I see it as a sociological response to much of the genuine man-hating spouted by feminists.
For example, a feminist wrote a book that suggested men be killed until people listened about women being murdered. I wish I could find the reference, it was in the past year or so. She was interviewed, and defended it.
How many times have I seen "kill all men," or "men are trash," or have had strangers walk up to me and call me a rapist for literally no reason? Too many times to count.
That level of murderous desire from women I simply do not see from men. They want to dissociate from women. Others definitely hate, but it is not a malicious, murderous hatred. I have yet to see one time where a man mentions to "kill all women."
MGTOW is loosely related to the men's rights movements, though it's different in that many men simply disconnect from society. That should be expected. These are not older men for the most part, but younger men disillusioned and disenfranchised trying to grasp what they can after being called rapists, child abusers, murders, and basically horrible people. Some men come back with that same level of hatred, because they're as immature as the women who espouse such malice.
MGTOW, by nature of being a backlash movement, will always generate friction just by existing, though it is also proof that bigotry exists in the feminist camp, simply by the statements made and actions taken.
Frankly, genuinely equal rights would probably make everyone miserable, and if they could stop being selfish and feeling entitled for a moment to have compassion for another person, then we'd start to see society heal. Instead, we're distracted by sports, material goods, and wealth, which has taken a dive in the past few months, leaving us to focus on other things, now seemingly news/politics oriented and turning more negative than before. We're no longer politely numbed.
I think it's all linked together and is a giant diarrhea sandwich.
It's multiple thing's.
The funny thing is that it's mostly female's that has something to hide or protect that isn't fun that it gets exposed, enlightened and that they doesn't have any control over it.
It's mostly a domination thing. that they can't control.
a lot of people that have certain kind of privilege and power over an other group tends to misuse it.
They doesn't like it when they loosing it.
Doesn't like that the one's they doesn't have control over enlight others since they gonna lose more, make it harder for them to to live in the same way as before.
(It's not fun and are unpleasant to change and develop)
Sure. you still have small group's of bitter people in that lifestyle group.
It's totally understandable when they have got enough of being surprised and misused.
It happens to every group that gotten surprised.
That do you notice from people that did flee from fascism and dictatorship.
Has nothing to do with victim complex like in certain ideology groups that actually suffers from mental health problems (they are in a dark place in their mind's). that kind of ideology group is a total different story that isn't popular to talk about since they behaves like some kind of narcissist.
A lot of them sadly are hypocrites. They say they don't to be around women altogether, no marriage, relationship dating, sex, nothing. BUT those same guys are watching pornography and masturbatimg but so called celibate. Tgeir premise at the beginning got me and I understood until I began seeing how many are bitter, spiteful and hateful men. And they're trying to recruit other males into their cult just like feminism does. It's just a male version of it and it's crazy.
As a celibate person myself, I am all for going your own way, but if your going your own way why you do need vasiy a club to declare it? Some have rational reasons for it, others are toxic just like any group. You have toxic Christians, toxic atheist , toxic leftist, and the lost goes on. Anybody who's toxic I don't like and need in my life period. Always loud and talk the talk bit don't walk the walk.
I think it's less to do with us hating the movement, and more so hating the irrational excuses those men being up instead of being responsible for their decisions. More than half the things they day makes no sense. Sometimes they have a good point, other times they do not. Just like feminism. Depending on who your hearing from, some have really good arguments, but many do not.
no no no they want a relationship
but they admit we are just not worth it
women require to much work
and they don't feel safe around women
so to be safe they decided not to date
how would you feel if someone kidnapped your child
I promise you would not like it
A lot of them really don't and can't with that attitude. As long as they pursue ungodly women and do ungodly things how do they expect to have a relationship and a family? Or Anybody? We do not require too much work. I should know because I am celibate myself and I have never dated, nor do I feel safe around men for that kind of relationship anyway. So that's how I know because I have spoken to many of those guys. And a lot of them have pent-up issues that usually have to do with them and nothing to do with these women. A smart man knows not to pursue a woman that isn't good for them. They just want to lust after women, then when they get involved with that same woman, they want to know why they got problems. And not only dating wrong, they not only just choosing the wrong people in chasing after the wrong people, they're doing the wrong things to begin with. And I have no desire of changing.
And they have no desire of changing*
I would not have somebody try to touch my child, it's going to be like Taken with Liam Neeson. And that's it. If they truly want peace only God can give him that peace. A lot of them don't even believe in God. So that says a lot right there. Can't ask for Godly things if you don't even want to serve a God you don't even believe in.
We know there are bad women out there. But they want to do bad things while chasing after good women. When a good woman is not accepting of those things, then they are resentful and angry. Relationships do take work. And a woman is no different as a man is. Just that men have bow become so sexually desperate that now women have enough options to find a mate. Whether she finds a stable one or not depends on her. They're just tired of being an option. That's it. What's not okay, is crapping on an entire gender for making decisions that we have no choice but to live with.
most of them have families
but I will agree with one thing most of them
have no GOD in them so I do agree with that
but women still need to change
YES IT IS NOT ALL WOMEN
but a ton of them have to change
Ecclesiastes 7:28
while I was still searching but not finding-- I found one upright man among a thousand, but not one upright woman among them all
Quran
I was shown Hell and I have never seen anything more terrifying than it. And I saw that the majority of its people are women.” They said, “Why, O Messenger of Allah?” He said, “Because of their ingratitude (kufr).” It was said, “Are they ungrateful to Allah?” He said, “They are ungrateful to their companions (husbands) and ungrateful for good treatment. If you are kind to one of them for a lifetime then she sees one (undesirable) thing in you, she will say, ‘I have never had anything good from you
AND THIS REALLY HAPPENS
tons of women do this
men do the best they can for the women
and she literally says you have done nothing good for me
if these ancient texts are telling the truth
I feel bad for women without GOD
Thanks, both, for your thoughts. I won't get into the religion debate because there are no winners in those but you both indirectly bring up a good point: this is nothing new.
The reason why you hate MGTOW watching porn is because porn is free. If more and more men turn to porn instead of real women it would mean less money, attention and free stuff for women. That's why you don't like it. You want commitment from one man and another one thousand white knights constantly serving your vagina hoping to get a chance to ejaculate inside you. So yes, porn is awesome and fun.
No I hate it's because again, it's hypocrisy on their part, besides it beong a sin. Sex is not free, there is always a price to pay even with pornography. First of all I am a Christian woman who believe in Christian values. I believe that when God said there's only but one man for one woman and woman for one man, it is one man for one woman and one woman for one man. I don't need a Thousand Nights and come in from one man. I don't want nobody to serve my vagina. I want somebody to serve the Lord. I am a human being as anybody else. And I don't want to be no whore. So how dare you call me a whore when I'm a virgin. It's sad to know that you have to beg or even try to fight just to have one person for the rest of your life. You can say is awesome and fun, but look where it leaves you. It leaves you lonely and miserable. In some cases make you want to lose your mind. Some of you already raped and sexually molest women already. Don't call me no whore.
You don't even love yourself if that's the case. You watching pornography and masturbation is a sign of self-hatred. You have no love in you, and it shows that you are fully on capable of loving someone else in return. You don't seem to understand that it is perfectly okay to be by yourself. But it's not okay to sin before the Lord doing those things. If you don't mind going to hell for that that's your business. But don't you dare try to drag someone else to hell with you. I have been by myself my entire life, never once had wanted to do those things, or even entertain the idea. But apparently it's a fairytale or a fantasy nowadays, to marry young, grow old and die together in marital bliss. That's how I know so many of you are hypocrites. In my opinion you're no different than the feminist. Now you hate all women but blame them for hating all men. You don't see what you're doing is what making any woman of any background, so called race, religion, faith, etc despise you. If you were really mgtow, and really against involving yourself with all women, you would not be needing pornography and masturbation. You will really be by yourself. But you're with them in your mind and with your penis. Spiritual fornication and your judging women. That's the only reason why feminist is a winning the battle, and so many women growing tired of your whining. And the fact that you think that sex is dirty and perverse is highly disgusting. And it speaks double when other men also hate your movement. Congratulations. You just became a religion.
