Think Every Woman Lies About Harassment in the Western World? Think Twice.

[Anonymous]

I am just writing this take for men who clearly refuse to admit that we still need feminism in Western World and that sexual harassment overwhelmingly happens at work environment since many men, coworkers or customers, think they're entitled to make sexual advances because they have penis, which is the most important organ in their body.

This happened to me couple days ago at a place where I work as sales assistant as my secondary job. On that day, I was working alone at my shift since the other two girls are in general lazy and they like to call last minute and get a sick day. In this clothing shop, a man came to order a bulk custom made hoodies for his work. I took his order, entered details on the computer. In the mean time, his wife also came with twins in a stroller, probably about 6-9 months.

The guy later told me to finish a certain color first because he needs it in an hour. I told him that I will do as best as I can, and he can come stop by in one hour.

They paid, and left. After 20 minutes, he came back while I was working on his order. I told this man that I still have at least 30 minutes of job to do and he can take a walk around the other stores. He said instead he wants to wait in the shop. Even though I was disturbed, not to be rude, I accepted, and he started talking to me while I am doing my job, designing and stuff. Rest is this way:

-- So I hear you have an accent. Where are you from originally?

-- I am from country XX sir.

-- Oh nice. I have many close friends from country XX, I would like to visit one day.

-- Be our guest sir.

-- So you sound grumpy today.

-- No sir I am sorry if I am being rude, or if I offended you. I am the only one at this shift trying to finish a lot of bulk orders and I have sore throat. That's why my voice may sound grumpy to you.

-- It's OK, no worries. Maybe you're grumpy for other reasons. Are you married?

-- No, sir.

--Do you have a boyfriend?

--This is very personal sir, and I do not like to talk outside the work. It's not appropriate.

--It's OK, I am just chatting to cheer you up. So you don't have a boyfriend. This is why you're grumpy. You need a man to satisfy you.

-- Sir I didn't tell you I don't have a boyfriend and please, I like you to leave now and come back when the order is ready. I will give you a call.

-- It's a free country, I like to stay here. So where is your boyfriend from?

-- He is American. (Me trying to bear with him and doing things quickly so he can leave)

-- So he is a white dude because you're white, that's why you're grumpy. These white dude can't satisfy a woman. You can call me at anytime dear.

-- Sir please. If you continue, I may have to call the security. (he stops)

I finished the order and basically kicked him out of the store. He later complained about me to my manager.

All my manager said "You need to please customers and be smiley. You shouldn't be rude. Sometimes guys like to flirt. Flirt back with them" and he got mad at me that I treated the customer rudely (which I did not).

I quit the job.

Yeah, women exaggerate. Women should be proud if a guy hits on them. Or women should be blamed because of the clothing if they get raped. Everything is women's fault and we don't need feminism or extra protection. Sure. (Sarcasm)

Oh by the way, I did not have a single doze of makeup. I was wearing a hoodie and not-so-tight jeans at work. I had a huge manbun on my head. I did not have anything provocative.

But anyways. Men are entitled to do harass women verbally, sexually, and in many other ways. Sure.

[Brewmaster531]

Generalizing is why I'm not a feminist. And I'm not a feminist because SOME woman DO lie about harassment. Not most, not even half, not even 10% of the claims, but they do happen, and when they do, the one who is falsely accused is hardly ever given anything except maybe legal fees he had to deal with.
I heard this story on a radio show and he was reading it off of a news article, so take this story as you will: A man was accused of raping a woman and was sentenced to basically almost life in prison, some very high sentence. He spent 25 years in a maximum security prison before DNA testing proved without a shadow of a doubt that he didn't do it. When he was released, he only received 4 million dollars. Realize that while that's a large number to average citizen, it's much less than any athlete, realize he wasn't able to work at his own job and you don't know how much he would have made, and realize how hard it is to adapt to society after 25 years of limited contact with the outside world. 3 years in to his sentence, his wife divorced him because she didn't want to wait for him, even though she believed he didn't do it. When he got out, she sued him for half of his 4 million, claiming she was entitled to the money because he was put in prison before she was divorced and she should have half of his assets. The problem isn't that this sort of thing happened. The problem is feminists don't address these issues. This is not discussed on The Talk, which always talks about a bad man doing something wrong to a woman, as you're supposed to. There was a story on The Talk about a man cheating on his wife, a piece of crap thing to do, I know, his wife found out about this. She got him drunk and drugged up, cut his penis off and put it through the garbage disposal. Guess what? While the woman on The Talk were talking about it, they were laughing. How about the next time a man knocks out his wife for cheating on him and cuts one off her tits off, I start laughing and making jokes about it? Oh that's right, if I did that, I would be labeled a sexist and I would be put on the news and no one in their right minds would hire me. But because shit like that happened to a man, it's hilarious. My problem isn't women's rights. My problem is they claim to want equal social and legal treatment, then this stuff happens and they keep their mouth shut. Sorry what happened to you happened, but you're in a lucky position where you can just quit your job because you're uncomfortable.

[InTimoreDei]

*slow clap* Well said

[Rissa95]

No, you're right, it's sexist.

Generalizing that all girls would condone that story or even laugh at it is, well, generalization too though.

A true feminist knows that it's about the same treatment for ALL people.

