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The Modern MGTOW Effect (Page 2)
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And I'm just here sipping my coke focusing on work and school and looking at society coming to a crumble all around me. It's quite fun to watch. I hate being involved in drama itself but I enjoy watching it when I'm not involved. It's also quite funny to watch the left and right no matter where in the world tear each other apart but offer no solutions themselves. It's like sitting in a lawn chair with a can of beer and watching an atomic bomb go off. I can watch the mushroom cloud and explosion go off while just relaxing until the end comes.
I kind of get where you're coming from but I think you should learn not to get such a rush out of it. It's more productive to just ignore it and contribute to the world in your own way instead.
While I am opposed to many of the more extreme feminist viewpoints, I'm yet to see anything good come out of MGTOW or any men's movement. All I see are a lot of male equivalents of radical, man-hating feminists who blame others for every problem they've ever faced and accomplish nothing to actually help men. Unlike feminism, there doesn't appear to be a rational side that truly just wants equality... probably because men aren't actually systematically oppressed in any society. I'm sure this will infuriate someone, but I'm just calling it like I see it.
I may have a suggestion for you. Watch The Red Pill by Cassy Jay, it's about actual MRAs and what they are passionate about. You don't have to watch it, but it's an example of level headed MRAs.
That's because MGTOW is the reaction to alt-left radical feminists. It's naturally going to be radical itself, alt-righters with a mission.
MRA is the equivalent of standard feminism. It focuses on male issues, such as male suicide rates, autism (which affects men 16x more than women), violent crimes, prostate cancer, etc.
I think really what needs to happen is for a single movement to assess what are the injustices in the world, and address them regardless of gender, race, or identity.
@Nice_Guy_Last
HOLD ON
Don't call those people alt-left. They want to be called something that makes them feel fringe, unique, menacing, etc. Don't give them the satisfaction. They know that they only have lame terms for themselves.
i dont like it but you have a point feminism has opened mena eyes to the severity and impact of their actions what has mgtow done do women even give a toss are they even paying attention so ill have to conclude you are right
mens*
https://movieonline.io/movies/the-red-pill.html
Watch the red pill... you will see why your viewpoints are completely backwards.
Casey Jaye stop being a feminist because she saw the truth behind both movements.
@Gonetowardthewind
@Gonetowardthewind I watched a video of Cassie talking about her documentary, and honestly she seemed disingenuous to me. Like she wants people to think she was a feminist before making the documentary, when really she was biased toward making MRAs look good from the start, and kind of staged the supposed "feminist outrage" reaction. So that turned me off, but I'll still watch it one of these days.
@LogicBomber I watched a video of Cassie talking about her documentary, and honestly she seemed disingenuous to me. Like she wants people to think she was a feminist before making the documentary, when really she was biased toward making MRAs look good from the start, and kind of staged the supposed "feminist outrage" reaction. So that turned me off, but I'll still watch it one of these days.
@Nice_Guy_Last I totally agree, I just don't see MRAs actually focusing on those issues in productive and proactive ways. They seem to focus more on undermining women's issues. For example, defending and apologizing for male domestic abusers and alleged rapists rather than opening shelters for battered men. I'm sure there are exceptions, that's just my observation.
uh oh excuses already feminism 101
I think this is a case of "The most extreme voice is the one most often heard." I think that, while the movement lacks large scale organization and publicity, like feminism, the associated groups do have legitimate and positive effects on the culture, like organizing men's health discussion meetings or fund-raising for autism research and awaredness. The problem is that the only time we hear about this is when radicalized feminists protest the actions being taken, like what happened in Toronto with the college sponsored men's mental health discussion. Unfortunately for both sides, feminists were seen as oppressive of men's issues when looked at from the MRA perspective, while from the feminist perspective, the backlash over this somewhat justified the women's actions.
She made MULTIPLE feminist documentaries before this one. She was a WELL KNOWN feminist documentary maker.
If you didn't watch THE DOCUMENTARY... then you can't make claims about the DOCUMENTARY.