I don't love myself? LMAO Said the christian woman who adheres to the most self-hating, self-destructive religion ever founded. Nah Im good lass. You better check yourself with that suicidal religion of yours. And by the way, by saying that there is always a price to sex you indirectly admitted that all women are whores who use sex as a bargaining tool. More porn to the people!
The things of God is not self-hating or self-destruction. Religion is religion, and it's man-made. You don't even bother to hear yourself you don't even bother to check yourself because there's something psychologically and mentally wrong with your mind. And you don't love yourself if you really love yourself, you would not be saying and thinking the way you do. And no, all women are whores and we don't all used as a bargaining tool! You still self-destructive in your own mind, you don't say you're in a reprobate States. Because you choose to. You're the one that self-destructive. All the Bible does it show you exactly who you are, evil.
Go preach your suicidal religion to someone else. Someone as stupid and gullible as yourself maybe. And yes. All women are whores. You said so yourself. You pay a price for sex. Women know this very well and use it to their advantage, This is female behaviour 101 since the cave days. Even your religion acknowledges it.
Because everything is speaking is out of jealousy and envy. You can't stand to see anyone else happy because you're miserable and unhappy. God long existed before religion ever came to be. He formed rasoul, he knew who you were before you knew your own existence, before he was sent down to be conceived within your mother's womb, and even you know his existence. That's why you hate him so badly. Because everything that you speak out of your mouth flows from your spirit and your soul because you're broken as a person. You are poor the righteous things of price, but you hate the sin that you were so much enjoy. You're like a pig in a pigsty. Enjoy the freedom of the pen, love being dirty, can't even see that they're dirty. Even animals have common sense than you do. You're literally a beast.
The price for sin is death. I don't got to preach anything I'm telling you the truth that you don't want to hear. Everything you want to say to me you actually talking about yourself. I don't believe in a religion, I have no religion, but I have a belief in Christ, and he's as real as you and I. Don't be going around twisting words in my mouth and say that I said all women are whores cuz I never said it. I said there is a price to sin. You going to pay the price no different than you stole something from a store. And you're already paying a price for it but you actually thinking that way about women and it's disgusting. You're the one that stupid and gullible to believe that pornography and everything else is not taking a toll in your mind. And I highly suggest you get your stuff psychological help for that dick in your body with your brain and get an MRI scan and I would not believe that your brain is anything less than corroded with less gray matter, and IQ severely low.
All- this is why I said that when you talk/argue religion there are no winners. Let's avoid the personal attacks. Both of you have passionate positions and reasons for them.
@Freddy78361
There is no such thing as religion and you have to understand something. This is not a personal attack against him or anybody else. This is me song correction of the way of life that we all supposed to live. You decided to ask a question that requires a Godly answer. And the answer is simply this. As long as people continue to live in sin we're going to continue to have this problem. This person hear how the problem of a because of the choices you chose to make. No different than anyone else. He don't want the answers being told to him, and now he wants to make it into a battle which I'm not going to engage in. Do not about having a passionate position or debate. This is less to do with a reason. This is more to do with the fact that he wants to spread his hatred because he don't like what's being said. And this is not the first time he's done it.
That’s why they’re called INVOLUNTARY celibates, or incels. Of course they want pussy; they’re just mad because they can’t get it 😂They “go their own way” because what choice do they have lol
They're not even involuntarily celibate. Their not celibate at all Just a by masturbating alone. The Incels are those with severe disabilities and mental disorders where they need adult help and supervision. Those who cannot marry, reproduce, etc. These guys are not those people. They lack social netiquette, eiyher socially inept, or sex obsessed. Or bitter guys who were once married and now divorced, single father with baby mamas, and the lost goes on. They can easily get a girlfriend if they choose too. They just refuse the work. Everybody has a choice. No, they only want it because they feel entitled to it.
True. Hence more to why we don’t want them 🤷🏻♀️
Not true at all. I don't know what your particular issue is. But it sounds very personal. If you don't share Godly values and make sure you are with the right person and understand what marriage and title you're not going to have a good marriage that's just reality. The word of God is very clear that marriage is not for everybody and by marriage the word simply means also having sex paper plates because sex isn't mad and that girl. I haven't. So no matter how much you desire sex the real question is should do even be involved having it? Answer is usually no. So it has nothing to do about godly woman or anything to Pine over. The question is what is your intent and what is your business involved with it in the first place? If you have no business than you need to stay out of it it's just that simple.
Lots of times a lot of you men don't seem to listen to a woman anyway. If men only learn to listen to the woman who they want to marry, a lot of them would not be in that problem. I have seen so many men who held your attitude end up in divorce and it makes sense why. You're too busy being immature and a jerk and you don't want to change your attitude you got to remember something. You have to live with other people. You can't just do whatever it is you want. If not how that goes in marriage. You ought to learn to work together and live with each other or is going to fall apart.
Forgive me for having so many typos. Sex is a marriage and marriage is about sex. Period. If you can't handle the hundreds of thousands of the responsibilities that comes with just that one act alone with a person you don't need to have it. Don't like the truth, guess what? The truth isn't meant for you to like. And a lot of people hate the truth. And this is why so many end up in divorce. What you're talkin about is the many lies and misconceptions being centered around marriage, sex, and relationships is why a lot of people in the church Community are having more divorces than separate people. Because what they did was that instead of sticking to the biblical Foundation that was set up, they try to incorporate secular traditions and to the church and that's why we have a problem.
I have no idea where this went. I just got the notifs and noticed he tried to tie this with religion.
There are people who are not religious who have good lasting marriages. (Not shutting your point, btbc, just making one to him.)
And... let’s look at which MEN commonly tend to get divorced by women the most. I’m against divorce, but since you wanna bring it up, there are patterns there too! Check it out 😂
Now the question is what she said: when are they gonna take responsibility? Lol
Tbh, people need to take responsibility instead of complaining. Complaining never solves problems, but responsibility does.
Happy Holidays!!! 🎄
Don't worry about it I understand. But I think we're a lot of people seem to miss interpret was being said is that the things of God is not religious. God and general makes it very clear he doesn't care about all that craziness down here. God is God. When he set up the foundation for all human beings the following, it applies to buy doesn't matter if you're Buddhist, or whatever. What I'm trying to tell him which is exactly what overall what you're saying is that it requires responsibility. And if you're not mature enough to handle that responsibility then you shouldn't be in it. The problem is is overall what you're pointing out is that it doesn't even matter what you affiliate yourself. If you desire for marriage, you got to follow the rules of what marriage entitles. People just think that is the different rules for everybody when that's not that's a little case. You can have different culture and tradition but marriage at the end of the day is still marriage. But divorced regardless who initiates it it's sad either way
They talk about women too much for a movement that was supposed to be about going their own way leaving women alone.
Exactly!!
That refutation has never made any sense to me... Wouldn't you expect a group of straight men who are actively defying the powerful, deep-rooted urge to procreate with a woman to be motivated by an even more powerful disdain for women? It seems par for the course to me!