[Brewmaster531]

@Rissa95 I'm not saying all women condoned it, I'm saying that I haven't heard a single feminist speak out against either incident I mentioned. Yet, men and women across the board generally do not condone rape or assault. But I've seen "it's never okay" and "no means no" everywhere for years. And that's how it should be until everyone is safe from either thing happening. But, I don't see anything about not chopping a dick off or not suing someone because of the money they have. Where are the feminists going after Carrie Underwood and that cheating song she wrote about vandalizing her significant other's car because he was cheating on her? Yeah, he cheated but vandalism is crime. Not only does she not get arrested, she brags about the whole ordeal in a song and made millions off of it. If I accidentally ding the car next to me, I have to pay damages and if things get physical I'm going to jail. But if you're famous and have a vagina, vandalism is practically encouraged

[myTake Owner]

There is a story of a man who was falsely accused of rape, and he was jailed for over 20 years. All those years, he maintained his innocence. When DNA testing started to be used in criminal cases, he wrote many letters to lawyers and innocence projects' leaders to get an appeal. He finally got the appeal, and then DNA testing found three different sperms in the rape kit they acquired many years ago. One of them belonged to the then-fiance. Other one belonged to potential rapist and it was definitely not a match with the falsely accused man, and last one was they had no idea where it came from. The woman, many years later, admitted that she had a boyfriend, she was cheating on his fiance (now husband) and she had consensual sex the before the alleged rape happened. So they brought this "boyfriend" and sperm matched with his. Out of the three with no match, this man was finally exonerated. You can watch I think on Forensic Files 4th season.

[Brewmaster531]

I am generalizing and I'm purposely exaggerating and probably being an asshole, but when people say they stand for something and I see no one, and I mean absolutely no one who proudly proclaims to be a feminist standing up against things happening to men, I'm going to get on their nerves. I'll stand next to all the feminists when we're talking about rape, assault, rights, social issues, equal pay, etc, but don't claim a movement is for equality of the sexes when men are getting screwed left and right by this over correction and everyone isn't doing anything about it. Hell, you try bringing an article about some awful thing happening to a guy up to a feminist "for equality of the sexes" bullshit social media pages and say "why aren't you covering this", they block you. I'm as liberal as they come, I want women to have their rights, I even believe for the most part, a women is stronger than a man, but don't claim to be for equality and then let this shit go unnoticed.

[myTake Owner]

Yes these things happen. These women exist, falsely accusing men of rape or harassment. I rather leave what they did to their conscious, what kind of people they are is kind of beyond me because they steal someone's life, dreams, family and kids (the guys said his family turned their back to him and stopped seeing him for so many years)

I do not deny it. However, because of these handful of women, it is wrong to claim 75% of women or almost all women lie about sexual harassment. Or any form of harassment. Look, intentionally I dropped of "some" men from my writing. In my original take, I wrote "several men on this website" then when i reread the take before posting, i changed it to "men". Look how furious they are because they think i generalize and put them in all one bag.

Same here. Just because some women lie does not mean we all lie, and we don't need any kind of feminism looking for ways to protect us and make us more vocal about concerns.

[myTake Owner]

I am not saying men do not suffer from harassment and therefore we should not care. I support that as well, however, this issue is not written in my take, even though it is not irrelevant totally.

If a man goes and writes about men's issues, or writes about his experience with harassment, I am sure I wouldn't be someone who comment the following:

"Go home have kids we don't need you in the workforce"
"You need to please customers whatever they want"
"You're a huge bitch"
"I'd be flattered if they compliment my boyfriend"
"You'd be crying and thinking if you're ugly if noone was harassing you"

I would rather write:
"I am sorry that you went through this. Men also experience these problems but they never come to surface because men are forced to keep quiet and act strong due to societal attributes of "being stronger". We should all sit and talk about a new wave, new movement to improve men's lives regarding harassment"

This is truly what I believe. You know what I wanna say?

[myTake Owner]

Sorry I wrote three long answers because of character limit. Please read them in order @Brewmaster531

[Brewmaster531]

I think, without doing a bit of research, that 99.9999 percent of claims women make are true. But, what I'm asking for is something, at least 3 minutes on television talking about the men who got screwed over. I don't want to just the conscience of the women because in the false rape story I shared, as long as there's one tiny legal loophole, that man who was sentenced to do life in prison (relistened after I wrote my comment) and served 25 years loses half of the money he got for being screwed over. How about someone host a benefit for that guy? Where is his moment of pity? That's what I'm asking for. I'm not even asking for punishment for the women. I'm asking for making sure the man involved is made whole again

[myTake Owner]

I definitely agree with you in that sense. What I am saying is that, writing a simple take as a man is the first step. We are in internet generation and a single unexpected story becomes viral and sheds light on many dark areas that people never paid attention to, and forces authorities to solve certain problems that they always acted they were not aware, when in fact they are.

[Brewmaster531]

I read them all after I commented after only reading one piece. But it seems like we aren't in disagreement actually. What I'm saying is, we get all worked up about the things men do to women, and we should. Men who hit and rape should be buried underneath the prisons and should be forced to give up all their assets to the one they wronged. I'm totally in on that. They are talked about for weeks when they do that shit, and I have no problem with that. My problem lies in where's the coverage for the men? We do anything we can to make sure the woman wronged is helped and her situation is covered by media. I'm just asking we give that to men as well.

[Brewmaster531]

I've seen people try to use this Internet platform, and the one I mentioned who told the story of the false rape is a comedian with a podcast. He's a liberal guy with a feminist wife and baby daughter. A movie acting, Netflix series writing stand up comedian keeps trying to bring attention to this stuff and you know what? He's called sexist. Feminist bloggers with huge audiences always blog about how he's sexist and said certain things that are sexist and condone beating women, but he absolutely does not do that at all on any level, not on his podcast, not in his stand up act, and it's portrayed very little in his Netflix series, which is based in the 70s anyways so you expect sexism anyways. So, if a big time comedian and actor who has three big platforms (stage, podcast, Netflix) can't bring attention to these issues without being called sexist by big feminists, how the hell am I going to bring attention to it? I've already been called a Nazi and Trump supporter, neither are true.

