In response to this question : Should today's women strive to be more feminine? Made by @jcampbell115 (thanks for the question) Well, let's see, Chivlary is gone men are not true with women and they have the intention to fool them just to get laid, respect is gone between others and most men are afraid of feminism instead of owning it. What do you think! One for the #Abdfangirls Looks should not matter much but you can include this in the arguments
Okay many answers thanks a lot I will have to get back to you with these walls of text later 💕
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+1 y
I really apologize people I don't think I can read all of your answers and replies... I don't mean to be rude but clearly this is a big content to read about I guess I will do a take about masculinity... #NotSweetNovember
I think it depends on how you define "masculine". How about this for "masculine" from a former emperor of Rome who fought and conquered the Marcomannic Wars?
"To be moved by anger is not manly, but courtesy and kindness, as they are more agreeable to human nature, so also are they more manly; and he who possesses these qualities possesses strength, nerves and courage, and not the man who is subject to fits of rage and discontent. The nearer one's mind is to freedom from anger, the nearer it is to strength, and as pain is a characteristic of weakness, so also is anger. For he who yields to pain and he who yields to anger, both are wounded and submit." -- Marcus Aurelius
None of this is with the suggestion to turn into a pushover. A man can raise his voice to command attention, fight those who are unavoidable enemies, but do it from a source that's not coming from blind rage.
So that's a quality I admire, but I admire it in both men and women who possess it.
I think a pop culture problem. I'm a big fan of Marcus Aurelius' brand of "masculinity" if you can't tell already. :-D A man who says these things has to be a good man as I see it, especially when it's an emperor saying these things:
There is a video here which might be of interest if you have some spare time. In my opinion it covers the essence of what I consider the most important fundamentals of manliness. And the professor is maybe a bit guilty of being a bit too much of a fan. Marcus Aurelius was a flawed human being, as with the rest of us. But for an emperor in such a powerful position to entertain the thoughts he had is something extremely, extremely, extremely rare as I see it. So this gets at the essence of not only what I think makes a good man, but a good human being in general:
Both men and women should spend the majority of their days in the right energy roles. Guys should be dominant and women should be submissive for the majority of the day. If either gender spends too much time in the wrong role it will quickly drain their energy and be bad for all.
Yes. I think that today the reason many men don't is because we're taught that it's a bad thing and that we should act more like women.
You say that "most men are afraid of feminism instead of owning it" - it's the feminists who are all about encouraging androgyny in both men and women because they think that will lead to a more equal society. In doing so they destroy everything that is good and everything that is attractive about men and women.
In fact the idea that men are "afraid" of feminism is a line that you've been fed. The reason they accuse men of being "afraid" of feminism isn't because they actually think that men are afraid of it, in fact it's a very smart shaming tactic to manipulate men into supporting feminism - because on some level they understand that a man's biggest fear is actually being accused of being a coward. If a guy doesn't like something and you want to fool him into supporting it, tell him it's because he's afraid of it, accuse him of having some kind of phobia, and he'll try to prove that he isn't. This works especially if you accuse him of being afraid of a woman. Very smart actually and many guys are gullible enough to fall for it.
Androgynous people are still able to date and have good relationships... so... I don’t see how that destroys attraction of males and females. There are always gonna be more of the standard janes of the world bec that’s how nature works. Let the minority be the minority. They may annoy you but at the end of the day it’s not going to affect you so you have zero to worry about.
It's becoming more and more common and I think it's because people are being influenced that way. There are many reasons why I think it's a bad thing, apart from finding them annoying. The biggest complaint I hear from both men and women I know is the lack of masculine men/feminine women. There are many studies that suggest that women are naturally drawn to masculine men, and men are naturally drawn to feminine women. I think that this should be common sense, I don't think it should take studies to prove it, and I don't think that should be so shocking for so many people to hear as it is today. I also think that it's unhealthy to encourage people to go against their nature. With men for example, masculine behaviour influences testosterone, and testosterone influences masculine behaviour. 1 in 4 men today have low test, which is associated with all kinds of health issues both mental and physical. I wonder how much of this is caused by this push towards androgyny.
