False Claims About President Trump

So a lady on here recently asked the question- If Trump wins in 2020 will we still have elections?

In it she proceeds to make several claims about President Trump which I find to be disengenuous at best. Because the Trump craze seems so hysterical I thought I’d respond to a few of her points and see what y’all think.

False Claims About President Trump

1) Trump has expressed desire to be elected for life after praising the elimination of elections in China. -When did Trump seriously express the desire to be elected for life? A brief Google search led me to a WP article which stated, “The president... has previously joked about serving more than two terms, including at an event in April, when he told a crowd that he might remain in the Oval Office “at least for 10 or 14 years.” If even the WP can tell it was a joke, I think we can rest fairly assured that it was a joke.

2) Trump has threatened political rivals and the free press. -When has he threatened them in a manner that’s out of the norm? Obama’s administration actually prosecuted more whistleblowers under the WW1-Era Espionage Act than all other presidents combined. “Since Barack Obama entered the White House in 2009, his government has waged a war against whistleblowers and official leakers. On his watch, there have been eight prosecutions under the 1917 Espionage Act – more than double those under all previous presidents combined” (Guardian). On the other hand Democrats at the highest levels of power have been saying that Trump is a traitor and Russian asset since before his presidency and threatened “lock him up.” Ie. “I don’t want to see him impeached,” she told senior lawmakers Tuesday. “I want to see him in prison.” -Nancy Pelosi

3.) Trump has attacked the legitimacy of US institutions including the military. -Which institutions are you thinking of? All of our institutions should be routinely questioned and not blindly believed. As someone who had a left of center perspective for most of my life (still do, but dems have moved radically left placing me slightly on the right) I find it wild that “liberals” are now saying we should trust all the institutions. Do y’all not remember the findings of the Church & Pike commissions? These are the same institutions that tried to get MLK Jr to kill himself and assassinated Fred Hampton in his bed.

4) Trump has expressed nothing but fondness for Putin, Kim Jong-un, and Erdoğan. -Trump likes dictators... ok have you seen his letter to Erdogan? Have you seen his actions in Russia which led to actual Russian deaths? President Obama promised the Russians leeway if he won re-election and the Crimean annexation occurred under Obama’s tenure.

Anyways I look forward to yalls thoughts.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-says-supporters-might-demand-that-he-serve-more-than-two-terms-as-president/2019/06/16/4b6b9ae2-9041-11e9-b570-6416efdc0803_story.html?outputType=amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/mar/16/whistleblowers-double-standard-obama-david-petraeus-chelsea-manning

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/06/nancy-pelosi-doesnt-want-trump-impeached-i-want-to-see-him-in-prison/amp

False Claims About President Trump
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  • nightdrot
    As obvious as it should seem, I am not clear on the point of this MyTake. That there is a certain amount of hysteria and hyperbole surrounding President Trump is not that surprising. In a populist age, augmented by a technology that reinforces the very human habit of living in one's own head, subjectivity and hysteria prevail, albeit more than usual. By the same token, hyperbole is fairly common to politics.

    Take Ronald Reagan in the 1980s. That decade was, on the whole, a stable, people and prosperous point in American history. Reagan's an emollient personality. Yet he was accused of being a doddering old fool who was losing his mental faculties and who was stealing from the poor to give to the rich. He was going to push the nuclear button and blow the world to bits.

    That was at the time. Yet by the time he left office, he was the first President since Eisenhower to leave office more popular then when he came in. The economy was booming with inflation down from 14.5% to 1.1%, and what was, at the time, thought to be statistical full employment. (Economists would later, as unemployment continued to fall, revise that number downward.) Most of all, far from the world going up in a mushroom shaped cloud, the first arms reduction treaty in the nuclear ear was signed and, in due course, the Cold War ended and the Soviet Union fell.

    Given the hair pulling during Mr. Reagan's presidency - particularly its early stages - one would not have expected that outcome. Thus, what Mr. Trump faces is pretty much the norm and deserves no tears. It is part and parcel of politics and the way to engage with it is to respond with dispassionate analysis.

    In that, the bill of particulars against Mr. Trump is not wholly without its merits. (This I say as a Republican who is no fan of, and did not vote for, the President.)

    To take a few - the motion that he will refuse to leave office if defeated is nonsense on stilts. It is a counterfactual and will only be disproved to those who are inclined to believe it with experience.

    As to attacking the legitimacy of institutions. This has a grain of truth to it, if not as extreme as the hair pulling suggests. Mr. Trump is not a conservative. He is a populist. He routinely denounces "the swamp" and "the politicians." He bypasses the Senate confirmation process with breathtaking insouciance. (This Administration has more offices held by "acting" officials than any in American history.) Indeed, Mr. Trump's troubles in Ukraine are as much because he skirts the edges of the law - not necessarily breaking them but acting against their spirit - as anything else.

    Reagan famously spoke of "We the people" and a "shinning city upon a hill." His rhetoric harked back to the nation's history and institutions. Mr. Trump rarely speaks of such things - generally speaking more of his own presumed greatness. Reagan calmed the social waters, Trump rubs salt in the social wounds.

    To be sure, Trump is the symptom and not the first cause of his times. However, he is playing with fire. He does indeed reinforce the ethos of a people to quick to assume their own virtues and too slow to realize the value of their institutions.

    As Disraeli said, "A nations freedoms are embodied in its institutions. The march of intellect is not enough." The only caveat being that Trump's appeals are to a "diffuse distrust and an indiscriminate suspicion," not so much intellect. Yet to Trump, all history was as nothing before he became, in his own words, the greatest President ever.

    As to tyrants. Here Mr. Trump gets some slack, but it is not untrue. Lord Palmerston famously said, "We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow." Trump is, rightly, less concerned with how cuddly and lovable certain national leaders are than with Machiavelli's dictum, "Lay down with the devil and achieve your goals."