[Brewmaster531]

And the only reason I've ever been called either is because of these men/women issues. My other stances on other social, fiscal and political issues scream liberal.

[Brewmaster531]

And I chose not to say the comedian's name because I don't want people looking up to see if he was a credible source, as they would come to conclusions that were not that comedian's intention and it would bring nothing to our discussion here.

[Mi2mi2a]

Now see it this way sir. There are criminials and sexual harassement is a crime. Now, if someone was murdered, it's not weird that you will find a case of a person falsely accused and had to go through prison because of it , then later on was proven innocent.
It happens, does that mean that every murder prime suspect should not be punished?
I don't think so.
Yeah, there are women who will lie about rape, does that mean that suspect with rape shouldn't be punished again? I don't think so again.

[Brewmaster531]

@Mi2mi2a, many of my comments said over and over that the men who have done the crimes should be punished severely. My only gripe is the lack of coverage on women who lie and the lack of support for the men who suffered because of false claims. If someone is punished for a murder they didn't commit and it's proven they didn't do it, the media is all over it, covered for weeks, the state gives the wrongfully imprisoned a bunch of money, and he gets to write a book about what happened. Guys wrongfully accused and imprisoned for rape don't ever get that level of attention. Never get that level of support, and are grossly under accommodated by the state. The Talk, The View, these day time women talk shows talk about women wronged with tears in their eyes, but never talk about guys who were wrongfully accused and imprisoned. That's my issue here. That's why I'm not a feminist. I'm not going to stand by and watch this stuff happen to men and then claim I'm for equality of the genders.

[Mi2mi2a]

equality for genders doesn't hinder men's rights. It's as its name says: equality for genders.
I can see how you're frustrated about the way men are treated with sexual harassement, it's understandable. However does that have anything to do with sexual harassement perpetuated by men? No. Yes, what you are talking about is a serious issue that sould be given attention. However, we are talking here about how men think that women lie about harassement.
What I'm trying to say is writing as a response another issue to the one we are discussing means you are claiming that this one doesn't hold importance. Again, I say that the issue you are talking about is serious and since it's not being given its due why don't you start yourself and write your articles or just myTake here to deliver your message.
That being said your comment to this problem was inappropriate and done in a way that sends the message that the issue of sexual harassement isn't real. That's what myTake owner was explaining.

[Brewmaster531]

@Mi2mi2a I'll admit, I misinterpreted the opinion owner's original title. I'll also admit that I picked the wrong MyTake to make a stand. I interpretated the title as "you think the world doesn't need feminism". And I whole heartedly apologize for that misinterpretation. I do disagree with the title, though. No, I don't think every woman lies, a large portion of the western world doesn't. But the fact is, it does happened. Doesn't matter if it only happens less than 1% of the time. It happens, and the wrong people are getting in trouble. That needs to be addressed. It needs to be talked about. I know there is a sexual assault and harassment issue in the western world. No problem with that part of the conversation. But that problem is addressed. Websites, commercials parades, marches, charities, causes, legislation, and news castings address the issue. And there should be. As long as the problem will exists, it should still be addressed. I'm fine with that.

[Brewmaster531]

My issue is the issues towards men I brought up are not addressed. This MyTake is yet another blog by another victim of a horrible action. I do feel for her, I wish nothing but punishment for the ones who wronged her and I hope she is fine and well. But she has people backing her cause, there are talk shows that at least once a week address the sort of issue she brought up. Men in the situations I presented don't receive the same attention.

[Brewmaster531]

Again, I'm not trying to downplay the MyTake owner's situation. I don't even disagree with her MyTake, despite what I may have said. And again, I sincerely apologize for my misinterpretation and using this as a platform to air my issues. I make it seem like I have a major disagreement with the MyTake owner, which is not the case. I even noticed we agree for the most part.

[Anonymous]

I am sorry you went through that. I recently went through something very similar and I was so scared. I can't believe the fact that so many people can't understand how shitty it is to deal with something like that. It makes you feel like you have no worth at all.

[hellionthesagereborn]

Has any one stated that all women lie about harassment? No. Never. Not at any point in time. That is a straw man argument. Two, what your describing is not harassment, he was hitting on you then said something assholish. This would of course never occur except that women demand, that's right DEMAND men approach them, as a result if a man wants any kind of relationship whether it be long term, short, or a one night stand he needs to approach women and hit on them. If he touched you like grabbed you, then that would be sexual harassment, words however are not, he was simply hitting on you (and yes clearly he was an asshole and racist) not all will do it well, not all will approach a woman that is interested but because they have to do all the approaching because women adamantly refuse to do so (again, you do) it means that these kinds of encounters are going to be inevitable. Three, that has nothing to do with feminism it has to do with the nature of our courting again, that men have to do all the approaching and thus its quite literally unavoidable for a woman not to have a bad experience with it because again, its the only way relationships are created, that is they only occur because men approach women and attempt to hit on them. That's the only reason why humans exist really, because its not women doing the approaching, we don't inherently know when some one likes us and know exactly what to say and when to say it. Some guys are assholes and you can call them that if they act that way but again, this is the nature of things you want them to change do so by demanding every woman start doing the approaching since clearly they can't handle being approached. Their was nothing dangerous about that situation. Again, this has nothing to do with feminism which itself is cancerous to our society (that's quite accurate too as all research and data shows that its only caused harm and that men are not these evil monsters that feminist want to portray us as (which is ironic as they claim its men who are sexist. Funny how that works). Over all this is stupid, I had my ass slapped by girls in grade school and highschool, they thought it was funny, that's actually sexual harassment. Does that men all men are suffering from this? No. Does it mean that we need to create a nation wide program to teach women how not to be sexist rapist? No. It means a few women where rude and inappropriate, nothing more nothing less.