@DonCachondo what
@CubsterShura Not sure how I could explain it any more clearly... The default for men is wanting a woman (en) in his life, starting from the day he hits puberty. It would normally take a whole lot of disenchantment with women, and maybe even society as a whole, for a man to seriously consider experiencing the remainder of his adult life without a woman by his side. I'm talking extraordinarily passionate (negative) sentiments on his part to avoid giving in because every part of a man's body is constantly urging him to set up his life around securing a mate at all times.
So do you want a medal for going MGTOW?
what? no I'm not even MGTOW lol just offering some male insight. It's what gag is for sheesh!
@DonCachondo I never got the "men going their own way" thing to me. That would imply to me that they aren't a group, but individuals being badass. Except they're some group with group-think for all I can tell critiquing women, just like those dumb group-think feminists critiquing men. It's like those Emo types that talk about being so unique and going their own way, except they all look and act the same. Lame.
Buncha sheep -- all of them -- feminists, incels, fat activists, black activists, MGTOW, whatever -- loser camp. You all should form a loser camp and then you can hate each other for a while until you all realize that you're all each other have.
Oh yeah, incels. I forgot those. Feminists and MGTOWs are like incels. Same thing in my book.
I never heard of MGTOW until this post on G@G. Apparently its been around for a decade.
Pretty quiet movement, then.
I'd say if the movement is that quiet they're not talking about women at all.
Actually no doctors don't talk about disease all the time... they do only when seeing sick patients or doing classes.
Imagine thinking that being an educated person who studied diseases for several years are the same as MGTOW men being bitter about women on their keyboards all day LMAO THE COMPARISON AHAHAHAHA
Opinion
58Opinion
From what I’ve seen, women don’t hate MGTOW. It’s MGTOW that hates women.
Every women I know is pretty much ambivalent about MGTOW. Like, basically a shrug is the response. The most verbal I’ve heard is “men who label themselves as MGTOW are just doing women a favor. Women don’t want to be with a man who hates women.”
It’s my observation that men do an awful lot of projecting in this world. Always have and always will.
Women are intimidating when you really think about it: we have the ability to create and nurture life.
With the loss of physical strength as a requirement for survival in modern society, it seems lost men feel lost or at least feel a loss of power. This comes out in various forms: abusing women, desire to control or dominate women, or just downright hating women.
The bottom line is that we all need to just be a bit kinder to each other, and we all need to stop trying to control anyone but ourselves. If a person can exercise self control and kindness, they will find no need to try to force roles, opinions, or anything really on another living being. The list for power is a sin for a very good reason. Men have been in power for thousands of years and it has brought war, hoarding of resources, and dehumanization of women and even other men.
The real problem doesn’t lie with men or women. The real problem is lust for power and/or control of another’s life, actions, skills, etc.
Now that women are starting to gain equal footing in the power arena, we are seeing backlash from men who don’t want to relinquish thousands of years of the ability to dominate over and oppress, another’s life. Anyone who engages in this lust for power, male or female, is embracing their evil side.
Back to MGTOW though. The guys who just want to be left alone and live a solo life, and have NEVER felt the need to say a single disparaging thing about women, are good guys. Kudos.
It probably the MGTOW that simply cannot stop talking about women, or who go out of their way to be unkind to a woman, that get hateful responses from women. But again, I’ve seen none of this. I have to assume it exists simply because this question exists: So the question sort of answers itself. It would be silly to expect women to love being victimized.
The problem with MGTOW is that it isn't a true movement that helps men, but rather a reactionary movement formed purely out of anger and hate. It's mostly filled with entitled men supposedly "going their own way" because they can't have their own way. Instead of developing the wisdom required to maintain a healthy relationship, gaining the courage to approach women for relationships, and/or being introspective to uncover potential character flaws that might cause a relationship to fail, MGTOW tend to blame women for their problems and completely give up on women. However, instead of actually "going their own way" and enjoying their supposedly single lives without women, they spend most of their time online complaining about women. It proves that they truly want women, but are frustrated due to not putting in the effort to get them. If not that, they feel that women should just come to them because they might be "nice." While I wouldn't call myself a feminist at all, MGTOW tend to blame feminism for many of their problems too. While feminism isn't perfect, it can't stop a person from finding a good woman and having a good relationship. When things get tough, a real man never quits. He solves whatever problem he faces in life and keeps grinding until he achieves his goal. MGTOW doesn't encourage men to do this. Instead, it encourages men to whine, bitch, and moan instead of doing better. I don't see how anybody can respect that.
Mayne the MGTOW movement helps men who felt wronged by women or 'the system'? I admit there is a "take my balls and go home" reactionary component but they may also be trying to rebuild their egos and psyche. Or maybe you're right. We only hear about the vocal MGTOWs. There are probably many who do it quietly.
Actually, I disagree and I just heard of MGTOW.
Your statement absolutely dismisses any concerns men have over male-female relationships. You have lectured and talked down to men with your statements, including, "When things get tough a real man never quits" and that MGTOW blames feminism for their problems.
I can actually see why, just in your statement, dialogue with some women on these issues is a complete waste of time.
@coffeewithcream:
"Your statement absolutely dismisses any concerns men have over male-female relationships."
The problem with the MGTOW movement is that it doesn't acknowledge these concerns and attempt to make things better. Instead, MGTOW just bicker and complain about women online.
"You have lectured and talked down to men with your statements, including, "When things get tough a real man never quits" and that MGTOW blames feminism for their problems."
My answer doesn't talk down on men; it's a simple statement of truth. Real men don't bitch and moan about the problems they face. They solve them and make things happen. I don't see how you can disagree with that.
"I can actually see why, just in your statement, dialogue with some women on these issues is a complete waste of time."
Constantly talking down on women online when they are supposed to be "men going their own way" is the true time waster. It would be more productive to try making relationships work instead of bickering on MGTOW platforms about women.
@ManHater: Parents mostly have joint custody after divorce. In rare instances, custody could be rewarded solely to one parent depending on the reason for divorce and why one parent was deemed unfit. Most of the time, women tend to make less money and rely on their husband to support them. If they divorce, the husband has to make sure she is taken care of. Also, if children are involved and the man is deemed unfit for custody, which is more often the case than the other way around, the court has to ensure that the ex-wife and child are supported. If I was a man and some women falsely accused me of sexual harassment, I wouldn't feel anyway about women in general, but rather the women lying on me. I also wouldn't be online complaining about women in general or "going my own way" just because a few of them lied on me. I'd be more focused on trying to win my case. Of course, I still would realize that not all women do that and find me one that is a good person.
@Tiffany_Taylor_Made AMAZING. Perfect explanation! When you start talking on tv let me know because I’m gonna be your #1 fan 👏🏻👌🏻
I would say far from perfect. I'm not a fan of mgtow but there was many inaccuracies in that such as why does a guy have to continue to support a spouse even if she chooses to end it. She now a days have opportunity to fend for herself. I'm for child support though as long as it is done fairly and custody is properly done. My mom is a courtroom clerk and she sees custody cases far too often and says about 25% of the time custody is giving to one of the parents and not the other. 90% of all custody cases are started by the women. Men are forgotten in domestic abuse almost all the time. We actually have a coworker that his now ex ripped his eye out. When the police came he was hand cuffed because she had red hand Mark's on her wrist. He was proven innocent in court after 6 months and many lawyer fees. That was 3 years ago and he ist still paying for the divorce fees and lawyer fees and he has custody of his kid once a month every year.
I don’t belong to MGTOW but I’ve considered it.
What women fail to understand about MGTOW is the that it is NOT a men’s rights activist movement. It is just men who have sworn off “modern” dating expectations and are going their “own way”. They don’t seek out or into relationships with western expectations. They might hire an escort to get their needs met. But they just don’t buy into all this feminist bullshit.
