You can't be a "modern woman" and expect a traditional man. Traditional relationships were based on a modernized version of Chivalry, and Chivalry is based on men and women having very different and distinct roles in society. It is the opposite of Equality, and cannot coexist in a relationship with equality, anymore than you can be in a room that is both light and dark, or loud and silent.
Women overwhelmingly choose Feminism, which isn't equality, but let's just say that it is. In equality, you give up all of your chivalrous privileges and get treated just as men would treat another men. Feminists INSISTED on this, in fact. Except many still somehow expected to retain their chivalrous privileges (without any of the responsibilities of chivalry), while also enjoying all the privileges of equality (without any of the responsibilities, of course), and are shocked and upset that men aren't willing to play along.
The rule is, you get to pick ONE OR THE OTHER, and whichever you choose, you get BOTH the privileges AND the liabilities of, and you don't get to switch back and forth as it suits you.
There ARE traditional men in the world, but they are only interested in traditional women, so if you aren't a traditional woman, then these men simply aren't available to you, and you will have to choose a "modern" man if you want to be in a relationship, and that comes with modern sensibilities and behaviors.
It's more of a fast food culture now. Or maybe a buffet is a better analogy. When it was no longer necessary for guys to put in the time to get serious, it also started shifting toward not being worth the time and effort. Everything and everyone are disposable and interchangeable nowadays. It's a big part of why I just walked away from the whole concept years ago.
You are only seeing the romantic part.. a lot of people would hook up at parties and with less effective birth controls some had to marry and have a family with their ONS. Also before women got their own rights they would barely survive if they did not marry a man, and some had to take whomever was proposing and could more easily end up with someone abusing them. Marriage have also for centuries been an instalment to join households for business and strategic purposes, not for love.
It might be more rare to get to know each other before having sex now (because sex is not as high risk anymore plays a huge factor here), but it is still a thing and you can still meet people who is likes it that way.
I prefer this modern world for sure. It has all the opportunities, just lower risk to end up in a situation you cannot get out of.
When people were real and genuine 😩.
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People arenāt old fashioned anymore! Thatās the main reason why dating canāt be as old fashioned as it was.
Assuming that 'things were better back then' is an oft-made mistake. Cheating, break-ups and hang-ups have always been there. It does depend on how far back you are looking and what culture it is and if you are looking at movies or history. It used to be (in most cultures) a deadly sin for a woman to cheat (yes back then it was almost always the woman that was blamed) and if a woman was caught---she could be killed for it. So, best answer based on the question? No death penalty now for women stepping out. (no not a sexist, men step out too, but usually didn't get in trouble for it)
Best answer to what I think is your intended question: Gender roles are no longer really there. We don't have a set of rules/guidelines to follow anymore. Best analogy? Ballroom dancing with very precise movements and choreography vs freestyle at a club. One has a set of rules for you to follow and that allows you to express yourself and get to know your partner in a clearly defined role/place. The other is chaotic. It can be fun and it can be a total train wreck.
It canāt because feminism. Iām not going into all that Bulldog butā¦with this new modern women brought in by feminism the games completely changed.
Ima list these changes to make it easyier on me and Ide like your opinion on it.
Sex is easy to get without commitment. Commitment dangerous for men.
Men donāt feel they gain anything from commitment.
What are they committing to though? Women donāt perform the old fashioned roles anymore but weāre still expected to?
Datings become complicated. One standard made a man a gentleman or not. Now however the same action to one woman is seen as chivalrous while to another itās sexist and even possibly assault.
Men and women donāt value each other anymore. I need to go into detail on this oneā¦social media like Instagram and dating apps inflate young womenās egos and make them feel important. But thatās a manās job. Honey just cause you a little cute does not entitle you to a good man. Also the really hot or rich men whom can give young ladies everything they want donāt value these women anymore then another option of which they got many. And women donāt seem to notice the guys that would value them because these are the guys without options.
These are the trade-offs accompanying the social revolutions of the last 70 years. That I can think of:
The behaviours within society have altered to reflect the incision we made to part of our nature; the biological purpose of sex. The invention of the pill changed the meaning of sex from making a family to pleasure. Now the child is an unwanted afterthought - if considered at all - of a hedonistic pursuit. It turns out Hedonism isn't very meaningful or satisfying.
Women's liberation under a Marxist reframing of society also contributed, which has also continued even as feminism has somewhat receded, expanding into many social dimensions; religion, race, sexuality, etc. The relationships between men and women have been upset by a totalitarian ideal of an impossible equality between everything.
People's prior commitments to functional philosophy, attitudes, and norms (which can still be found in many places today outside the Western liberal world) have been usurped and disregarded as merely being "old fashioned" in favour of apparently non-functional ones.