But it's so much fun to downplay ones masculinity in order to disappoint women, conservatives and those men that have shit for brains. :)
Yeah, yeah, I get it. The world needs more men to step up and become these responsible work horses of old, nest up with one of the women who are longing to raise a stable happy family. Men who are up for filling those masculine virtues are coming in shorter and shorter supply, only...
We can't compel people to do or be anything anymore. It's much too late for that.
It's not often talked about but strides made by progressive groups opened the gates for men everywhere, not just to experiment with their gender expressions, but to flush out ALL normative expectations of what sort of masculinity they supposedly should fulfil, good or bad.
A vast majority of those guys won't be coming back to the table (or stable, depending on how you look at it). There are those trying to shame them back into the fold, but that strategy is pretty pathetic and ineffective.
Women: Men should be more dominant, confident, capable and in control of their emotions! They should be tougher than me, a rock I can lean and rely on, who leads me! They should be less intimidated by and afraid of violence, and be emotionally less effected by it! They should take over manly tasks, like maintaining the house and the garden, carrying heavy stuff, driving, pumping the gas, and they should know about cars and technology! They should take me on dates and pay for them!
Also women: Why are men more successful, confident and dominant than me? Must be sexism! THOSE EVIL MEN! As a woman, I have a right to be more emotional and express my emotions more than men! BUT DON'T SAY I'M MORE EMOTIONAL!!! EVIL MEN! Why does he behave like HE is the one in control? Why does HE decide everything? DISGUSTING EVIL MAN!!! Why are men more violent and have less compassion than me? Must be because they are simply WORSE human beings! FUCK THOSE MEN!!! WHAAAAAAT? YOU EXPECT ME TO COOK AND CLEAN? Evil patriarch! Castration will be your punishment!!! I know I said I wanted you to know more about cars and technology, but please stop being so interested in cars and technology! That is SOOOO typically male! Also, don't behave like you know more about cars and technology! That is so condescending and conceited!!! Yes, I know you needed to work more in order to pay for dates, than I have to when I cook! SO WHAT? I can still expect you to take me on dates, but if you want me to FUCKING COOK? YOU ARE A SEXIST!!!
Lot's of gay men out here are starting to look and act like women. Lot's of men (not all) are somehow wanting to turn gay and wanting to act and become a female. Same with women. It is scary and not normal. Nothing charming about it. It seems like LGBT community is really trending right now; for lot's of people. So these days, when I see a guy come close to "acting" feminine or playing around--for example when they talk like a valley girl to be funny, or dress like a girl to make a funny dance video, or use girly snapchat filters often, it's not a good look at all. Mainly when they play the part real well too. I never use to feel this way before but now, guys need to just watch out how they carry and present themselves these days. I always say that us women need to tone down on heavy make-up these days because guys are over here looking like women with the magic and power of make-up and weaves. It's crazy and it blows my mind.
I kind of agree. Guys in general are so feminine because being gay is trendy that I can't tell if they're straight or gay half the time anymore
My masculine female friend has a feminine boyfriend who owns a gay bar. They joke about it all the time, but sometimes I wonder if he's really gay and only into her because she's so masculine
People who try to be nice and disciplined are mistakened as "weak" and "uncool" and emasculine.
While indisciplined men who keep making stupid comments, using foul langauge and remain indifferent to the society are seen as "cool" and "masculine" Now that's stupid
Lol man Nice response, if only we have more men like you.. But what I meant by owning feminism is that each man has his limits to his lady, that how it should be. And I wtoe the question based on other User question
I don’t think you can really ask this question without defining what masculinity is. Things like chivalry were originally a strict code of conduct that defined the behavior for all male nobility of a certain level. Not to mention it included a system for them to have romantic (and often sexual) relationships with women other than the one to whom they were married. Most of the things listed there are things that any ethical human being should do. And I definitely think that men should all strive to be more ethical humans.