    CONT.
    Is this still revelant?
    • nightdrot

      However, even here, Mr. Trump is less impressive than he appears. As the recent situation in Syria demonstrates, it is less a matter of cold ruthless calculation than a vain obeisance to campaign promises without reference to the long term wisdom of the promises.

      Trump in that case acted rightly, particularly as a way to draw Turkey back into the US orbit. Yet, because he had no long term plan, the domestic and international backlash against his action forced him into an awkward political and diplomatic stance that undercut much of what he had sought to achieve. In this Mr. Trump was less Bismarck and more Mr. Magoo.

      Suffice to say, the list goes on. As Executive Head of Government, Mr. Trump's administration has been slipshod and chaotic. With frequent changes of personnel, policy flip-flops and muddled communications. This only being mitigated by his outsized personality and a strong economy. The latter of which he gets some credit for, though not nearly as much as he credits himself. (Compare the economy Mr. Trump inherited from Mr. Obama as against that Mr. Reagan inherited from Mr. Carter. By far, Mr. Reagan had the bigger climb and the more impressive accomplishment.)

      Bottom line, this MyTake is not wrong. Rather it fails to acknowledge that there is a certain level of truth in the criticisms once the emotional hyperventilating and hyperbole are stripped away. In that, Mr. Trump is not as vile as the criticisms suggest, but paradoxically he is in some ways even more reckless and damaging to the nation - certainly not as great as he, and his less critical supporters, assert that he is.

    • nightdrot

      Type-o:

      This line - "That decade was, on the whole, a stable, people and prosperous point in American history."

      Should read - "That decade was, on the whole, a stable, PEACEFUL and prosperous point in American history."

    • nightdrot

      Apologies - second type-o:

      This sentence - "Most of all, far from the world going up in a mushroom shaped cloud, the first arms reduction treaty in the nuclear ear was signed and, in due course, the Cold War ended and the Soviet Union fell."

      Should read - "Most of all, far from the world going up in a mushroom shaped cloud, the first arms reduction treaty in the nuclear ERA was signed and, in due course, the Cold War ended and the Soviet Union fell."

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  • silvermoon84
    I’m not good at political discussions so bear with me here. I’m going to try. Mind you I’m not defending Trump per se, just stating my observations.

    1.). When did Trump ever say he wanted to be elected for life? And even if he did, people seldom understand the system of checks and balances. The president only gets a portion of federal control over the law but before he puts anything into effect it requires approval from congress and the Supreme Court. For those that don’t understand checks and balances, it’s a process in which all three branches of federal government check each other to ensure full power doesn’t go to only one branch, which means even if Trump did say he was going to do that, he might not be able too asl long as democrats keep fighting him.

    2.) these same people pushing to impeach Trump and lock him up where also thinking it was utterly ridiculous to even consider putting Hillary away for mishandling classified information, an act that resulted in the death of an ambassador and four special agents. Trump is definitely not an angel at least he’s not a lying criminal either.

    3.) Sorry, but as a veteran I have seen more vitriol against the military spewing out of liberals themselves.

    4.) Trump likes dictators? If that’s true, I’m guessing names like “rocket man” are really a term of endearment rather than contempt?

    And to all the leftists who want to call me a brainwashed moron, go ahead. After five years in the military I’ve definitely been called worse so nothing bothers me.
    • Sabretooth

      point 1: https://youtu.be/09ZCJnf-qMw?t=63 point 2: not true-in fact-it seems backward-people condemned Hillary for defending a pedophile-yet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qL8zDigxOzo&t=3s it seems like those offended by past actions committed by past presidencies are completely fine when trump does those same things. 3: trump lashes out at anything and mocking everything about the law and constitution-as well as his low-balling of McCain and disconcern of soldiers who die-he doesn't care. 5: Putin has him wrapped around his finger-Erdogan was able to get what he wanted easily by strong-arming him. as for Kim Jong-un... well, here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we0awE-rnL4 trump tells people how he feels about Jong-un.

    • @Sabretooth Point 1, since you think that what is clearly a joke, is serious you will appreciate the fact that the Washington Post once "fact checked" Donald Trump for saying we have burgers stacked "a mile high". What a liar!

      Point 2: Saying some nice things about someone who just died is totally the same as a lawyer, volunteering to defend a pedophile that gang raped a little girl until her cervix collapsed and she almost died, and not forget running state secrets on her illegal server that even James Comey admitted she broke the law:

      Violation of 18 U. S. Code § 798 — disclosure of classified information

      Anther law, 18 USC 793 — gathering, transmitting or losing defense information

      Scratch that multiple laws.

      3. I don't know WTF your point is here

      4. You skipped 4

      5. I'm old enough to remember back when democrats didn't want endless wars. In fact they were the party of anti-war, "bring our troops home." That was before November 2016. Since then EVERY time Trump has tried to negotiate peace, or actually BRING OUR TROOPS HOME, as in Afghanistan or Syria, he is lambasted by democrats. They even want to go to war with Russia! Gee I wonder why so many people are leaving the party in droves? #walkaway

      https://youtu.be/4Pjs7uoOkag

      https://youtu.be/4Pjs7uoOkag

    • Sabretooth

      @genuinlysensitive yes, yes-EVERYTHING crazy that comes out pf his mouth is a joke-that covers a lot. jackson was a known pedophile. as for ''Saying some nice things about someone who just died'' i doubt the widow and her family who lost a husband, son, and father benefited from trump saying ''it's what he signed up for-but i guess it still hurts anyway'' trump is known to have no real concern for laws or the constitution-as he's constantly breaking them and no respect for the soldiers. Syria was for him-even the soldiers have spoken out about it-we abandoned our allies to get slaughtered-allowing isis to be freed-all because of his towers in Istanbul-and it's suspected that Putin might have also been involved-but as it stands-it's all circumstantial. you are desperately defending an immature and incompetent person who doesn't really care about you or this country-and who can't even BE defended anyway-those who try only look like idiots... or, if they work for him-they can also further incriminate him-as this fool did: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQxL6WE3Ob8&t=19s even trump can't defend himself. here is a tweet by trump-giving a weak defense in regards to Ukraine: “Neither [Bill Taylor] or any other witness has provided testimony that the Ukrainians were aware the military aid was being withheld,” Ratcliffe said on the show. “You can’t have a quid pro quo with no quo.” according to nsnbc-Ukraine already knew-plus, there are the transcripts. watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aC1VAPJ5cgE

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  • GreenPenguin
    1. His repeated jokes about being president beyond the two four-year terms could easily be a joke, but repeating it this many times shows that he's got it on his mind a lot. As a president you're not a private person anymore and need to remember that what you say is more than just your view on things, it's your entire administration's view. He keeps doing things that is unfit for a person with such importance.

