Why don't men treat us like ladies anymore?

Question

Okay, I was raised in a family of gentlemen. I'm not stuck up by any means, but I was brought up "old fashion" and was always taught that I should be treated like a lady. I don't see anything wrong with men opening doors for me for God's sake. But my friends say I have high expectations for the guys I date. My answer is, "They should treat you that way regardless of the decade. It's the way it should be anyway."

I'm sick of being asked out via text message (seriously?), having to split the bill on a first date (Seriously?!), and doors being literally slammed in my face. Than they want to make out in MY car when I shouldn't have even driven in the first place?! Are you kidding me? Am I wrong?

muliebrity · Accepted Answer

Its not so much treating women less. Men now as a whole lack any meaning as to what a man is. It was very black and white back in the day. Technological advancements increased humans to have more instant gratification. More choices. Less commitments. Created more lethargic people. We even order food through our phones. Obtain groceries through amazon. Small examples on hoe human interaction is more distant.

Before cellphones and such. men had no choice but to hold on to the damsal they met... there wasn't as many chances to meet new people. They written letters and poems that took forever for their dates to get. They had to meet at their homes or at a restaurant.

Likewise medical advancements increased our ability to live longer. Back in the day... who knew how long we'd live. It was culturally different

why people are on your ass about it? The manner in which you communicated it seems like absolute truth when really its quite subjective. Your personal upbringing is also after the technology has happened no? Your group of aged guys were bred off of technology. My age group not so much. I had guys made me casette tapes! cds! had to pick me up as I didn't have a car or a phone or even pager.

I still get to meet those guys that call me to see how my day is. text even.. pick me up.. pay for whatever. Likewise I do the same.. sometimes Ill drive to that guys place sometimes we split the bill. Beyond dating and into marriage.. its one big pool of money anyways.

Im not saying that your values (which is the same as mine) is wrong. What is wrong is your entitlement. What is wrong is you are misjudging character based on subjective values. back in the day women didn't behave this way.. huffing and puffing every single time. Likewise I feel some women nowadays have lost their sense of what femininity is and the power it has.

Dont give up hope dont settle but learn to keep things in perspective to the age.
You can have a guy do all those things and still be a bad person.

MaskedSanity · Accepted Answer

All the things you listed there that you believe ought to be done for you reek of self-absorbed entitlement.

You're saying this is the way things "should be done", but did you ever bother to stop and think WHY? Why should HE pay the bill? Why should doors be opened for YOU? Why is it HIS obligation to drive you?

Have you ever SERIOUSLY questioned these "traditional" beliefs that were spoon fed to you?

The reason people are on your ass is because you believe you deserve to be treated with a minor form of worship just because you're female. Having a vagina doesn't give you special rights. Nobody is obligated to do any of these things for you unless they WANT to.

Another reason for people being upset with your question is because a lot of women, who expect this sort of chivalry also expect to be treated as an equal. This is of course absurd, because as soon as you exclaim that you deserve to be treated in a special manner just because you're a woman, you denounce yourself as an equal and reduce yourself to a mere object of desirability, a trophy of sorts.
In this case, please make sure to adhere to "traditional" views of what women are "for": cooking, cleaning, sex and baby-making. If you disagree with these expectations for yourself, then I strongly recommend Googling the words 'hypocrisy' and 'double standards'.

Anonymous · Accepted Answer

I don't get why people are so up in arms about this post! Its good to see SOMEONE from this self indulgent, self absorbed, ignorant and rude society finally step up and say something!

I read all of this and was completely appalled by the answers she got. She could have worded it a different way, but all she wants is a guy to treat her nice.

What? Guys are too lazy and ignorant to see the truth in her question? Ya'll say its about equality and feminism and all this sh*t, and that's just a pathetic excuse for rude behavior! Are you THAT quick to switch the blame?!

You go girl. Don't ever lower your expectations because this society has no sense of what it means to have REAL courtesy.

markml · Accepted Answer

It's not that you have too high expectations.

Your friends have low standards, and society in general has become very low.

A few of these things you should probably look past though. For instance, does it really matter whose car gets used? What if you met a really great guy but he didn't have a driver's license. Would you prefer to take the bus with him? Or should he hire a limo?

What matters (imho) is not so much the specifics, but the spirit of them...whether the guy is trying to be a gentleman or not.