That said, question your beliefs and live how you like, maybe you'll be able to recreate what was disinherited, or maybe you'll be the genius to find some other stable form that's neither this nor that.
You can thank feminism for shitting on men who have traditional values. Doing chivalrous things like opening a door for a woman is oppression nowadays. Men have adapted to today's standards of women. Being old fashioned is often seen as weak, needy, desperate, etc. Women react to the highs of men who have 'bad boy' traits. Old fashioned acts are often a shortcut to the friendzone or simply rejection al together. If women in their masses liked old fashioned men, then men would still act old fashioned.
The problem lies in women trying to be "Modern women" but expecting guys to be traditional. Bigger problem is that all modern women expect a whole lot with very little in return from themselves. Add that so many people hype them up, we have average looking girls believing their super models. Im not saying its bad to be average I consider myself average looking. But most girl just go out looking for validation. Only decide to settle down after they have been ran through. Expect a 6 figure man, 6ft tall, fit man, thats gonna take care of every little thing for them, but only bring pre used coochie to the table.
Ah yes dating the old fashioned way? You mean going out with a guy you barley kmow getting pregant than due to the social pressure you have to get married to a person you barley now?
The form of dating you see as old fashioned is just in films. Dating has always been the same, it wasn't all flowersand drinking milkshakes at a dinner.
I wish the same were true. Nowadays I hear there is a 3 day rule: After 3 days of dating, you need to hook up with a guy. What? I don't hook up with strangers. It seems that sex is something like a sport these days, and taken not very seriously between couples that are new to one another. That, I find sad.
I was about to respond to this and then I read the response from MrOracle. He nailed it and I can't really add much. I'll just say that I see a LOT of women lately who are complaining about men not being old fashioned or traditional in dating anymore. I'm sorry to point fingers but women are to blame for that, for all of the reasons he outlined already.
What women are getting today is exactly what anyone with any common sense could have told you that you would get decades ago when you asked for equality. Equality means equality, and that's not just "equality when it's convenient and beneficial for women". It has consequences, as you are seeing now.
Women, as a whole, have made their collective bed and now they have to lie in it. You let the genie out of the bottle and I'm pretty sure it's never going back in. If it is, it's going to take a hell of a lot of work and effort on the part of women, and I don't see that happening, ever.
Because those good men keep getting shut down, while bad boys use women for sex. After so many first dates, just feel used and unwanted. Now I avoid that. Well actually it's way too hard to me women today. Dating site suck so much. Do you realize we have feelings too? We arnt just a wallet? Man has to ask out the woman, man has to pay, man has to ask he'd put in second date, man has to pay, man has to crack the code if she likes him or not. Man has to make the first kiss, first everything it seems. When both are fully grown adults, both work hard, so why does the scale alway top in one direction? It's all mentally stressing. So hard to trust people too.
It can be if you want it to be. Before I married the woman I am with, I got to know her and then asked her father's permission to court her. I had to come to her house every week and be in the presence of her family so they could get to know me. Then, after a while, they permitted me to take her out on some old fashioned dates alone. We did that for a while and eventually married.
Technology, Feminism (not necessarily saying it's a bad thing overall, just that in relation to dating, increased rights for women means less reliance on men, so less pressure to find a long term partner) media environment pushing the generally looksist nature of our society (being average looking is no longer good enough for a lot of people), the rise of fast/instant gratification culture meaning people don't want to invest time... probably more.
My advice would be if you find someone that you match well with, agree that both of you limit your social media use to only communicating with friends you know IRL, no posting pictures without each other's approval (for friends only, not public posts at all), and explain that you want a relationship without all of the modern destructive influences/expectations.
Because feminism has happened back in the day being traditional mean basically accepting gender roles but most women wasn't technically satisfied with the stay at home wife role. Basically chivelry and feminism can't possibly coexist with each other without cancelling the other one out.
Lmao to the guys being mad about feminism. Apparently having basic dignity and freedom as a human being means that you are no longer suitable for love and relationship because men can't own you and control you, cute.
If you want it to be that way you have to require it from a man. If they donāt want to take time to get to know you and be meaningful you just let them go. It is harder now to find that and I think it is because online dating makes it so easy to find meaningless hookups.
Well said! But first you would have to convince the people to get their heads out of their fucking "smart"phones for at least an hour at a time... :-/
It can be, but lots of men and women prefer hookups and online dating now and you canāt expect much from that. People saying itās because of āequalityā is wrong. Getting to know one another has nothing to do with that, you either want to or you dont, it has everything to do with peopleās morals and what they actually want.
Feminism. It's told gentlemen they're "misogynistic," attractive women they're "problematic," and average single men they're "incels" and people actually fell for it.
When you say "old fashioned" I assume you mean like how my grandma and grandad were like when he used to beat her and take her money to go down the pub with. Super romantic but that was just common place back then 🙄
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