[meowcow]

Harassment goes both ways, even if it happens more to women than men. And there are both predatory men and women. The difference is that men tend to prey on women, while women tend to prey on children. The reality is that there are good people on this planet, and then there are those who care about nothing more than themselves.

That is the reality, and this is why parents always watch over their kids, and why women look behind their backs in a dark alley. Sure, people have the right to be safe and free from harassment, violence, rape, robbery, murder... etc (name your social injustice here). That doesn't mean people don't need to lock their doors at night, or that we leave our children unattended, or otherwise protect ourselves.

If he called your boss to complain, I would have looked up his invoice and called his boss (his wife) to complain.

Putting blanket statements on all men will not help your argument. It only serves to isolate you more. If you look around on this board, there are enough men posting that they have trouble even speaking to a female without shitting their pants. And there are millions more such men who have trouble speaking to a woman, much less engage in sexual harassment.

When these men read your take, they think, "This stupid girl is calling all men sexual harassers? That's bullshit". And they think this because they have never catcalled a woman, or even dated a woman.

So take a bit of advice and don't follow the sheep. If you're going to call out a group of people for something, then be accurate. There's a big difference between calling all men sexual harassers with blanket statements that apply to guilty and innocent people, and actually focusing your energy on those who are guilty.

[RandomBritishGuy94]

The definition of harassment is the issue. Take this example - www.independent.co.uk/.../...t-abuse-a8028536.html - Where even the women considers the matter closed. Was it ok to do? No of course not but it was dealt with at the time and the mass media coverage this year covered up some very disturbing problems. The report about sexual harassment even had consenting relationships (because they work together) in along actual reports of unwanted sexual advances.

Nobody is lying but the media needs to take a step back and consider how it reports figures. A cat call, done once by a random man on the street, is not in the same category as someone who puts their hands on you repeatedly and who has actual power over you in the work place. It should be called out but context is important and the reports never give it. Frankly it devalues the real issues by lumping them in with things even the women involved doesn't consider an issue.

[lumos]

That's awful, and the way your manager responded was even worse. At that point, if I was your manager, I would have told you that you handled it professionally and that you, by no means, have to accept that sort of behavior by a customer. Sure, you're there to serve customers and to keep a certain image, but there is definitely a line customers can cross to abuse the system. The customer is NOT always right. It would have been unprofessional of you to flirt back or accept his advances, so you handled that very gracefully. I probably would have told him to fuck off tbh.
I'm glad that my workplace is set up in a way where my boss would immediately notice if a customer came on too strong, so nobody has ever dared to hit on me or say lewd things. But that is a privilege it seems, not the norm. The only thing I've experienced at my workplace so far is guys standing a bit too close for a bit too long, but that's as much they'll ever get away with.
Thank you for your take and for sharing your experience.

[Anonymous]

See? Feminists like you only look at the world from one side and focus only on one part. You just wanna say that men are to blame for everything in America. Only men rape, only men harass, only men cheat, etc. But you refuse to admit that the opposite along with other things are also 100% true. Women rape and steal money, women attack men and think they are entitled to it because they have a vagina, women expect belief in everything they say so they make false rape accusations, and do everything else they can think of to ruin men in every way possible. You know it, but refuse to admit it. That's how all feminists are in America. If you have an unruly customer, get your supervisor or manager. That's what I was taught to do and that's what I did when a crazy woman started cursing at me because I did not put her groceries in the order she wanted them in her bag. The supervisor kicked her out and everything was back to normal. Pretty much everyone of any gender, race, religion, culture gets harassed one way or another at some point. Being rude and blaming all those people is very immature and wrong. Not everyone is good, not everyone is bad.

[snowangle]

Did you read the part where her manager sided with the customer? 🙄

[Opinion Owner]

@snowangle Yes I did. And he is right. Avoid being unruly to customers because it might cost you your job. You are expected to be polite and welcome the customers. It's part of sales jobs. Avoiding conflict is the best thing you can do. There are rules and you have to follow them or quit the job. Your choice.

[snowangle]

Yeah I don't buy it. If a customer is making an employee uncomfortable and is not stopping when asked, the employee doesn't have to just take it. It's perfectly acceptable to say "please don't talk to me like that." A good manager will have their employee's back.

[Opinion Owner]

@snowangle He did have her back because the dude went away. A bad manager would've ignored it or joined the guy. But he casually got rid of the unruly customer.

[snowangle]

Where did you read that?

The manager didn't do that. The OP kicked the guy out of the store.

[Opinion Owner]

@snowangle The manager prevented things from going into further trouble. And just how can she kick him out? An employee can't do that.

[snowangle]

She didn't say how she did it. But from the sounds of it, her manager was nowhere around when this was happening. I don't know how you got the idea that the manager did anything.

[Opinion Owner]

@snowangle The guy did stop so I assume the manager did something. If not then the customer could've continued. And again, an employee is not allowed to just kick out a customer. They need to report customers to the supervisor or manager.

