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It only 'demonizes' a girl if you take it that way. The whole point of the 'friend zone' is that you're not trying to just be friends, you're trying for something more. If those advances get rejected, you've been friend zoned, ergo, they don't see you as more than a friend. It doesn't negatively portray them, it doesn't demonize them not does it mean that they're expected to 'put out' or be with you for making all of that effort. It just means they weren't interested in you as anything more than a friend. And you're allowed to be bummed out and think that sucks without being a chauvinist or entitled.
Rather then complaining the friendzone doesn't exist then describing how it does, it might be more productive to explain to guys that being a great friend is not a step towards dating and to only spend all teir time talking to friends if they are happy just being friends.
Guys should know that already, but you're right, the title and article are contradicting each other.
I'd agree they "should" know that (should in the sense that it would be good information!) Many young guys (especially some of the nicer, less aggressive ones) seem to NOT know it though. That and they often think they are seeing/showing signs because male-female relationships are not like male-male relationships.
Amen.
Amen @kheserthorpe that is.
Okay and if they don't know that's fine, at their age. But it's the ones that act bitter and throw a fit about it, at any age, that are stupid
Get over it. Guys have always tried to jump through behavioral hoops to attract desirable mates. It sucks to think you're making solid progress towards building a relationship and find out you were spinning your tires and should have been working on another woman.
If you think of showing interest to a woman and them rejecting you as a waste of time that could be used toward another woman, you obviously had no respect for the first woman in the first place.
As for "jumping through behavioral hoops", how about YOU get over it?
This is it exactly. It's wasted time for the person involved. The friend zone may be inherent to dating, but men can still complain about it, just like break-ups are inherent to dating, and people complain about them.
@80HDx That's kind of the opposite of the truth. If we don't have any respect for a girl, we won't be her friend. We might still try to have sex, but we won't invest personally in her.
When a guy invests personally in building a relationship, you can be pretty sure he really likes her.
When a girl realizes that's happening, she should let him know as soon as she decides if romance is completely off the table. If she knows and strings him along by letting him think he has a chance, she's burning his other chances and not being a very good friend. Song to explain below.
www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DX7Zp7oh1smY&ved=0CCEQyCkwAA&usg=AFQjCNHzZtrvyGLbatLNLdH-KSkXJc_nMA
Because all songs explan the truth.
And you said you would be "wasting your time you could use on another woman." I sure as shit would not want to hear that me being someone's friend is wasting someone else's time. Girls don't want to say "I don't want a relationship" in fear of the guy saying, "I never said I wanted one" so maybe guys should be more forward and say their interest up front and it saves us both the trouble of "wasting time." If you want to know something, you gotta ask for it.
Not "could" use. Should use. If a guy is looking for a mate and he's on a dead end road, that's really important information. We're not young forever, and if you waste time pursuing something you'll never have, you're not looking at other options and pursuing them. It's simple logistics.
If you don't want him, let him know so he can find someone else who does want him.
That's not too much to ask from a friend is it?
There seems to be some miscommunication on what the friend-zone is. It's simply a term to describe a person that has romantic interest to another person that regards them as nothing more than a friend. Now what you're referring to is a typical attitude some people have when someone they like doesn't reciprocate that back to them due to their lack of romantic attraction to the other person. While people are not obligated to like you back regardless of what you might think, that has nothing to do with the friend-zone, it just has to do with how some people think when they themselves have been "friend-zoned." What you're talking about is not the friend-zone, but rather some people's bad reaction to said "friend-zone."
*-Girls get friend zoned too.
*-Guys can shove them selves in the friend zone: liking/loving a female friend but not daring to suggest sex because they don't want to get banned from an uptight friend's life for suggesting it. They can get signals the girl supposes "clear enough" but don't understand them or believe them to be jokes or teasing ('to good to be true' or 'she has had two drinks') and thus don't act on them, for friendship's sake, valuing friendship over a break up after eventual sex. The eternal "oblivious guys" story. Sometimes the girls are thankful for it, other times they friend zone him. (while in fact, the guy did it himself.)
Also:
*Annoying nice but useful friends get in the friend zone*
"*Annoying nice but useful friends get in the friend zone* "
Interesting. Is this the romantic equivalent of Stalin's "useful idiots?"
the West made it a Stalin quote but " G. K. Chesterton said before Stalin : 'Evil always wins through the strength of its splendid dupes; and there has in all ages been."
I get what you're saying and can't disagree, though I feel it's a case of the male not saying what he means to say. Some do try to be friends, good ones, too. But from personal experience, it is quite difficult to be a good friend while your love interest is swooning over and smooching her beau in front of you while you try and point out the philosophies conveyed in Fight Club. Do you remember how painful a breakup is? Been cheated on? That is kinda what it feels like. It especially hurts for me, a 22 year old Aspie with no emotional safeguards for things like this. I walk away because she deserves better, she doesn't need me lingering over her shoulder, like a ghost, telling her who to date. That's what her dad's for. And somehow, I'm the jerk...
It's one thing to try to get a single girl but it's annoying and disrespectful to be chasing a girl in a relationship...