    2. By threaten political rivals, I don't think people mean that he is using a law to defeat his opponents. Check the link below. It says "he implicitly threatened the life of officials in his administration who had helped a whistle-blower reveal Trump’s abuse of power"

    And that^ is just the most recent one.

    3. It is important to question things, but remember that as a president, he can order an investigation into it, going public to say that something is corrupt is creating chaos for that institution, it literally makes their job harder even if it is 100% legit.

    4. On this one... He's back and forth, one moment he loves them, the next he hates them. I have no clue what the man's thinking. I think he has expressed a that he likes the fact that they hold absolute power for a lifetime, and feels that is the way to go. No sources on that, but I faintly remember something along those lines a few years back when he was in his Putin loving mood.

    www.bostonglobe.com/.../story.html
    • ladsin

      Hey at least a thoughtful response, thanks.
      1) You won’t find me defending Trump’s rhetoric. He’s certainly not very presidential, but that doesn’t mean he’s planning on doing away with the democratic process.
      2) There’s a reason that I specifically said, “Out of the norm.” I’m not a fan of a lot of political rhetoric which I think is inflammatory without cause, but this isn’t out of the norm. I couldn’t read your link (they wanted me to sign up), but I presume it’s about the recent “treason” debacle. Lots of people have accused Trump of having committed treason. Hell for the entire Mueller probe we had to hear people claim that he was a Russian asset (committing treason). Trump has also accused nearly everyone and their grandmother of treason, it just seems to be how our current president blows off steam. That’s not a defense of his conduct, but it does have to be noted that he’s not rounding these people up.
      3) He has ordered an investigation into how the Mueller probe came to be. Particularly were interested in knowing if President Obama directly ordered the intelligence agencies to spy on now President Trump for political gain. We should know the results soon.
      4) President Trump does ACT rather sycophantic toward dictators. I presume he just likes strongmen and this is how he does business (obsessive flattery to try and eke our a better deal). This seems to be the case to me because he also wants people to treat him that way. The main point here is that while verbally Trump is rather kind to them his actions are quite different. Either way he’s hardly abnormal in this realm. Again see Obama’s comments to the Russians, Bush’s statements about Putin, etc.

  • I’ll start with The Trump Foundation

    A charity he used to avoid taxes. He had put zero money into it since the 80s. Other people would put money into his charity as a way for him to avoid taxes. Rather than donate his own money to charity he used the Trump Foundation as a way to pay himself.

    The wrestling foundation he appeared on played his fees to the charity.

    He took money from other donors then used that money to donate to (bribe) a political campaign for the Florida attorney general who at the time was investigating Trump University (remember that?). With charity money from his Foundation he paid off a lawsuit where he tried to cheat a million dollar contest winner for getting a hole in one at his golf course. Because donating money to a political campaign using charity money is illegal he doctored his books to make it look like he paid a legitimate charity.

    He bought a $10k painting of himself to put in one of his clubs. He bought a Tim Tebow football helmet with charity money.

    He was forced to close down his charity for several reasons including STEALING MONEY FROM A CHILDRENS HOSPITAL.

    He took money from one charity owned by someone else and turned around and donated it to Florida police ball as his own money as a way to gain business.

    ‘“The foundation was accused by the attorney general, Barbara Underwood, of “functioning as little more than a checkbook to serve Mr. Trump’s business and political interests,” and of engaging in “a shocking pattern of illegality” that included unlawfully coordinating with Mr. Trump’s 2016 presidential campaign.“

    www.nytimes.com/.../...rwood-trump-foundation.html

    Sued for self-dealing
    www.reuters.com/.../new-york-sues-trump-and-his-charity-over-self-dealing-idUSKBN1JA26G

    Trump foundation admits it
    www.washingtonpost.com/.../...15787add0_story.html

    www.wsj.com/.../new-york-attorney-general-sues-trump-foundation-alleging-illegal-coordination-with-trump-campaign-1528988443

    www.vice.com/.../donald-trumps-charity-foundation-scandal

    Read about Trump Foundation’s “critical” rating from a charity rating website.
    www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm

    I could go on and on but I’m bored now. Next time I’ll maybe talk about Trump University.
    • Paige90

      So you only quote liberal publications?

    • ladsin

      That’s all well and good. I’m perfectly willing to accept that Trump is a crook, my point is that he’s not radically outside the norm in American politics for the aforementioned reasons. If you want to talk about crook politicians we’ll be here till the sky falls.

    • @Paige90 - It seems that only liberal publications care to report that the Trump family can no longer run charities after they broke every law on operating a charity. Since all charities must have public tax documents, show me a Conservative publication that criticizes Trump's charity for self-dealing, using charity money for political campaigns to bribe a DA who's investigating another Trump crime, using a charity to pay off lawsuits, etc. Show me a conservative newspaper that mentions Trump's Charity in the non-political, non-partisan www.charitynavigator.org with a rating of "high concern".

      Next @Paige90 will ask me to show her a positive rating of "Mein Kampf" in an Israeli newspaper.

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  • supercutebutt
    Trump is an idiot. I am concerned about the people who defend him no matter what.
    • ladsin

      Did I do that here? Did you read the MyTake?

