The reason this topic is an argument against feminism is because it's a shining example of the hypocrisy that characterizes modern feminism. Feminists have fought for women to have the RIGHT to serve in the military IF THEY CHOOSE TO, but it has not fought for women to have the concomitant RESPONSIBILITY to serve in time of war the way men have do.
And that is, in a nutshell, what feminism is all about today... women's rights without responsibilities; choice without consequences.
The thing is that women still need to qualify for the military and most do not even with the standards being slightly adjusted. So why would tou demand someone unqualifie go to. fight? And how is that an argument for looking at a woman like she's a sandwhich maker?
But regarding what you said about feminists fighting for women being able to join the military. I don't think the criteria must be adjusted based on gender because in a war women aren't going to be able to pick whether they fight a man or woman. Let the same criteria for everyone and only. the truly qualified ones will fight. And drafting should be made on skills too. An unqualified person can be worse than no person.
Men have to qualify to serve in the military as well, but unlike women, men are required to register for the draft. If feminism was ACTUALLY about equality it would fight for women to be required to register for the draft and go through that qualification process just like men are required to. But feminism isn't about equality at all. It's about rights and choices without responsibilities.
What the hell does ANY of this have to do with looking at women as sandwich makers? I have no idea where you are coming from on that.
I don't think women should be forbidden any jobs, but i don't think the criteria of selection must be adjusted for women when it is a mixed gender thing they are applying for. If it was for a female only sport category, then yeah, makes sense to adjust the criteria.
Your second comment came through after I posted my response. Of course people should be judged based on their qualifications, and all should be judged based on the same standards, regardless of gender. But that's beside the point here. The point is that men are required to register for the draft and women are not. And that is NOT equality, but it IS what feminism has pushed for.
In my country women's standards for police or military are lower than men's. I don't think that is justified considering they need to face the same dangers. And I already said that if drafting was mandatory it should still be for those who are qualified, not based on gender. I just don't see how men being at a disadvantage here is an argument for women being seen as "sandwhich makers". That is entirely another problem which should be fixed.
It's wrong to have different standards for women and men, for obvious reasons.
It is also wrong that men are required to register for the draft and women are not. And that has nothing to do with the standards they must meet to be accepted.
I will ask again... what does ANY of this have to do with whether women are thought of as sandwich makers?
Yes, but guys are arguing that when it comes direct physical combat they're still relied on to defend the weaker ones in the country that can't physically fight for the country. They just want to stop being emasculated. That's what I think they're trying to say. 🤷
I think you have a strange and not well thought out perspective on drafts, wars, and the people who fight in them.
Have you done a lot of research into the history of women during the World Wars?
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Anonymous
(25-29)
+1 y
Women were expected to look after their family and their home. They were expected to do everything people still expect from us today. The military isn't for everyone and being forced to go to war had to be a hellish nightmare. I can see why they're sour about that, but a lot of the negativity against feminism comes from the misinformed.
Drafting is no longer a thing. People love to live in the past and bring it up as a way to argue against something.
No women actively fought against women's right to vote because they didn't want to be conscripted into the military. The draft does in fact still exist and the only way men get the right to vote, get a license, be eligible for state and federal loans (like student loans) is by signing up for selective services. I'm not surprised you wouldn't know any of this because as a woman your incredibly privileged and don't actually have to do anything to earn your rights you just get them for free (and then belittle men who don't get the same rights as you have while proclaiming to be a victim (because this is the essence of feminism, hurt men get rights and power over them then play the victim to get even more power (because women have more rights then men do)).
It's being used as a stick to beat feminists over the head because is shows how feminists want special treatment not equality. In ww1 the suffragettes shut up because they were unafraid of being conscripted. Conscripted Women did great service in WW2 here in Britain, worth looking up.
The reason why they're drafted has nothing to do with being a woman. If they don't wanna be drafted then they have to be treated like men which a lot of them can't take it so they want special treatments instead.
it's used as an argument because "feminism " wants "equality"... so when push comes to shove would women grow a pair and go to war. The answer is no. Equality is in EVERYTHING not just the things feminists want. That means not relying on a man to defend yourself when getting mugged, or doing the heavy lifting when you're moving or taking your place in the military. Equal pay? i'm ALL in for that one, but that means you hit a guy, he can hit back. Equality everywhere
Honestly, I don't think drafting should be a thing at all. What use is a soldier that doesn't want to be there? I do agree that it would mostly consist of men, we are just more suitable on the battlefield. That isn't an argument against feminism, feminism doesn't say males and females are the complete same, it says that they have equal rights. I would say equal rights include the same rules of drafting.