What can I do or say if I try to befriend a girl that rejected me and she ignores me completely? I was ready and willing to swallow my pride and settle for friendship and she pretended like I wasn't there. It's like I try and try again to be a good guy but people want to discourage me from doing so. I'm not sure if it's because people think I'm creepy or what, but this is why I don't bother anymore.
I don't like the term friend zone either, thats why i stopped having that many female friends, if you have feelings for a girl you should tell her sooner rather than later so you don't feel like you invested so much into a girl only to be rejected...
On another note, Being friend zoned or being an upset dude in the friend zone is a completely valid feeling. Male entitlement has little to nothing to do with being upset that you got rejected by a girl you invested in.
And you see the womens point of entitlement when they ask someone to stop liking them and to see them only as a friend. And then becoming angry because they that person rejected the friendship. After all, its unacceptable to ask a woman to change how she feels, but it is perfectly fine to ask a male to. And if he doesn't want to because its to painful, he needs to grow up and be her friend.
You should learn to formulate your opinion in a way where you don't sound like one of the woman hating douchebags I described
No girl says "lose feelings for me and love me as a friend. " Well actually I'm sure *some* do but most don't. They're saying "I like you as a friend and hope we can continue being friends. " but you're not obligated to continue that friendship. Obviously.
www.girlsaskguys.com/.../a7737-the-friendzone-does-not-exist-the-way-you-think-it-does
Simply put. Women think that a male friend should simply stop having feelings for her and continue to be her friend. If he chooses to leave, see how fast the anger flares up in her. I've seen countless questions pertaining to this. I see two sides to this coin, while you only see heads. Most males don't choose to develope feelings for a friend. It happens. Sticking around will not make the feelings dissipate. The man does what is best for him, and in turn gets slammed for not being able to shut off how he feels in order to continue being her friend. A few days ago, a girl on gag called her male friend a pussy for choosing to leave the friendship. That would quantitate to her wanting him to conform to her wants and needs. But then again, it's acceptable.
She has no obligation to date him. I agree.
She asks to stay friends, he has no obligation to do so. I agree.
Its that second part that women tend to forget.
Do you not see how leaving someone because they don't wanna be your girlfriend would cause a girl to be mad? Like you're her friend for 5 years and because she rejected you, you suddenly stop being her friend and you expect her to not show any emotion?
That is what you are asking the male to do, is it not? Not to be upset.
This person is completely correct. A lot of woman do feel entitled to define the terms of their relationship, and get angry when she can't. There is no difference. The guy gets hurt, the guy gets angry. The woman gets hurt, she gets angry. They are both only thinking of themselves, and that is normal human behavior.
Yes I see why leaving someone because they don't wanna be your girlfriend would cause a girl to be mad. You don't seem to realize how painful and selfish it is to ask someone that loves you, to remain just friends, as you date other people. Sometimes guys need to stop being friends in order to get over her. It is harder, and in some cases impossible to move on, with that person still in your life. That is the same reason people follow the no contact rule with their ex's.
@been_waiting
"No girl says "lose feelings for me and love me as a friend. " Well actually I'm sure *some* do but most don't."
I agree most don't. However, it might be more common than you think, given the number of women I've seen who express anger at a man who didn't call them a bitch, didn't get angry at the girl, didn't feel entitled to sex, but terminated the friendship because it was too painful.
It is NOT OK to get angry at the girl for rejecting you. Similarly, it is NOT OK to get angry at the guy who doesn't terminate the friendship out of anger but terminates it out of pain. They are both equally shitty.
Yet in this very thread, the take owner said, "Do you not see how leaving someone because they don't wanna be your girlfriend would cause a girl to be mad?" and you leave that statement totally unchallenged. Being angry at someone for terminating a friendship which is painful is selfish and cruel.
i'm not even gonna read a comment from someone with the username heavensgift2girls. But I do agree with what @Bluemax said. When I said that part I meant throwing away a meaningful friendship because of a petty and selfish reason like that. But no one is entitled to friendship either, just like a relationship, so I guess I looked hypocritical when I said that and I apologize for giving out the wrong idea
Heavonsgift2girls said pretty much the same as bluemax and I.
Hm well that's not what I saw when I read hos response to this
That goes both ways men are not obligated to listen to female emotional crap like a boyfriend. So a girl strings alongs. A dude for months and then is surprised to find out her feelings were false and gets upset over the deception, doesn't sound crazy to me. Check your female privilage
Give this man a medal
Great take. I like it a lot. When I was a young man, I unfortunately used to be that guy that would expect something after being “nice” to a woman. It was a pretty douche bag thing to do, as real friends do things like this out of kindness. I see now how I was wrong and how ridiculous my behaviors were. I had to learn the hard way and am embarrassed and ashamed of how I acted when I was younger. It’s unfortunate that most guys like this are going to learn the hard way.
Wow. Im really glad you actually saw the point I was trying to make and im glad you matured in that area!
I have personally been friendzoned so its hard for me to know what to say. I started to fall in love with her but I was too shy to say. I did things for her only a boyfriend would do. she was leading me on. I just wish in retrospect that she would have just told me she wasn't interested right away since she clearly knew I loved her
did you tell her directly? unless you straight up told her and she said she just wanted to be friends then you would know if she actually knew you loved her. so you can't say for sure if she was leading you on. were you doing things only a boyfriend would do? or a best friend? did you spoon with her in bed? or kiss her? etc?