I don't believe there isn't any rule for that. Everyone is different, but I can tell I don't like guys who be very shy.
A guy can be slim, but also with a beautiful, handsome face and also a great heart, amazing personality and I wouldn't give a damn about him having lack of muscles or beard.
For me, face > body as long as he is not fat. Personality face & body, but he has to be someone looking like still nice to me. I just can't be with anyone that I don't like his face.
Also about acting as gentleman or masculine, again it totally depends on the person. I am a dominant person, but I may behave submissive around someone who is confident around me, letting myself to him, trusting. It totally changes, it is not like be always masculine or gentleman, it always changes. My behaviour can do aswell
I think your opinion is far too misandrous. You've taken what you see as the worst things about men, and painted them all with it. Here's what masculine REALLY means: adjective 1. having qualities or appearance traditionally associated with men, especially strength and aggressiveness. "he is outstandingly handsome and robust, very masculine"
Now, you don't address the qualities of aggression or strength, but if you are correct, and men are unchivalrous, lying womanizers who fear feminism, then by calling for more masculinity, you're asking for them to be more of that.
Oh my god no. People just need to accept that the world isn’t so black and white. There is a spectrum and not everyone is going to fall under the same spot. People are different. People are versatile. People are unique. So let’s stop fighting it. And in regards to your description—chivalry and sleeping around has nothing to do with the variations of masculinity. A man who is not chivalrous isn’t less of a man for it.
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Anonymous
(18-24)
+1 y
I have nothing against feminine men even though I'm not attracted to that.
However men who think they're so alpha and call other men cucks or betas for things that have nothing to do with masculinity such as taking care of their appearance and "nice" guys who blame women and feminism for everything even though they are the ones who don't understand how relationships and attraction works should really consider growing those balls.
You can't strive to be what you're not. Today's boys and men get there're ideas and examples from mothers to women around them , not fathers and real men around them to lead them as they should or lead as a great example thetefor... sad , this generation looks like the boys have gone girlish and the girls boyish. ... in my eyes , not real individuals as biology assigned. Shi... I won't even allow a woman to be around me without a strip search for true conformation of its biological assigned makeup.
@Jamie05rhs. There's a damned good reason why men and women are designed different in the first place. People should strive to be all they can be under their complicit original design.
Chivlary: I encourage all young men to learn how to conduct themselves as a gentleman. I think most women value a man who treats them like a lady instead of treating them like a "pal."
Honesty: Dishonest guys think they cannot get a lady of they are honest. Develop some self-confidence and treat a partner the way you want to be treated, including being honest.
Respect: All relationships require Love, lust, trust, and respect. If you want a relationship, treat your partner with respect. If you don't want a relationship, be honest about your intentions.
Feminism has many forms. Quite a few of those forms are hostile, arrogant, and offensive. I have no problem with any woman who wants an equal opportunity to succeed; I have been treating women as equal partners my entire life and I don't need to join a movement to maintain that attitude. If a feminist wants to pretend that there are no differences between men and women, I don't want to be around her.
Young guys say, "Other guys don't behave that way." I say, "So what? Conduct yourself so that you stand out from the crowd! Give a girl a reason to notice you!"
I don't think that those things have anything to do with masculinity at all. I think a lot of people talk about morality when they talk about masculinity, but I believe that masculinity is amoral. A "man" might be chivalrous, respectful, honest... But what if he's also weak? Cowardly? Incompetent? This guy might be chivalrous respectful and honest, would you honestly say that he looks like a masculine guy?
@englisc I am responding to the Asker's definition of masculinity. I do think that a strong man would exhibit all of those behaviors and beliefs, but those alone do not constitute masculinity.
I think guys should strive to be whatever they want but I'd be lying if i denied the fact but young men really do need start being more masculine in the way they behave. I just feel like my whole generation could really do with a good kick up their privileged ass and stop being cry babies just in general
If there was anything in it for them, they would do it. But why would you want to be a man for a woman who doesn't want to be a woman? If men have to make sacrifices and make an effort for the opposite gender, then so do women. Otherwise it's just not worth it.