    • While I agree that Trump isn't fit for the job, I still gotta say that your comment really lacks substance. Do you have a reason to say what you said?

    • @GreenPenguin A reason? SERIOUSLY? How about three years of childish ridiculousness. The guy is an embarrassment. If an individual is unable to recognize it, I can't help them. Every day is nuttier than the last. :(

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  • Z3ID366
    I can't see in the near future that the US government won't have presidential election, the US is too much of a stable democracy that a single man could ruin it, as much power the president has he can't make the Congress and the supreme court not rule out some outrageous bills so no he will have to tems tops
    • TITAN-IDC

      Trump has to much power, he says criminals go to jail.. 😂👎🇺🇸trump 2020🇺🇸

    • ladsin

      Not that Trump wants to, but he certainly doesn’t have that power. The two-term limit is enshrined in the constitution and would require a 2/3 vote in Congress to overturn.

  • goaded
    Does this question mean that you accept that: "The GOP have stacked the maps with gerrymandering and illegal election tricks. The GOP has refused to pass comprehensive voting system protections. Trump has offered pardons to government agents who break laws by following his orders. His, and many GOP'ers are currently under the protection of President Trump. This all ends if Trump is no longer president."?

    1. I think the only way he'll get away without prison time when he steps down will be if they can argue that he can't get a fair trial, especially as his co-conspirator pleaded guilty. That's quite an incentive to try to stay on. What sounds like a joke can also be testing the water (like Clinton threatening to run again - do you really trust her not to try?)

    2. You're talking about what the media say about Trump, that's not important. He's been talking about having his political opponents arrested, and gone so far as to extort an announcement of a fake investigation into another from a foreign government. And let's not forget about the constant "fake news" mantra.

    3. You can question what you're being told by your intelligence agencies, but dismissing something they *all* agreed on (and stood up in court) on the say-so of the leader of the accused nation, is attacking those institutions.

    4. You're talking about the letter that looks like a joke? It sounds like something Baghdad Bob would have written; Erdoğan already had what he wanted, and felt free to ignore the letter. The Saudis murdered someone in cold blood, with no repercussions. Russia interfered in the 2016 election (and is still working on it), with no repercussions. Kim is still building and testing missiles and nuclear weapons.

    Maybe he doesn't love them, but he sure as hell doesn't stand up to them.
    • ladsin

      No, I just figured I covered enough for a start.

      1) For what?

      2) I didn’t say that... did you read this one? “Obama’s administration actually prosecuted more whistleblowers under the WW1-Era Espionage Act than all other presidents combined. “Since Barack Obama entered the White House in 2009, his government has waged a war against whistleblowers and official leakers. On his watch, there have been eight prosecutions under the 1917 Espionage Act – more than double those under all previous presidents combined” (Guardian).“ Also the quote from Nancy Pelosi isn’t a quote from the media 😂 she’s the Speaker Of The House.

      3) Not sure what you’re arguing here.

      4) Sure? And Crimea was annexed under President Obama and Obama promised the Russians “flexibility” if he won the 2012 campaign. Not to mention giving Iran boatloads of cash so they could continue to sponsor terror.

      Trump isn’t widely outside the norm of American politics. He’s a little more exaggerated sure, but this mad fervor that’s sweeping through the left that Trump’s the second coming of Hitler (or something) is incredibly odd. The dudes really not that odd. He’s a crappy businessman and reality star who won because all the politicians just suck.

    • goaded

      "1) For what?"
      Really?

    • goaded

      "3) Not sure what you’re arguing here."
      Come on. It's one thing to choose between competing US intelligence agencies, it's another to choose Putin's word over all of them. And an FBI investigation, which lead to indictments of Russians.

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  • 2os4ngeles
    1) I think is okay. The other two, I think you're blinkered.

    Trump's rhetoric alone is extremely damaging, and has lead a large part of the electorate to blindly follow their leader and attack the press that is meant to hold him to account. It has resulted in FOX News turning into a literal propaganda channel for the President, full of boot-licking anchors. It has resulted in the Republican party turning into a group of unprincipled boot-lickers. And he lies all the fucking time. That is so damaging a norm to set and so unhealthy.

    About institutions: Trump has encouraged police to beat up suspects. He has accused judges of being partisan on account of their heritage. He has - again - made a large portion of the electorate write off the FBI, simply because they investigated him - an investigation that he himself ordered.

    If you are apologizing for Trump, sorry, but you have no principles worth having, and your whataboutism isn't going to change it.

    What a profoundly damaging man for the world, and for his country.

    Regarding dictators, sure, sometimes MSNBC and CNN exaggerate, but he has been far too cosy with them compared to how he has behaved towards others. The fact that he just accepted that the Saudis ambushed and murdered an American resident in their consulate is outrageous.

    The defense of him is so staggeringly hypocritical, because everything he complains about, he is himself guilty of. E. g. corruption.
    • ladsin

      Alrighty, so let’s go step by step here, it may help you to know that I don’t consider myself a always Trumper. My point here is that the vitriol and apparent exhasperation about him being wholly out of place in American politics is incorrect. He’s not that out of place for the reasons I stated. I do find that Trump’s divisive rhetoric is deepening a growing political divide, but this has been happening and would continue to happen regardless of whether or not Trump was in office. Ie Former VP Biden claiming that Mitt Romney wanted black people back in chains.

      “If you are apologizing for Trump, sorry, but you have no principles worth having, and your whataboutism isn't going to change it.” This statement is so strange to me that I can’t believe you actually thought through it. My claim is that Trump is not far outside the normal realm of American politics. How the hell am I supposed to make that case without referencing other American politicians? That’s not whataboutism, it’s literally the entire argument. Secondly I’m not apologizing for trump. I’m making a case that he’s not outside the norm for the reasons listed.

    • 2os4ngeles

      But he is outside the norms. Just his language. You are young, but just consider previous presidents. There would be an outcry if they had done a fraction of what Trump has done. He just called his opponents "human scum" on Twitter FFS. He has changed the entire public discourse.

