Do men REALLY want women to start making the first move or just women to say yes more often when men approach?

[Ez-Bri-Z]

Is the problem more about fear of rejection rather than men having to be the ones to actually approach?

Traditional: Men should approach first, but women need to say yes more easily.

Modern: No! Men have approached enough, women need to ask men out more!

Equal: It should be equal approaching so that both side experience rejection.

[CrazyGirl2]

Yes, I do think girls should make that move more often but I think guys should also make the first move. Christ guys! If you see someone you like just ask them out and if you don’t see anyone, then thank god, the are progressive, because they can check you out!

[CrazyGirl2]

@ez-bri-z Thanks for the MHO 😘💋

[PrettyPriya]

I didn’t wait. I asked. Now look. What if I had missed on an opportunity with my current partner? Yikes.

[PrettyPriya]

@ez-bri-z Tank you for MHO 😊❤️

[Cynicaldreamer]

I too would like some clarity on this question. Because I'm actually one of those women that has no issue approaching men that I like or I'm interested in... you know, the same thing most men on here claim they want women to be more proactive about?
Yet when I do, said men either friendzone me or aren't interested! Which yes, I get it, is THEIR right, as it is a woman's right to reject men.
But don't come on here claiming you want women to be more assertive in asking you out, yet the rare ones that DO ask you out, you immediately toss aside.

I think the issue is men want women they deem as attractive to pursue them, not just any woman. Meaning if he's not attracted to you, then it's a moot point. He might be flattered he's getting attention, but if it's not a woman he's into, then he won't care.

[Novacane]

I can I agree with you on that, but also note that you are experiencing what most men experience most of their life, what man doesn't get friend zone or most girls are not interested in them that's normal, but I applaud you for not letting those things get to you. Also, we know that women have higher standards than men so who is not to say that the men you are approaching are really good-looking men so it's evident that those kinds of men, the ones who have options will reject you. The same men who are claiming women should make the first move are not the same kind of men you are approaching, it's like you said the "RARE" ones, because out of a majority it's only a very small percentage of women who do make the first move, and when they make the first move it's evident that it's usually the same type of men that do get asked out. And who wouldn't want someone they find attractive to approach them, anyone would want that. It's equivalent when women say they have no one to talk to or are lonely when we know there are a lot of men they ignore or friend zone, obviously they say that because the guy they find attractive isn't reaching out to them

[RandomDude212121]

Clarification : asking a guy out won't make you more or less attractive.

[JSmuve]

Now THIS is an interesting question! I think it's one of those situations where guys say they want women to approach them, but really, they only want the attractive girls to approach them. But what they're forgetting is if women were the ones to approach, what makes them think the attractive ones would approach them?

I think the real issue isn't necessarily that men want women to say "yes" more, which is certainly a good outcome; but I think it's more about men wanting women to be more approachable in general. Guys often hear about how women don't want to be approached here or there or when they're doing x, y, or z, to the point where, when you look around and do a tally of all the places they don't want to be approached, it leaves very few places that they DO want to be approached, which is probably why guys outnumber women on dating apps. I was just at the gym this morning and saw a woman I might be interested in. Did I approach her? Nope. Because I remembered all the women raging in disgust at the idea. Were there opportunities? A couple. Would she have minded? I have no idea.

Women have a tendency of wanting guys to approach them but simultaneously discouraging them from doing so with their words and actions. And I think guys want that to change.

[Ez-Bri-Z]

I think we are honestly in an overcorrection right now which is pretty normal when things have been a problem for so long. It is true, a lot of times we just don't want to be approached. To make it worse, for every legit guy who approaches there may be 9 jerks who just are approaching for sex which we may not be into.

I think sometimes people need to take their shot, but they also need to learn to accept no otherwise those few spoiled apples are gonna ruin it for the rest of you legit guys

[JSmuve]

Yes, there will always be the users out there on both sides of the fence. But that's quite the little conundrum there, eh? If women don't want to be approached a lot of the times, but they're too scared to approach themselves and prefer guys to do it, how do women expect to get into relationships? It seems like they're talking out of both sides of their mouth.

[Ez-Bri-Z]

No more like each woman is speaking for herself and the messages are getting lumped together as if it were speaking for the whole.