@fabulouspancakes
@LogicBomber I'm not making claims about the documentary till I watch it. Just stating my impression of her. I don't doubt she was a feminist in the past, I just don't think she was when she began working on the documentary. That's all. But as I said, I'll still give it a chance.
Well, she was. She was funded by the feminist. They pulled their funding halfway through when she started to tell them she was understanding of the men's issues.
"It scares me to think that the men of this movement are giving up on relationships with women."
Well, it's not a movement and I don't think the MGTOW is having any significant effect on society yet.
Personally, I'm not scared at all. It's up to each person to choose how they live their lives, including finding someone who they can share their views of the world with or not, how to raise a family, etc. If they cannot, then they may choose to remain single and dedicate their lives to something else. Nothing new - for both men and women - except many of those people nowadays apparently would like to blame other people (or an entire gender) for their own choices and misfortune.
That's probably the only reason feminism even enters the picture.
They don't want to enter relationships due to the culture of false rape/assault accusations, giving half of your money to women after a divorce, etc.
Why would someone enter a relationship when all odds are against them?
@FreedomResistance The only incentive is procreation. That's it.
@FreedomResistance why would someone? I don't know. You mentioned financial loss, but why would someone gamble away all their money at the casino? Go to expensive restaurants or spend their money on something else likely expensive? Have kids?
Yet the majority of people still look for a relationship, to get married. Some people are guilty of polygamy, gay people are still fighting for that same right to get married.
All I'm saying is to each their own. Most of us don't agree with the way of the world and which it was different, but I believe that even today most women wouldn't falsely accuse someone of rape or assault or, in other words, very few women would that. The same holds true for man.
Anyway, it's my opinion. I don't think I'm being unrealistic or saying lies, but as you can see many people don't agree with me.
Feminism and MGTOW is just propaganda and was never started by real women or men.
Feminism got all ethnicities of women to work, double tax for government.
Feminism meant women would work and buy more stupid shit. Women love shopping. It's great for consumerism.
Working women had to shave and wear make-up. These industries are worth billions.
MGTOW probably causes divorce. Divorce costs a lot. It promotes single life. Single people on average spend more money.
It's not very hard to see, but it is PROPAGANDA.
Right, if the world was perfect no one got sick everyone was nice. No jobs would exist. Doctors, police, lawyers depend on people to get sick, commit crime etc.
Hence, media will always create negativity, heck they might even make you sick so you can buy shitty tablets.
for example, UK has ton of grass, which many people are allergic to in the summer that creates hay fever. People buy anti histamine tablets. How about we just not buy the stupid weed?
right feminism is good because its a womena movement but mgtow is bad because its for men its thought like that which started mgtow mgtow is good peacefull feminism is a hate movement maybe it started as something good now its just evil
@troychapman both are propaganda and keep men and from enjoying the most basic heterosexual relationships
MGTOW doe a not cause divorce. In fact, divorce is a very large reason why MGTOW even exists. It is a direct response to the large divorce rate and marriages unfavourable for men.
@ThisDudeHere
The point is both are propaganda, see the big picture not the minute details
They won't see it's propaganda, because their egos are now part of it.
Nobody say the opposite to me, because I have 75 H on training in marketing online. And all is about making people slightly insecure about themselves, then creating an ego around your product.
Welcome down to Earth, fuckers. Either you buy my philosophy, or my pockets.
@es20490446e
Yessss you and I think the same about this topic. Majority of news is actually not even real, its to sell products. Many people don't realise this.
Consumerism needs unhappy people.
financialhighway.com/sad-people-spend-more-money
@es20490446e
Very interesting article
"The authors point out that being sad and self-focused we tend to devalue our possessions and ourselves and this devaluation makes us willing to pay more for goods which we hope will enhance our self worth. One can of course argue that material possession doesn’t necessary increase our self worth, however it does provide some psychological comfort. The new purchase often takes your thoughts away from what is bothering you and you shift your focus on your new possession that reduces the anxiety and sad mood."
Woman goes on journey to actually look at Men right movement and renounces feminism after listening to men rather than bashing them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3LqbqUMXinQ&t=101sWorth a watch
If you listen to / hang around anyone for long enough you'll start adopting their views.