Girls aren't as analytical as you think- sometimes we are dense. When you say she "clearly" knew you loved her... if you did not tell her, she most likely never knew.
Well I was pretty young at the time so I didn't consider it then. As you know kids can be stupid and I just assumed that she liked me back and eventually it would work out. Looking back at it I feel embarrassed over how much I tried to please her all the time without getting anything back. And yeah she told me several years later that she knew I had a crush on her
I'm glad you see now what went wrong. Some of these guys pursue the girl without her reciprocating and then complain when they see they're getting nowhere.
Well in my mind I was so sure that it really was going somewhere. Love can make you blind so to speak. I just wish she would have told me she didn't like me. Because once again she told me afterwards that she knew.
She probably didn't address your feelings for her cause she thought it'd make things awkward between you guys if she didn't like you back. If you didn't come right out and tell her you liked her, she couldn't say yes or no to being with you so she just went along without saying anything.
Well she was the only one that knew how we both fellt about our relationship. I honestly thought she liked me back during our entire friendship. Like in my head I didn't feel like I even needed to confess to her because I thought it was already established that we liked eachother xD. I was 14 so yeah lol
Lol it's fine when you're 14 and take it with pride, just don't be 34 and crying lol
What I want to know is if im wrong for not wanting to waste my time on something that will never be there i. e. keeping a friendship with your interest because you are right guys shouldn't befriend a girl they like because they feel like they will get rewarded
The way I see it is, if you wouldn't want her as a friend, what's the point of having her as a girlfriend? So if you're interested in her, be her friend first and if she's not interested when you ask her out then don't take it personally and continue as friends.
No i dont take it personally I actually prefer that they say that they're not attracted to me so i won't waste my time life is to short to waste my time and effort on someone thats not interested
Well, you have a solution that a bunch of guys couldn't come up with
"friendzone" seems to have two definitions, the one you gave and the other I've encountered is that it's when the very fact that the two have had a platonic relationship means that the girl can't see him as a romantic interest - that is she could potentially have been attracted to him otherwise, but having been friends somehow puts a psychological block on that (just like being her brother would). So I'm never sure which people mean when they use it...
Either way I agree with you that being a good friend doesn't entitle anyway to affection or sex from the other person. It's not a word I use.
I hope girls don't when guys fall for them though, it's not like I can always avoid liking a friend. It's not like I have some sinister plan to befriend her and then guilt her into giving me sex either, I generally don't feel that way about someone until I know her better.
Friendship zone is just a description for a particular social occurrence. It is real. The problem comes in that although it is a neutral and natural occurrence that happens often, some people see it as a bad thing because its happening to them. It like being angry at a dog because it runs after somebody else instead of you lol
People who ramble about a bogus topic annoy me... I've no patience for losers who befriend girls in the hope of banging them but girls who bitch and moan about guys like that... They're attention hungry untermensh... Just don't string these losers along, that way everyone's happy
I feel the same way about girls who think guys are obligated to have a relationship with them after sex.
hahah, lol
Okay, the friendzone is a thing. Guys go through it. Girls go through it. I have (JOKINGLY, keyword is JOKINGLY) complained about being in the friendzone. It all matters on how you act upon it.
If you're going to see as being placed in the friendzone as "wasting your time", then you were not worth to even consider being out of the friendzone. It goes as the famous quote: Time WORTH wasting was such time NOT WASTED.
Like she said, it happens to men and women. Thing is though, women are far LESS likely to just be friends with some super cute guy who turned them down. You see the male version happening more often, that's all.
I am actually still good friends with this guy I was incredibly friendzoned by. He is the non-celebrity embodiment of Chris Hemsworth (aka HOT). I enjoy his company so I am still close with him. I tried with him, but it just didn't work. Life happens. Shit goes on. Doesn't mean I need to lose a good friend just because they don't want my vag or my heart.
Wow I love this take so much.
Couldn't have said it better
10/10
I'm glad you agree, thanks!
I agree with you with everything you said. Although I do believe the friendzone does exist, some guys are nice and funny so they make good friends but if the girl is not attracted towards him then that's all he is, a friend. She is not obligated to like him back. The friendzone means that a girl sees you as a friend and does not even consider having a relationship with you.
Thank you for seeing the point I was trying to make. And yeah, the title could have been different cause I guess it does exist although it doesn't have to be a bad thing.
I've had girls who were HIGHLY attracted to me and who told me that they liked me strongly and they still tried to put me in that little friendzone bullshit. And half the time they were the ones who walked up to me... therefore what you're saying is partially invalid. A girl can be extremely attracted to you, but still use you like a pawn because you let her, whereas the guy that usually makes it to the boyfriend level wouldn't tolerate that shit... which is why I leave that type of person alone. But it's humorous because as soon as you find a girl who's straight up with you and who really wants to make you her boyfriend, that same girl comes to her senses and tries to snatch you away from her. Guys knows this situation ALL TOO WELL.