    • ladsin

      And in 2012 then VP Biden said that Mitt Romney wanted to put black people in change. Accusing your political opposition of being a racist and desirous of slavery > or = tweeting that someone is human scum.

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  • Dargil
    Thanks to mass media and government schools, half the US population is incapable of logical, fact based, serious thinking. They think that their force of will will get all those unrealistic things they want. But what they are becoming is tomorrow's proletariat, living in an emotional, materialistic, sensual fantasy world, while the other side ("my") side, gradually assumes all the reins of power. Not by choice, but by forfeit of the other side abandoning their constituency and good sense.
  • MarkRet
    There's already enough 'fake news' out there, and there's no need for news outlets to make false claims on Trump, because the reality he gives us is entertaining enough.
  • TylerC137
    I like how everyone that hates Trump never points out the actual good things he's done and countries he's aided. I'm not saying he's 100% perfect. Nobody is perfect. That's just like watching a movie and only remembering the bad parts. Trump is obviously sick in the head, but the people that hate him are also sick in the head and need to get a life. The government is controlled by the IRS and corrupt people that have massive amounts of currency. They don't care about the people. Anything you say or vote involving the president is just seen as an opinion to them. They will continue to elect who ever they want based on Congress majority vote.
  • NewUser19
    Educating people with TDS is difficult and personally I gave up. They refuse to see what the truth is and just dismiss all your statements as Fox News talking points or conspiracy theories and then use the good old flat earth label to further dismiss you
    • ladsin

      I’m not an always trumper nor am I a republican. So if you feel that you can sway me I’m happy to hear it. My case is rather simple, Trump is not radically out of bounds in modern American politics for the reasons stated in myTake.

    • Most people have absolutely no idea that the United States Government lost its power in 1913 with the federal reserve act of 1913. The federal reserve is not federal and contains no reserves. Look in the phone book under the blue government pages, bet you won't find it. It's in the white pages right underneath Federal express. When Roosevelt got elected he made a law that made it illegal for American citizens to own gold. So they had to turn in their Gold for Federal Reserve notes. The gold is now in fort Knox Kentucky. In 1971 under the Nixon administration we were took off the gold standard and put on the petrol dollar. Trump wants to reverse this, he has already opened the oil wells in Texas and the gulf of Mexico and Alaska. We are no longer dependent on foreign oil. He got rid of 2 industrial skids worth of regulations that were keeping business from staying open. See once we go back on the Gold and silver standard, we no longer owe the Federal Reserve money. As the price of gold and silver rise so do the value of the dollar.

      Go to www.freedocumentaries.org

      Search for (The Money Masters)

      This will explain everything that Trump is up against. And all you Trump haters better cool your jets
      He's going to give the spending power of the dollar back to the American people. Right now there are shareholders running the Federal Reserve and it's purely for they're profits not yours.

  • jiffyjeff1029
    And for all you climate change people that think we are all going to die in 12 years. AL Gore said that back in the 90s. Hmmm I'm still here.. Now AOC is tooting the same horn. Any of you ever take science classes in school?
    We have oxygen in the atmosphere right? Where does this oxygen come from? Hmmmm TREES AND PLANTS CORRECT?

    So of oxygen comes from Plants and Trees and Trees absorb Carbon Dioxide then we are safe right?

    NASA has a photograph of the Earth right now... Guess what folks?

    The earth is greener now then it ever has been. The left wing globalist are using scare tactics to to get the uneducated, misinformed and otherwise complacent population to vote for this Green, New deal. And Guess what this deal is going to do for you. You will pay a carbon tax on every gallon of gas you buy, you will pay a carbon tax on every piece of beef, pork, lamb or poultry that you buy. It's all to further impoverish the people of the United States. The 15 dollar and hour minimum wage will force employers to fire workers and replace them with kiosks because they have to cut cost and raise the prices of they're products to cover the extra expenses. Free education and health care? That will raise our taxes even higher. Trump took us out of the Paris climate accord for a very good reason. The United States was paying the whole bill that would cover all the free loading countries of the world. We have an environmental protection agency here in the states. We scrub our coal emissions before releasing it into the air. NOW WHY SHOULD WE THE American PEOPLE PAY FOR PLACES LIKE CHINA THAT HAVE NO ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION WHATSOEVER? THEY PUMP THEY'RE INDUSTRIAL WASTE INTO THE RIVERS. The free health care and college will raise our taxes sky high. So if you like to pay your bills and eat you all better wise up or your actually going to vote in someone just like Hitler.!!

  • ShortCircuit
    I'd like to add that...

    1. The only president in history to *actually* serve more than 2 terms was FDR... a Democrat--which is especially relevant in this case because FDR ran and was elected on the Democratic platform *after* the so-called "platform swap" that modern Democrats love to use in order to distance themselves from Dixiecrats. In fact, it could be argued that it was FDR's very own New Deal that single-handedly *caused* the "platform swap".

    2. The Espionage Act was passed under Woodrow Wilson (another Democrat) 's administration, in the first place.

    ... just sayin'
    • ladsin

      To be fair though those were both in wartime. Lots of things get suspended during war, just look at Lincoln’s suspension of habeas corpus and jailing of a Supreme Court Justice.

    • Just because some principals *are* often sacrificed during wartime doesn't mean they *should* be. War is no excuse.

    • ladsin

      Hmm. Hard to say really. Do you, for example, extend this to the seizure of personal assets to assist in a war?