And people do sometimes get really confused in this modern era too, so we all mess up every now and then. Like with paying for the first date...I agree the guy should do it, but that actually makes some women feel uncomfortable, so I can kinda understand why a guy might think it safer to split the bill until he gets to know you better. Other guys will do the opposite -- pay for the first couple dates, and then never pay again.

So ultimately, I think that judging the guy's character is more important than just looking at the etiquette rules alone, in deciding if he's a prince or a swine.

Also, if you don't like being asked out by text message, have you considered getting a land line? Some of my friends don't even use cell phone any more. Only using a land line is a great way to avoid text messages.

passinby · Accepted Answer

"To me, it's not about feminism or equality." It is everything to do with feminism. You might be this special unicorn woman, I hope you are and good for you, but feminism has wrecked men's perception of women. We now see women more like the enemy due to 50 years of constant misandry. They are ready to cut our dick off in the middle of the night and laugh about it on national tv. They are ready to falsely scream rape because they/she now has a hangover. They scream and sneer in our faces for holding the door. They fk every hot guy in sight (not complaining there). They have proven that they really hate our guts and have exposed the true nature of the woman and it is an ugly sight to behold. It is almost impossible to take a woman serious anymore especially considering an LTR in this raunchy culture the feminists have created. While you might be wonderful individually, you are associated with the foulest trash in existence by being a woman. Get used to it, because it is only getting worse.

Anonymous · Answer

Here's why everyone's on your ass about it.

"I treat men the same way I'd like to be treated and that's with respect."

That's fine. However, you're contradicting it with:

"Having to split the bill (Seriously?!)" and "I shouldn't have even driven in the first place?!"

You're looking for respect and treatment that you are not giving. Splitting the bill sounds perfectly fair and reasonable, but you're blowing up about it. You're complaining about having to drive, so unless you're willing to walk, you're holding him up to much different standards than you are yourself. While asking someone out by text isn't exactly classy, that doesn't make him disrespectful. You're not complaining about respect and common courtesy- you're complaining about not being treated as well as you think you should. Like superuss said, there's a distinct difference between not pulling out a chair and belching the alphabet.

So I ask you this: what's so wrong with you driving? What's wrong with splitting the bill? You're both going to the same place, and you're both eating the food. You claim it's disrespectful of him to have you pay for your share or to have you drive, but you see no problem with expecting him to do all of that? How can you claim that you're treating them as you want them to treat you? People are riding your ass about this because you're considering double standards and inequalities to be "equal" when it benefits you.

Anonymous · Answer

I don't agree with anything you say. This is definitely about equality and feminism. If you want guys to treat you like a lady, then you need to treat them like a  gentleman, even if they aren't. Personally, I don't act like a lady, never have and never will. I don't just give out my respect. If someone, including women, want respect from me, they need to earn it. Sure, I'll be polite to a lot of people. But I don't expect every guy to hold open a door for me or pay for all the dates with the full amount. Nor do I expect him to drive all the time. It's unreasonable. And unfair. I'm on your ass about it, because you are making assumptions. And being a prickly, little, sensitive priss about things you have no control over. If you want people to respect you and treat you like a lady. You need to earn it. If you want people to respect, don't be suck a whiny bitch about every single thing a guy does wrong on a date. If you don't want him to do something, for f***'s sake, tell him! If you want to be treated as a lady, act like a lady. Don't be a whiny bitch. And don't worry over everything guys do wrong. People make mistakes. No one has ever gone through their full life, without making several mistakes. We're human. No one is perfect. You have high expectations. You need to mellow out.

David-NewZealand · Answer

In the 1950's and 60's men would open a door or give up their seat in public for any women. It was considered very rude if they didn't. But I must mention women had much better manners back then too and acted far more lady like. Since then women pushed for equal rights which is good for them and I support them with that. Now that women are considered equals society believes it is not a mans responsibility to go completey out of his way to open a door or give up his seat for random women that are completely capable of looking after themselves. If you ask most women in modern society they also believe it is not necessary, they think I am more than capable of opening my own door or I am more than capable of standing on the bus. In the past some women have even told us guys off for opening a door for them and we often do not get a thank you for it when we do. I had that happen the other day, I unlocked a door so a girl was not locked outside, she did not even thank me or look at me. How rude. There are many men that have been treated badly by women when they have never treated a women badly themselves. Hows that fair? All this type of behaviour is also why men are less willing to open doors and give up their seat in public and I don't blame them. Many women are not they ladies they use to be.  Times have changed it's not the 1950's anymore. However, if your on a date I considered it good manners for a man to open a door for you. So if your expecting any random man in public to always open a door or give up his seat for you then yes your excepting too much but on a date then I feel no your not expecting to much. You are right with being annoyed with anyone that lets a door slam in your face, that is simply rude. When a guy asks a women out it should be done face to face not by text I agree. However, part of the problem is that some women can be so rude and cruel to a guy that asks them out. Especially if they don't like him. That is simply wrong.

selfishstars · Answer

I enjoy the benefits of equality, and I don't mind that responsibilities that come with it.