Some of the most influential men in the world have avoid relationships to focus on their livilihoods (Isaac Newton is one example).
Nothing wrong with that and it doesn’t make them “gay”. It’s just funny how single men past the age of 30 get labeled “weird or gay” and single women get labeled “strong or bitter”. It’s bullshit either way. But still it’s a disgusting cheap shot. Women say that because they KNOW it hurts those guys and it has to stop.
I don’t hate women. But when I’m trying to seek out a meaningful relationship I continually encounter freeloaders, ghosters, psycho chics , dishonest/unfaithful women and flakes I find that MGTOW looks more and more appealing.
It’s obviously not the same thing at all.
MGTOW overly promotes self-ownership, taking control of your own life and not being at the mercy of others, namely women in this modern political and social climate.
Modern men tackle this problem with a number of different strategies, but MGTOW in particular are ore tied toward the isolate and hunker down, wait for the storm to pass... or lock down and wait for the pandemic to pass.
They know it’s not practical for a society for everyone to do it. Unlike feminism, the point isn’t to assimilate everyone and make others like themselves. The point is that they’ve experienced some kind of hardship with women (for many is a bad divorce and no custody or younger guys who had unusually many or damaging encounters with women that were toxic) and they process that by isolating themselves from what hurts them and work on themselves.
Nothing to do with feminism, except in the sense that feminists don’t like groups of people that won’t bend the knee — and also has disproportionately many of those toxic women that need to be avoided.
Because they very often make wide generalisations that simply aren't true in order to justify putting women down. (I know feminazis also do this with men). Even the generalisations don't bother me so much as the fact that they often refuse to listen when someone points out the flaws in their arguments, especially if a women disagrees with their statements if she doesn't believe they apply to her or those she knows. I am sure there are some who just don't want to date and that's perfectly understandable, but there is no need to demonize any particular group of people. I find that they also often put too much stock in evolutionary fundamentalism, obviously we do exhibit evolutionary behaviours but people are so far beyond those times in terms of psyche, imagination, ideals, individual beliefs, cultural and religious differences etc that I do not think one single evolutionary trait (that may or may not exist) can be used to define how half of the population thinks and acts e. g. women don't care about men, they just need a protector and someone to give them babies to continue the species and they only people they need to live are their offspring. I've seen that one a fair few times and obviously it's based on multiple assumptions rather than facts.
well everything you jusy said can be applied to women as women also make generalisations that simply aren't true in order to justify putting men down and they often refuse to listen when someone points out the flaws in their arguments, especially if a men disagrees with their statements and you seem to think it is ok to demonize men but women why
I literally said that at the very start. The question was why do women hate mgtow and I answered based on why they seem somewhat negative to me. I know women do it too but that wasn't the question
Maybe when you're actually 18 you'll learn specific examples of why some men have given up on relationships with women.
I have been to the subreddit and it is nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be although there is the occasional bitter user. The entire idea is wanting to get men to improve themselves for their own sake instead of for women, that their life shouldn’t revolve around having a girlfriend or wife.
They can if they want but they are aware of the risks. The risk of the false rape allegation and the marriage institution being easily exploitable by the wife as she can divorce for no reason and has a high chance of winning family court if the man was stupid enough to have children with her.
This isn’t what I believe but this is what THEY believe. For the most part I can see where they are coming from but I cannot stand by their “all women are like that” narrative as supporting such claims makes them no different than the radical feminists they hate so much. Maybe that is to say that until things are fixed, that is what they will assume but I don’t have enough evidence to support that.
Why do women hate MGTOW?
The first and most important reason is that women's power over men (hence, over a modern society that was built by men, but not owned by men anymore) was acquired by regulating what we need the most. Women know 100% of men need sex so bad. Is an urge too painful to just shrug away, it will just become pointless aggression if repressed, which is starting to manifest in society, either by the rise of very frustrated angry men or by the overgrowing of passive men in this godforsaken world. And that is exactly the point of control they need to do whatever they want with us. Men has been tricked by women into doing the most idiotic deeds since the most masculine patriarcal of eras. Even for a movement that looks so ridiculous, watching a bunch of men standing up to just ignore their unfair play and stop "simping" just represents a threat to their instinct, because it may turn the sorcery against the sorcerer, making things a little bit harder for them. Which is more than fair, in my opinion. Having romantic relationships with women is just plain risky nowadays, because you never truly know if you can trust even the most angelical attitude. You give means to exploit a lot from men to a being that is shady and unconsciously manipulative since the dawn of times, you're in for a lot of trouble. That is a fact. If women looked at this JUST as some "incels" talking BS, they wouldn't be seething this hard.
The other reason is the most obvious one. They look ridiculous and they are in reality a bunch of hypocrites, missing the whole point. If you want to ignore something, just do it. Blabbing about it and attacking who you want to shun is just an illogical move. If they were organized, rational and aimed only to men that wants to control their urges, their complexes and insecurities, it wouldn't be so much of a disaster.
Listening to the responses here is amusing. I have never seen so many poorly researched responses in my life. Many MGTOW’s don’t even visit online sites and if they did it would amount to the tip of the iceberg. I’ve been married twice so the pathetic incel goes out the window. I also have a child, many MGTOW’s have been married and have had children. Many of us just have no interest in the rat race called relationships and dating. We’d rather focus on self improvement and gaining financial independence. I realize in doing such actions that attracts suitors. It fits with the desires of what women want sucessful men and the lack of pursuit. Women want the pursuit to some degree not the crazy stand outside your window type but the goo goo eyes in a gym, a well timed smile or wink. Sure MGTOW men are going to acknowledge attractive women issue is it stops there. MGTOW is a vague outline of platforms, no meetings, no steps, no management, people are free to choose to the degree they wish. Most men choose staying away from long term relationships, no cohabitation, no marriage.
The court system has had a massive effect on the growth of MGTOW also has the general overall change in the most basic woman through feminism. Many women here have mentioned radical feminism what they fail to mention is the small changes in all women. Women look at MGTOW and can easily spot what they don’t care for as we all can with other people but not see it in themselves.
It is only radical people that are a problem... including feminists, vegans, mgtow etc. The movements themselves can and often do posses some good values but when someone radicalizes and it becomes their identity and their life and they begin hateful words and actions towards opposing views or even people who don't exactly align with their views, then it is a problem.
If men don't want to pursue women then go for it but don't get hellbent on us paying attention to you going your own way it defeats the purpose of the whole movement.
The same reason why men usually hate more radical feminism than MGTOW.
Those two are gender exclusionary groups, both quite toxic and full of hate. They don't hate individuals for what their individual traits and acts, they hate a whole gender without greyscale. However, even if you disagree with both, it's not the same when you aren't the target of hate, than when you are the hated and the excluded.
That's why men who might dislike MGTOW, dislike more radical feminism, and women who dislike radical feminism might dislike more MGTOW.
I don't see MGTOW as hate.
I see it as men quietly making for the exit.
@coffeewithcream The few I met from that movement aren't precisely quiet. Besides I believe that if they were actually quiet, I don't think that anybody would talk about them. Which isn't the case.
On the other hand, you might not see it or won't like to see it, but there's hate. The moment you avoid a whole gender is because you hate that gender. You don't avoid half of the population just because.
I'm a man and I don't like MGTOW. There are guys that are realistically just deciding to focus on themselves and that's great, but there are guys going around kicking hornets nests for no reason making arguments about women and its just pointless. If MGTOW is about going your own way, then why are they so obsessed with others and their WAY. Men going there own way, its more like, men rebranding themselves and complaining that everyone hasn't complimented them yet.