[JSmuve]

But as guy you have to lump everyone together to get a sense of the majority opinion. We can't read minds, so we have to go based on the majority. And the majority is usually "we want guys to approach us" but also "we don't want to be approached". Even if they're different populations of women, it leads to confusing and contradictory messaging.

[Ez-Bri-Z]

VOCAL majority. Not an overall majority. This applies to everything from politics to things like feminism and those blue/red pill pushers who speak the loudest.

[JSmuve]

Well a vocal majority is still a majority (I think you meant vocal minority). But, there's no way of showing that they're the minority, so they're taken as the majority because they dominate the narrative. You said it yourself, "It is true, a lot of times we just don't want to be approached", which confirms half of what I said. Unless you're speaking from a minority position?

[Ez-Bri-Z]

Yep sure did mean minority. My mistake.

[OpenClose]

C and I can list off so many reasons why.

Pretty much the entire dysfunction of modern dating comes from espousing equality on a day-to-day basis but then suddenly playing every double-standard under the sun the moment dating or sex are involved.

Ever wonder why guys have trouble relating to women who talk about getting too much unwanted attention? #1 reason, we get absolute jack for attention and are told we're either "too lucky" or even undeserving when we do. So you view us as being free from constant attention and scrutiny while we view you as celebrities complaining about paparazzi and too many adoring fans. We are getting too much of our own side and want what the other side has.

This is why the slut/stud double standard exists or counterpart, the pure/pathetic virginity double standard. It's responsible for so much bitterness and resentment.

Like, when it was all traditional dating during an era of traditional roles, things might have gone smoother due to there being a specific procedure, specific gestures, specific roles. Not fair, but like people had clear guidelines so you knew what to expect. Now, we are much more free of gender roles which is great, but it sure makes it pretty jarring when everyone wants to slip right back into some strange mix of medieval and Victorian "chivalry" that was, if anything, a response to how much we were constraining women and treating them like children.

Be adults. Do nice things for each other. Don't hold any expectation you don't also hold for yourself. Simple as that. Every other piece of formality beyond this is a barrier. An extra layer you have to break through.

[NathanDavis]

I can only speak for myself of course, and in my case and experience... honestly, it doesn't really matter to me as long as it is genuine

most of the times (3 out of 4 girlfriends I ever had) girls have been the ones to approach me or make a move first, and because it was a genuine interest and also reciprocated, it worked for us...

I very rarely approach women myself and first, but when I've done it.. it was a genuine interest, I do not go out and "hunt" sort of speak, I never approach a woman just because she's good looking... I've always needed more and like more than just that, so, if I've approached someone is because I'm beyond those first impressions and genuinely interested AND, if she isn't... that's not a big deal to me, because that surely happens sometimes and that is just fine

[Prettygurl12]

Men have, traditionally, never made the first move. Ladies have always orchestrated some situation or environment in which she and the man she's interested in exist.

Women have dropped something in front of a man and the man returned it to her. Everyone thinks the return of the item is the first move but it's not. The dropping of the item is the first move.

Women asked their fathers to go introduce himself to the man... at which time the man would invite the dad and ladies to some gathering as was common custom... ergo fulfilling the "first move" requirement.

Technically, it's very modern for the man to make the first move. 😉

[Lonewulf57]

Traditionally speaking, if that was the case, then no woman has ever been interested In me my entire life.

[ChrisMaster69]

I’m not really bothered either way tbh.

i ask, they ask, as long as someone asks and does not just think should I or should I not.

a few times I’ve asked a girl, she’s said no, then dragged her mate over who was to she to ask me.

Admittedly I grew up in an area where girls are like packs of sharks, they are not really shy, and some scare the shit out of me lol.

Also, if you are good you can get her to ask lol.

also admittedly, I am an arse at times and apparently miss bloody obvious signs and everyone else knows apart from me 🤦

@DonkeyDan Would you say Geordie birds are shy and reserved?

[DonkeyDan]

Oh god no, Geordie birds are like predators lol

[VanillaSalt]

It’s not about the approaching it’s the manor. Men can easily been accused of terrible things and society will condemn men before the truth comes out. Look at things like metoo and false allegations. It’s dangerous to be a man in the dating world. Besides that women have double standards for men they like and men they don’t. Considering this women should step up and start proving to men they want us by carrying dating for a while.