I prefer to split the bill. We both work, we both make money, we're both enjoying the date, so why should he be the one who has to pay?

I've never had a door slammed in my face; guys open the door for me, but I open the door for them if I get to the door first. I don't need someone to open a door for me, I'm fully capable of opening it myself, but it's polite to hold the door for someone else regardless of their gender.

Usernamesrdumb · Answer

e·qual·i·ty
/əˈkwälədē/
noun
the state of being equal, especially in status, rights, and opportunities.

Now your statement.

I'm sick of being asked out via text message (seriously?), having to split the bill on a first date (Seriously?), and doors being literally slammed in my face. Than they want to make out in MY car when I shouldn't have even driven in the first place? Are you kidding me? Am I wrong?

Now reverse the rolls:
Why don't women make my bed, cook for me, do my laundry, raise my kids, and be happy when i come home from work.

I have had plenty of women let a door slam in my face.

See how sexist your own original statement is if you just reverse the sexes and traditional gender roles? You want men to woo you, then pay for everything, and you want to be driven? That doesn't meet the definition of equality. Both parties should be splitting that evenly.

i think you have a case of wanting your pie and eating too. Feminism doesn't want gender constructs (thats how its coming into the conversation). Blame your XX chromosome carriers for woking all us dumb bumbling men. We are just adapting lest we get put before the court of twitter with no due process for angering “the mighty female” by opening a door.

moaterboat · Answer

There's an old saying that applies here,

"If more women would sit down and act like ladies, more men would stand up and act like gentleman."

There is absolutely NO incentive for men and boys to act like gentlemen in today's society. The so-called "women's lib" movement caused it. Don't blame guys, blame other women.

Surfinforlife · Answer

Because those uhh "ladies" don't exactly treat us with the same respect either.

Don't get me wrong...there are mature girls out there that deserve the best.

But most of the girls out there are full of playing games, and are flaky with mixed emotions. Us guys can't read that or ever understand it, so we can't exactly give our full selves to you without being hurt in the process.

I am a gentlemen and hold doors open a lot. But I don't give a girl all my time of day either...only if she was "the one" or my wife would I ever do that

Investigator · Answer

"When did this become about equality and feminism?"

Surely you jest, right? Let's put this statement another way, "why don't men treat women like women rather than treating them like men?", because for the last several years, women have been screeching about how they are unfairly treated because they are women. So, what do they do? They create additional laws and legislation that makes them legally more like men, except when it comes to dating, where they still want to be treated like women.

Equality is not an all-you-can-eat buffet, you don't get to pick and choose how equal you want to be treated or when you want to be treated equally. Either you are treated like a man all the time or a woman all the time. Pick one.

bDizzie · Answer

I wouldn't say you have high expectations because you want the man to hold the door open for you, pay for dinner if he asks you out, and ask you out on the phone rather than through text.

Stop dating the jerks and give the good guys a chance, that's all I got!

udolipixie · Answer

1. Reciporation.

I don't treat men like gentlemen because they don't act like gentlemen.

^ being nice for sex...uh no opening /= gentleman

^ thinking you're entitled to whatever you want in a girl /= gentleman

aka I'm nice girls should want me...uh no girls should want you because they connect emotionally with you & find you physically/sexually attractive

I don't act like a lady since men don't treat me like one even if I do act like one.

2. Abuse

I act like a ladyand get treated like a feeble minded & weak as a newborn kitten piece of property that needs to do what a man tells her.

So I guess men don't treat women for the same reasons women don't act like ladies & when they act like gentleman they're not treated like gentlemen. Plus fear getting abuse for it since lots of women think gentlemanly behavior = misgnony.