It's very hard to tell what is correct because of that unfortunately :/
that was an interesting watch.
Let's be perfectly clear about one thing... MGTOW exists ONLY because of the sexism and injustice of feminism and the damage it has done to gender relations. When feminism goes away, MGTOW will disappear almost instantaneously. The reverse cannot be said though. The evil that needs to be eradicated is feminism, and when that happens the damage will begin heal. Until feminism is dead and gone, there will be no peace in the war of the sexes.
Wow, lots of down votes. Anyone care to explain why they down voted?
Because you apparently spoke critically about feminism. In the modern world that is sin.
Can't stand MGTOW and MRA stuff honestly. The ideals were actually great such as more rights for fathers in court, breaking down stereotypes of men, etc. Then it became this parody of a frat boy movie lead by outright creeps like Roosh V. Now it's become a "who can get the most bitches in bed club?" or "we'll not be around women because they won't have sex/date us" (MGTOW). When it becomes less of a parody I'll rejoin efforts to help men with actual efforts. As much as I like a fair view on MGTOW all I've seen with them are men who honestly are jerks (maybe that's why nobody wants to be with you?)..
Well, do you have any idea how difficult it is to impress women these days unless you look like Spartcus or have a lot of money?
Nigh impossible. I feel women have hypocrisy in them, as in they want a thuggish alpha male when they're young, only to want a beta male provider when they're past their prime.
It's gynocentric unfairness.
Those thumbs down by girls just indicate the lack of understanding
While I am ok with the first two waves of feminism, the third is pure bull. Its followers are filled with misandrists and women who perceive men as some sort of enemy. I believe in equality not superiority.
I applaud you for being open minded and realizing some of the pain men experience as well but I don't really see where you were going with it at the end. The dating market has been upset by our modern technology and lifestyle. And I think it will only get worse. The number of men who are not even part of the dating market is already up to like 40% and it could get even higher. These trends can't be counteracted by vague sentiments.
This is the worst dating has ever been for men. We have less agency than ever before in dating and men never had much.
Even though you are slightly critical of feminism you still use a lot of their talking oints in this article.
I think it's good that you're open for different perspectives but I don't think you really get it yet. Keep going.
😈 Women should be banished from 🌎!!
Well all jokes aside, very well written. Never was aware of this MGTOW. I can understand your curiosity and concerns. Lots of fear, hate and insecurities exist in our world. Women and men don't really get along for that very reason, but that is the challenge of life. There are all kinds of people in this world and we should not let the acts of one define the entire group. That is very easy to do. There are caring, kind and lovable men/boys out there that will adore you. Stay away from the ones consumed by hate. All men are different. It SUCKS how people use their past experiences to hurt innocent and committed members of the opposite sex. Everyone suffers from that.
Yes lots of social stigmas exist. Men and women should keep doing what they like and look like whatever they think is attractive. The right mate will find you.
Hey, its all what any sane person would say. Equality in its essence and spirit must remain gender neutral. Neither Feminists nor MGTOWs can claim that they stand for equality without contradicting themselves. If I truly believe in equality I should see past the fact that you're a man or a woman.
So do you support a man/woman having two weeks off for a pregnancy? Or both should have 9 months?
@Hidden_P lol, your question makes no sense. Pregnancy is special circumstances, and its not just about the woman anymore. And its not like all women want to be mothers. I'm talking about basic rights. Pregnancy has no place in the equality debate. And most places give paid maternal leave, so I don't know what your issue is.
equality
ɪˈkwɒlɪti, iːˈkwɒlɪti/
noun
1.
the state of being equal, especially in status, rights, or opportunities.
"an organization aiming to promote racial equality"
synonyms: fairness, justness, equitability, impartiality, even-handedness, egalitarianism, equal rights, equal opportunities, non-discrimination.
Chief16 definition:
Equality when suitable to a situation.
@Hidden_P 'Equality when suitable to a situation' I'm sorry, that's what you said. When did I ever say that equality is suitable under favorable circumstances? Lol.