Don't get me wrong I get that sometimes a man has to take the time to find himself and focus on his own path, and MGTOW has those men, but it also has guys who are tip toeing into incel territory who are just mad and want to start arguments. So women probably hate mgtow because they are tired of having arguments about gender with men who are mad and projecting their anger on strangers.
MGTOW refuse to engage with women.
We avoid contact, so far as that is possible, and will not give women access to our resources, beyond what the state extorts from us at gunpoint and then pays to women as welfare.
We do not seek to harm women. We just walk away and let whatever to going to happen take its course.
We do not date. We do not have sex. We do not have relationships. We do not marry.
There is no hate. We simply do nothing. MGTOW is an entirely defensive posture.
For this, women are angry.
For decades women have made it clear that they want men to leave them alone, especially sexually.
When a group of men decide to leave women alone and walk away, women scream and vomit even more hate over us.
This is more evidence that women are born insane.
I personally don’t care if a guy labels himself as such. I do, however, have an issue with the ones who are openly bitter towards all women and go out of their way to generalize and attack women simply for being women. If you don’t want to be in a relationship then don’t, that’s fine. But there’s no reason to be a jerk about it.
Maybe women could self reflect a little bit on the mgtow's complaints?
That could be possible if the ones I’ve encountered didn’t make grossly untrue generalizations about women and then shut out any form of counter argument. I’m not against heading out the other side if they’re willing to hold a civil conversation, though none have really given that.
Making generalizations as a whole is wrong anyway. And as I’ve mentioned in my previous comment, I personally have no issues hearing out the other side and having a civil conversation but those in this movement that I’ve encountered just stick to insults and attacks. That being said, there’s all types in any group or movement, but the civil MGTOW seem very few and far between in my experience.
I cannot speak for all women nor am I going to, I’m speaking purely from my experiences.
well true but just like you say about MGTOW should be applied to other groups like feminism should we discard and disregard them due to the overwhelming bad ones in the moment who activly seek to take rights away from men?
as what if i said the same about feminism i would be labled a women hater and be cast out of any movemment yet you generalize and attack the MGTOW why
as most of what they say is true yet most women try to turn them into women hating monters just for protecting themselfs from the unjust laws of today that mostly target men
I haven’t generalized MGTOW, at least I didn’t do so intentionally so if you think I have then I apologize. But I have not attacked them in any form, I’m just stating facts of my experiences and what I’ve seen from them on this site.
With the extreme and toxic members of any group or movement, yeah, take them with a grain of salt. They should not be what the group should be generalized as. But with MGTOW I and many others have yet to really encounter any civil ones who don’t openly attack women for no reason. Are some women to blame? Maybe, but I can’t answer that for certainty. But again, you can choose to not date for whatever reason and not be a jerk about it.
but the ones on this site are not the whole of the movement but you say they are openly bitter towards all women and go out of their way to generalize and attack women simply for being women is that not is self a generalize of all men and you go onto say shut out any form of counter argument which in its self form of generalizing MGTOW
plus i am yet to encounter any civil feminist who don’t openly attack men for no reason and i am yet to see any feminists make any changes to the law that benefit men all i see is them doing everything ou say MGTOW is doing
you know one of the other women on here just proved my point for me lol she blocked me so i could not give any counter agrument so why again do u not like mgtow?
as this women just said my oppion dumb and that the laws are not unfair even after i have them a list of unfair laws agaisnt men after she asked me to then she just blocked me
@grace9876 Yes I have also been blocked because someone didn't like my opinion.
So here I am: Mgtow, not an incel. Single by choice at the moment, open to finding a good woman.
The AzureGirl or anyone else can ask me and I will give you an honest opinion.
That seems to happen a lot, especially on here. I swear no one can have a civil conversation or debate anymore without attacks or blocking. Present company seemingly excluded thus far.
I can honestly say the only ones I’ve encountered are ones on the Internet. And 9 chances out of 10 they act as I’ve described. I don’t think these types just whine and attack on the Internet because they hate women for whatever reason and think being behind a screen empowers them and makes them feel as if they can do whatever they want without consequence. These are obviously going to be the toxic ones.
I’m assuming, and you can correct me if I’m wrong @Mellontikos , that most guys who label themselves as such don’t go around advertising it or acting terrible to any woman for no reason other than her being a woman in actuality. I’m also using you as an example of one of the ones who are more pleasant
Well, so let's start at the beginning.
There's 3 groups of mgtow types. There's the ones that have been through a couple of really bad relationships, sometimes losing everything in the process. These types will just pull away from women completely and just concentrate on something else, like a car or motorcycle hobby.
Usually these types don't bother to complain anymore. They feel it's useless and a waste of time.
Then there's the group that feels slighted because they weren't born with good genes, and are constantly rejected by women for things they can't change, like height, or race. A lot are rejected for weight, and although you can change it, it is very hard to do so, as most women know already. The effort required is pretty intense (hard workouts, watching what you eat for months). So I would add the weight thing to their list of gripes (being rejected on weight).
The third group is more like me. I consider all people to be stupid, including most women and most men. The trick is trying to find the wise ones, and it's a tough job, but no point in getting bitter about it.
So for example, I am fully aware of some of the problem women have. For example, maybe a woman is already dating someone. So she doesn't want me to constantly be harassing her, trying to ask her out. So she might put up a "bitch shield". Some guy will come and try anyway, and get a scoff from the woman, or say "I have a boyfriend, sorry". The guy will take it personal, like he was rejected.
HOWEVER, the biggest problem that is fucking up both men and women is Online Dating. In Online Dating, both men and women are only selecting each other based on how hot the picture looks. THAT'S IT. But it has been proven scientifically that women are far choosier, choosing only the 10% best looking males, while men will select the 50% best looking females (so basically from average to super hot).
So I would say over 70% of the experiences men have with women are through Online Dating. Since women are ultra picky on those platforms, it negatively jades men, who are less picky, and that's a large percentage of these mgtow types you don't like.
Also most men are lied to about what women want.
Women are usually told the truth. Example: Most women even as children, are told the truth that guys primarily care about how hot they look. This is why women grow neuroses about their physical appearance (they worry about their weight. They worry about make up, their breast size, etc etc).
Guys on the other hand, are lied to about women. Guys are told that women don't care about looks, that they care about personality only. So all these boys and men start approaching women who are far beyond their reach, and then get angry when the woman rejects them for their looks.
They will say things like "what's wrong with her, I'm such a nice guy!". So when they start learning the truth, basically like a shock to the system, they get bitter about it.
I will respectfully disagree with you on that one. Otherwise men wouldn't be striking out so badly.
I think what you consider to be 15% looks and 85% personality is not valid because you cannot know personality until you have dated the guy at least once (and probably more times).
The reality I see, is that usually guys that are 7, 8, and 9 out of ten are the ones usually dating women who are one or two points below them.
I can give you a perfect example right now. 2 examples actually. There are 2 YouTubers called Joshua Fluke, and Louis Rossmann. Both have their girlfriend's on their livestreams once in a while.
Both, in my opinion are dating a woman who is 1 point below them in looks.
( don't hate MGTOW any more than I hate uh... cancer. And i don't think mysogynism is any worse or better than misandry, Rather, I think each is pathological-an abberation of normal. To say or think anything else is to ignore what our bodies are telling us.