Chris6542 · Answer

The truth is all the strained feelings by the way men snd women today are rooted in uncomfortably changing gender roles. When men and women became competitors in the workplace en mass... it changed everything (whether we like it or not). As a guy, I know many terrific women... but also know way too many who use men, lie to men, and in general despise men. Their choice I guess... As long as men and women continue to be competitors in the workplace, this mindset and strained gender feelings will continue. Men and women are no longer complimentary but adversarial. Sad.

slipslender · Answer

i agree with your first paragraph... but not so much with your second paragraph...

1. agreed, getting asked out by text message feels somewhat like a copout, I'd rather that kind of thing happen in person. however, it isn't a deal-breaker to me.

2. it's 2011. I think it's totally acceptable to split the bill on the first date. both of you are having a good time (hopefully), so both of you should pay. personally, I wouldn't feel comfortable having a guy pay for me on the first date.

3. I hope they aren't doing it intentionally. I like it when doors are held open for me, by either gender, and I always do the same- it's just common courtesy.

4. you are a functioning human being. driving is a non-issue.

jesseray · Answer

You are not wrong.

I believe that people should deliver date invitations in person, that people should open (and keep open) doors for others when they see others who are close and approaching the door, and that people should accept their responsibilities as the host of the evening (e. g., pay for the meals) when they are on the dates for which they delivered invitations.

You are right, of course, that this is not an issue of feminism and equality. That should be clear from the absence of gendered pronouns in the previous paragraph. Despite the role that the feminist and humanist movements may have played in the diminishing of these customs, these customs can be established once more without abandoning feminism and humanism. It is my sincere belief that our society would be more beautiful and pleasing if these standards were adopted by everyone: male, female, and in-between.

Anonymous · Answer

Honestly because most women these days don't have any class. A lot of them are sluts that whored around in college and still expect to be treated well even though they have shown they clearly don't respect themselves, their own body, their health, monogamy, marriage or commitment.

Sounds cold but just my opinion

Abtraction · Answer

Because most of you are not ladies, you act like 9 year old toddlers throwing a tantrum when they don't get a toy. The worst part is other women & society does not hold women accountable for their bad behavior. So men have started to avoid you and relationships.

This is the modern age, men are getting educated on all the "Society Traps For Men".
Divorce Rape, Child Support, Family Laws, Losing their kids, False rape, False sexual harassment, Me 2.

Add on top of that Feminism, Babies are parasites, Pussy Hats, Toxic masculinity, Fake wage gap, Fake Male privilege, and a complete lack of support for men's issues.

Maybe someday when the "Ladies" have sons and see the problems their son's will have they may wake-up, but I think society will collapse first. Just look at all the single mom's and the impact of raising kids with-out fathers. Women may be good Mom's, but they are shitty fathers.

The signs are already appearing...

berrybush · Answer

As someone also raised by "old fashion" I've always treated women as a gentleman.
Until I saw that there was nothing in it for me, it was all for the woman to feel special.
Until she dumps my ass for being "too nice'.
Probably true for a lot of other men.

Chivalry is dead.

brownworldtraveler · Answer

Whenever I have opened doors for women, they've always acted super creeped out. Instead of walking through, they always stop right away and make me go first (with a creeped out look in their face like they're looking at a monster). These same women then complain about men not opening doors for them anymore. Makes me feel worthless and anger at these women.

Frost_Byt3 · Answer

Its because most women these days don't ACT like ladies. You have to act like a lady if you wanna get treated like a lady.

Anonymous · Answer

Well, you certainly sound more like a conceited bitch than a lady to me. You all demand equality, then complain about the parts you don't like. Grow up.

giselle1969 · Answer

Haha!  You should live here in Idaho!  Yes, we have cowboys... but we also have an abundance of gentlemen (to include cowboys).  I am a very independent woman, but have raised my son to always respect women.  He opens the door for me, and anyone else that wishes to enter at that time (be it male or female).  He understands it is simply a shoe of respect... nothing more.

DodgersGM · Answer

A lot of those things have become outdated. For example, I'm a big fan of paying for a first date, but a woman should at least offer to split. Getting picked up and carted around is another one that's getting phased out.

I do agree with you about the other chivalrous things though. Women actually get surprised when I hold doors open for them and offer them my hand/arm when we're going up and down curbs.

GuyBot · Answer

Because women don't act like ladies anymore. Women are sexually aggressive and promiscuous and they are competing with us in the workplace.

It's called equality, I thought it's what you wanted.

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Anonymous · Answer

I'm really fortunate for being born in this generation where I don't have to deal with that crap. I just started dating recently (15 years old :P) and noticed girls really think they are something special lol
I can guarantee you that I will never do anything like that for a women just because she's a woman. What's so different about boys and girls? Give one reason why I should treat you differently?