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  • FunkyMonkee
    What? False claims about President Trump? WHO would DO such a thing? I've never HEARD of anything so ridiculous!!!
    1. He HAS the power to rescind the two-term limit, if he wants to! And, even if he doesn't, there's nothing to stop him from taking 2 terms and then running again in 2028 AND WINNING!!
    2. Yeah? SO WHAT? How many people have threatened him? Let's see, Johnny Depp, Madonna, little Bobby DeNiro, some woman I just saw downtown today while he was speaking, several hundred others. But THAT'S OKAY!!! Nothing wrong with any of THAT!!
    4. To the lefty snowflakes, just saying, "Hi" to Putin & the others is displaying fondness for them!! If he passed one of them on the street and said, "Hey, man, you're shoe's untied." They would've had him taking it up the ass in the heat of passion with each of them!!!
    • Actually, it is illegal to take more than two terms. Regardless of who is running, we have laws against it to protect our country.

    • ladsin

      Hmm. Can’t tell if sarcasm or...

    • @Randomawkwardness We do, now, but one of the presidents from the `40's had 3 terms and, like I said, he has the power to rescind that law! How would a two-term limit protect our country... except for keeping crooks, assholes and dictators like Bush, Clinton and Soetoro from staying in power forever? Even if they did, The Constitution is on OUR side! THAT'S what the 2nd amendment is all about!! THAT'S why Hitlary wants it removed so badly!! Without that, we have no (or VERY little) power over them!!

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  • Grond21
    I think this is an excellent mytake. I read her original question and was equally frustrated, but didn't have the emotional energy to engage with it like you have. So I'm glad you stepped up to the plate. It was needed.
  • curiouswxboy
    Trump is a waste of space. If a lot of people had their way, he'd be six feet under. Does he care about school shootings? No. Rape? No. Childcare? Hell no. I'd kill the bastard myself.
  • Jltakk
    Trump Derangement Syndrome is alive and well unfortunately. We still have people unironically calling CNN a viable news source. Americans are gullible.
  • RHK36
    If you can't see why he's an embarrassment then no amount of debate will come close to convincing you otherwise. It's not even hard at all to see why he's bad. Not just as president, but as a person. People that continue to support him are either too stupid or willfully ignoring how bad he is for whatever reason.

    That's not an opinion, it's a fact. Enough with the I want to see proof or evidence. The moment anyone shows someone something they'll have excuses ready or ignore it. Y'all just as bad as flat earthers.
    • ladsin

      I’m presuming that you also didn’t bother to read the myTake? If that’s the case do you not feel rather like the pot calling the kettle black? You’re literally ignoring what you think might be an argument that goes against your beliefs.

  • SirRexington
    he's done all of those things... why are using semantics and half ass attempts to defend him? if this was a democrat they would not be given the same leniency or nuance that Trump occultists give him.
    • ladsin

      So you didn’t read it... my point was exactly that Democrats have done the same things. As well as other Republicans. Trump’s not that out of bounds for American politics, it’s just that he’s being covered differently.

    • But he's getting away with shit others have been impeached for. Politicians have gotten in trouble for less than he's done. He isn't getting coverage that treats him wrongfully. It's just that he's a fucking idiot and proves it again and again.

      Now that is not me defending MSNBC or CNN or any other neoliberal centrist propoganda machine, but Trump's coverage is bullshit from everywhere. Nearly all of Fox news worships him like a deity and there are sites dedicated to him. Sure Fox has had some anchors point shit out but they have all either gotten in trouble for it or worse no longer work for Fox...

    • ladsin

      What have other presidents been impeached for that president trump hasn’t? That’s a very specific and interesting claim. If it’s true you may have me beat on this.

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  • ObscuredBeyond
    The Tide Zombie Level Rating System was developed specifically to measure degrees of anti-Trump lunacy and hysteria by comparing insanity levels to Tide Pod eating. The "eater" who eats the most without complete self-destruction levels up to the point of being able to create Downy-nadoes (like a sharknado, but with purple Downy beads) - all while mutating into something that looks like the troll from Cat's Eye.

    The number of times I've had to use this index on some Facebook users, frankly saddens me. They don't even try to be modest anymore. If you wish to know more about this index, there's an article about it on Uncyclopedia: "How To: Survive the TidePodcalypse." Google it.
    • And to those below curious, Super (not) CuteBehind below is wrong on all counts. She is about a level 5 zombie. And when they make one unsubstantiated accusation of character to back up another, and can't cite a single incident, and call you "racist" when you run them out of unsubstantiated claims, it tells you that they know they're wrong; but are too full of Tide to concede.

      Let these types continue to scream helplessly at the sky, while you smile and MAGA. With or without Trump; the New World Order needs to be terminated with extreme prejudice. All their evil human trafficking and power grab desires need to be put to death. And in their place, a divine order over all nations should arise.

    • TITAN-IDC

      Supercurebutt is a clown butt. she's atheist, spewing hate by not finishing first debate.. What a clown.. 😀👎

  • nailu
    I’m a fan. I’m embarrassed by the coverage he’s getting, and he’d be more likable if he deleted twitter
  • Exorcist_Rampage
    Trump is one of the best turnaround cases in history. This man used to sexually harass women but now treats women with class and dignity. People just hate Trump winning the presidency.
    • So you’re agreeing that Trump used to be one of the biggest sexual predators only he’s cured now? I guess those 20+ unrelated sexual assault lawsuits spanning a dozen years can just be dropped now.

    • I didn't say that but people act as tho he is still living this lifestyle, when he isn't.

      He should be held accountable for his actions but it shouldn't dictate his political success or political failure.

  • BLUEXEYEDXGIRL
    This is my opinion. I hate trump. I hope he’s out of office next election.
    • Can I ask you one simple question?

      How the hell can you hate person if you don't even know him professionally, personally or historically?

      Your hate for him come from the false statements, out of context sound bytes of only bits and pieces of every word he said, and the fact that the news media, the political, Elite, globalist, and deep state hate him for what he's doing. Trump is exposing them for what they really are the enemies of the people of the United States. The news media and globalist hate him for 2 reasons
      #1 they can't blackmail him, bribe him, threaten him, scare him, kill him or control him. And you know what that means don't you?