[Samantha2448]

No the guy stopped because she said she would call security

[Opinion Owner]

@Samantha2448 Again, she cannot kick out a customer. That's what managers are allowed to do. Scaring is one thing, kicking out is totally different. She's probably purposely hiding a few important details in her story.

[Rissa95]

She threatened to call security if he didn't stop. That's when he stopped and later complained to the manager.

[Opinion Owner]

@Rissa95 And what did the manager say to the customer? That's the hidden part.

[myTake Owner]

I was working alone and manager was not present.

Later I told manager that this customer is disturbing, and he harassed me and i dont wanna deal with him if he comes at my shift if possible. the customer DID NOT complain about me, neither the manager had seen the customer.

The manager had just checked the name on order, and the design, and he said this was a regular customer, and he admitted that another girl complained about him. Yet he still defends the customer because he brings in money. He even told me to dress less flashy colors (like i had a hoodie with red and white he told me to wear black)

I hope the manager burns in hell. Equally the customer.

[Opinion Owner]

So I was thinking correctly. You got your manager and he got rid of the customer by completing the order. The comment about dressing less flashy is kinda weird, but a business is about making money. Getting more customers and finishing orders brings money. If you are not satisfied with the job, leave.

[myTake Owner]

Are you not reading? Later i told the manager, manager did not interact with the customer. It was after this happened, a day after. God you need every single detail to gradp something.

[Opinion Owner]

You never mentioned that it was a day after. So the customer left when you said you will call security. The next day you reported this guy to your manager. He got the orders ready, the customer walked in, received what he ordered, and left. Correct? Ok, then you did everything correctly. Good. Going back to the original topic, this one incident does not mean all men are bad, that all men need to be killed, that women need 'more' rights than men, and that women are better than men. And not all women are liars, gold diggers, misandrists, etc. Both genders should have equal rights, no double standards, no chivalry, etc. This won't work in every category, but it's the best we can make it.

[myTake Owner]

I didn't say “women need more rights” “neither i claimed all men are bad” see how it bothers you because i didn't say “some men” equally it bothers me when some guys think “every woman” lies about sexual harassment, we do not need feminism, we do not need extra rules for harassment. Clearly manager is a guy, he thinks the same, he does the same, Did you get my point now?

[snowangle]

Except tons of women every day experience sexual harassment in the workplace, many instances much more annoying than this one - many of them even being unsafe or threatening situations.

OP never said anything to imply women being superior to men, or getting more rights than men, or saying that all men are monsters. She simply pointed out that this was a problem and a common one. The question is why do you feel the need to get so defensive at the subject of sexual harassment?

[Opinion Owner]

@snowangle One of the main points I am trying to explain is that women only look at one side in problems related to men and women. You only talk about things that women face. You never talk or care about the problems men face. Men get harassed in the workforce too. Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Men do a good job at keeping these things to themselves or else people won't believe them or even laugh. Double standards. What if all men were to stand up and accuse women of harassment. You know what will happen? The women will be delighted and laugh. And all men would get thrown in jail for false accusations even with evidence. "A man harassed at work? Yeah right. And who cares anyway?"

[snowangle]

We do talk about men's issues, dude. But this Mytake, in particular, is about female sexual harassment in the workplace. I'm sorry it can't always be about you.

If you'd like to talk about men's issues, feel free to write your own Mytake, or go to a Mytake where that's the subject.

[myTake Owner]

@snowangle Thanks @snowangle. I wonder why they don't spend some time writing takes about men's issues, so we can discuss and open up, and understand each other, but rather they "waste" time on bashing under topics irrelevant to their agenda.

[Opinion Owner]

How is this irrelevant to our agenda. Male and female problems affect one another. Feminists just look at it from one side thus don't understand why what they are doing is all wrong.

[myTake Owner]

This is irrelevant because I am not a man and therefore, I don't experience what a man experience as harassment in his daily life. If a man takes his pen and writes down a take, I'd be happy to read, discuss, try to look for constructive ways how two pieces of human population can work on these problems to solve.

I would not write and attack the man like the following:

"Go home have kids we don't need you in the workforce"
"You need to please customers whatever they want"
"You're a huge bitch"
"I'd be flattered if they compliment my boyfriend"
"You'd be crying and thinking if you're ugly if noone was harassing you"

And I would definitely not claim that whatever a woman did to him is normal, like some over here told me that i am a bitch and he is a guy and so he has needs, and what he did is normal, i should rather please him because he is a customer. OK. Next time, I'll accept someone sexual advances and go sleep with him immediately cuz my face looks sexually unsatisfied.

[BigDicRick]

To all the dudes trying to downplay how vulnerable women feel at times imagine this: you're alone in a parking lot and a 6'8" muscular man comes up to you and tries to talk to you. Sure he's "friendly" but you can tell he wants something from you and won't leave you alone. What do you do? Congratulations you've been placed in the same situation as 75% of women.

[myTake Owner]

Thanks for the analogy.

[bbb10]

If women are supposed to be heterosexual, then it shouldn't be comparable. And men are the majority of assault and murder victems in every country, men statistically have more to worry about when walking about, you hear us complaining?

[myTake Owner]

@bbb10 You sources for "EVERY" country?

[lumos]

This, exactly. Men always compare it to being approached by a woman. "Oh I wouldn't mind it if an attractive busty woman came up to me and flirted!" of course you wouldn't because you're a desperate little twat with no awareness at all. If 6'8" roided up Chad comes over to you and tells you to bend over you probably wouldn't be as thrilled.

