TheOtakuMaid]

9. no many of us do not "hate religion" hate is a strong word. many of us strongly dislike it however for what it does to people

[TheOtakuMaid]

10. any atheist who solely rules out a God or being is an idiot.

90% of us simply state the Abrahamic God is 99.999% false but still leave room for a possible creator if the evidence arises as that's what scientists do

11, true

12. mostly true

[ADFSDF1996]

1.) Doesn't look like it
2.) Atheism does have some hypocrites as well, so you can't really claim to that atheists are perfect
3.) I've clearly addressed this, Christians are open to new ideas. Most Christians really on science and logic as well.
4.) WWI, WWII, Korean War, Vietnam war and the list goes on and on of wars that weren't over religion.
5.) Again, I did mention that but modern day Christians are not like that anymore
6.) Sounds like a excuse. Stalin killed many Christians because communism persecuted religion.
7.) As I've said, you don't want Christians vilifying atheism then leave Christians alone, they aren't hurting you.
8.) That's a statement without proof, I know many Christians who oppose all sorts of Bigotry, go to a church and you'll see people of various political beliefs, both men and women and even some LGBT people who interact peacefully amongst each other,
9.) actions speak louder than words.

[TheOtakuMaid]

4. yes but i can list a large group of wars that were.. so saying for at least since the start of agriculture up untill the 1800s or so religion did not play a part in war would be a lie. it did many times whether it was the main purpose or used to incite it

[TheOtakuMaid]

6. hint the word is communism which is not atheism. you accept the earth is round yes? well if you went on a killing spree on flat earthers because they dont see the earth as round that no more discredits the earth being round or the people who stated it as such. Afterall there is no doctrine in the book of science saying kill those who think the earth is flat.

so your argument their is a fallacy

[TheOtakuMaid]

8. without proof? read a history book. plenty of christians do not oppose the lgbt shit yes but thats due to the current social climate and the enlightenment. even less than 20 years ago you would see the opposite why the actual Fuck did you think it took so long to get gay marriage legalized. sure as fuck was not us against it

[TheOtakuMaid]

9. well have we banned religion yet? no even in the most atheistic nations like iceland. while some of us hate religion granted we have good reason too you killed us for 1000s of years. mercilessly. for simply stating scientific truths. your a catholic you should know this.

[ADFSDF1996]

The point is that even atheists can be corrupted. Anti theists often assume they are smarter and morally superior to religious people but then you bring up communism and they try to disavow the actions of communism. With that logic, Christians can disavow the inquisitions.

[ADFSDF1996]

Nort Korea and Cuba are intolerant of religion.

[TheOtakuMaid]

7. we would "leave you alone" but there are still many of you wanting to push your shit on government and education we will not have it., you keep your ideals in your head. your church. and home where they belong and we will have no issues with it.

[TheOtakuMaid]

@ADFSDF1996 north korea fucking worships kim as a god if you knew anything of it as I you would know they might as well be a religion. cuba sure but again atheism has no doctrine to promote or condone such actions its simply the acceptance of truth. someone killing a person who thinks the moon is a hologram no more denotes the person who found out the moon is rounnd and a rock

[TheOtakuMaid]

@ADFSDF1996 while religion *the Abrahamic ones atleast* have a doctrine that promotes similar action. and has been used time and time again as fuel for it

[ADFSDF1996]

Most Religious people keep to themselves. they don't try to force the gov't to appease them. Maybe the fanatics do but not the regular religious people.

[ADFSDF1996]

Kim Jong un is a dictator, that's why he is "worshipped" but that's not a religion, that's closer to cultism.

[TheOtakuMaid]

@ADFSDF1996 better example. the Nazi's they have propaganda. etc, them killing people is due to that propaganda. and ideals.

there were Christians who were Nazi's but the Nazi's, for the most part, have nothing to do with Christianity and no one blames Christian nazis for killing people due to Christianity it was Nazism. there were pagan Nazi's *Himmler* atheists *probably Hitler* and even Muslims *the 13th mountain division of the ss.

but none of their doctrines' backed genocide, Nazism, however, did so Nazism is to blame.

same for communists. Stalin was an atheist yes but the reason for his actions was the religion *I use a term loosely* of communism. communism, especially in North Korea and many nations, raise the leader up to the divine status that it might as well be a religion.

however, for those in the crusades, the only thing to blame is the religion. as that's the only doctrine that promoted backing of it. along with the Inquisition and many other such conflicts

[TheOtakuMaid]

all religions start as cults the base word cult just means a religious group.

you raise a carpenter jew to the status of divine and a pope to a sub status of divine there is no difference other than you back one and they back another.