It’s not that we have issue with men going their own way. That’s your right and I at least support such an endeavor. But there’s a vocal minority of the mgtow group that are extremely toxic, spiteful and disrespectful. Those are the ones we hate.
because MGTOW is becoming the male version of feminazi's aka Dicknazi's and people attack us for saying stuff just like feminists attack y'all its a mutual hate that you guys share against our feminazi's
We hate your dicknazi's and you hate out feminazi's
one of the dumbest myths about MGTOW. If going your own way is the male version of feminism then where is my government funding? Where are my university speeches? Where are my demonstrations with thousands of guys dressed in penis suits? Where is my welfare just for the fact that I have a penis? Where are the lower standards that will help me get the job over a woman? Where my pro-male laws implemented by my patriarchal government? Feminism is aggressive, state-funded and taught in schools. MGTOW are passive walking away from everything and working for their shit. Your lies deceive only dumb people miss 14 year old.
@TheFlak38 MGTOW are passive walking away from everything and working for their shit. Your lies deceive only dumb people miss 14 year old. then walk away mad boi if this is true you wouldn't even need to defend it but its not, both side have radicals that are just as bad as the other, both sides have people like you who do the same shit just under a different flag lol
@TheFlak38 also i campared y'all to feminazi's not feminists
@TheFlak38 see why are you insulting me? do you feel good? insulting me? I haven't insulted you but you seem to need to insult me to validate your actions right now.
The Flack dude has issues don't mind him.
I don't hate MGTOW by default or anything. Hate is a strong word, and I know that there's plenty of different guys who want to go their own way. I just think a lot of them come off as very bitter and hateful, and for men going their own way, they sure like to make a ruckus about it. It's as if quietly living your life the way you want to isn't enough, you also have to give a fat middle finger to everyone you feel has ever wronged you. It doesn't really come off as you going your own way, if you constantly have to prove just how much you're going your own way. It's like the bitter ex constantly posting on social media about how fine they're doing and how great their life is, when it's very apparent that they're actually miserable.
Live your life. Date, don't date. It doesn't really affect me. I don't really care about those who just do their own thing.
I just heard about MGTOW and apparently it's been a thing for a decade.
So I'd say for a movement that you say advocated are making a ruckus, I never heard one peep about it until this question on G@G.
I'd say they just decided, "Fuck women"- literally and figuratively- and decided to get on with their lives.
@coffeewithcream you are also only 19 which means that you should have been made aware of this... at 9 years old? I've known about this roughly since it started making its first mainstream waves online.
The better question would be why do MGTOW unconditionally hate all women so much. Because women couldn't care less about MGTOW. It does not affect them at all. MGTOW to women is like splashing water on a ducks body. I can't say the same for the MGTOW, who keep preaching "KILL ALL WOMEN" or "ALL WOMEN ARE EVIL GOLD DIGGING WHORES" or "GET BACK TO THE KITCHEN AND MAKE ME A SAMMICH BITCH".
Those types are best left ignored into oblivion and let them soak up their own bitterness. Because even when attempting to help or make a healthy argument, they'll likely always find a way to win against you. You can't win with them. They're not a teamplayer.
Have you read their reddit sub site or watched any YouTube videos on it or is all of your info third hand knowledge? MGTOW advocates are treated with scorn and derision or, at best, being made fun of; they aren't ignored by all women.
I posed this question because I have seen a number of comments about MGTOW in different forums that were very negative, condescending, and vitriolic by women.
Oh, let me tell you MY stories then
A reminder: What MGTOW is all about ↗
only to be followed by
How I Turned From Being Bitter and Resentful Toward Girls Into a Philogynist ↗
Your posts are inconsistent.
I genuinely feel like men going their own way when they feel that way about women is best for everyone. I don't get when women are upset that men they dislike remove themselves from the dating pool.
Once again you took the words right out of my mouth.
Because men who remove themselves from the dating pool don't call themselves MGTOW and continue to spread their misogynist views. These men just disappear quitely, unlike the ones who let everyone know they're members of the MGTOW club. That's an ideology.
Yeah it's a win-win for everyone.
@Aislin9 well yeah we can't expect them to exit society just our dating pool. My biggest concern is the way it's been used as a justification for violence. Otherwise it's just annoying to hear about.
Well yeah, they all want to freely beat and rape women (they also complain about not being able to hit women and being afraid of being accused of rape). Since they can't they whine and complain about how bad feminists are. The entire group is a hate group that literally defines itself on hatred for feminists.
@Aislin9 I get that. I still pity more than hate them.
@Aislin9 yeah! Like where is the "going their own way" part. You can't go your own way AND stick around... 🤔. Quantum Physics might have an explanation for this phenomenon.
@Hermes-Paris hahahaha
two places at once. Lets just call it the double dick experiment.
It's because the don't actually shut up about women and going their own way. For some reason a lot of 'em like to start fights with women instead of just ignoring us like they say they want to due to being balls deep in misogyny. They're ignoring the "Going" in "Men Going Their Own Way". Honestly, women don't mind if you all go your own way, but keep us out your mouths and thoughts, and stop with the harassment.
I just heard about MGTOW.
So apparently, for a movement that I was told has been around for a decade, it's been a pretty quiet movement.
@xXiTacoXx Exactly. Or at least “go your own way” and not fuss because you can’t get sex in the process. If you’re going your own way then 1) you shouldn’t be wanting sex and 2) news flash: we don’t care lol because the guys we want aren’t MGTOW
@nathanp97 Yep. But very few of them actually are legit that way. Most want to have sex and then claim to hate women 😂😂😂 makes them look stupid because we’ve got them in the palm of our hand and yet we don’t even care.
I think one of the rules for MGTOW is no sex too. If you’re having sex with women, you’re not going your own way. You’re just an idiot lol
@nathanp97 Okay, thanks for correcting me about the rule, but not giving anything to women yet having sex with them? How contradicting... Basically like I said, that’s not going your own way; it’s just looking like an idiot- one who claims to be for a movement but really is too weak to handle it and gives in
@nathanp97 Feminists do the exact same thing, just with more consequences given to the men along with it. Bingo. So again... idiots lol
Or look at it like this: both feminists and MGTOW are stupid. Either group could win it all simply by going all out and saying “no sex.” But both groups are too weakling to do that. Therefore, MGTOW is actually making feminism look stronger, which is a shame
@nathanp97 Dude, feminist aren't concerned with you as long as you actually shut up and go your own way. Far away.
@nathanp97 They're protesting about other things. Guys who go MGTOW are doing them a favor by staying out of the way
Well first of all Feminists can't be misandrists (unless they also hate women equally). Secondly MGTOW has very little to do with "Men going their own way" and very much to do with trying to attack women and feminists from a social rights perspective. This is why people generally hate them, because its a fake group trying to hide behind actual social issues to try score cheep shots at a group that is actually trying to help because said fake group can't make an actual position to oppose feminism in the first place.
An example : The MGTOW next door has a wife with no personality , no intellect, she is Stepford , he hates her lack of intellect , he hates her robotic non personality and he has a definite disdain for her complence with no input
He married what he believed to be the perfect woman and he hates her
He made his bed and now he has to deal with it
MGTOW rants about wanting compliant women, when they find her , they
complain about her as much as they complain about feminist
They don't like a gold digger then complain about working women
They complain , that is why, nothing makes them satisfied
"Is MGTOW any more misogynistic than feminists who are misandrist?"
No, it's not more misogynistic than Femnists WHO ARE misandrist. But unlike Feminists, where there's such and such, there's nothing about MGTOW that isn't in someway based on pure misogyny. And know there's MGTOW who claim they don't hate women and I'm not saying they necessarily HATE them, but once you let them explain their reasons, you'll always get to premises that are misogynist one way or another. And that's just not the case with Feminism. There ARE Feminists who are misandrists, of course. But it's not inherent and there's also the ones who simply fight for women's rights.
Is the misogyny of ALL MGTOW worse than the misogyny of SOME Feminists? No, of course not.