"Pregnancy is special cirmcumstances".
Either men and women are fully equal or we aren't. Equality should mean men and women are the same, ego no situation is explimairy.
Either we aren't the same or we are. You believe we are, given your first statement.
FYI, read my opinion and you may understand why I'm saying this.
@Hidden_P its not like women can become pregnant at will. Lol. Pregnancy is a choice. I don't see how you want to factor this in, it makes for a BS argument.
My point is equality. Like for like.
A sheet of blank white paper is identical to another sheet of blank white paper. Equal.
Men and women are not the same, and therefore "equality" (as in one rule fits all) will never 100% apply. I'm trying to make you see that "equality" and "fairness" are not the same thing.
Understand now?
Also pregnancy isn't always a choice 👍 I'm starting to see you need to think about your wording a bit more carefully.
@Hidden_P what do you mean pregnancy isn't always a choice? Under normal circumstances, pregnancy is a choice. Your analogy makes no sense, no two people are the same. True. But what does that have to do with equality? Which by constitution in many countries across the world provides the same rights for men and women. If you're talking about merit or worth, I could see your point but since that isn't the case here.
What about rape? Or failed contraception (pill doesn't work, condom breaks). It's not a choice then is it? You made the choice to avoid pregnancy and it didn't go to plan.
I'm trying to make the point the two genders are different so a simple one rule fits all (aka the true meaning and definition of equality) doesn't fit. The word shouldn't be equality. It should be fairness.
@Hidden_P yeah? Tell me you're not considering rape and unplanned pregnancy as normal circumstances. The two genders are different in every what way, but the constitutional rights give us the definition and spirit of equality. Fairness? You can't develop an impartial system based on fairness.
MGTOW = negative thinkers, guys who go well beyond thinking "But, what if she doesn't like me back?" to thinking "She'll divorce me, take half my shit, and have me put in jail for rape while at the same time have me paying child support for a kid that clearly isn't mine... Sluts..." (basically excuses for not having any balls)
Usually stems from either not getting any female attention (or the don't know what to look for in terms of signals) or, 1 girl broke up with them once and now they blame all women because all women are the same (this is a feminine thing btw).
should also point out the influence by the media obviously reporting on false rape claims, divorce figures etc. They're not gonna report on happy marriages, relationships or points where the girl said yes to being asked out on a date now, are they? Once had a friend who was scared to go on trains because in his words "they crash, I saw it on the news" They're not gonna report on all the trains arriving safely because boring.
ah silver what a wise fool you are. you dont have to be a negative thinker to not want to touch a hot pan.
@DontStepOnTheCat This fool gets laid without getting falsely accused of rape.
when mgtow say that stuff they mean dont be having sex with random chicks you dont know. thats just good advice for everybody.
@DontStepOnTheCat no, when MGTOW say stuff it's a manipulation of minority facts. Such as false rape claims, not really that many to speak of if you consider the vast majority of people get by just fine without this EVER happening. Or, if you want to look at manipulation of majority facts, divorce statistics, YES the majority are raised by women. Yet conveniently leaves out the reasons for divorce (the guy could've been a deadbeat, he could've abandoned her which is a reason for breakdown of the marriage as is cheating)
See what I'm getting at? It's all bullshit because these guys have no balls so they just dream up shit as excuses for not doing anything about their own problems and shortcomings.
as a mgtow myself i just think you are misrepresenting the message. I've banged a lot of chicks likely more than yourself. the majority are raise by women because the women picked the man. she's either to dumb to pick a decent guy or so bad that she drove one away. as far as false rape claims it could be up toi 92% of all rape claims. we will never be able to know for sure though.
@DontStepOnTheCat okay prove it
prove what exactly? everything i stated was factual or logical. no proof needed.
@DontStepOnTheCat so prove that it's factual
look it up. most rapes are never convicted meaning they have the possibility of being false. its that simple.
@DontStepOnTheCat Most rapes are never convicted due to lack of evidence it's a he said she said thing), doesn't mean they're false. Another example being having sex while intoxicated, the whole "i was so drunk I didn't know what I was doing" crap. Again doesn't mean it was false. Been with a few drunk girls who changed their minds after getting their pants off and just because I stopped there doesn't mean everybody else does the same.