[ADFSDF1996]

The difference is that modern cults are usually scams which is why they don't last long or grow. Nazism didn't put much of a emphasis on religion, they put more emphasis on race and if of course they persecuted a certain religious group.

[TheOtakuMaid]

yes but how nazism was set up was close to a religion. the fact hitler researched the occult shows such. while i do agree modern cults are mianly scams. but every religion besides maybe buddhism has some pyramid scheme the Catholic church especially

[ADFSDF1996]

Yes, it's true that most cults originally started as cults but they "evolved" to the point where they became more organized and more civilized.

[TheOtakuMaid]

true. but the reason for why Christianity became civilized was after 1000 or so years of killing each other and the emergence of science taking stage you lot realized that it is a waste of time and inefficient

[ADFSDF1996]

Science is something that continues to evolve just like religion. Science in the 20th century is often laughed at by modern scientists, while religion of the 20th century is often laughed at by modern religious people. Historically science and religion rarely conflicted with each other. Both sides took seperatism paths, it's only recently that science and religion have crossed paths.

[TheOtakuMaid]

they conflicted quite a bit at least Christianity wise. many were killed as heretics

as for it yes science evolves but a religion that claims truth, to begin with, should not. the fact it changes proves its falsehood as its not truth as just a ideology like any other

[ADFSDF1996]

Religion claims truth based on faith and eye witness accounts of divine intervention from scriptures.

[TheOtakuMaid]

eye witness *no actual evidence and most are second-hand accounts of what people heard*

"faith" is not something to back as truth. nor can anything be claimed true solely on faith

[ADFSDF1996]

Eye witness accounts can be taken seriously if they are from a reliable person that you know will never lie.

[TheOtakuMaid]

yet you don't know. human perception is malleable. and very very controllable. even if they dont lie they could still see wrongly., we know this for certain.

nor is anything in the bible truly eyewitness or trustworthy

[ADFSDF1996]

The question is, what if they are right? Most religious people are not gullible. I'm not going to believe some random person who claimed to have seen and army Of angels fighting a legion of demons. When I refer to eyewitness accounts of divine intervention I'm referring to modern documented cases of terminally ill people being miraculously healed that even the doctors say a "it's a miracle".

[TheOtakuMaid]

and yet if you don't believe humans are gullible when they claim an army of angels fighting demons yet then why are you not Hindu? or pagan? why Christian?

I don't think such people were lying persay i think that it started out as a normal tale like robin hood. and over time got more and more stretched. i think people saw things they did not understand and tried to rationalize it with such stories.

allow me to give an example.

some humans are in a camp a couple 10'000 years ago. a lighting bolt strikes and kills only one of them. they wonder why? well why him? well, he was doing something before then? why would he just die. there must be someone who can control lighting who did it. lets not do what he was doing... then a few weeks later another storm comes but no one dies. well, then they must of not pissed that dude off. this due they call a God. than a man come's around probably high and says he speaks for that God and you start getting traditions and offering

[ADFSDF1996]

Christians often think when a person dies, it's God's way of saying "Your time is up". People choose a religion that they can feel attached to. It's not just about worshipping a deity it's also following a set of rules. Some religions like Buddhism don't have God, it's mostly philosophical.

[TheOtakuMaid]

over time it builds and builds and you get different stories about different things from different religions either due to conquering or being conquered or just trade. most the stories in the bible are not even Judaic but from other religions like Baal and such.

when humans get smarter the stories more complicated and Gods more complex. what was just a lighting spirit is now the God of storms. etc. and he now has a personality and set traditions. over time it gets to a point where the Gods start controlling more and more aspects that someone comes along and states why do we need 13 Gods when 1 God is enough? so starts monotheism. i don't think everyone is a liar i think humans are just hungry creations that want answers but can't handle the truth or the not knowing so they make excuses to help them sleep at night.

do you know why we are afraid of the dark?

it's not due to some mystical thing we are afraid of the dark because we are virtually blind in it.

[ADFSDF1996]

Another thing you have to wonder is what if religion is a alternative way of explaining scientific questions. For example in Christian tradition it's believed that Humans were made out of dirt, coincidentally scientists says we started as microbes. Microbes are so small that are probably found all over including dirt.

[TheOtakuMaid]

we are afraid of the dark because we don't know what is in it. and the unknown is the one shared fear of us all.

tell me what is more comforting. that everything happens for a reason and a big powerful being is on your side against some vague "evil"

or we are the only ones here for light years and nothing happens for a reason and shit just happens. and that we may never fully know everything or comprehend it.

i find the latter a bit less scary but to others the latter is unthinkable...

you ask why there is a religion then. I think humans are very much like children. no, they are children. they are afraid of the dark for no apparently true reason when the light is just as scary. they ask they, parents, to check to see if there are any monsters but even when they say there are none they don't believe it so they chose to leave a night light on and hide under a safety blanket.

https://youtu.be/ODetOE6cbbc?t=8m35s

[ADFSDF1996]

When I think of the unknown, I think of the universe. It's been said that the universe is endless possibly because it continues to expand. So if that's true, then there will always be the "unknown". Even if Humans master the technology of interstellar travel, there will always be unknown parts of the universe.