Interesting parsing/redefinition. At its root mgtow is sexist. Feminism is sexist the other way.
No, it's not.
You are confusing hatred with indifference. If a guy is going his own way he needs to shut the fuck up and go already. Nobody actually cares and talking about something without actually doing it is just attention seeking.
I don't hate them, i have the same amount of respect for them as i would for anyone else's. I just don't like them type of guys who sleaze around women and then after sleeping with them, tell them their not into committed relationships and treat women with no respect and act hatred towards all of them.
It might surprise men but not all women are "feminist bitchs" even if we have are own opinions nows. If a guy wants to live his life his way that's none of my business and i couldn't give a shit about it just as long as he doesn't turn into a woman hating incel douchebag.
I do not have anything against Men Going Their Own Way. However, Men Getting Triggered Over Women is quite annoying.
If you are happier on your own it's great, live your life and be the best version of yourself you possibly can be.
I don't have any trouble understanding this, but I'm also a former ardent, passionate Feminist. Everything comes down to the way women are being marketed to. Feminists hate MGTOW, not women.
Remember that MGTOW is a group of men that have banded together in their efforts to reject women. Not only does it reflect a deep seated resentment in lots of men (so many modern women adopted feminism because they were of the impression that men respected what the feminists considered to be powerful women), but MGTOW also promotes certain ideologies that women feel will deprive them of the progress and rights that they have obtained thus far.
Feminism is trying to promote female advancement (not domination, which is a common misconception). MGTOW is trying to promote men not dealing with women.
I am not a women and I think they are a trap for the week, the wounded and the stupid. Just because there is a group of people that thinks like you doesn't mean thay are right! There is a very big group of people that actually believes the earth is flat!
Look I get it, they make people feel like they are not alone and that what happened so far wasn't their fault. "It was all because of female nature" or whatever. That can be really apealing. But it's nothing more than closing your eyes to reallity to ease your pain.
No reason to like or hate it
I just find it stupid. MGTOW guys basically hate women, so even if those women did hate them, who cares? The women hated them first. All the men are doing is complaining and retaliating to something when the other party couldn’t care less. That’s why it’s stupid,
*hate women for not wanting them
That’s the whole reason for MGTOW, and that’s why those of us who are AGAINST modern feminism don’t even want the MGTOW guys. As some users have already said, we want men, not somebody who’s gonna cry like a baby because he can’t get a woman.
Is it that they hate women or that they don't trust them and want to avoid being around them? Hate is a strong word. From my research I think they don't like how women behave.
Only that the women don’t want them and they get mad about it. So of course they don’t like it. Until, of course, they meet those of us who are against feminism and are actually FOR them and not against them (men), then they want us and we don’t want them because they generalize us all in one group. If you’re gonna go your own way, we don’t care. It gives us more leadway to the guys who are worth it when the crazy ones get out of the way lol
The men who are really going their own way don't talk about it, they just do it. The MGTOW are just begging for pity. It's complete BS and that's why women find the whole thing so tiresome. It's just another take on the "why don't women go for nice passive-aggressive guys like me instead of picking some guy who has a life and is straight about what he wants"
This is a good observation. In effect, "real MGTOW don't talk about it."
I think that some men ARE real MGTOW but also talk about it. Why? Excitement? Maybe a woman burned them in divorce or through sexual abuse claims that were unfounded and they are angry.
Some MGTOW ARE angry. Nobody says that MGTOW have to be stoic.
Marxist feminists are just as bad as MGTOW. Neither represent any significant portion of the population so they can be ignored
Yes but, as we've seen with Marxists in general, eventually people listen to them.
Simple
well obviously, if your tits and pussy usually gets you what you want, you get angry at people that don#t grant you the power you usually have xD
This is an interesting perspective and probably cuts to the core of a debate: sex. Cisgendered men want it and women are the gatekeepers. To get it men have to behave in certain ways and/or contribute economically to a woman (more than just transactional prostitution). Some men find those costs too high or that the deal was changed unilaterally by the woman and they are responding in a particular way.
well a woman has to do certain things to get what she wants from you too right? she has to trade economically what she can offer to gain your trust and your commitment. men are the gatekeepers of commitment. and yes understandably so, some women demand higher prices for their boobies, while some men demand higher prices for their commitment.
the individual constatnly has to check with "how high" of a demand they can get away with. and if you are tired of playing that stupid game, i completely understand that.
As I was responding above I thought about gold diggers. They are reviled, pitied, and celebrated at the same time by different groups. Look at onlyfans. com. it's a way for a woman (or a man but mostly women) to monetize their beauty and sell the sexual fantasy to men. Or a sugar baby. Or a woman who 'married well'. Even high maintenance girlfriends.
Before I get called out I realize that there are pick up artists, players, kept men, gigolos (does anyone use that term anymore?), and other men who take advantage of women.
well everyone has their "customer". you have certain things to offer and you're looking for certain things you want.
i think it is fairly stupid to get mad at gold diggers, if those are not the kind of people you want in your life anyway.
if i could get people to pay me for getting naked, you can bat your ass, i'd get naked in no time. so i don't blame onlyfans thots for doing that.
i don't think players take "advantage" of women. women aren't dumb animals that can't help themselves. if you know how to push their buttons so they wanna fuck you, good for you. they are still free to say no to you, so i don't see anything shady in that.
I generally don't care about the MGTOW tbh (no offence) they can go their on way
Men are the ones in a position of power, so it comes across as mocking/insulting to complain about their problems. Like a white person complaining about how they've been affected by racism or a rich factory owner complaining about workers asking for wages they can live off of. When you have it better than everyone else, is it really surprising that people roll their eyes at your "problems"?
So much to unpack... Between 65 and 70% of divorces in the usa are initiated by women. In over 90% of the cases child custody goes to the mother. Spousal support also tends to flow in one direction (not to the men). Perhaps men don't have it so great and it isn't one sided?
I do believe that whites can be the victims of racism just like women can commit spousal abuse. It's not the majority but it happens. As to the factory owner comment, I believe in efficient markets and employment at will unless the employer is a monopsony. But, hey, we can disagree.
Again, when you have it better than everyone else, is surprising people roll their eyes at your "problems"? No one said men have it perfect. They said they have it better than women. White people have it better than literally everyone else. And the factory owner has it better than the workers.
Why I am MGTOW
I am a 60 year old man, never married. I Choose MGTOW as a form of personal risk management. Come on folks , there is another profile not even considered of a modern man that chooses MGTOW. It does not mean that I don’t have relationships with women, I do and many are strictly professional. I hire ($$) women to clean my house, wash my clothes and make me a sandwich. I also utilize the services of women to meet my needs as a man ($$). The huge difference is I have total control of what I want and when. I also enjoy the company of women and call many my friend. Fortunately I realize that anything more than that can be extremely risky to the quality of my life. It is not that complicated.
It's in the name: men >going< their own way. It's never men >gone< their own way. They are in a perpetual state of announcing their departure without ever actually leaving. And pretty much everyone hates people who choose to build their adult lifestyle around crying for attention.
Damn we didn’t get our answer as to why... but women certainly are triggered by it. I know why tho... its actually pretty obvious
short answer is mgtow is a threat to the modern woman’s way of life
Why are they a threat? Because women rely on the economic output of men? Don't let a feminist hear you say that.
I have no problem with MGTOWs or any of the other "justice" groups and similar things to it, but I DO hate people who belittle others because they are in those categories though
No, mgtow are the haters. I’m all for them staying out of the way.
I suspect that some of the mgtow crowd were uncles or 'unlucky in love.' Given their lack of power in romantic relationships some don't want to play at all. Then there's the ones who got raped in their divorces (figuratively). Some may (in their minds) have reasons to hate.