[bbb10]

Maybe if some butch women came up to you, it would be comparable. Women honestly don't understand how much easier life is for them because men are far more attracted women than women are to men (the reason why we are desperate little twats). Fuck even "straight" women are more aroused by the female body than the male body.

[Bananaman177]

Your position is completely ridiculous, you are arguing against a "strawman."

There is NOBODY, nobody ANYWHERE who is saying that EVERY WOMAN LIES about harassment. That is the most absurd implication, and you should argue against what your "opposition" is actually saying, not just attribute the most absurd argument you can possibly imagine to them and then argue against that so you can claim victory in an imaginary debate that you played both sides of:

https://i.imgur.com/vITX4FX.jpg

This has nothing to do with sexual harassment, you just plain don't don't know how to argue, you're so ill-equipped for argumentation and debate that you have NO BUSINESS trying to argue about something as important as sexual harassment.

We NEED to start talking about serious issues like sexual harassment. But all you're doing is broadcasting static at top volume. Because it makes you feel good.

You're just like a damn toddler.

[myTake Owner]

“Unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature constitutes sexual harassment when submission to or rejection of this conduct explicitly or implicitly affects an individual's employment, unreasonably interferes with an individual's work performance or...” read rest at eeoc. gov

Yes i am a toddler and so i dontbget your point. What are you trying to argue about my argument? I am giving an example of my experience and this is experienced by many western women on a daily basis. So you’re argument not-so-ill-equipped-man?

[Bananaman177]

This is what the problem is with your argument:

NOBODY IS SAYING "EVERY WOMAN LIES" EXCEPT YOU, PUTTING WORDS IN OTHER PEOPLE'S MOUTH.

That's called a "Strawman fallacy," it means you're building fake men out of straw to attack instead of actually addressing a real argument or a real opponent. You're debating against yourself and you're letting your favorite side win, it's PATHETIC.

Learn this, then come back and try harder next time:
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

And don't you dare hate me for criticizing your GARBAGE technique, you should be THANKING me.

People like you who commit these logical fallacies hurt their own side's credibility, that's all.

Whenever people DON'T believe sexual harassment victims, it's because they associate the victims with your irrational man-hate. So you're doing your own part to silence the real victims, plus you blame innocent people, victimizing them. You expect praise?

[Cosytoasty]

You know... the best thing is to not give a shit, like us guys do when a woman flirts inappropriately with us. Also, to give you some perspective... while you typed this out about a guy talking to you, there were probably 5 other women in third world countries who were being raped and murdered.

[bente2]

Some people are more sensitive than others, you cannot tell them to just “not give a shit” because they always will.

And yes, of course, feminism is extremely important in other countries where issues regarding women are way worse then here, but that doesn’t mean the issues in the western world are not important. Especially since the issues here are easier to resolve due to the fact western women have access to a lt more resources etc.

You cannot achieve feminism fast and easily in the middle east of africa for example, it simply isn’t possible.

[myTake Owner]

@bente2 thanks for putting the words very well together that my English language abilities as a foreigner is limited to express.

[bente2]

I’m glad you feel that way😄

[Cosytoasty]

@bente2 how do you propose to resolve this issue? How do you stop a man talking to a woman of his own free will?

[Cosytoasty]

@bente2 every single time this issue is brought up on GaG it’s just stating the obvious thing that happens. Nobody offers a realistic solution, which is what peeves me off about the whole thing.

[bente2]

“Talking” is not the same as harrassing. In this example, the man was harrassing her, which is punishable by law.

[Cosytoasty]

@bente2 Alright if you want to bring law into it, then we need evidence. So far it’s his word vs hers (+ her side of the story) unless there were witnesses or audio recordings made? You see where I’m going with this?

Furthermore if you want to actually go ahead and put ever guy who has done this through the court system for harassment it would collapse under the number of claims and cases, as would the prison system so the result = our taxes would go up to pay for it all.

[bente2]

Taxes are already high where I live but can be evaded easily so ;).

I get what you mean, but that is still an argument I have.

[Naydyonov]

I think it's literally the same 5% of guys who do this to every woman.

I have never done this type of shit and if any friend of mine started doing it we would hit him and get him out.

I know this because in school a group member was doing some weird shit to a girl and we started wiping him with our shirts and slapping him in the face.
He did later try to approach the girl again so from across the room we threw water bottles at him. (Full Ones)

Let's just say this guy kept his distance from her.

[lumos]

Unfortunately it's not a minority we're talking about.

[lumos]

Oh and not saying the majority is doing this, just that it's more than 5% of guys.

[Naydyonov]

@lumos personally I've only seen it a few times.
I haven't heard of any male from my connections who do this type of shit.
in fact most react quite negatively to it.
so I'd honestly be surprised to find a statistic that says that say 50% of men do this.

if so, then it might just be America. maybe in Canada men are better

[lumos]

I mean sure, you've probably only seen it a few times because you're not the target and sometimes it's hard to catch in public. I've only seen it a few times too, but experienced it plenty. So you not seeing it =/= not something that happens often. Also that just means that you have nice friends, or friends who don't dare to admit what they've done/don't even understand that they've done it. Plenty of men pressure women both subtly and aggressively.
I live in one of the safest countries in the world and it still happens pretty often here. I don't go out very often in the evening but for my friends who do, it happens nearly every time.

[myTake Owner]

@lumos i agree with lumos in the sense that because you’re not the target you don’t really feel as prevalent as we do i think

[Naydyonov]

obviously. But I have seen general male reaction to harassment or confrontation.