Remember the only thing that needs to be proven in a rape case is lack of consent, or that consent has been withdrawn at some point during the encounter. If it's found that there was any confusion as to consent being given the case falls apart. Again doesn't make it a false rape claim.
@DontStepOnTheCat Anyway like I said, prove it.
as i said look it up.
@DontStepOnTheCat you just had 3 hours to look it up and show it to me...
Unfortunately most I've met have been this. I keep hearing this "pain" caused by women thing. So what if she doesn't want to take you back? Keeping looking. So what if she's doesn't look like Megan Fox and pay for all your crap? You really deserve a perfect chick? I have yet to find one who did this out of good reasons.
@ShadowUnicorneTears Thank you someone who agrees. Finally!
im busy living my life. look it up. you're the one that needs the information. be a man help yourself.
@ShadowUnicorneTears i went mgtow because i can't find a women who has seen less then five dicks before the age of 20. now that im older im dating older women so older women have seen a lot more dicks.
@ShadowUnicorneTears hows that for a good reason shadow?
modern women are whores no respectable man wants to wife a whore.
@DontStepOnTheCat No, you're presenting an argument. you provide the backing for that argument. How do you think it would go over if a lawyer in court said to the judge "Well, go look it up your honour... you'll see I'm right..."?
@DontStepOnTheCat Also "modern women are whores"? that's a massive generalisation. What about the tons of guys that have been with tons of women? It goes both ways.
Also, I know plenty of girls who've only been with the 1 or 2 guys they've been in relationships with. So it's subjective.
@DontStepOnTheCat I've never met a man who hasn't bedded at least 6 by age 20. That's also kind of a stupid ass reason. Chances of an actual virgin over 18 are slim.
Including males.
@ShadowUnicorneTears I also know plenty of guys who haven't had that many after 20. It's subjective.
Here it's rare. I just like pointing it out to people like Dontsteponthecat. Honestly it's ok if someone's not a virgin or is. (I just prefer if they're STI or STD free you know...)
i dont work for you
@DontStepOnTheCat bet you don't work for a woman either. Also that comeback only took a week. Well done!
Technically the birth of MGTOW came to fruition because of the radicalization of Feminism.
But I'm on neither groups sides as far as I am concerned their both a cancer to society and both need to be completely destroyed.
Also no the world is not going to end because of either group, be annoyed? Sure but end? Lol no.
"All it takes is one step toward a willingness to love."
Reminds me of the bumper sticker I once saw on a dilapidated old VW van at the beach...
"Visualize whirled peas"
Seriously no, this isn't going to get better 'till society as a whole comes tumbling down. Feminism is here to destroy what culture we have left, it's not going in a positive direction.
There's certainly a woman hating element, and some guys who have been betrayed in the past, but I think some of them are just sick of men and women being held to different standards romantically.
I think of MGTOW as just a bunch of simps who wet their underpants at the thought of having to take responsibility for their actions and learn to live in the real world with the rest of society.
I've been told I am unwanted by women my whole life. I believe it. Even my own mother put me up for adoption. My adoptive mother pounded into my head that i wasn't shit.
I BELIEVE IT ALL. I don;t have any other purpose here but to piss people off and be a human punching bag.
Nobody's going to come sweep me off my feet or rescue me, because I happen to be born male. I didn't ASK to be here.
So now i distance myself from everyone. I'm not worthy of love at all, I have no purpose here. It is what it is.
Damn dude.
@Robertcw Well, it's true. Brutal honesty comes a long way.
We live in a society where men get 60%+ longer sentencing for identical crimes compared to women... what do you expect?
Casey Jaye did research on men's groups and that is why she no longer identifies as a feminist.
She discovered that feminism and feminist beliefs are hateful while men's groups are not. They have real issue and are simply shamed and attacked by feminist and gynocentric culture.
Watch the red pill documentary
https://movieonline.io/movies/the-red-pill.html