As for religion, I personally don't believe our lives are planned out. I believe we have free will but how long a human lives might have to do with how the person lives their life.

[TheOtakuMaid]

yes there will always be unknown.

but like children it is time we grow up and understand there are no monsters but the "unknown" and not knowing is not that scary. but it does not mean we should stop trying to know.

it's the same argument Christians give in defense of trying to be holy when they will never even become close to how holy Jesus was their answer is "even if we can't reach perfection it does not mean we should not try and achieve it"

[TheOtakuMaid]

I don't think anything is planned out but like dominos, i am not as arrogant as to believe we have any real control. we are animals. based and chained to our programming until we escape ourselves we can not achieve true freedom. and even then what lead us to obtaining that freedom was due to variables beyond our control

[ADFSDF1996]

In Christianity, we know we will never be as holy as Jesus but all we have to do is try to follow God's rules.

[TheOtakuMaid]

exactly and that brings you comfort. you don't have to think or search for answers or solve problems you simply have to be a good sheep and follow along with your shepherd. humans are simple creatures like that

[ADFSDF1996]

It's easier said than done.

[TheOtakuMaid]

we are already doing it. we have broken our own evolution and effecting it ourselves.

[ADFSDF1996]

I'm referring to Christiams following God's rules.

[ADFSDF1996]

*Christians.

[TheOtakuMaid]

quite simple with "everything is forgiven"

[ADFSDF1996]

Asking God for forgiveness has to be from the heart not just from the mouth.

[TheOtakuMaid]

Oh well than 99% of you are fucked,

in fairness it does not state such it simply says asking forgiveness

[ADFSDF1996]

When a person asks God for forgiveness the person must really mean it.

[TheOtakuMaid]

can I have a verse actually saying that?

[ADFSDF1996]

It's not in the bible but that's how it should be, it wouldn't make sense to ask for forgiveness when you really don't mean it.

[TheOtakuMaid]

not much makes sense logically speaking in the bible... you need to remove logic and reasoning before reading it

[ADFSDF1996]

The bible uses allegory to explain things.

[TheOtakuMaid]

while it does use metaphor in this sense it does not. you have no evidence it does for this instance it can be taken literal and if it gives no detail than at face value

[TheOtakuMaid]

example of allegory.

How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

true meaning,

a hit piece on the king of Jerusalem at the time for falling out of Gods grace's
verses like this are spread commonly through the bible this one is simply the most poetic out of them. furthermore, Lucifer is a Latin word showing this was not an original verse

the earlier verses state o day star, not light bringer.

yet people like you take this as a pre Genesis literal verse and take the asking forgiveness as allegory is just laughable

[ADFSDF1996]

Matthew 5:30 is another allegory. The bible is meant to represent current scenarios, as the years go Christians look at a different passage that symbolizes whatever is going on.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Bro, I think you are really a smart dude who can articulate yourself great. However, I have a couple of things against this MyTake.

#1 "Some people might interpret the bible one way and others another way."

The Bible is clear that God's word shouldn't be mess with. The Bible interpts itself with scriptures.

People who like to "Interpret" God's word usually have agendas to do so.

#2: "Christianity has the mark of the inquisitions."

Big No NO bro. Wicked apostate Catholic Church did the horror of inquisitions.

The Lord Jesus didn't command anyone to torture others, like the Catholic Chruch did, not to mention how many fundamental Christians they murdered for refusing the Pope.

Lastly, a Christian can't be gay or a lesbian.

[TheOtakuMaid]

1. if you take both books literally in the 1st world you are gonna have a bad time

. I can bet money that a few verses you read you interpret wrong. example "oh Lucifer son of the morning" that's not a pre-Genesis verse or even speaking of any being it was a hit piece on the king of Jerusalem at the time for falling out of Gods favor. you see tons of verses like this talking about such it happened for David too. the reason you think it's speaking of a fallen archangel or Seraph or whatever is due to what someone you listen to interpreted. along with the fact, satan and devil are titles and not names the original texts don't capitalize them. and are applicable to many "Demons" hell the church itself was known for making giant codex's of the demons of hell and many held such titles. so even if you say the book interprets itself your understanding is only due to that of your parents and sect. otherwise, you would know both of what I stated.