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Anonymous
(45 Plus)
+1 y
“I don’t see how women are privileged here.”
No, you don’t. And that’s the problem with your entire argument. Men die in battle, but the women who are nursing and cooking are most affected. I would be laughing right now if your viewpoint were not so tragically solipsistic.
Eh don't worry about a draft. Back in the day it was needed but now it's not. Changes in the way war is fought + population growth + more poor areas now compared to back then = no need for draft.
0
0 Reply
Anonymous
(25-29)
+1 y
Why should be "the most qualified person" be the men? Women aren't weak or fragil. I'm a soldier and I defeat any fucking men. I love the boys from my unit, they are like my brothers. But I really hate it to be told to cook or do "womens work". That's bullshit!
Your logic is flawed. It is privileged for women to think they do not have to put their lives on the line for country. We should have a more equal establishment in the military like they do in Israel.
No, drafting shouldn't be mandatory and even if it was, only those who really qualify should be taken, regardless of gender or age. The thing is most women or old people wouldn't qualify anyway.
Not just any man would be forced to fight they take the ones that can fight and force them to if the woman can't fight then she won't be forced to fight it's only when a country gets desperate for people to fight when they take the ones that aren't as ready to fight
Military draft is funny when talking with feminists because most "feminists" only want the benefits of being viewed as equals, but the draw backs are completely ignored and/or rejected.
go ask feminists. they are the ones who turn themselves into housewives once there is just a slight possibility for a draft. All of a sudden you get your sandwich.
Why dont women go fight and men can be nurses. This would make up for past inequality. Women should be drafted to the front lines and men can take over as account managers and HR reps because someone has to do it.
I mean if you want to carry wounded men on your backs and get your legs blown off be my guest I personally can't see why anyone would want to go to hell on earth when they could stay at home safe with food heating a warm bed its beyond me
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The reason this topic is an argument against feminism is because it's a shining example of the hypocrisy that characterizes modern feminism. Feminists have fought for women to have the RIGHT to serve in the military IF THEY CHOOSE TO, but it has not fought for women to have the concomitant RESPONSIBILITY to serve in time of war the way men have do.
And that is, in a nutshell, what feminism is all about today... women's rights without responsibilities; choice without consequences.
The thing is that women still need to qualify for the military and most do not even with the standards being slightly adjusted. So why would tou demand someone unqualifie go to. fight?
And how is that an argument for looking at a woman like she's a sandwhich maker?
But regarding what you said about feminists fighting for women being able to join the military. I don't think the criteria must be adjusted based on gender because in a war women aren't going to be able to pick whether they fight a man or woman. Let the same criteria for everyone and only. the truly qualified ones will fight. And drafting should be made on skills too. An unqualified person can be worse than no person.
Men have to qualify to serve in the military as well, but unlike women, men are required to register for the draft. If feminism was ACTUALLY about equality it would fight for women to be required to register for the draft and go through that qualification process just like men are required to. But feminism isn't about equality at all. It's about rights and choices without responsibilities.
What the hell does ANY of this have to do with looking at women as sandwich makers? I have no idea where you are coming from on that.
I don't think women should be forbidden any jobs, but i don't think the criteria of selection must be adjusted for women when it is a mixed gender thing they are applying for. If it was for a female only sport category, then yeah, makes sense to adjust the criteria.
Your second comment came through after I posted my response. Of course people should be judged based on their qualifications, and all should be judged based on the same standards, regardless of gender. But that's beside the point here. The point is that men are required to register for the draft and women are not. And that is NOT equality, but it IS what feminism has pushed for.
Who said anything about adjusting the criteria? Again, totally beside the point of this discussion and your original question.
Waiting...
In my country women's standards for police or military are lower than men's. I don't think that is justified considering they need to face the same dangers. And I already said that if drafting was mandatory it should still be for those who are qualified, not based on gender. I just don't see how men being at a disadvantage here is an argument for women being seen as "sandwhich makers". That is entirely another problem which should be fixed.
What country are you from?
It's wrong to have different standards for women and men, for obvious reasons.
It is also wrong that men are required to register for the draft and women are not. And that has nothing to do with the standards they must meet to be accepted.
I will ask again... what does ANY of this have to do with whether women are thought of as sandwich makers?