@Journeyman11 not all women are the same there's plenty of men just as bad but I understand what your talking about women have became intilted and men just like to play the victim and wine instead of actually making changes to their life.
No, they just don't want those women. Why should men make changes in their life, that ONLY benefit women? Especially if they don't WANT those women? It's just not worth it.
@Journeyman11 your literally doing it right now. You attract them girls because you keep running back to them and just decide all girls are bad so don't other changeing and finding a different type of girl who will treat you better and get bitter instead and blame all woman for it and act as if your all innocent in the reasons why modern relationships are going to shit and blame it on feminist when we all know your lots porn additions has a big part to play into it as well.
Men and women are just as bad as each other so stop playing the victim and acting like all women are terrible just because clearly some girl broke your heart.
I don't blame anyone. I didn't say that all women are like that either. And I didn't say that anyone does something to me. I said that THOSE SPECIFIC WOMEN are not worth the effort. I also think that saving money for a ferrari is not worth the effort, and that training every day so I can participate in the olympics is not worth the effort. Doesn't mean I'm blaming them. This is purely my decision. I'm not blaming anyone. Women don't owe me a certain type of behavior. They can be however they want. YOU on the other hand think that men should be and behave a certain way (for women). And porn addiction has nothing to do with it. Interesting that you would call it that, though, "addiction". You'd rather men were addicted to WOMEN instead, and had to read their every wish from their lips, wouldn't you? The fact that men have access to porn means that they don't have to impress women to get their fix. It means that women have less to offer. And this is why men don't think it's worth it.
@Journeyman11 were did I say men weren't putting the effort in? I said you guys wine and play victim as to why women don't like you instead of making changes about it.
To be fair, he said that the way women are, they are not worth changing for... So basically we all have to change. If you have trouble finding good guys, maybe you're just not good enough for them, or not worth changing for, and YOU should start making changes.
I can say that because I have an awesome guy, and believe me, it took a lot of self improvement and effort to be noticed by his kind 😅 But he's absolutely worth it! You have to be better than all the women he could have, in order for him to be interested in you... Just like I didn't settle for anything less than my guy 😊
@AuroraHorizon don't understand why people are getting so triggered by this I said "my whole generation" last time I checked my whole generation weren't all men.
I think that both men and women need to ste up and take more responsibility. Not that they necessarily need to be more masculine, because I love that it is okay for guys to be more in touch with their feelings today and be their authentic self. That is a good thing I believe. But in other ways we could use more masculinity. Like healthwise, many people are getting lazy, get up and go for a run or walk and stop wasting time on video games and instagram, instagram is not masculine. You have to work to get what you want in life, so get up and do something, direction is masculine and that is good. Furthermore all these men complaining and men’a right thing is not very masculine, stop whining and do something about your life. Both men and women lack responsibility these days I believe, you form your life how you want.
No, they should be however the hell they wanna be. I actually quite like pretty boys (like guys who *obviously* take good care of their skin/hair/outer beauty)
I agree with most of your statements though but most of them have nothing to do with real masculinity or a lack thereof and EVERYTHING to do with what we like to call “toxic masculinity”
Toxic masculinity has reached a slippery slope of boogeyman status. People patrol toxic masculinity so much that any display of masculinity can be seen as toxic.
I think there needs to be more of an overall balance. I think the men who claim to be "alpha males" should tone it down a bit, but similarly, all the soy boys could do with eating a few steaks. People can be whatever they want to be, i don't have a problem with that... but I think some guys could do with reaching a middle ground.
It's not that they need to be more masculine. Most don't understand what being a man really means. I recommend reading "power of a man". Most equate being a man as having the most women, the most money, the most prestgious job, and the highest social standing. If you don't understand what it truly means to be a man filling yourself with these is like filling a glass with no bottom. You'll never be fulfilled.
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