Gender Roles in the 21st Century

[Anonymous]

Gender roles are the roles or behaviors learned by a person as appropriate to their gender, determined by the prevailing cultural norms. These are the bits of your culture or society that assign to you at birth blue or pink (hello, just look at GaG!), a truck or a barbie, to help daddy mow the lawn or mommy cook the breakfast, to grow up to be the provider or the mother, and so on down the line. Some people strictly conform to what some view as completely antiquated gender roles, some fall somewhere in the middle, and some totally turn these notions on their heads.

I think people are too overly concerned with this idea that a boy or a man has to be this one thing and a girl or a woman this other thing when so much in this and the last century has changed to prove that you can do and be whatever suits you, and equally as important, what suits you with the person you are in a relationship with.

Here's the thing...if you like the 50's version of what a man and woman 'should be,' you are going to most likely seek that out in a partner. If you don't find it, you will be dissatisfied and keep looking until you do, and conversely if you can't ever see "playing that role," you will equally look for someone who is more modern in thought and doesn't conform so strictly to what gender roles and stereotypes used to be. It doesn't actually matter if everyone around you thinks one way, and you another, because unless you are weak willed, you aren't going to suddenly change your mind as to how it is you present yourself as man or woman.

I see these types of gender questions and comments all the time...does a man need to cook, what if your husband wanted to be a stay at home dad, would you let him, aren't women supposed to be mothers and raise their kids, who should pay for the check, were things better for men and women back then...and so on and so on. People weigh in, get into arguments, go back and fourth, but at the root of it, we live in a time where there is more choice and opportunity than ever to pick and choose which roles you want to conform or not conform to. I do not think we are going to be rolling back in time any time soon to a time where "everyone" was on the same wavelength because it's nearly impossible to put the genie back in the box, as it were, once it's out, and it's definitely out there.

Neither way of thinking about gender roles is better than the other. Whether back then or now, there was or is no one blueprint for the best way to make things run in society when it comes to who should do what. There was unrest and unhappiness and joy and satisfaction back then as surely as there is now, it's just that now, there is an internet and a social media verse where people can openly talk about it. There are people flipping gender roles on their heads on all corners of the world all the time, so there is nothing to say what someone else can or can't do with their lives, but rather, pick what works for you and yours.

[Anonymous]

I only see the issue of gender roles happening in the US. Where I'm from, no one really cares and its not even talked about and everything is all good. People in the US seem to be making a big issue out of nothing and its only dividing the genders from what I have observed from the 'outside'.

[Opinion Owner]

Thanks for MHO :)

[ADFSDF1996]

I personally don't think it's right to enforce someone to act a way they don't want to act. Most of us men are comfortable with our masculinity, unfortunately there is a "certain group" of people who constantly shame men for being masculine and women for being feminine. In my opinion people should just let a person embrace their gender roles without being shamed for not acting the way other people want them to act. If a man wants be masculine; let him be masculine, if a woman wants to be feminine; let her be feminine.

[meowcow]

Much of your take is just regurgitated bullshit from uneducated online trolls.

In every human civilization, the roles of males and females have developed in very similar manners - even if their civilizations developed completely independent of each other.

The reason that males and females develop similar roles in every society is because of their fundamental biological differences. The same patterns are also seen in the animal kingdom where the male is physically larger than the female. This means men are the muscles... the laborers, workers, and women bear the child and perform most of the domestic work. If a particular family reversed roles, and the woman was in charge of manual labor as the breadwinner, that family would probably starve to death... being outcompeted by every other family where the male is the worker bee.

If gender roles were random in their nature, you would have some civilizations where women do the labor work while men take care of the family. However, this has never been seen in any civilization for the very reason stated before.

The only reason why we see women in male roles today is because through our technological advances, life is a lot easier and people have more time on their hands to explore other ways of living their life.

You don't need to spend hours a day gathering water and food. You simply turn on the tap or go to the supermarket. You don't need to spend weeks knitting and weaving your clothes. That's all done by machines now, and you just go to your mall to buy clothes. All of these little things add up, which gives both men and women more free time. If it were not for this freeing up of time, men and women would still be doing what they have been doing for millions of years.

Do these roles still matter? Certainly. No matter how much you deny it, the fundamental differences in biology between males and females will never change. That is the basis upon which most gender roles arise.

Even though modern women are more likely to have a career compared to their predecessors, when the biological clock rings and they bear children, they will fall back on the biological principals of women as caretakers of the family. They will want to stay at home and take care of their child... breastfeed.. etc... things that men are biologically incapable of performing.

[Frosteh]

I don't know that society in general is attempting to push gender roles onto people, which is sort of how this piece reads. Somewhat dangerously close a kind of social marxists position about oppressive society and how it forces gender roles on people.