Yes, but guys are arguing that when it comes direct physical combat they're still relied on to defend the weaker ones in the country that can't physically fight for the country. They just want to stop being emasculated. That's what I think they're trying to say. 🤷
I think you have a strange and not well thought out perspective on drafts, wars, and the people who fight in them.
Have you done a lot of research into the history of women during the World Wars?
Women were expected to look after their family and their home. They were expected to do everything people still expect from us today. The military isn't for everyone and being forced to go to war had to be a hellish nightmare. I can see why they're sour about that, but a lot of the negativity against feminism comes from the misinformed.
Drafting is no longer a thing.
People love to live in the past and bring it up as a way to argue against something.
No women actively fought against women's right to vote because they didn't want to be conscripted into the military. The draft does in fact still exist and the only way men get the right to vote, get a license, be eligible for state and federal loans (like student loans) is by signing up for selective services. I'm not surprised you wouldn't know any of this because as a woman your incredibly privileged and don't actually have to do anything to earn your rights you just get them for free (and then belittle men who don't get the same rights as you have while proclaiming to be a victim (because this is the essence of feminism, hurt men get rights and power over them then play the victim to get even more power (because women have more rights then men do)).
It's being used as a stick to beat feminists over the head because is shows how feminists want special treatment not equality.
In ww1 the suffragettes shut up because they were unafraid of being conscripted.
Conscripted Women did great service in WW2 here in Britain, worth looking up.
The reason why they're drafted has nothing to do with being a woman. If they don't wanna be drafted then they have to be treated like men which a lot of them can't take it so they want special treatments instead.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/8TtsGIiaR_cit's used as an argument because "feminism " wants "equality"... so when push comes to shove would women grow a pair and go to war. The answer is no. Equality is in EVERYTHING not just the things feminists want. That means not relying on a man to defend yourself when getting mugged, or doing the heavy lifting when you're moving or taking your place in the military.
Equal pay? i'm ALL in for that one, but that means you hit a guy, he can hit back. Equality everywhere
Honestly, I don't think drafting should be a thing at all. What use is a soldier that doesn't want to be there?
I do agree that it would mostly consist of men, we are just more suitable on the battlefield. That isn't an argument against feminism, feminism doesn't say males and females are the complete same, it says that they have equal rights. I would say equal rights include the same rules of drafting.
“I don’t see how women are privileged here.”
No, you don’t. And that’s the problem with your entire argument. Men die in battle, but the women who are nursing and cooking are most affected. I would be laughing right now if your viewpoint were not so tragically solipsistic.
Eh don't worry about a draft. Back in the day it was needed but now it's not. Changes in the way war is fought + population growth + more poor areas now compared to back then = no need for draft.
Why should be "the most qualified person" be the men? Women aren't weak or fragil. I'm a soldier and I defeat any fucking men. I love the boys from my unit, they are like my brothers. But I really hate it to be told to cook or do "womens work". That's bullshit!
"I defeat any fucking men" really? Tell us more
Your logic is flawed. It is privileged for women to think they do not have to put their lives on the line for country. We should have a more equal establishment in the military like they do in Israel.
No, drafting shouldn't be mandatory and even if it was, only those who really qualify should be taken, regardless of gender or age. The thing is most women or old people wouldn't qualify anyway.
Untrue about the most women. Women are just as capable to fight in the military.
Not just any man would be forced to fight they take the ones that can fight and force them to if the woman can't fight then she won't be forced to fight it's only when a country gets desperate for people to fight when they take the ones that aren't as ready to fight
Military draft is funny when talking with feminists because most "feminists" only want the benefits of being viewed as equals, but the draw backs are completely ignored and/or rejected.
go ask feminists. they are the ones who turn themselves into housewives once there is just a slight possibility for a draft. All of a sudden you get your sandwich.
Why dont women go fight and men can be nurses. This would make up for past inequality. Women should be drafted to the front lines and men can take over as account managers and HR reps because someone has to do it.
Cause women say they want to be equal to men but at same time don’t want to be drafted just like men
Oops..
Women are treated like salves huh? Well then stop using us all the time for your own benefit
And yes I think women should go to war , think of the rampage she can cause to the enemies when she's on her periods
I mean if you want to carry wounded men on your backs and get your legs blown off be my guest I personally can't see why anyone would want to go to hell on earth when they could stay at home safe with food heating a warm bed its beyond me