[Ez-Bri-Z]

Metoo was a legit thing that, as always, has bad actors in it to profit and gain from lying. In the end it did more good than harm.

I do agree though more women should step up and ask guys out.

[VanillaSalt]

Metoo did more harm then good. Period. It was started on the tailcoat of an innocent man and pushed as though all men… even if you say it’s good… the result immediately after was men stopped. If it was worth it it was worth it if not we’ll… remember this is the consequence of decisions made by others that now effect you.

[VanillaSalt]

The really disappointing part… lies saying 1:4 women are raped on college campus or whatever that fucking figure was. All because stupid little girls who regret their drunken skank behavior decided to throw men under the bus. One single false allegations too much but for it to happen at the rate it does? Hell nvm that look at the consequences… rapes 3-5 years but for false allegations women are unlucky to serve 1.

No. If women want men they now have something to prove. Step up and “be a man”.

[AngelPoop]

The number is probably higher. And the cases are backlogged.
If you're not a troll and genuinely believe this, I hope you get some help.

[Ez-Bri-Z]

He isn't a troll. I legit know him irl.

He is a great guy with just some hard to swallow beliefs sometimes. I dont agree with him here in the slightest but he already knows that

[VanillaSalt]

First off 1:4 girls don’t even know the difference between rape and assault. Second cases wouldn’t be backlogged if stupid women didn’t file false alarms.

[Quigly]

A Woman should make the first move if she wants a choice in the type of guy she is with. Personality disorders play a big role in a toxic relationships. If you don't want toxic relationships. Start choosing who you want to be with instead of letting someone else choose for you.

A narcissist thinks he's gods gift to women. This is a highly toxic relationship. Many women avoid this personality and walk away.

Many girls know the right guy is unlikely to think he has a chance. Cause he isn't a narcissist. He doesn't think he's gods gift to women. So, If you want better quality men, start choosing the guy instead of letting the guy choose you..

[ZackBan]

I just think it's a shame so many women miss out on great opportunities all the time.
I often hear women complaining they are getting low quality men.
And they see the high quality man walking by them every now and again. Just Apprach him (and by him I mean me 😊).
Trust me women's odds of success are much higher than men and unless the woman is truly physically repulsive to a visible point a man will give her a shot will take interst the second she says she does

[DonkeyDan]

I'd say both really, most women have no idea the courage it takes some guys to approach a girl, only to be shot down without an ounce of consideration.
I'm not saying that a girl should say yes everytime, but you see situations where a guy is approaching a girl, and you can see on her face, that she has already decided to reject him before the guy says a word.
People seem very judgmental these days and not willing to even chat to someone to find iut what they are like before rejecting then. These are the same people who wonder why they are alone.
Also in today's world where guys are becoming nore afraid to approach girls, because the media portrays all men as rapists, and all women as feminists, it is refreshing when a woman initiates contact.

[Ez-Bri-Z]

Let me counter that idea with sometimes we are just not looking for a date, or we are just not having a great day, or we have already been approached several times and that guy approaching has that look that puts women on guard.

It gets harder for guys because for like every ten guys only 1 or 2 or gonna be legit interesting enough in those first few lines to continue holding a conversation if we even want one.

Women should approach more, but men need to get WAY better at reading body language and holding interesting conversations that extend beyond "nice tits" lol

[DonkeyDan]

Hahaha, that is very true, thankfully I've never used the line "nice tits" before, so you're saying that doesn't work? 🤣

[Ez-Bri-Z]

Only if I'm holding a pair of birds.

[DonkeyDan]

🤣🤣

[PrettyPriya]

I’d be inclined to ask @DonkeyDan out if he gave me MHO more often. 😕

[Ez-Bri-Z]

*gasp* name change time to PrettyPolyPriya

(Say that 7 times fast)

[DonkeyDan]

@PrettyPriya
You need to answer more of my questions then 😂

[PrettyPriya]

@DonkeyDan per last question…chocolate. MHO 😕

[DonkeyDan]

@PrettyPriya
Ok it's a deal 😉

[PrettyPriya]

@DonkeyDan Damn it! I should have answered on the actual question! Oh dearie me. I’m such a newbie 😞

[Anonymous]

This is why shit like Bumble often fails. The whole point of that app is women making the first move. Since they rarely do, nothing happens, and the app may of failed if it wasn't bought by the Match. com group. Also, the ones who do are probably going to have more confidence and be pickier on who they choose. It ends up with girls on there often career driven with a shit ton of guys on there for the peace of mind. Often, the wealthiest career driven guys wouldn't be matching with them, because they don't want a dominate date. It's a complete mismatch. No wonder they have the "networking" option. How else would they stay even remotely relevant?