      He's doing what he said he was going to do. DRAIN THE CORUPT WASHINGTON DC SWAMP OF ALL THE FREE LOADING, LAZY, DISHONEST POLITICAL HACKS THAT ARE IN GOVERNMENT GIVING THEMSELVES RAISES AND VACATIONS AT YOU THE TAX PAYERS EXPENSE.

      HE'S GOING TO BRING DOWN THE FEDERAL RESERVE THEREFORE ELIMINATING THE NATIONAL DEBT. DOING AWAY WITH THE UNCONSTITUTIONAL IRS.
      AND TAKING ALL THE GOLD IN FORT KNOX AND PUTTING US BACK OB THE ECONOMICALLY SOUND AND STABLE GOLD STADARD.
      some people have no idea that because of the Federal Reserve and the fact that Obama raised the debt ceiling. For which he had billions of dollars in financially unbacked money printed out of thin air. What this did was increase the debt you as a citizen are now in and devalued the dollar.

      You are now 1.5 million dollars In debt on top of the personal debt you own. Your car, house and belongings.

    • 😂😂😂 All trump has done is rape woman, sexually harassed his daughter and put children in danger. He doesn’t respect other people. He doesn’t pay his taxes. He doesn’t do anything for anybody but himself. He wants himself to look good. Obama has helped people get health insurance, unlike you and me, some people can’t afford heath insurance so Obama was kind enough to create Obamacare. And like I said, this is my opinion, so like it or not, I’m stating MY opinion. So shove your “make America great again trump 2020” up your ass.

    • Obama care destroyed a lot of people young lady. It raised the cost of insurance and penalties were tacked on if you didn't buy the incrediblly expensive insurance.
      Did you know that Michelle Obama was an attorney at one time?
      She was dis bared for unethical behavior, just like two other attorneys we know, BILL AND HILLARY CLINTON. guess what they got Michelle Obama for?

      INSURANCE FRAUD!!

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  • Liam_Hayden
    The same garbage has been said about every POTUS I remember and probably about those from before I was born.
    • ladsin

      Huh? Did you read this? My case was entirely that President Trump wasn’t far outside the norm for American politics and your response is that he’s not far outside the norm 😂

  • loveslongnails
    Some people go overboard, but the facts remain that he's a narcissistic, pathological liar. He makes up stories, tries to create his own "facts", and is constantly walking back statements because "nobody understands them but him". Eventually, even his own appointees leave because they can't work with him, or any good ones get fired. As the woman pointed out is her reply, he DOES love dictators, except for one, and that's because he told Trump to fuck off. He's also broken enough laws to deserve his inevitable impeachment, many times over. The sad part is, trumpettes actually DO believe that he's never told a lie... about anything. That too, is an illness. By the way, Pelosi wanting to see him in prison is NO different than trump wanting to see Hillary there, or ANYONE who opposes him. That's why Cohen is there already, because he chose to lie for the liar. Had he turned him in and quit his lucrative job, he'd be a free man today.
    • ladsin

      Did you read myTake? My entire point was that President Trump isn’t wildly outside the norm for American politics. Case-in-point, president trump calling “lock her up” isn’t radically different from democrats chanting “lock him up”.

    • Yeah... you make 4 rather weak points which I didn't feel like debating. Nor did I care to bring up about 500 OTHER idiotic and irrational remarks he's made. We all accept that politicians exaggerate, tell partial truths and spin, so it's up to us to read between the lines. Trump on the other hand, NEVER stops lying, and by never, I mean that 75% of what he says at any given time is anywhere from a partial truth to a full blown "I'm making up shit as I go" lie.

      His biggest, most glaring fault besides the lies however, is that he continually disregards his oath to uphold the Law by placing himself above it. He continually looks for ways to get around the law while accusing others of breaking it. As to the "lock her up/ lock him up " chant, he is being mocked for what he started, as he deserves it.

    • ladsin

      It’s weak to point out that Trump hasn’t jailed political dissidents whereas Obama did when I’m simply saying that Trump’s not as out there as you claim? What the hell could be a strong point to you then? Christ.

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  • will see people lived 1 president bush but grew to hate him way after Dixie chicks said they dint like how he is running country
  • zagor
    Yeah, the crazy shit he has done doesn't need embellishment...
  • JamesRandiDebates
    Trump Derangement Syndrome is real.
  • Zap69777
    It was a joke 😂
  • Anonymous
    i fear for this country under trump
  • Anonymous
    I saw that question you referenced on GAG. She's a complete tool that uses this site to spam Trump.
  • Anonymous
    I wish there was a dislike button on GaG sometimes...
  • Anonymous
    It's obvious that you're a Trump supporter.
    Trump supporters have a known history of denying basic reality and verifiable facts.
    Like his love affairs with dictators. "Did you see his letter to Erdogan?"
    Letter schmetter. He let the Turks do exactly what they wanted, because he is a weak spineless sap of a man, who kowtows to dictators and have never made a decision without Putins approval.
    • ladsin

      Lol 😂

    • NewUser19

      How can Trump be spineless when he's literally berating you democrats daily? The reason you guys have lost it mentally is because despite what you throw or say his way he will dismiss it or flip right back on ya.

      How does he do that? he's a former Democrat, and Democrats know how to play dirty. Especially since they control the vast majority of the media they can influence the public to become outraged and they apply pressure for change and still Trump doesn't give a fuck about y'all

  • Anonymous
    Nice mytake. I love how you accredited the source lol. As a college kid, I totally respect that.
  • Anonymous
    With trump I am back and forth.
    1) I doubt a man like Trump would willingly leave office. I think he will find some loop hole to try and stay there. However I think he wasn't joking. In 87 Regan wanted to start a movement to repeal the 22nd amendment (that's limits 2 terms). Trump could try and abolish the term limit, I don't think America would allow for it though...
    2) I don't know all that Obama did in office because I was fairly young when he was elected however in the Trump situation and "threatening" press and rivals I believe has little to no proof. Things online can be twisted SO many ways
    3) The legitimacy of everything should be attacked, I for one am glad he spoke against them. The military hides too much from the American public. I believe every organization has a secret agenda and it's be a lie to say everyone isn't driven by money. Hell, you can't even trust pharmaceutical companies anymore because why would a doctor heal you completely? Hed be without a job.
    4) Dictators. They have completely control of their people some Koreans even worships kim or so I've heard. I think it's a plus for America as long as the complete control isn't put into effect here. I don't believe any other president has been allowed im North Korea... that's good on our part because with the nuclear weapons they have we need eyes so we can better prepare if they do turn on us.

