Do men understand physical signs of non-consent? How can I set better boundaries?

[Anonymous]

I recently went on a date to a man’s place. He asked me to go to his bedroom and I said no. He said “come on” and picked me up and carried me to the room without my consent. I had never been picked up like that before and got scared, so I just held him really tight.

Once in the room, he immediately took off his clothes and turned the lights off. He told me he just wanted to cuddle, and I asked him, “Do you promise you just want to cuddle?” He said yes. I got in bed by choice, but I was stressed and scared, thinking what if he does more or hurts me. I felt like I had no other option, so I just got in bed, hoping he would only cuddle.

While in bed, he kept trying to touch my breasts, and I physically moved his hands away, but he kept going back. He tried to put his hand inside my pants, and I said no and put my hand over his to stop him. Then he tried to rub me from outside, and I held his hand away again. After that, he held my fingers and put them on his penis. I had never touched a penis before, and it took me a minute to realize what I was touching. I made a fist and tried to move my hand away, saying no, and eventually he left me alone.

After that, I said I had to go home and asked him to drive me. He got up and said let’s go.

Throughout all of this, I kept wondering why he thought it was consensual. I don’t want to call it sexual assault because I refuse to accept that I was violated, but I also wonder if maybe my signals weren’t clear enough. I pushed his hands away and said no—was that maybe confusing or seen as playful instead of non-consent?

[Orion84]

You were perfectly clear in your signals, and you didn't do anything wrong. This is not your fault.

Men understand consent, and the word "no" should have been enough, but beyond that, your physical signals would have also been obvious to anyone.

This guy simple chose to ignore them, because he's a POS. He should never have continued after you said "no" and it would have been clear that his actions were unwelcome.

Unfortunately, there's not really anything you could, or should, have done differently. You did what you were supposed to, he just didn't listen. I would advise you to stay away from that guy in the future.

[Asker]

Your reply helped me a lot in understanding I wasn't at fault thank you

[Orion84]

I'm glad to have been helpful. You're very welcome.

[Screenwriter]

Though your physical moving away of his hands were clear, BUT you did go into his bedroom and were OK with him taking off his clothes. You were giving mixed messages.

I think you could have said "I said No, and I want to go home." Your allowing SOME touching made him believe he could push for more. So he did because your actions had him to think "maybe."

It's true, this guy was an asshole. But with the carrying you into the bedroom action and your saying you were fearful, I don't know why you got into bed with him. That was your giant red flag.

Don't ever allow any man to do anything like this again. You were lucky he stopped. There are some who would not have. Be direct and set ironclad boundaries. No carrying into bedrooms or getting into bed with a naked man who SAYS he wants to cuddle. That's unrealistic. He was clearly lying.

I would ALSO avoid going to a man's apartment unless you are considering having sex with him. Another mixed message. End your encounter at your front door until you know someone better, feel safe with them and you've had a discussion about sex.

I don't get the feeling you discussed boundaries with this guy because he kept breaking them no matter what physical action you took.

Save going to a man's place for later. Good luck.

[MisterPandemonium]

Have you considered calling the police?

It sounds like you might have been assaulted. A prosecuting attorney would have to figure out what to charge this guy with.

You should probably never go on a date with this guy ever again, or talk with him, or have anything to do with him.

[CherryLove007]

Hey where is the good advice here for this woman? Yes you were molested by this pervert. He used his power and authority to coerce sexual behavior by picking you up after you stated NO to him. And getting nude is the ultimate nail in his coffin. Report this incident. He took it too far and had enough time to stop.

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

Men can’t read body language worth a damn, you basically have to yell at them to get them to leave you alone

[RedTiefling]

What makes you say this?

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

Experience

[RedTiefling]

Do you yell at every man you encounter in person in order to establish the boundary for them to leave you alone?

[CupcakeTheDestroyer]

Only if they violate the social sanctions of personal space to a disturbing degree.

[Asker]

Now i know this. All my gfs told me to start yelling at men too. They truly don’t understand when enough is enough and they don’t comprehend “no”

[RedTiefling]

@cupcakethedestroyer does every man you encounter violate that sanction?

[MisterWack]

There are some dirt bags and assholes who literally don’t care about boundaries.

”I pushed his hands away and said no” yeah that was non-consent, it can’t be seen as playful. But with everything else “I was stressed and scared”, “he kept trying to touch my breasts, moved his hands away”.

When flirting or talking up a woman, if she looks uncomfortable or acts in a way not friendly then absolutely I’m getting out of there. If you put up your hand 🖐️ and say “STOP!” as loud as you can and they still go through with it, 100% not consensual. What you did was that, you made it known the whole time from the beginning, middle, and end yet he didn’t care.

Consensual is wanted, Non Consensual is unwanted.
Since you didn’t want it (and you were clear about it), then it was Non Consensual.

[dudeinohio]

Your signals were TOTALLY clear. He was trying to get through your defenses and failed. When I hear NO, I stop everything immediately. I'm then willing to discuss the issue so I don't make the same mistake again, like saying she has to initiate.

[Asker]

I am so happy to hear that people like you exist! He kept going past all the nos

[Anonymous]

Based on what you said, you made it very clear you only wanted to cuddle. It definitely seems like your behavior would indicate you were uncomfortable with all of his advances. His behavior definitely seems like SA.

[Asker]

Ok glad to know it was obvious cause I thought maybe there is a specific thing i have to do so he understands

[AngryCarl2]

Men understand yes and no. If no doesn't work it doesn't mean they don't understand. That's when you leave. Ideally you don't put yourself in that position with a guy you don't know and trust.

[Asker]

Yeah i never should’ve been alone with him

[bowenw]

I think most guys do, but obviously the guy you were with didn't care and didn't respect you.

[Asker]

He didn’t fr

[bowenw]

I’m so sorry that happened to you. Don’t blame yourself for his actions. You were the victim.

[slatyb]

Never go to a man's home unless you are ready for sex, or you know him well.

[jahaims]

He doesn't respect you and just wants pussy. It has nothing to do with how you communicate