I'll give an example, this guy let me shoot his BB gun. I shot it a bit and that was all. A few days later I'm outside my house and he and his two friends come up to me. I was 14 or so , they were 16-17. They start telling me that I broke the gun and have to give them 400 bucks. They started threatening me saying they will beat me up until I give the money. We were talking pretty loudly, my neighbor and friend who was 10 came up beside me and was telling them to leave. They didn't leave but they got less pushy. Then my other neighbor (13) saw and heard what was happening through his window and came down and joined us. At this point the guys had "fuck this" faces and quickly left.

Maybe it's only the guys I know, but they will drop what they're doing if they see someone being threatened. Maybe of course it's only my friends, old and new, who do this, but I think many guys would do it.

[Naydyonov]

I will give another scenario.
I got off the bus and started walking home. I was wondering what my physical reaction would be if I went up to a girl and started talking to her. Would I sweat and be nervous? Or would I remain calm as I normally am?
So a girl was walking beside me and slightly behind me.

I checked my pulse.

Next I turn to hear and said Hi.
First thing I learned was that movements have to be slow because other you may scare the shit out of them, and in a bad way.
Next thing was that I literally had no questions to ask, so the only thing I came up with was "Where do you live?" and "Where are you going?" , as well as "What school do you go to?".

Welp.

I definitely came off the impression of being a creep, I saw it in her eyes.

But, the point of the experiment was to see how I react to this situation. And I can say that my pulse stayed exactly the same, I did not sweat at all, breathing remained constant, and no mental effects.

[Naydyonov]

In that case I had proved my hypothesis that I was not scared to come up to girls, I just couldn't find any that interest me.

But, reviewing my experiment I did realize that she probably saw me as a creep.

I can however assure you I'm only creepy at home :D

But really, many guys that seem creepy or slightly on the harassment side may be trying to talk to a woman in such a manner for the first time.

The guy in your store has definitely done that to numerous women prior, thus I believe the impression is that all men harass, but it's really 5% maybe 20% that do.

That's what I personally believe.

[JustblockRebecca]

I think you're right now that I actually think about it. It is the same group of guys who harass most women. When I look back at the amount of men I interact with on a daily basis or even just come into proximity with. It's probably less than 1% that even makes rude comments towards me and it's always a particular type of guys that do that shit. Fruit for thought.

[Naydyonov]

@JustblockRebecca I'm glad you took the time to analyze my responses. :)

[Chief16]

Is Sexual Harassment a big problem? Yes it is. Feminism doesn't have a monopoly on the definition of rape, harassment etc etc. The liberal media, sjws, feminists have made a sort of self serving vigilantism where they let people like Caitlyn Jenner get away with murder but will act like its a holocaust if someone is accused (no not proven) of sexual harassment. Not every woman lies about harassment, and not every person who is accused is guilty.

[Staryboy1492]

Not gonna lie. This is indeed an important issue (sexual harassment/assault) however I will be glad when the shitstorm in the West dies down... At present I feel I have to walk on eggshells when around women. Just yesterday this lady went off the rails on me. We were having some bland conversation. I merely stated that men on average are physically stronger, which is true. She shouted at me. Stating that women are just as strong as men, I'm apart of the problem and challenged me to a fight... lol...

[AthleticMom]

You are in the right and boss in wrong clearly
and your guilt expressed in no makeup has no foundation, nothing you did wrong.

That said, you were caught off guard with nothing prepared to say to ward off advances like this quickly & more easily. Consider this event a wake up call to have somethings canned on hand to say to quell such behavior, best if they are also boss friendly.

Next is to be more selective in bosses. This one was such a failure, he bends over for any cash flow, so desperate he be, with no extra prostitute pay in compensation to workers he expects to also bend over. Ergo, find a boss more successful & picky in clients served and there's a better chance this confidence & pride will extend to workers as well.

There's no excuse for any married Person to seek sex on the side and it happens on both sides of the gender fence. The guys are a bit more overt when they are the sort controlled mostly by their little heads in all things

[Anonymous]

There are women who lie about sexual harassment. There was a girl at my old job who falsely accused our supervisor of sexual harassment because he gave her a bad review. It was another woman in the office who backed him up because she was with him, when the girl claim he harass her.
So yes there are women who face sexual harassment, but there are some women who lie and use it as weapon against guys.

[Juxtapose]

lol @ the triggered feminist down voting you!

[Opinion Owner]

@Juxtapose I don't get it, what did I say wrong?

[Juxtapose]

You disagreed with their narrative.

Don't worry about it, your position is very reasonable.

[I-am-a-nobody]

"... sexual harassment overwhelmingly happens at work environment since many men, coworkers or customers, think they're entitled to make sexual advances"...

You are confusing "sexual harassment" with "sexual advances".
Just because someone approaches you with a more than non-sexual interest doesn't mean they are out to harass you or that they want to rape you. It's called a sex drive and without it mankind would probably cease to exist.
On the other hand, the man in your specific example sounds like a real pig. He is married and really has no business approaching you that way. However, the many single men who legitimately approach women shouldn't be lumped in with harassers and rapists.

I think many single women out there would agree that they definitely WANT men to show an interest (of a sexual nature) in them.

[myTake Owner]

I am not on PC to copy paste th definition of sexual harassment for you. Go to eeoc. gov and lookk for it before saying “oh men have testosterone and women have estrogen so it is ok to make sexual advances”

Also, telling me that he can satisfy me sexually and i will become less grumpy just because i have flu and so i speak with rough voice due to my sore throat, and saying hat my boyfriend is a gringo and not be able to satisfy me is not something a normal man do. I am not even reminding you that this guy was with his wife while putting the order in the system, so he is not even single.