[Idiotikhumanz]

the sad thing is, i never in my life tried to approach or ask a girl out, but 2 girls in my life have tried asking me out, both of which i was very attracted to, but because of my insane shyness and low self esteem, when they was complimenting me n shit., i jus sort of closed off and acted unintrested because i was scared to show i like them,
now they probably dont think theyre good enough, but they was more than good enough,
maybe a lot of males have jus lost their balls, or maybe its how i was brought up that caused my complete lack of self esteem

[Idiotikhumanz]

jus dont feel like i deserve a girlfriend, especially not an attractive one

[HighValue]

My personal reason why I prefer the girl to make the first move is because I don't want someone that will always be passive in the intimate/physical/romantic parts of the relationship. Many girls that always want the guy to make the first move stay that way even once in a relationship. That means no hugs, no hand holding, no kisses, basically nothing unless the man initiates it ALL THE TIME. Then the man never actually feels wanted because the girl does nothing to make him feel wanted. For that reason I would prefer a girl that would make a move first and I would expect her to initiate those other things sometimes too once in a relationship. If I always have to do that I won't be happy and will leave her.

[loveslongnails]

Choice "C" comes closest for me, but I wouldn't word it so "equal" needs to be there. I'd say "anyone should feel at ease doing the asking instead of paying attention to a societal "norm" Choice "A" is not good. Are you advocating that women say "yes" anyway when they don't want to date the person asking? That's like blaming an incel women for his choice because they wouldn't date him, without considering how non-date worthy he is in the first place!

[Ez-Bri-Z]

Not advocating for anything, just simply putting answers based on responses I have seen before on here

[loveslongnails]

Gotcha. I've seen that concept from choice "A" tossed around, that women need to less picky and say "yes" more to guys, even though they might be turds, and that way it will prevent them from becoming aggressive or depressed. Brilliant, huh?

[Ez-Bri-Z]

: )

You said it. I was just thinking it REALLY hard. lmao

[TheBootyChest]

I don't mind making the first move and asking for a date. But I will like it if when we were interacting that she would show more signs that she is interested in me first.

Like if we are talking, she could just be friendly and talking with me. And I wouldn't know she is just being polite or if she is into me. But if there is a vibe, she could give a coy little smile or something to let me know she feels it too and that if I made a move she would like that.

Does that make sense?

[Tiptoetamm]

Personally I think it should be equal. I have no problem going up to a guy I like and telling him. A lot of men are shy and don't want to be rejected so just don't ask. If a guy asks you out and you are busy take their number set something up for later time.

[Phoenix-gb]

I think it's a mix of both, if you've only ever experienced rejection then that fear is going to get worse as it becomes more of an expectation, so it would be refreshing if someone showed interest in you for a change. But at the same time, if you had the experience of success when approaching someone (women saying yes more often), the confidence to do so again would increase and future rejections wouldn't have as much of an impact.

[Idazle34]

Let's be honest here, women make a lot of first moves. Infact it used to be that a woman would see a cute guy, drop their handkerchief, the guy would notice it pick it up, and run after her thinking she had accidentally dropped it. We can pretend that we want the guy to make the first move but most of the time if a girl is really interested in a guy she could careless if he makes the first move.

[Oigit]

Cish It would make it easier if I woman approached me. I'm very much the kind of person that spends a lot of time in their head. Even when I'm out and about my mind is going. So I don't spend to much time interacting with people and I don't tend to give people more then a quick glance as I pass. So there has probably been a lot of times where a woman ended up waiting for me approach her and I never did.

[BungusHighFivePizza]

dont need 2 ask men out. just let them know ur interested unless u want little control over who u date. dats not even modern. women even dropped their hankies in front of guys 2 actively show interest in victorian era. they were often making first move. a person interested in another shouldn't be afraid 2 make first move. its in their own interest 2 make first moves. but first move doesn't have 2 be asking men out