People are mostly free to do whatever they like, it's just that if you want to live among society, there's certain benefits to behaving "normally", it means people are less startled around you, they're more likely to be trusting, you'll do a lot better.

Most of the gender roles we have aren't arbitrary, they came about for specific reasons and people continue to adopt them over time because the benefits of doing that typically outweighs the cost.

We've strayed form traditional roles quite recently (in evolutionary time frame), and since then, reported happiness of women has dropped significantly while female freedom has skyrocketed. Google for a meta study of happiness called "The Paradox of declining female happiness" for good data on this.

This is something Jordan Peterson talks very coherently about -
here's a good related little clip

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4-IUsB4ozE

[errorgoodnameunfound]

Dude ofc women are becoming less happy. Because now that some actually want MORE happiness than before, society FREAKS OUT and shoves her back in line. So now she's less happy than before because of the pessimism it causes. I would argue MAJORLY on your point that gender roles cost less. I'd say it costs WAY more. Imagine the time saved when both a man and women both clean the house and both fix their car. Imagine the money men can save if women pay for dates as well because they start earning more. Imagine the benefits of women no longer dependent on men and not being as likely to screw them over. Remember when Target decided to ditch the boys and girls section for toys and combine them? Think of how much less time it takes to set it up and organize. Also if we had a unisex bathroom everywhere instead of two, the amount of doors needed to be built and space it saved would save BILLIONS. ofc it raises sex assault maybe, but thats all. Most people do their biz and thats it.

[Naydyonov]

If two countries compete for resources and each have 1000 men and 1000 women.
Country A sends 1000 women out to fight, Country B sends 1000 Men. Now let's assume that women and men fight equally, very big assumption because on average a man will be much more capable of fighting.

Now, the big battle starts and ends. Both sides retreat, each having lost 900 people.

Country A has 1000 men and 100 women.
Country B has 1000 women and 100 men.

20 years later Country A and B face off once more.
Country A has roughly 150 men aged 18-20 + ~1000 men aged 36+.
Country B has roughly 1500 men aged 18-20 + ~100 men aged 36+.

Assuming in country A there wasn't anarchy because of the intense competition in between men to have a woman Country A will only have been able to birth 50 boys per year at the max.

In Country B each man had 10 partners and so their population didn't take much of a hit.

The point is that putting women into dangerous jobs is much riskier. If in country B third wave Feminism was present then they'd have serious problems.
Country A has 1000 men + 150 new men.
Country B has 100 men + 1000 new men.

How?
Because in all Feminized countries the native population has around 1 child per woman.
Meaning if the battle took place in 2000 then:
C-A:
2000-2003: + 50 *3 = 150
2004-2007: + 50*4 = 200
C-B:
2000-2003: +500 *1 = 500

If Country A has 7 children per woman then by 2020 it will have 1000 men + 150 new men with a reserve of 50 new men a year for 4 years.
Country B by 2020 will have 100 men + 500 new men and no reserve of new men.

Now not only will C-A have a 1.66/1 numerical advantage but it will be able to compensate a part of it's losses.

[Babydyke]

Lol bullshit.

[Naydyonov]

@Babydyke Nope.
Women of childbearing age are the most valuable people in society, which is why logically you wouldn't give them work that could kill them now or slightly later.

[Babydyke]

Whatever you just tried to calculate there is bullshit and you know it.

[Naydyonov]

@Babydyke No.
It's how it is. A population can be left with just 1 man and it will be able to survive. Leave a population with 1 woman and that population will cease to exist.

[Dale1982]

If gender roles are artificial and didn't occur naturally then how does anybody explain how people lived for the thousands of years before mass manipulation and propaganda? Tribes with no influence from the outside world or social manipulation fell into the roles we recognise today as anachronistic but which our parents and grandparents lived. Even in the animal kingdom the male mostly falls into hunter/gatherer and the female nurturer of the young in the den or home. I honestly think some people just like upsetting the apple cart for the sake of trying to leave a legacy or their 5 minutes of fame. Saying that though I'd love women to approach me every time I went out wanting sex, id love them to buy me new football tops and expensive aftershave and take me on holidays and entertain me. I'd love a woman to keep me laughing with her stories and jokes all day long and pester me for sex every 5 minutes. It'd be amazing her wanting to go out and work 5 or 6 days a week and let me sit in the house chilling out and then giving me a chunk of her money every week for 'housekeeping.' I did that shit for years and im not talking about a cushy job planted on my arse all day in an air-conditioned office talking shite to similar workshy cunts. I'm talking soaked through in the winter outdoors shoulders aching from carrying a hundred plus pounds of scaffold on my shoulder constantly all day. Getting a bottle of fizzy juice and a cold roll for lunch whilst trying to defrost your hands on the vans heaters to manipulate the selophane, all the time thinking, is this even worth it. If women can up to that standard of unquestionable slavery and docileness then I'll be the first to doff my cap and say well done. It'll never happen though coz most want just want all the pro's and none of the cons and that's the truth about blurring the lines of gender roles. It's all one way traffic

[metalsucks2]

"These are the bits of your culture"
I or my sister were never taught to do specific things or act a certain way because of where my parent come from (India)

My parents are Indian and both my parents worked, they owned a business, my mom was not a "house wife" instead she hired a nanny/maid and we were all expected to help in the kitchen. Heck my dad would tell both me and my sister to clean the car on weekends.