Sure, some men don’t get everything they want, romantically. More often than not it’s because of something they’ve done or haven’t done. You’ve got to put in the work if you want to get good with quality women. You cannot be an average Joe and expect a hot ass wife to worship you until you die. You got to work for it. And sure, some men get “divorce raped” and many of them don’t want to take a look at why and how it happened. These men have a right to be upset but they are directing their pain incorrectly. I’m not surprised these men have failed and faulty relationships with women. More often than not, they do have some responsibility for it. But many just don’t want to self correct. They want to stay average. Well, great. Leave better men for the better women.
@Aislin9 You're right, they can be, but it's a scientific paper from a reputable site that's probably not worth targetting for malware due to the low numbers of visitors.
"In this paper, we present a large-scale characterization of the Manosphere, a conglomerate of Web-based misogynist movements roughly focused on “men’s issues,” which has seen significant growth over the past years. We do so by gathering and analyzing 28.8M posts from 6 forums and 51 subreddits. Overall, we paint a comprehensive picture of the evolution of the Manosphere on the Web, showing the links between its different communities over the years. We find that milder and older communities, such as Pick Up Artists and Men’s Rights Activists, are giving way to more extremist ones like Incels and Men Going Their Own Way, with a substantial migration of active users. Moreover, our analysis suggests that these newer communities are more toxic and misogynistic than the former."
The answer is very simple. Going your own way means no more money to women, as well as no more attention "drugs" and no more free stuff. If the vast majority of men decided to walk away from everything it would mean in the end no more welfare for women. Women hate on men who prefer to serve their own interests instead those of women. Simple.
I just looked it up and it sounds exactly like the male version of radical feminists, I don’t mind it unless it’s shoved down my throat.
Many women (I won't say "women" since it would be a stupid generalization) hate MGTOW because it's a movement where men refuse to have any relationship with women. And that's a problem for those women because they know most of their power over men depend on sex and attraction.
If men refuse these 2 things, women's power over them is reduced to the minimum. And that, those women can't accept it.
Because it doesn't involve them. It's like if you had a man only organisation feminists would be outside protesting
RadFems hate men, period. Women who are normal who have issues with MGTOW generally do not have problems with the ones who are actually just doing their own thing. Instead the issues are with the Red Pill Rage guys who constantly complain about women and attack them with AWALT nonsense, using a small % to smear the entire gender. They are the male equivalent of Clementine Ford.
If you go to MGTOW and Red Pill forums it’s a bunch of losers glorifying rape and picking on chicks in general. They don’t respect others, why should anyone respect them? My girl and I treat each other kindly and spoil each other. If I were like those men in those forums, I’d just expect my girlfriend to be kind, caring and giving while I treated her like a second class citizen. It isn’t right and eventually people will tire of hate.
Thank you for your perspective. I feel the need to differentiate between mgtow, red pill, and PUAs.
MGTOW don't see any need to have a romantic relationship with a woman because the economic downsides exceed the romantic upside opportunities.
Red Pill WAS (before the infestation of PUAs) about men reinventing themselves so that 1) they were more attractive to women and 2) they weren't taken advantage of by women. It used to emphasize being so great that women chased you. Then the PUAs came to the party.
The PUAs just want to get laid and will do anything short of rape to get it. Some don't stop.
Nope they are all in forums together. They all have the same attitude too. Their main idea is to screw women over simply because they are women. I look at them the same as I look at the Klan or even a cult.
I was just talking to a dude in Australia who called himself a PUA and MGTOW. He was absolutely clueless.
Then he will end up getting what he deserves. We all do in the end.
Look, I have a disdain for women, I advocate for the whole "most women aren't good for serious relationships" ideology... But 'mgtow' is a superiority group and an echo chamber.
As far as women are concerned, men exist only as a resource to be exploited. When a man goes his own way, he is declaring that his resources are for himself alone. The female hive mind cannot let that happen. They all will fight it tooth and nail. A man going his own way is a man who will never pay alimony. Women can't have that, now can they.
That's an interesting perspective. Women traditionally have been more community focused instead of individually centered. I suspect one reason for that is the fact that it does 'take a village' to raise a child. Like it or not... women have a different motivation in many cases (sorry for the stereotype). How do we work with women within that framework? Walking away is likely bad for society.
Societies rise and fall regardless of what any individual does.
I’m pretty surprised given how useless men are and how we don’t do anything to help or how we don’t contribute enough to the relationship. Been told many times they’re happy to live without us. And here we are and what do you find hating on the very thing you asked for.
Any "going their own way" movement is full of idiots. Honestly it's a bunch of people wanting to blame their own problems on the other sex. I can understand being screwed over as I've been screwed several times myself, but I don't hate the opposite sex and "go my own way" to prove some conceited point.
Libe life the way you want it, you're free to do so but stop acting like a dick because you're mad, take responsibility.
What is there to like? They’re the Male version of feminists, annoying extremists.. if they want to go their own way then fine, but they never shut the fuck up about it lol
They aren’t the male version of feminists. Those are MRAs. Annoying as they are they don’t even hold a fraction of the political power and influence feminists have anyway.
@youknowbetter they’re both irritating as hell
Yes but one group has the full power of Hollywood, the mass media, justice system and higher education behind them. The other group only has a voice on reddit, 4chan, GAG and a few documentary movies (the red pill). You can’t compare them apples to apples.
@youknowbetter both losers
I just heard about MGTOW.
Never heard about it before today.
So apparently they have made the decision women aren't worth the trouble and have shut the fuck up about it.
@coffeewithcream that’s the difference women don’t understand. That’s different than MRAs.
I sound like I’m defending them but I’m but I’m not. But for every 10 loud mouth radical feminists out there you might find one MRA guy. You won’t see him holding signs like “all women are trash” or some other bs either.
They can’t be compared. Unlike feminists they have almost no societal leeway or power.
Just like Feminism "they never shut the fuck up about it lol" Women complain they want equal rights but can't land a job with the fire fighters because the fitness test is too hard for them. So they complain and the lower the bar so women can now get jobs and not have to drag or carry heavy crash test dummies out of buildings. Thanks to Femenism we now have a higher mortality rate in fires.
Nothing against other people's beliefs. I, myself, am against feminism but as usual, in any group, there are the ones who wants to be more harmful and hurtful than helpful
Typically MGTOW are bitter and/or hateful towards women, which makes disdain for them pretty reasonable
So many groups behave similarly. I won't play the 'whatabout...' game but it's true. Why is MGTOW called out as the worst?
It's not "women" per se. It is Feminists that hate. Like every other identified leftist fringe group (LGBTQ, Radical Socialists, Jihadis) they feel theneed to utterly destroy anyone who opposes their agenda. There is no room for "live and let live" in their twisted thinking.
they want men to chase them... which makes them feel desired and powerful and going their own way is the wrong direction.
Cause most MGTOW men say they're doing this to avoid women but seem to only talk about how women are the devil and how they're the problem.
You can see why they'd be upset.
because is male gay society that spew lies and hatred about the superior sex males typically very misogynistic oriented
Gays and incels, yup pretty much
No women actually cares, or even know what that means. I had to google it.
Ditto.
But I can see their point.
You're mistaking them for even giving a shit. Fifty one? No one cares dood. Go your own way.
Same reason why you hate feminism. Why would you have to ask?
Interesting rejoinder. I don't hate feminism but I do have some problems with militant feminists. The question is what defines 'equality' and what you have to do to achieve it. That isn't agreed upon by everyone so nobody can say if we have solved women's problems or not.
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