    I don't want trump to babble for longer than he already has but the majority of america will decide wether he is fit for us. If not, its a least a learning lesson.

    Just my opinions though. I don't have a political background so don't hate if this isn't 100% factual.
    • ladsin

      Hey another thought out response! I’m always happy to hear one, so thanks for commenting.
      1) it may be true that Trump WANTS to maintain the presidency, but I’ve not seen compelling evidence of that. All I’ve seen are jokes as the WP has pointed out. I’ve seen no action towards repealing the 22nd but if he did I’d be staunchly against him.
      2) That’s my primary point. Let’s assume Trump’s tweets indicate an actual will to prosecute political dissidents in his administration (which I find gullible) it’s the case that his actions do not reflect that. At least not outside the normal boundaries for American politics as demonstrated by the Obama administrations handling of whistleblowers.
      3) That last comment seems a little conspiratorially minded, but in general yes. Skepticism of purported authorities is good in my book.
      4) N Korea has jokingly been called an necrocracy as the “supreme leader” is still Kim Jong-il despite his death nearly a decade ago.

    • Barry spent most of his time taking vacations at our expense and playing golf.

    • NewUser19

      We should abolish President term limits. Republicans could have a Trump just as Democrats had a FDR

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  • Anonymous
    Your region is apparent by use of the word "ya'll"-you're obviously one of the bat shit crazies in the South. Trump has trampled constitutional norms, obstructed justice and solicited foreign assistance in his campaign both 2016 and 2020. He is about to be justly impeached and, while Republicans are to cowardly and craven to follow their oath and remove him he will be resoundingly voted out and the Republican party will probably become a regional party, influential only in the South as to your "points"-Trump often claims to be "joking" when he floats ideas and they get huge blowback. That joking excuse is threadworn. No on believes it. Trump HAS threatened his political rivals and even sought to have other countries target them. He is about to be impeached for this and, yes, there is plenty of evidence. Attacking the legitimacy of institutions? Yes he has-from the military to the free press. He even has usurped Congressional powers which he had confirmed by his lickspittal court which he stacked using a stolen seat. Trump's letter to Erdogen? Hardly threatening and Erdogen hardly felt threatened. The betrayal of our commitments has allowed Putin to move into the vacuum-probably Trump's intent the entire time so Putin won't release the Piss Tape. In sincerely doubt you have been "left of center" all your life unless you are judging by southern standards where Fascism is considered the "center".
    • ladsin

      Lol that was rather vitriolic. If you’d like to have a more civilized conversation then I’d be happy to do so. As for my personal political views, I was always a slightly left of center libertarian particularly on social issues. In the past decade however the democrats have shifted leftward at twice the rate that the republicans have shifted rightward (Pew research). Because of this shift I’ve now been placed slightly right of center but still libertarian. (Obviously I’m a fan of the four quadrant model)

      I’m not sure what being from the southeast has to do with my positions. If you’d like to know my positions you can feel free to ask them.

    • ladsin

      P. S. I prefer talking with people who disagree with me more, because that’s the only way to really learn. So if we can have a calm discourse I’d be happy to.

    • It seems the democratic party has adopted a new platform since November 2016: Agree or you are Racist/Sexist/some kind of phobic/Russian agent. Its like writing a computer program. Anything other than "I agree 100%" gets you one of these responses.

  • Anonymous
    Trump doesn’t help himself with his antics. But if you really look at what position he’s in there are people in all directions trying to undermine INCLUDING tax payer funded people in his own administration.

    Now the NYT is claiming that an active member of his team is coming out with a “leak” story about Trump... but the guy is STILL working for him!
    • ladsin

      Yeah, I’m certainly not a big Trump fan, but the mainstream left response to him is insane.

    • Anonymous

      Neither am I. But it’s a choice between bad and radical insanity.

    • ladsin

      Yeah, I think I’ll have to vote for him next round.

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  • Anonymous
    Your defending trump. Yeah ok support the dumbass who keeps trying to push laws that go against the constitution
    • Kind of like the Iran Nuclear Deal? DACA? Obamacare? Allowing pedophiles who identify as the opposite sex to use the girls bathroom? Actually hacking the laptop of journalists and spying on them? The Fast and Furious incident? Benghazi? Oh yeah he's an idiot alright 👌.

    • All of that was constitutional right?

    • liam2409

      I don’t support Trump but he’s still allowed to state blatant lies and bigotry against Trump as false. Hell I don’t like either Democrats or Republicans but they are still allowed to disprove straight lies.

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  • Anonymous
    Trump haters are idiots. I am concerned about the people who attack him no matter what. I honestly feel bad for some of them, because they are just believing what they're being told. As they've done their entire lives. I'm surprised a bigger deal isn't being made about ABC editing video footage to make it appear to be bombings in Syria when it was in fact, an event taking place in Kentucky. You can't get any more "fake news" than that. Freedom of the press is meant to protect a press while telling the truth about a government and what's taking place. Nowhere does it defend the press's "right" to falsify news and to invent lies about a sitting president. I fear some people will take the lies that the media feeds them about Trump all the way to bed. They just don't care enough to learn the truth.
    • Real brave, Mr. Anonymous. You know the guy who you support sucks balls when you have to hide your identity to defend him. Sad.

    • I don't hide. Most people who hate Trump can't even give valid reasons as to why they hate the guy.

    • Sabretooth

      @JohnnySigma85 there are plenty.

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