I do admit that some people especially muslims place certain roles on women and certain roles on men and even in hindu culture which I do not like or agree with. I don't like the whole women must stay at home and men go out and work. Both must work and earn money.

[FreedomByChoice]

you are only 24

[metalsucks2]

@FreedomByChoice
And?

[FreedomByChoice]

its time to join the real world boy.

[FreedomByChoice]

enroll in the army with me

[FreedomByChoice]

we can be like bubba and forest gump i.dailymail.co.uk/.../...900000578-118_634x384.jpg

[Girly1710]

I think it's only a problem if it forces people to do things they really don't want to do. I feel like everyone should do what they enjoy and what they're good at. Utilizing skill sets for optimal efficiency. At work the other day The manager told me to empty these big trays of water which is usually done by a man but there wasn't one working that day so I had to do it and it took me SO LONG because I'm short and it was up on a table and really hard to lift these heavy things and pour them out without sloshing everywhere. Then the next day I saw a man do the same chore so quickly because he could lift them up like they were weightless. Made me feel like I wasted my time the day before. Was that off topic? I had a point but I don't know if it came across.

[Ppiero]

Gender cannot exist without sex, so the real argument should be about sex. Sex is determined by chromosomes, except in some extremely rare cases which can be dealt with with compassion and humanity, but not taken as a challenge to the overwhelming evidence. The overwhelming evidence suggests that sex is a necessary component of human evolution. Unless sex exists, variability would be too low to permit a reasonable chance of improvement. Therefore, sex exists and will exist as long as minds are tied to bodies. To pretend that gender and biological sex are independent is only believed by sophomores who will in time come to a mor reasonable conclusion. A gay man is not a woman: he is a man who is attracted to men.

[404filenotfound]

I'm just as much of an advocate for personal freedom as anyone is and I'm aware that not everyone fits neatly into gender roles. That being said, I also think that a sizable portion of the people that are "flipping them on their heads" are doing so more for political purposes than anything and I believe that a lot of gender roles are rooted in our biology.

[FakeName123]

"Gender roles are the roles or behaviors learned by a person as appropriate to their gender, determined by the prevailing cultural norms."

You already went wrong right here. Gender roles developed culturally and socially, BECAUSE they existed biologically and evolutionary already before. Society and culture just (used to) emphatise and amplify those.

[HungLikeAHorsefly]

You'll hear a lot about how gender roles are necessary due to biological differences, and how for thousands of years they evolved the same way in every culture. I doubt that's actually true. Regardless, a couple needs to do what works best for them. If that's to follow tradition, great. If it isn't, that's fine too.

[John_Doesnt]

Ignorance is the name of the game. Here's a gender role from the 18th century:
s3.amazonaws.com/.../gilbert-stuart-george.jpg
Too much blush?

[Regular1]

In a couple's relationship, the vaginad one cooks, cleans and has sex with the man. If there are kids involved, she takes care of them too. The man mows the grass, takes care of the cars and replaces burned out light switches. Anything different is an abomination to nature.

[Hispanic-Cool-Guy]

Listen lady, a man has no business being a stay at home dad and being feminine washing dishes and cleaning the house etc, that makes a man look weak as hell.

Twisting gender roles will destroy strong families and cripple a nation over time.

Men were created to lead and women to follow their men.

[RealDarkeyes]

Gender roles only exist because of breasts, think about it, we had to feed children female breast milk thousands of years ago but now we have cow milk and milk formulas safe for babies
Now there is no reason that a woman can't do what a man can do besides the thousands of years of staying home caring for the young
And women had to stay home because men can't breast feed and women shouldn't bring their children into a hunt so early

Now gender roles should not be existant

[mamamai]

I have to say, that guy in a apron is super sexy, never thought that would turn me on, but it does.

Personally i like equality. Both people putting a 100% into their relationship. What 100% mean is open to interpretation

[Anonymous]

A lot of women seem to want to reject traditional gender roles in the home while expecting men to still be bound by theirs and preform women's.
Like in your take the pictures are of men doing traditional women's household chores yet I do not see any of women doing DIY, house maintaince, lawn maintaince, car maintaince.