Anonymous · Answer

In my experience, most women don't act like ladies anymore. I always start out as a gentlemen, only to discover that girls pride themselves on being wacky and wild. If you want me to play the gentlemen, act like a lady. What may be men's problem is that they've gotten used to this kinda behaviour in women and adjusted themselves accordingly. Another thing is, if you're demanding paid dinners, being taxied wherever you want to go and having a lot of money and effort spend on you, I'd be quick to 'drop you like it's hot'. It has to remain a voluntary effort, not an expected one. If you act like a bundle of expectations, I run and don't look back.

And the thing is: I like paying for dinner, take you on a vacation and do all the gentleman stuff. It make me feel good. It's just that when I see things go unappreciated I simply don't want to do them.

Cudetatetoarele · Answer

Chilvary is dead and women killed it -Dave Chapelle
You’re a strong independent wymyn you can open your own damn door. And no men are not required to to pay for your dinner and to treat you like the princess you think you are.

Stephbansan · Answer

no you are NOT wrong. i am a lady and i will be treated as such. and this isn't sexist because i treat any deserving man as a gentleman. just carry yourself as a lady would, tell potential men that YOU ARE A LADY, and dont tolerate anyone who treats you and anything but. hopefully you will fine your gentleman, i know i did.

dmbarrad · Answer

You have to ask MGTOW.

In addition, in this age, because of women's demonstrations, the meaning of the word respect has become that of non-rape.
As it is not every girl raised in your style, everyone will not treat you because you grew up in that manner.
You have to show that

Aquariusmystery · Answer

Yes you are wrong. Why don't you treat them nicely for a change or at least pay half of the bill for a meal this is the 21st century for fucks sake!

Mario23 · Answer

not all guys are like that. trust me. personally guys should treat girls right. personally I try to treat girls with respect. I was brought up to respect women. trust me there are guys out there that respect women. hope this helps.

Anonymous · Answer

I knew what sort of ridiculous responses this question would get. Far too many cynical blues here. Now I’m not against them but I don’t like petty negativity in anyone, blues or pinks. I will say however, that I found a good guy and chivalry certainly wasn’t dead with him, in fact I even dated a couple before him. The good guys are out there. Just keep your sights set on a respectful relationship, accept no less - ever, and appreciate it when you find it. Good luck 🙂

Anonymous · Answer

My grandpa was very polite and well spoken, could charm the legs off a mule and would always take the lead in dating... and beat up and cheated on his wives, had children out of wedlock, etc.

You're looking at the "good old days" with colored glasses, youngster.

Anonymous · Answer

I completely agree with you. A lot of guys are so "ungentlemanly" these days I almost got a chock when a guy opened a car door for me... several times!

I think it's bad that women aren't treated like ladies anymore. At least once in a while. Instead we're left wondering if the guy is upset that he had to pay for our food, wondering if we should offer gas money...

SIGguy · Answer

I, myself, identify as feminist, and I would say it's been taken a little too far. My mother once told me your attitude is a pretty big deal breaker, when it comes to dating. You treat your woman like a lady and respect her, at the same time. Not that hard. Some girls like it, they don't control you. So if you want it, go for it.

Shaun · Answer

Because women don't act like ladies anymore. Women are sexually aggressive and promiscuous and they are competing with us in the workplace. It's called equality, I thought it's what you wanted.

superuss · Answer

It is called equality. You have to take the bad, with the good.

Anonymous · Answer

i always treat ladies like ladies. I think of them like our sisters, if I had a sister I would treat my sister like a lady

Wollu · Answer

Absolutely not astonishing. It's dangergous (metoo), it's controversial (some like it, others don't) and it's of course MISOGYNISTIC because she isn't a weak, inept female, right?

Anonymous · Answer

Lol at you thinking men should pay for you, don't be hypergamous

AlexCab · Answer

I wished I knew. I still open the door for my wife, and pay for every meal we take together. Nothing wrong there...

Anonymous · Answer

The answer to this lies into why women don't treat men, like men anymore.  Let me know when you sussed it out. ;)

Maxemeister · Answer

I guess you have TOO high expectations.

NonchalantBro · Answer

you stopped being ladies

stevo · Answer

That works both ways...

Anonymous · Answer

Blame feminism

Anonymous · Answer

Becaus feminism and equality

Why don't men treat us like ladies anymore?

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