[I-am-a-nobody]

If I would have been there, I probably would have told him to leave you alone. Then again, that's what more women ought to do in no uncertain terms. I'm sorry you went through that kind of garbage from him.

I wouldn't really rely upon the eeoc definition.
Quoting from https://www.eeoc.gov/eeoc/publications/fs-sex.cfm

"Sexual harassment is a form of sex discrimination..."

Sexual harassment is NOT a form of discrimination.
I've been harassed by both women AND men. When it happened, I didn't feel as though discrimination had anything to do with it.

"Unwelcome sexual advances..."

How do you know the advances are unwelcome until you approach someone?
That said, people like the guy in your account should realize when they are being annoying.

[myTake Owner]

Did you just read the first sentence of that report to conclude all of those things?

Read the rest.

[FatherJack]

This man should have got the message & left & NOT pressed on with his attempted advance , & he was out of order making the complaint , yes agreed here ... however THIS statement " think they're entitled to make sexual advances because they have penis, which is the most important organ in their body." ... that reeks very strongly of misandry & is also total BS !! Also a sizable percentage of women will not hesitate to falsely accuse a man of sexual ill behaviour !! Wouldn't it be best for everyone , if men lost interest in women altogether & became coldly indifferent & distant towards women?

[Agent]

Some people are such babies. Your "story" just further damaged the credibility of harassment accusations; it was an exaggeration. That was just regular flirting which happens to guys too, but they don't whine about it in articles. Even your manager knows this. Matter of fact, if the guy looked like a 10/10 and you were really into him, you probably wouldn't even consider it harassment. Hell, he even stopped when you made it clear that you're not into him. There's no case here.
Grow up.
Come back when you have a real issue.

[NJ_Casanova]

I do think "some" women scream harassment when it's the first a guy is just playfully flirting.

I DO think... all of this media coverage will make guys think twice about approaching women. It will force girls to start making the first move. SO it will backfire for the rest of the girls that are horny wanting guys to be more aggressive.

[Juxtapose]

It already has. One of the first things I ask women is if they're a feminist.

[Nabla]

Unfortunately, the first paragraph already ruined it for me. Why do so many women assume that men tolerate or defend other men's misbehavior? The customer was obviously very rude, and your boss's reaction was not helpful, either. What more do you need me to say?

[lumos]

It's not an assumptions. Guys have watched me get harassed plenty of times. All of them have stayed silent or looked the other way.
Silence = acceptance.

[lumos]

assumption*

[Nabla]

@lumos No; silence = lack of courage. Men can be cowards, too, and unfortunately, I'm one of them.

[myTake Owner]

I dont assume men are fine with some other men’s misbehavior yet i’ve seen times they didn't stand up and instead sometime even they joined

[Anonymous]

#METOO. This has happened quite a few times to me in workplace and I can tell you you women are just as bad as the men, like diet coke ads glorify female on male sexual harrassment. I was also raped a few times at college when I was too drunk to consent and have been coerced into sex by a girl when I was in my teens.

[GayHowellMeme]

I would not blame strictly on anyone. But it doesn't just hold on just men, it holds on immigrants, muslims, indians, arabs, and any country that's not in the western world. BEFORE YOU SAY I SHOULD NOT JUDGE RAPE/HARRASSMENT BY RACE, RELIGION, NATIONALITY, it's actually fucking up to their culture. Indian men have this culture for example right? And they harras and ask about sex constantly so most indian men are like this upon their culture. It's their fucking culture and they don't view it as wrong in their. Here in the western world, we just have different culture, and different opinions, and how we treat children and what we teach them by culture and culture.

But anyways, women should stop overreact on every guy. I don't overreact, but I know when a guy's horny or retarded.

[Mia2020]

Your response to this and blaming it on other nationalities is just so ridiculous, how into mainstreamed memes are you? I'm pretty sure this was inspired from some meme. But anyways since you asked for this let me introduce you to the Indian religion and culture because you obviously grew up with the wrong ideas. First of all, let me clear this major misconception from your head that "IT IS OKAY TO RAPE IN INDIAN CULTURE" I don't think that it is okay to rape in any culture and considering my mom is Indian I'll tell you, NO ITS NOT FUCKING OKAY TO RAPE IN INDIA, so you really need to erase that from your head because if all Indian men were rapists then the Indian country would be on the top of the charts for rape rates since we are almost more populated than China. But guess what America is more popular for rape rates than India sure says a lot about America huh? And just so you don't think I'm lying here's a source- www.nationmaster.com/.../United-States

[Mia2020]

Second of all, you think Indian men or other nationalities are raping in USA or are influencing rape in any way so let me show you what bureau of justice statistics said- "A 2014 study of college campus rape statistics by the BJS found that 63% of reported rapes against females aged 18 to 24 are done by white males, 19% are done by black males and 10% are done by another race and 8% are unknown." This is a reflection of rape cases in USA now tell me who are the ones with the perverted mind and who has rape in their culture? Sure India has a lot of males males raping females but it ties in to a weak government and the literacy rate which was below average, but now it's all improving and yet we still have a lower rape rate than USA. So all in all, this is what I want you to reflect from this, whole argument- 1. It is not okay to rape in any culture. 2. Before targeting any culture first have your demographics and

[Mia2020]

... demographics and statistics clear on who you are attacking. 3. No culture is the same, and no culture accepts rape. 4. Look at your coin before faulting someone else's. In case you are wondering what I am I am a mixed kid with my mom from India and before stereotyping an entire religion and culture based on a minority of horny males, think Twice. Thank you.