[soulbabe]

What you talkin about boy today I helped my dad put down sub flooring helped my cousin lift his stupid workout machine into the truck (I hate moving shit with him he always forces me to throw my back out) fixed a fence then came inside did laundry dish made dinner cleaned floors and some point this week I need to get some nails so I can fix the rabbit cage while my other cousin laid in his pig pen room playing vidoe games all day

[Opinion Owner]

@soulbabe of course you did dear lol
I only said a lot of women which is true.

[soulbabe]

Now see I feel like your mocking me like I made it up. look any time my Liam brain cousins do something they don't do it right so I have to go out and do it. I wait till thair doing something else so they don't talk down to me actin like I'm stupid when I know more about building than they do.

[Opinion Owner]

@soulbabe only teasing

[soulbabe]

Sorry still pissed off about my cousins room spent 6 hours cleaning it for him to trash it in a hour

[soulbabe]

That and I'm a bit bitchy because my back hurts I correct here in a little bit with yoga

[Poopsiewhoopsie]

That first picture almost gave me cancer. It is common sense that you do what is best suited for you to do. Of course, there are some issues when those roles move, but they don't really move, not really. Nowadays, we have people ignoring why they do not move and trying to force them to move. That is the reason it is such an issue today and why we had many problems with it.

[Phoenix98]

There are only two genders.

And the only gender roles worth doing are the traditional ones.

[errorgoodnameunfound]

Yes because the rest of the world sees that as truth too. (SARCASM) Dude. Times are changing. This isn't the 50's like she said. If you like the ways of the past so much, then build a time machine and go live in it. Society will move on with or without you. I refuse the traditional ways. Many people do. Nothing you can do about it!

[Phoenix98]

@errorgoodnameunfound

There's a difference between what people want to think and what is a biological, scientific fact.

Yeah and how's that looking to you? Riots, civil, unrest, fat and or insane feminists, weekly and even daily terror attacks in Europe. Blacks trying to guilt white people into paying for their stuff, schools segregating students for the sake of fighting racism. People being sent to prison because they said a word someone didn't like, people reporting each other and governments sending those people to prison something both Nazi's and Communists did, I could go on but I'm sure you get the point.

The further society "moves forward" the more it moves backwards. Your not moving forward, technology is sure, but as a society your going backwards and you just keep repeating the same mistakes of the past over and over again.

[Phoenix98]

@errorgoodnameunfound

Also many more support the traditional ways actually, the generation after us, has shown to be more traditionally minded then the people that actually lived in the 40s, 50s

[errorgoodnameunfound]

Dude, that's all off topic and too opinionated. Focus. Sure, there are things untraditional things that happen that aren't great, but all in all, most people are still leaving traditional ways more than they realize and it works fine. I doubt bringing back the 1950's will do much more good either. If you want to further the argument let me know and I'll get some stats and sources or else stay on topic and keep it simple. Usually arguments on that many topics Im warning you will end in insulting contests. It's not worth it unless there are formal rules and a neutral judge. You should do a MyTake and write all you can about the stuff and well argue there. Can't do as much with a 1000 word limit.

[Phoenix98]

@errorgoodnameunfound Well I'm not really interested in debating it to be honest I just was putting my opinion as it is my right to do so.

Just as it is yours.

[Djaaay]

No... there's three.., male , female and idiot

[Phoenix98]

@Djaaay Lol.

[Djaaay]

😲...

[Dog19]

So basically everyone has to go to church, have to believe in God, and they have to follow gender roles. Women cook, men go to work and it should never be the other way around. Which is basically hoe society wants the world to go

[Poncho_Luoncho]

I would try to stop you on this highway of self destruction you are on because of your buy-in to the lies you are being told, but I suspect it's not going to make any difference. Just know that you are being lied to.

You won't believe me when I tell you that you'll be happier when you are older if you are able to stay home and raise your children while your husband provides for the family. Go ahead and date that genderless or feminine man and be prepared for confusion on why you despise him so much.

I'm certain you will reject my premise when I tell you that the "good man," you eventually want isn't going to tolerate the fact that you jumped from bed to bed with any number of bad-boy thugs and rebels.

You also won't like to hear that society has traditions for a good reason. Women are built for domestic roles while men provide and protect their families.

But, go ahead and embrace the lies you are being told. Just know it's not reality and you're gonna be unhappy about it later.

[Dog19]

@Poncho_Luoncho if I'm unhappy I can always divorce him and get a new husband/ boyfriend. Hopefully it won't be that hard.

[Poncho_Luoncho]

There's memes aplenty concerning the reasons why women are single and bitching about the lack of "good men," when they are older. On the bright side, felines aren't in danger of going extinct.

I love your attitude, it ensures that you and your kids will keep the therapists children in college another semester.

But, I knew you wouldn't believe me. Just know that life and reality is going to smack you across the face eventually. They don't care about your theories or what you believe.