[TheOtakuMaid]

2. a bit ironic i agree.

and yes Jesus did not state backing of it but many of his apostles did state similar things. especially on slavery.

definition speaking one can still be a gay Christian *its complete hypocrisy ik* but the only verse's against it if i recall are old testament. and if you are backing that then you also back everything else in it which contradicts the idea's in the new testament. however, even if there are verses in the new testament against homosexuality than with the whole "everything is forgiven" one need only ask forgiveness after each offense and would be fine so long as they asked for forgiveness before they die

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@TheOtakuMaid www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a47744-christianity-legalism-why-i-am-so-angry

[TheOtakuMaid]

i think i read that before and agree. however i can not say that legalist christians are still not christians as many old testament versus and some christian one's back such ideology.

Jesus does not granted but the apostles ideals and the catholics who edited the bible's do

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@TheOtakuMaid: The Catholic Chruch is of the Devil.

[TheOtakuMaid]

no one is the devil the devil is more metaphoric. among it your sect comes from them and your books edited and made by them. they hold the original texts or close to it after all

[SteppingOnRoses]

sigh... no the Bible doesn't interpret itself because it doesn't have a literal meaning...

same goes for the Quran by the way

Everything should be interpreted with its proper context

How can you expect to be able to understand well all that was written centuries ago? You may need people that are experts and have studied how people spoke and wrote during that time.

[SteppingOnRoses]

and really... he's here promoting tolerance and there you go again having to comment and find fault with being tolerant lmao

just to instigate and attack

tolerance lol... do u know what it means? even if u dont fully understand it you are open to accept it may be beyond your comprehension... so you decide to respect other people that do understand it better than you do...

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@SteppingOnRoses: You have no idea what you're talking about. Smh

[SteppingOnRoses]

Oh I think I do

Meaning why can't we just respect each other? Even if you dont agree with organized religion, can't you simply respect someone does and therefore it isn't ok to insult those religious beliefs?

Same way you may not believe in a God, but I am fine with it. I know it is who you are. And you are intitled to think the way you think.

Just mutual respect, you know?

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

@SteppingOnRoses: I respect everyone that respects me. And I have a right to criticize religions just like they have a right to criticize mines.

[SteppingOnRoses]

as long as it is healthy criticism...

[realgrrrl]

I'm a Christian who became Christian last year after being a lifelong Atheist and because of my reflection from being an Atheist I've really come to understand that people believe what they want to believe and most debates about such topics really lead to nowhere. Trying to get along with them is really the only thing that works for me and after all my entire family and friend circle are Atheist so I just have to deal with it. I just prefer to avoid the topic of religion unless I'm speaking with other fellow Christians.

[Jemini_Crocket]

I'm atheist. I don't believe in any god but that doesn't mean I hate religion and/or religions people. What I hate is when people are trying to force THEIR believes on ME. Radicals and so on. That's what I hate.

Either way, interesting mytake.

[Lopezz1999]

Bro, I completely agree.

I've had christian friends and as an atheist, it really doesn't matter to me what their beliefs are.. I simply live my life as if there is no god, not as if there are not god-loving christians.

[Loveyourself4ever]

I believe in God and in Bible but I believe in my own way.
I also agree with every single word in your text.

*Sorry for my English

[JohnW42]

This was very sound and insightful. Great job and thank you. I learned something today.

Now back to bed.

[404filenotfound]

I enjoyed reading this take, too bad a lot of people don't really want to hear the message behind it though.

[ThisDudeHere]

So to summarize, there are good and bad people on both sides.

[wankiam]

i dont agree on the point of religion not causing war... its just that people worship money more than gods nowadays but other than that... a great take

[RationalMale]

True. A lot of christian denominations throw out whatever parts of scripture they don't like.

[TemplarKnight]

I used to be tolerant against atheists but over the years I detest them now. Most of them are fat neckbeards/low IQ retards because they prayed for a billion dollars when they were younger and didn't get it LMAO.

[strateguy632]

anti-theists want to be able to insult without hearing insults. kinda like shooting rockets and complainning the response is not peaceful.

[Maxemeister]

I've been closest to an agnostic all my life. In reality I have no way of knowing what's out there.

[Max_winner1]

Should have put muslims on the spot they are the ones raping and cutting off heads and killing innocent people with cars and bombs.

[Anonymous]

Good points. I think we need to focus on our common humanity... not our belief systems...

[John_Doesnt]

This seems more like Christianity vs atheism. There's other religions in the world you know. That's why I became atheist in the first place.

[Asad1ONE1]

Wow how informative.

If only people could study Islam to learn it's true purpose. That is bound to happen eventually.

[chrismarie5589]

I think religion is for morons who only think religious nuts have morals and everyone else is lost